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Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 194

post #5791 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddler11 View Post

...It is going to be used as a htpc. Any tips to avoid having issues?

Set your WINDOWS screen saver to kick in blank screen after one minute.
-In case a member of the fam leaves the thing on with a static pic.

The windows screen saver interacts nicely with WMC and only activates if nothing is playing.
Its better then the slide show as that has lots of borders and samey things.
post #5792 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

Set your WINDOWS screen saver to kick in blank screen after one minute.
-In case a member of the fam leaves the thing on with a static pic.

The windows screen saver interacts nicely with WMC and only activates if nothing is playing.
Its better then the slide show as that has lots of borders and samey things.

Lol "samey things" good tip though. Is a solid black or white screen considered to be a static image?
post #5793 of 11459
Any reason NOT to use the Disney WOW Pixel Flipper, or the Pixel Protector Pixel Washes for the 200 Hr (300 Hr) burn in - both Programs exercise every Pixel.
post #5794 of 11459
Okay, the Shootout bummed me out so much I decided to go back to Magnolia and take another look at the VT60. This time they had the 65" right next to the 64" F8500, which I have at home. Considering the pro's preferred the VT60, I tried my best to determine if and why it would be the better choice. I actually wanted it to be better so I could justify making an exchange.

The salesman was very helpful and, right off the bat, told me it would not be a good idea. We compared the picture on a variety of content and one thing became perfectly clear. The weakness of the VT60 is it's level of detail. In every other respect it was excellent. The brightness was fine, colors, blacks, and even the whites looked great as well. I just could not get over the lack of detail in most of the content we viewed and in some content it appeared incredibly blurry.

I don't know exactly why, but the F8500 just looked better in virtually every scenario. Yes, I know Samsung uses different video processing, but no if's, and's, or but's...that screen technology makes a difference. Maybe it's not a measurable thing, but it sure is obvious from a visual standpoint. You can clearly see the difference.

I was disappointed that the shootout used such a limited array of content and was so heavily weighted toward the measurable instead of the visual. They were so engulfed in the technology they use determine what they think makes a picture look good, they actually spent very little time actually trying to see which picture actually does look better. They simply do not know how to measure screen clarity or detail level, so they simply did not take it into account. Maybe it does not show up in the resolution tests they use, but it obviously shows up on what we see.

If they simply did a comparison of faces from various distances using diverse content (instead of just blu-ray), it would be obvious to the pro's as well. They could then ask the audience which picture they preferred, but that would be a visual comparison, and possibly a contradiction to their measurable's...can't have that! Bottom line, they simply did not take take into account any factors they could not measure with their toys.

It's pretty obvious to me, and everyone I've been with who has viewed them together, that the F8500 provides a better picture. The potential for Samsung to make the picture even better with a future evolution kit convinced me I would be a nut to exchange it. I tried my best to convince myself I was wrong, but came away convinced the pro's are little to full of themselves and their own ability to determine picture quality...without really letting the audience to do that with diverse content from strictly a visual perspective. That's where I think they dropped the ball at the shootout...big time.
post #5795 of 11459
Sorry, I got carried away with the simply's biggrin.gif
post #5796 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

Set your WINDOWS screen saver to kick in blank screen after one minute.
-In case a member of the fam leaves the thing on with a static pic.

The windows screen saver interacts nicely with WMC and only activates if nothing is playing.
Its better then the slide show as that has lots of borders and samey things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddler11 View Post

Yup good tip any others?

Good tip pie.
Would that work if the PC screen and TV screen are not extended and one is being used at a time?
post #5797 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Sorry, I got carried away with the simply's biggrin.gif

I simply love your post.
post #5798 of 11459
Jackobots - From reading your posts, I believe you did that right thing and you will continue to be a very happy camper with the 8500. I have done extensive comparisons between the VT60 and the 8500. Bottom line: both are excellent panels but, each caters to a different set of eyes. Besides luminance, I have found the main difference to be the VT60 as having soft lines and slightly more saturated colors whereas the 8500 has striking and sharp lines and slightly cooler color - which appeals to me. Some of us folks who have a closet LED side to us like this look. We all just need to get it out of our heads that after we buy a panel and get it home to quit trying to second guess ourselves because it just drives us crazy - I say "us" because I follow this forum religiously and I can see that the folks her have a similar fervor and bent to perfection. It eats me up sometimes. I'm going with the 8500. I'm going to just grab a cocktail, put my feet up, and enjoy the best (and try very very, very hard to never look back).
post #5799 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddler11 View Post

Yup good tip any others?

Again if you are using XBMC. You can always loop play or queue play videos. That way when it finishes it gets played again. This might be good as precaution.

But again you need to be careful as XBMC sometimes gives you notifications with yes and no option like when a plug in is disabled and I think this pop up stays on screen until the user press yes or no. You don't want to wake up and see this as an IR. I hope not
post #5800 of 11459
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimShaw View Post

Help choose

Sony's 65HX950 for $2900.99

or Samsung's 64F8500 at its market price

I am in a quandary and totally need help.
Is the 65" new, these others are not familiar with why you have an LED in the mix. I of course am, with this said amazing price on the XBR !!
post #5801 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Okay, the Shootout bummed me out so much I decided to go back to Magnolia and take another look at the VT60. This time they had the 65" right next to the 64" F8500, which I have at home. Considering the pro's preferred the VT60, I tried my best to determine if and why it would be the better choice. I actually wanted it to be better so I could justify making an exchange.

The salesman was very helpful and, right off the bat, told me it would not be a good idea. We compared the picture on a variety of content and one thing became perfectly clear. The weakness of the VT60 is it's level of detail. In every other respect it was excellent. The brightness was fine, colors, blacks, and even the whites looked great as well. I just could not get over the lack of detail in most of the content we viewed and in some content it appeared incredibly blurry.

I don't know exactly why, but the F8500 just looked better in virtually every scenario. Yes, I know Samsung uses different video processing, but no if's, and's, or but's...that screen technology makes a difference. Maybe it's not a measurable thing, but it sure is obvious from a visual standpoint. You can clearly see the difference.

I was disappointed that the shootout used such a limited array of content and was so heavily weighted toward the measurable instead of the visual. They were so engulfed in the technology they use determine what they think makes a picture look good, they actually spent very little time actually trying to see which picture actually does look better. They simply do not know how to measure screen clarity or detail level, so they simply did not take it into account. Maybe it does not show up in the resolution tests they use, but it obviously shows up on what we see.

If they simply did a comparison of faces from various distances using diverse content (instead of just blu-ray), it would be obvious to the pro's as well. They could then ask the audience which picture they preferred, but that would be a visual comparison, and possibly a contradiction to their measurable's...can't have that! Bottom line, they simply did not take take into account any factors they could not measure with their toys.

It's pretty obvious to me, and everyone I've been with who has viewed them together, that the F8500 provides a better picture. The potential for Samsung to make the picture even better with a future evolution kit convinced me I would be a nut to exchange it. I tried my best to convince myself I was wrong, but came away convinced the pro's are little to full of themselves and their own ability to determine picture quality...without really letting the audience to do that with diverse content from strictly a visual perspective. That's where I think they dropped the ball at the shootout...big time.

I know how you would feel. But believe me it doesn't matter. I said this before and will say it again that this whole shoot out thing should never be taken seriously. It can be an educational event not only for the audience but even the calibrators. The final say should be left to your own eyes. You cannot just go with what others say and not follow your own eyes. If you do that from deep inside you will always regret it.

I remember when I went to see last year's best TV VT50. Immediately I said "THIS IS NOT FOR ME". It looked dim, dull, waxed, picture washed out, no clarity, no sharpness. Now some will jump and talk about calibration. Again a TV has to be good without calibration to look excellent with calibration. I know if I would have purchased that TV I would have regretted it. Thankfully I didn't. I knew I will never like it.

The point is what is good for others might not be good for you and what might be good for you may not be good for them. The funny thing in the shootout when the clarity and sharpness of the F8500 was claimed to be because of its brightness which is TOTALLY WRONG. This was one of the biggest mistakes I have heard in this shootout because Samsung TVs (not just the F8500) are all sharp due to their way of processing. Even a person whose eye sight is not perfect can tell that. Why they haven't put enough material? Where is the SD material upscaling where Samsung is excellent in that aspect? Did they even test sports? Hockey? I have my own reservations about all the discussion went there and the way this whole thing has been presented. But that doesn't matter. What matters is that you have made one good purchase that you will continue to like.

I would not call F8500 best TV because to each the best differs. But I would call it a REVOLUTIONARY TV as it has pushed the plasma technology to a new level that was never exploited, something we haven't seen on other plasma displays.

The last thing I would say that this shootout has caused the ZT hype bubble burst very hardly. Not in a good way smile.gif. Now even if the ZT is chosen as the TV of the year I bet many users are already disappointed as the expectations were high. ZT has competition when it comes to its blacks at least with its own cousins but the F8500 absolutely has NO competition when it comes to its brightness and sharpness.
post #5802 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by quicknick View Post

...and try very very, very hard to never look back

That's easier said than done, that's for sure wink.gif
post #5803 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

Is the 65" new, these others are not familiar with why you have an LED in the mix. I of course am, with this said amazing price on the XBR !!

I think you would be surprised how know why he has the 950 in the mix wink.gifbiggrin.gif
post #5804 of 11459
any chance the 8500s go on sale during memorial day weekend?
post #5805 of 11459
Thread Starter 
There on sale everyday depending where you look..........
post #5806 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

I remember when I went to see last year's best TV VT50. Immediately I said "THIS IS NOT FOR ME". It looked dim, dull, waxed, picture washed out, no clarity, no sharpness. Now some will jump and talk about calibration. Again a TV has to be good without calibration to look excellent with calibration. I know if I would have purchased that TV I would have regretted it. Thankfully I didn't. I knew I will never like it.

Thanks for the nice post Halimali. I know the VT50 very well and in all sincerity, it's really hard to tell the any difference with the VT60. It's a nice tv and the missing detail is not real obvious until you see it next to an F8500. Once you get used to that level of detail, it's really hard to accept less...it feels like you are taking a step backwards.

Here's hoping that Samsung continues to improve the picture to address some of the issues the shootout revealed. They designed the tv with the ability to do just that and I'm pretty sure they will, sooner or later.Panasonic will not be able to do that nearly as well...if at all.

I admire that you are so confident in your decision, I'm sure you will be happy with your new F8500....it seems you already are wink.gif
post #5807 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Okay, the Shootout bummed me out so much I decided to go back to Magnolia and take another look at the VT60. This time they had the 65" right next to the 64" F8500, which I have at home. Considering the pro's preferred the VT60, I tried my best to determine if and why it would be the better choice. I actually wanted it to be better so I could justify making an exchange.

The salesman was very helpful and, right off the bat, told me it would not be a good idea. We compared the picture on a variety of content and one thing became perfectly clear. The weakness of the VT60 is it's level of detail. In every other respect it was excellent. The brightness was fine, colors, blacks, and even the whites looked great as well. I just could not get over the lack of detail in most of the content we viewed and in some content it appeared incredibly blurry.

I don't know exactly why, but the F8500 just looked better in virtually every scenario. Yes, I know Samsung uses different video processing, but no if's, and's, or but's...that screen technology makes a difference. Maybe it's not a measurable thing, but it sure is obvious from a visual standpoint. You can clearly see the difference.

I was disappointed that the shootout used such a limited array of content and was so heavily weighted toward the measurable instead of the visual. They were so engulfed in the technology they use determine what they think makes a picture look good, they actually spent very little time actually trying to see which picture actually does look better. They simply do not know how to measure screen clarity or detail level, so they simply did not take it into account. Maybe it does not show up in the resolution tests they use, but it obviously shows up on what we see.

If they simply did a comparison of faces from various distances using diverse content (instead of just blu-ray), it would be obvious to the pro's as well. They could then ask the audience which picture they preferred, but that would be a visual comparison, and possibly a contradiction to their measurable's...can't have that! Bottom line, they simply did not take take into account any factors they could not measure with their toys.

It's pretty obvious to me, and everyone I've been with who has viewed them together, that the F8500 provides a better picture. The potential for Samsung to make the picture even better with a future evolution kit convinced me I would be a nut to exchange it. I tried my best to convince myself I was wrong, but came away convinced the pro's are little to full of themselves and their own ability to determine picture quality...without really letting the audience to do that with diverse content from strictly a visual perspective. That's where I think they dropped the ball at the shootout...big time.

Great post, I think the F8500 is the best all round TV with the biggest range by a mile, there was no comparison when I compare it to the VT65(VT60). The VT was very good but the visual impact of the F8500 was a lot better. I think the shootout result will sadly come down to what the computer says rather than what people actually see.
post #5808 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

I know how you would feel. But believe me it doesn't matter. I said this before and will say it again that this whole shoot out thing should never be taken seriously. It can be an educational event not only for the audience but even the calibrators. The final say should be left to your own eyes. You cannot just go with what others say and not follow your own eyes. If you do that from deep inside you will always regret it.

I remember when I went to see last year's best TV VT50. Immediately I said "THIS IS NOT FOR ME". It looked dim, dull, waxed, picture washed out, no clarity, no sharpness. Now some will jump and talk about calibration. Again a TV has to be good without calibration to look excellent with calibration. I know if I would have purchased that TV I would have regretted it. Thankfully I didn't. I knew I will never like it.

The point is what is good for others might not be good for you and what might be good for you may not be good for them. The funny thing in the shootout when the clarity and sharpness of the F8500 was claimed to be because of its brightness which is TOTALLY WRONG. This was one of the biggest mistakes I have heard in this shootout because Samsung TVs (not just the F8500) are all sharp due to their way of processing. Even a person whose eye sight is not perfect can tell that. Why they haven't put enough material? Where is the SD material upscaling where Samsung is excellent in that aspect? Did they even test sports? Hockey? I have my own reservations about all the discussion went there and the way this whole thing has been presented. But that doesn't matter. What matters is that you have made one good purchase that you will continue to like.

I would not call F8500 best TV because to each the best differs. But I would call it a REVOLUTIONARY TV as it has pushed the plasma technology to a new level that was never exploited, something we haven't seen on other plasma displays.

The last thing I would say that this shootout has caused the ZT hype bubble burst very hardly. Not in a good way smile.gif. Now even if the ZT is chosen as the TV of the year I bet many users are already disappointed as the expectations were high. ZT has competition when it comes to its blacks at least with its own cousins but the F8500 absolutely has NO competition when it comes to its brightness and sharpness.

Totally agree with all of that too, nicely worded cool.gif
post #5809 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Sorry, I got carried away with the simply's biggrin.gif

I haven't seen the final results but I wasn't holding my breath, there's too much emphasis on meters instead of eyes.. Can you imagine buying speakers based on which measured lower bass wise?
I guarantee the sales numbers will tell the true winner, I wouldn't trade my f8500 for ANY other TV..
I've seen both the vt60 and F8500, no doubt which one I felt had a better, brighter and more detailed picture, the EvoKit doesn't hurt either biggrin.gif
post #5810 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Are you buzzard or a monkey...or a combination of both eek.gif

Either way, I hope they get the calibration firmware fixed before you head up north biggrin.gif

I'm a little of each and will explain when I'm at your place if you really want to know. Don't count on a fast fix for the CAL modes. These have been problematic for the past several years, each model having individual anomalies. For whatever environment we calibrate Movie we'll do the opposite with one of the CALs and see what shakes.

The cal modes are broken? Do you know if that is true for the other Samsung models, specifically their LCD ones?
post #5811 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by dad0118 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by coresare View Post

It's the 60" I'm 10 feet away. Even with program material playing (but at quiet volumes) I can hear it buzz if I point one ear towards the screen. It's constant. It's mostly directly in front of the plasma. I think I bought the last unit around my area so I'll have to have one ordered and compare the buzzing with the second unit. It's just multiple people have told me they don't hear any buzzing at all from their plasma..

Thanks in advance!

Regardless of what people say - if it bugs you return in. Try again with a different unit. If that doesn't work you may just be sensetive to the Buzz. While I haven't tested 2013 models for buzz, in my own experience the E series Samsungs I tried out in my home all had an unbearable buzz and I ulitmately settled on a VT50 which isn't audible to me over 12 inches away.

good advice.

Also, I know some people's ears just seem to be sensitive to the sound. But beyond this a good thing to check out is to make sure it isn't your circuit. Try unplugging everything from your circuit (extensions, everything) and then plug only the TV directly into the wall and see if its still there. Also, altitude has somehow made buzzing more apparent, so if you live at mile high stadium there could be something to that as well.
post #5812 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Okay, the Shootout bummed me out so much I decided to go back to Magnolia and take another look at the VT60. This time they had the 65" right next to the 64" F8500, which I have at home. Considering the pro's preferred the VT60, I tried my best to determine if and why it would be the better choice. I actually wanted it to be better so I could justify making an exchange.

snip

snip

That's where I think they dropped the ball at the shootout...big time.

Wow did you hit the nail right on the head jackobots, I agree whole heartedly with your consensus
of the shootout.
Sure technically it was very interesting, but there was NO depth to the visual of the screens.

Seems to me like the calibrators missed the whole VISUAL of how does it look to you, what do you see, how do you interpret this picture on display a b and c.

People should still buy what they like visually not what might come when u calibrate.

Anyway its to bad the whole thing was about the technical not the visual.

Rob
post #5813 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

There on sale everyday depending where you look..........

hey cleveland, im looking for the 64. i dont see a price on your website, but i will call and check it out. can you say where else you see these on sale?
L
post #5814 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

Is the 65" new, these others are not familiar with why you have an LED in the mix. I of course am, with this said amazing price on the XBR !!

Thanks, Chris but I have decided when the time comes it will be the 64F8500.

I happened to be at a BB yesterday when I saw their 950 demo model on sale $2900.99 and with a price like that I had to double check my decision. The 950 was about 10 months old but still came with full warranty. So, I guess you could say it was new. Like buying a car from a dealership that has use it as a demo for months. It still is considered new for registration purposes.
post #5815 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Okay, the Shootout bummed me out so much I decided to go back to Magnolia and take another look at the VT60. This time they had the 65" right next to the 64" F8500, which I have at home. Considering the pro's preferred the VT60, I tried my best to determine if and why it would be the better choice. I actually wanted it to be better so I could justify making an exchange.

The salesman was very helpful and, right off the bat, told me it would not be a good idea. We compared the picture on a variety of content and one thing became perfectly clear. The weakness of the VT60 is it's level of detail. In every other respect it was excellent. The brightness was fine, colors, blacks, and even the whites looked great as well. I just could not get over the lack of detail in most of the content we viewed and in some content it appeared incredibly blurry.
The same exact impressions I had. I really wanted to like the Panasonic more, as that's what I've had for the last 5 years. But side by side, I just couldn't get over the fact that the Panny lacked the detail and sharpness. It's not even the brightness of the 8500 that wins me over... it is only the clarity. As you said, the panny just appears a bit blurry for whatever reason. I give a very slight edge to shadow detail on the panny, and I definitely like the warmer appearance, as I've grown accustomed to it over the years, but I cannot forgive the lack of sharp edge detail that it suffers from. It makes a huge difference in my eyes when viewing both side by side. Enough to leave a lasting impression.
post #5816 of 11459
So did VE announce a winner for the Shootout yet? I have read some comments here that the calibrators preferred the VT60 but I watched the whole event live and don't recall them saying that conclusively at any point, unless I missed it. I wonder if it was a comment made somewhere else and everyone is just running with it. It would be great to hear the final, official verdict and reasoning.
post #5817 of 11459
I'm torn with my decision again. I have a ZT on order, but can go back to the F8500 as well, now that they have the brightness pops fixed. However, both have flaws. I'm not sure if the brightness of the ZT60 will be a big deal, as that was only the calibrated brightness, it could be brighter then that, but then with the F8500 is the horrible gaming lag. I tried a game on it when I owned one and it was terrible. Playing NHL on it was awful, so I'll rprobably stick with the ZT.
post #5818 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark_b View Post

I'm torn with my decision again. I have a ZT on order, but can go back to the F8500 as well, now that they have the brightness pops fixed. However, both have flaws. I'm not sure if the brightness of the ZT60 will be a big deal, as that was only the calibrated brightness, it could be brighter then that, but then with the F8500 is the horrible gaming lag. I tried a game on it when I owned one and it was terrible. Playing NHL on it was awful, so I'll rprobably stick with the ZT.

ask d-nice his thought on that.
post #5819 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvamir View Post

So did VE announce a winner for the Shootout yet? I have read some comments here that the calibrators preferred the VT60 but I watched the whole event live and don't recall them saying that conclusively at any point, unless I missed it. I wonder if it was a comment made somewhere else and everyone is just running with it. It would be great to hear the final, official verdict and reasoning.

What one of the calibrators said was, for him and his way of viewing the Panasonic would be the best

One or two of the calibrators said that the F8500 was the best over all

Going to be interesting. Because of the difference of the Samsung and the Panasonics in PQ regarding whether in a dark room or a like room, maybe a tie???
post #5820 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by cooknl View Post


Sure technically it was very interesting, but there was NO depth to the visual of the screens.

That's for sure! I was most astonished when they played the same blu-rays all over again the second night. It would of at least made it more interesting with more varied content and obviously would of given everyone a better idea how the pictures compared.

I think next year they should have someone from the entertainment industry involved with the production, the geeks sure could use some help in that regard. tongue.gif
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