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Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 218

post #6511 of 11459
The degree of buzzing remains constant regardless of scene brightness for me. It would appear there are two different causes of the buzz.

I can try getting a third unit to compare as the Best Buy has more in stock now, but I think that's going overboard.
post #6512 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by coresare View Post

I just received my second F8500 hoping this one wouldn't buzz as loud. Unfortunately the buzz is the same so I returned one. I'm suspecting they all do it and the people who claim they have no buzzing have terrible hearing. Depending on the angle of the tv in relationship to the ear does affect the volume of it.

electricity buzzes. no way around it really. i'm not sure if what you're hearing is normal, but if it's what i'm hearing I think you need to be insanely picky to care about it. mine buzzes about the same as my lights do. without any other noise in the room, sure I can hear it whenever I try, but you deal with it by turning up the volume past 1 and you're fine.

I don't think I would have paid any attention to it if not for forums like this. I don't think the plasma buzz is any worse than CRT's. LCD's are definitely quieter, but they aren't silent either.

the buzzing becomes noticeable with high ABL scenes, and is nearly silent with dark scenes. there is a difference depending on where I sit and which way my head is turned as well. it seems to be less obvious when I face the TV. if I look at a 90* angle(ear facing the screen) it sounds louder.

if I were in your shoes, i'd try putting a blanket or something behind the TV to see if it makes a difference. if it helps, you probably have something behind the TV that reflects the sound unusually well. some sound absorption could fix this minor issue pretty easily perhaps?
post #6513 of 11459
I find that this post points out that there are at least two sources of buzzing that are not directly caused by plasma screens.

RandyWalters' Buzzing

In my situation, our display has neither of the problems Randy mentions, but from six inches with a pure white screen, I can hear a fain hum that might be a buzz if it was louder.

I suppose that the board that needed replacing in Randy's set might have something about it that's related to plasma technology, but it's not the screen itself that's making the irritating noise that he was objecting to. His problem was a board component failing before it's time.

What Randy had, that lot of people don't have, is a smart tech that came to examine his set. biggrin.gif
Edited by htwaits - 5/19/13 at 11:05am
post #6514 of 11459
No buzzing here on my 64" to my ears. I checked quickly banding and dead pixels, none found and I am not going to check it more closely, it is fine by me as it is. Very good picture including black levels, although coming from backlit local dimming LED TV. My LED had brightness fluctuation problem every time when subtitles appeared, Samsung is brilliant also in this aspect.
post #6515 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony1 View Post

geezuz747 is not "full of it" because he is expressing what his impressions of the comparisons of these sets are.. I highly doubt he works for samung...I have not owned the F8500, but going by the sets that i currently own and hearing that they are not that different than the 2013 models, i would tend to believe him when he says that the pannys do not show much detail and are not as bright as they should be.. .

It's one thing to express an impression and another to completely insult people. He'd rather cook steaks than care about how his TV looks because TV tech talk is for nerds, yet he's here making ridiculous claims and arguing over nerdy stuff, and then gets mad at us when we call bs.

I also never said he works for Samsung, in fact I wouldn't care if he did or not. His claims that the ST60 doesn't have detail, is dim, and has crappy color are flat out false. Yes, I think the F8500 is a better panel, but I won't sit around and be as subjective as I can about the issue and then get mad at people.

He says he owned both, and shared his opinions, and then said if other people owned both they'd see that it's true. However, I've owned both myself, have spent a lot of time with the ST60 played games on it and so on, and it simply wasn't as he described. The ST60 is a good panel, but it's not F8500 good. Still, it's a good panel, and when I played games on it in bright daylight scenes they looked bright and looked like they were during the day time. I don't know what else to say.


geezus, dude, I really don't care at this point. You're extremely condescending and insulting and yet you're saying we're insulting you because we think you're exaggerating, yet you sit there and call people who care about image quality dorks and geeks and nerds who don't have a life, as indicated by you have "better things to do" than give a crap about how a TV looks when calibrated and so on. I have stuff to do, too, and frankly you're wasting a lot of people's time by making the claims you're making. And again, I'm a F8500 owner, who returned a ST60, and I couldn't disagree with you more about your claims.


Anyway, enough of this. I'll be happy to talk about the F8500 objectively with anyone, even about how it compares to a ST60 or even a UT50, but as soon as it starts to go into fanboy territory I'm out of the discussion.
post #6516 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by coresare View Post

The degree of buzzing remains constant regardless of scene brightness for me. It would appear there are two different causes of the buzz.

I can try getting a third unit to compare as the Best Buy has more in stock now, but I think that's going overboard.

Have you tried using a heavy gauge cord instead of what came with it? Maybe a line conditioner hooked up to your power outlet as well.
Edited by surfmlb - 5/19/13 at 4:22am
post #6517 of 11459
Please do not waste a second of your life or your money replacing the cord or getting a line conditioner. I promise you neither of them will make an iota of difference (unless you are really susceptible to the placebo effect).

If your TV is making a racket, get a service tech out to see if they can help. Or return it.

But don't try a bunch of irrelevant fixes that have not been proved to work for anyone. And by proved, I mean "using a meter to show an A/B test where the sound is actually different by a discernible amount".
post #6518 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Hi, zoyd,

Also shows a reduction of detail on the underside of the leaf as the LCE is increased. smile.gif

Larry

Hi Larry - I don't really see any reduction in detail since only the luminance is changing and resolution is not disturbed, although the stronger the effect, the less natural it looks.
post #6519 of 11459
Is anybody here using the hand gesture controls? Seems like such a waste of technology unless they are going to use it for games.
post #6520 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Please do not waste a second of your life or your money replacing the cord or getting a line conditioner. I promise you neither of them will make an iota of difference (unless you are really susceptible to the placebo effect).

If your TV is making a racket, get a service tech out to see if they can help. Or return it.

But don't try a bunch of irrelevant fixes that have not been proved to work for anyone. And by proved, I mean "using a meter to show an A/B test where the sound is actually different by a discernible amount".

You have proof they don't work?
post #6521 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony1 View Post

Brightness, brightness and more brightness!! lol The main thing i despise about plasmas is they are wayyy too dim and the colors are not as vivid at lcds.. Now finally one has arrived that has
brightness that rivals most lcds.. Also, they fact that my current pannys do not show detail well, and i hear that the f8500 is superb at showing detail.. Honestly, the only thing
that's making me hesitate is the plain looking bezel and that i may not be able to live with a set that buzzes too loudly.. The GT50 i have buzzes like crazy, but thats in my bedroom
and i barely even turn that tv on these days.. biggrin.gif

OK, I hear ya. I might disagree with you about the Pannys not showing detail well. I think they show detail, but the 8500 is obviously better in that regard. There's more detail, whether it's 'apparent' detail or real detail. Either way, the resolution charts may say one thing, but for most of us, our eyes say something totally different. When it's charts vs my eyes, my eyes win every time. wink.gif

I'm not sure there's any definitive data suggesting which panel has more or less buzz. You're probably safe to assume most of them buzz to an equal degree.
post #6522 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Just maybe there are sets that buzz more than other sets of the same model an make.

I think there was a long-standing feeling that altitude played some role in the magnitude of the buzzing. Best to not use it in outer-space.
post #6523 of 11459
No buzzing here
post #6524 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by shpankey View Post

No buzzing here
same here.
post #6525 of 11459
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by coresare View Post

I just received my second F8500 hoping this one wouldn't buzz as loud. Unfortunately the buzz is the same so I returned one. I'm suspecting they all do it and the people who claim they have no buzzing have terrible hearing. Depending on the angle of the tv in relationship to the ear does affect the volume of it.
Sounds like this is subject to a persons hearing, does not mean they have bad hearing, they just do not notice it. Maybe you have exceptional hearing and in this case is causing an issue ........ Glad most do not hear a buzz, that is for sure.
Edited by Cleveland Plasma - 5/19/13 at 9:45am
post #6526 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

I'm not sure there's any definitive data suggesting which panel has more or less buzz. You're probably safe to assume most of them buzz to an equal degree.

Most do have some buzzing but few are intolerable. My D8000 and VT50 PDPs are both silent. I was lucky.




Quote:
Originally Posted by geezuz747 View Post

Most of all,I think all the insults here do you guys more harm than good. I threw out the stuff about nerds after i took the time to write a review and was instantly attacked by zealots. I know the type and you people do more harm than good for your passion.

Yep, I confess. I used to be a straight shooter like yourself but twelve years in the US Marine Corps turned me into a nerd.



And what about you? Why so sensitive? You used to be such a nice, quiet boy asking for help back in 2006.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geezuz747 
It's been about 10 years since I rode a bike, but I've gotten the itch again and have decided to pick up a new bike. Was looking at a myriad number of bikes, but have narrowed it down to the Triumph Speedmaster or the America. I had a few questions and was hoping some of the experienced riders here could help me out:

1) I'm a pretty small dude... 5'8" and 150lbs. Are there any other riders approx. this size, and if so, have you found the SM/America models easy to handle? Or are they too large for a guy my size?

2) I will be doing a lot of urban riding, as I live right smack dab in the heart of downtown Seattle. Are these bikes safe for city riding with the foward set controls?

3) Also, plan to do some serious cruising this summer, am taking off 2 months from work to just ride all over the country. Will the America/SM be reliable for 5,000-8,000 miles of travel in a 2-month period?

Thanks in advance for any input. Have been reading this forum a lot the last few days, and have found tons of great info.

I can hardly wait to pick up one of these bikes, and have not been able to think about much else for the last few weeks. I have fallen completely in love with the entire Bonneville lineup from Triump, and find myself almost obsessed. My girlfriend has gotten tired of hearing about it and even threatened to breakup with me if I actually bought one (she's worried that I will get killed).

You knew more about Triumphs eight years ago than you know about TV displays today. If you'd ask questions rather than point fingers you might actually learn something. Although your subjective opinion is appreciated this is still a science forum.
post #6527 of 11459
^^^^^^

Thanks. smile.gif
post #6528 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by surfmlb View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Please do not waste a second of your life or your money replacing the cord or getting a line conditioner. I promise you neither of them will make an iota of difference (unless you are really susceptible to the placebo effect).

If your TV is making a racket, get a service tech out to see if they can help. Or return it.

But don't try a bunch of irrelevant fixes that have not been proved to work for anyone. And by proved, I mean "using a meter to show an A/B test where the sound is actually different by a discernible amount".

You have proof they don't work?
If I'm spending my money, I want proof that what ever I'm buying will do the job I have in mind. In the case of "magic" power cords, I would like to see double blind testing of any subjective performance claims. smile.gif

It's very simple. If you don't know which power cord is being used, can you tell the difference?
post #6529 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, I hear ya. I might disagree with you about the Pannys not showing detail well. I think they show detail, but the 8500 is obviously better in that regard. There's more detail, whether it's 'apparent' detail or real detail. Either way, the resolution charts may say one thing, but for most of us, our eyes say something totally different. When it's charts vs my eyes, my eyes win every time. wink.gif

I'm not sure there's any definitive data suggesting which panel has more or less buzz. You're probably safe to assume most of them buzz to an equal degree.

To be clear, when I say refer to "Pannys" I am just referring to the particular ones that I own.. Those definitely do not show great detail, compared to some of the older
panasonic models.. On some channels i will get a great image, but very few..
post #6530 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

It's one thing to express an impression and another to completely insult people. He'd rather cook steaks than care about how his TV looks because TV tech talk is for nerds, yet he's here making ridiculous claims and arguing over nerdy stuff, and then gets mad at us when we call bs.

I also never said he works for Samsung, in fact I wouldn't care if he did or not. His claims that the ST60 doesn't have detail, is dim, and has crappy color are flat out false. Yes, I think the F8500 is a better panel, but I won't sit around and be as subjective as I can about the issue and then get mad at people.

He says he owned both, and shared his opinions, and then said if other people owned both they'd see that it's true. However, I've owned both myself, have spent a lot of time with the ST60 played games on it and so on, and it simply wasn't as he described. The ST60 is a good panel, but it's not F8500 good. Still, it's a good panel, and when I played games on it in bright daylight scenes they looked bright and looked like they were during the day time. I don't know what else to say.


geezus, dude, I really don't care at this point. You're extremely condescending and insulting and yet you're saying we're insulting you because we think you're exaggerating, yet you sit there and call people who care about image quality dorks and geeks and nerds who don't have a life, as indicated by you have "better things to do" than give a crap about how a TV looks when calibrated and so on. I have stuff to do, too, and frankly you're wasting a lot of people's time by making the claims you're making. And again, I'm a F8500 owner, who returned a ST60, and I couldn't disagree with you more about your claims.


Anyway, enough of this. I'll be happy to talk about the F8500 objectively with anyone, even about how it compares to a ST60 or even a UT50, but as soon as it starts to go into fanboy territory I'm out of the discussion.

I think he was just a bit frustrated, because, like myself, we tend to go by reviews like Cnet's, not realizing that these reviewers, don't really review the TV in real world sinarios.. They just
use all these types of light meters and quickly just give the tv a once over, then proclaim it as the best TV on the planet earth, which once we get the tv home, is clearly not the case.. I cannot
back his claims about the ST60 being dim, but in Bestbuy, it sure was one of the dimmest tv's in the place. As for colors on the pannys, they are good in the sense of being accurate, but they
are not vivid, and not as bright as they should be, to give it pop, that only an lcd can provide, and hopefully now the f8500 smile.gif Obviously, this is all subjective..
post #6531 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, I hear ya. I might disagree with you about the Pannys not showing detail well. I think they show detail, but the 8500 is obviously better in that regard. There's more detail, whether it's 'apparent' detail or real detail. Either way, the resolution charts may say one thing, but for most of us, our eyes say something totally different. When it's charts vs my eyes, my eyes win every time. wink.gif

I'm not sure there's any definitive data suggesting which panel has more or less buzz. You're probably safe to assume most of them buzz to an equal degree.

To be clear, when I say refer to "Pannys" I am just referring to the particular ones that I own.. Those definitely do not show great detail, compared to some of the older
panasonic models.. On some channels i will get a great image, but very few..
That's a source difference. What about a fixed source, the same Blu-ray disk for instance, played on displays calibrated by the same professional calibrator. As soon as you move away from that standard, too many variables are added. The interesting thing about sharpness and the F8500 is the new sub pixel structure. There seems to be a good possibility that verifiable differences in sharpness are possible.

The thing that makes "sharpness" discussions at AVS difficult is that you never know for sure that the people reporting have their display setup correctly. All it takes is for overscan to be on and sharpness is changed. It's similar with IR. Very few people who report IR think to indicate exactly how they are seeing it - slides or programming.
post #6532 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony1 View Post

I think he was just a bit frustrated, because, like myself, we tend to go by reviews like Cnet's, not realizing that these reviewers, don't really review the TV in real world sinarios..
There are people who follow CNet advise, but at AVS I hope that there are more people who take what they read at CNet with a big dose of skepticism.
Quote:
They just use all these types of light meters and quickly just give the tv a once over, then proclaim it as the best TV on the planet earth, which once we get the tv home, is clearly not the case..
I think it is a good idea to separate the CNet type of reviews from the reviews done by professional calibrators who are active here at AVS. It's been my experience that "our" calibrators are very careful about the conclusions they draw about any particular display, and they have a lot more experience with displays than the folks at CNet. wink.gif
Quote:
I cannot back his claims about the ST60 being dim, but in Bestbuy, it sure was one of the dimmest tv's in the place.
We are lucky that we don't have to live with BB showroom lighting at home. eek.gif

For me what is important is how a display performs in my room, with the kinds of things I like to watch. With us it's football (me), hockey (my wife), and movies (both). Our display is professionally calibrated because we want to see the movies as close as possible to the intent of the director who created them. Everyone doesn't feel the same way. If they did there would be a lot more professional calibrators in the world. eek.gif
Quote:
As for colors on the pannys, they are good in the sense of being accurate, but they
are not vivid, and not as bright as they should be, to give it pop, that only an lcd can provide, and hopefully now the f8500 smile.gif Obviously, this is all subjective..
Right. smile.gif
post #6533 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

That's a source difference. What about a fixed source, the same Blu-ray disk for instance, played on displays calibrated by the same professional calibrator. As soon as you move away from that standard, too many variables are added. The interesting thing about sharpness and the F8500 is the new sub pixel structure. There seems to be a good possibility that verifiable differences in sharpness are possible.

The thing that makes "sharpness" discussions at AVS difficult is that you never know for sure that the people reporting have their display setup correctly. All it takes is for overscan to be on and sharpness is changed. It's similar with IR. Very few people who report IR think to indicate exactly how they are seeing it - slides or programming.

You may think I'm crazy, but even blurays don't look all that great to me on it.. When i compare certain programming that I'm watching, I usually compare it with the same exact channel
and same cable provider on different tvs.. Not even one person that has been over my house and has watched tv, has ever complimented the PQ of my vt50. The few that I've asked
have replied "eh it's ok" I've seen better".. mad.gif
post #6534 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

...I hope that there are more people who take what they read at CNet with a big dose of skepticism...

CNet couldn't even calibrate the F8500 properly, bless them. They (he) didn't do 10p due to some bogus anomaly. The calibration results looked like crap too.

2c
post #6535 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

CNet couldn't even calibrate the F8500 properly, bless them. They (he) didn't do 10p due to some bogus anomaly. The calibration results looked like crap too.

2c

well mr kats wanted to get through it as fast as he could. he was reviewing a Samsung after all.rolleyes.gif
post #6536 of 11459
hello guys

i just wonder how many of you have upgraded from kuro to samsung 8500? and how much the diffrence PQ wise, black and motion?

im trying to pull the trigger.
post #6537 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alkaizer View Post

hello guys

i just wonder how many of you have upgraded from kuro to samsung 8500? and how much the diffrence PQ wise, black and motion?

im trying to pull the trigger.

ken ross has in the past,not sure about any others. most kuro jumpers go with the Panasonics because they have much much better mll #'s.rolleyes.gif and don't care about any other positive attributes that the f8500 brings to the table.
post #6538 of 11459
^ Like a free pair of sunglasses to watch the TV with on a beach at 1:00pm. cool.gif
post #6539 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

^ Like a free pair of sunglasses to watch the TV with on a beach at 1:00pm. cool.gif

LOL...yup loving the dynamic range this pdp offers.
post #6540 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

ken ross has in the past,not sure about any others. most kuro jumpers go with the Panasonics because they have much much better mll #'s.rolleyes.gif and don't care about any other positive attributes that the f8500 brings to the table.
Well, there are some other Kuro upgraders even here in this thread who also feel differently than us neandtherals. For me, personally, the Kuro was bright enough, and I don't need something that supersedes its brightness. About the only thing I can imagine really craving is that Samsung video processing, and a Darlee Darblet does pretty well using similar image sharpening techniques should I find the Panasonic isn't sharp enough (again, lack of sharpness is not a concern I currently have with my Kuro).
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