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Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 228

post #6811 of 11459
I love this TV, I just wish the 3-D popping fix would come sooner.....
Don't let me down Samsung.
post #6812 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

Ok figured out the problem. The TV was in store mode. Now it is in Home mode. All is going well.

Some Pics smile.gif Sorry camera is not good but can give slight idea.
The contrast at 50 and still the pic is so punchy



As I said blacks in under bright lights retain their ink. Love that. No wash out



Loving the whites even in warm 2 color mode.



biggrin.gif:D:D

Do you plan on watching white scenes the whole time you own this set?
post #6813 of 11459
And away....we...go! biggrin.gif The hornet's nest has just been stirred. frown.gif
post #6814 of 11459
Are there variations between the different sizes? I heard the bigger panels have more aggressive ABL, is this true?
post #6815 of 11459
Hello All,

I've had my 60" F8500 for a little over two weeks now and have some thoughts and observations to share as well as a few questions.

Hours of Operation
I've been running slides pretty much 24/7 since taking ownership of the set, so I assume I have around 200 hours on it already. However, I would like to know for sure. Does anyone know how to check this on the F8500? I've only got the included touch remote and am hoping this info can be accessed from it.

Stand
When I first saw the F8500's Metal Flow stand in pictures I thought it looked awesome. When I saw it in person at CES I was underwhelmed by its dark grey complexion as I thought it would be black. But when I look at it in my living room on a black-brown color Ikea TV stand flanked by black-brown Ikea shelves and a pair of black speaker stands, I absolutely love it. The stand literally disappears when watching the set at night, which is more than I can say for my soon to be departing Pioneer Kuro 5020FD who's reflective piano black bezel was a magnet for picking up reflections, even from its own screen which would reflect horribly on the inside edges of the bezel in any lighting environment.

Having said all that, my F8500's stand appears to be missing one or more feet or pads. As such it is possible to make it wobble slightly with gently pushing on the set in either direction. The folks who delivered the set assembled it for me and I wonder if they forgot to place a rubber foot or two on the stand. Does anyone else have this experience?

Banding
My set absolutely has the now ubiquitous horizontal band. In fact, mine has two, one about one-third down from the top, and another about one-third up from the bottom. They are rather faint and only show up in a small amount of content, but still, for a nearly $3k TV I would prefer it if they were not there at all. I've seen a total of five different F8500s in my area and all have the band when displaying a full white screen slide. I've yet to see an F8500 without the band although many insist they have sets sans band.

Can anyone fathom any rhyme or reason as to what the band is and if it is truly possible to get a set without it? I wonder if those who claim there's has no band are not looking at a full screen white slide? This is where it is very obvious to see if the band is there or not.

Set Top Box Pt. 1 - Screen Size
The first issue I'm having with my DirecTV HR23-700 DVR and the F8500 is one of screen size. With the F8500 in Screen Fit mode, when playing Blu-rays or content from my HTPC or the set's Smart Hub the material fits perfectly to the screen with only the normal small black border of screen space around it (as is usual for plasmas). However, when my DirecTV HR23-700 DVR is playing back there is extra empty black space on the top of the screen, maybe quarter to a half of an inch. I've tried using the set's screen move utility to move the picture up, but still it looks a little off.

All devices are connected to my Pioneer receiver via HDMI which in turn is connected to the F8500's HDMI Input 1. Could this screen fit issue be due to my specific receiver? Anyone had a similar issue?

Set Top Box Pt. 2 - Motion Judder Canceler
The second issue I'm having with my DVR and the F8500 is that when Motion Judder Canceler is turned on I get 'dancing' or 'squirming' text and menus including subtitles, credits, and the DirecTV guide. This does not happen at all on Blu-rays or other sources. Anyone seen this?

Buzzing
My F8500 absolutely buzzes, no question about it. It is about the same as my 5020FD but is much more directional. In fact, it greatly increases in volume and pitch when I turn my heard hard left so that my right ear is squarely facing the screen. And the buzz all but disappears when I turn my head hard right so my left ear is facing the screen. Weird. I'm wondering, does anyone under the age of 40-ish have a set that absolutely does not buzz? I ask because of the typical high frequency hearing loss starting with adults around 35-40. I wonder if those who claim their set does not buzz are over 40 and simply cannot hear the buzz (which begs the age old question, if you cannot hear the buzz, does the plasma actually buzz?).

Blacks
I've got an HDMI splitter hooked up to send equal signals to my F8500 and my 5020FD, and much to my surprise, the Samsung held its own against the Pioneer. I should qualify that statement by saying I have no light meters or scientific instruments of any kind and that neither set has been professionally calibrated (although both were tweaked with the Disney WOW disc). What I saw was the F8500 actually showed better black level where the screen was mostly black, like when credits roll and such. Blacks levels otherwise were damn close and difficult to discern between the two with both sets appearing slightly stronger in various scenes. The F8500 did not have a reddish tinge to its blacks which my Pioneer does exhibit quite obviously (which affects black bars and also on screen content).

One aspect of the F8500's blacks that I'm disappointed in, however, is how they hold up at night in my very dark living room. When there is bright content on screen black bars absolutely disappear (which is the affect I am after) giving the illusion that the image is floating since the bezel completely disappears as well. However, when there is moderate to dark content on screen the black bars look a shade of dark grey and are clearly visible.

To be fair, the 5020FD performed basically the same (albeit with an undesirable reddish tinge), and I am not sure if the VT/ZT 60 would perform any better given the similar MLL numbers that I've read in various reviews. Or would said MLL, however small it may be, make a difference in a case like black bars in a very dark room?

Contrast
When I tweaked the set from the WOW disc I found that I was not able to make the white stars disappear in the test pattern, even with the Contrast set to 100, so that's where I've left it. Thoughts?

3D
The actual full 1080p 3D is stunning. I've recently watched Hugo and Life of Pi in 3D on the F8500 and was blown away each time, albeit with some crosstalk in the picture (especially Hugo). So then I went out and bought Dredd 3D after reading how stellar it looked in 3D on another site by a professional reviewer. What I saw was a mostly flat image that lacked any 3D depth at all outside of a few shots in the movie's intro. In fact, after about 30 minutes into the film I switched over to the 2D flick and watched it in 2D --> 3D conversion for the rest of the way which I thought looked far better (but still not very good) than the actual 3D presentation. And this movie was supposedly filmed natively in 3D. Anyone experience similar with Dredd 3D?
post #6816 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Yellow doesn't work well on my monitor wink.gif.

Tough. Get over it.tongue.gif Blue doesn't work on mine. biggrin.gif

Larry
Blue on blue used to be a cute trick on the original IBM color monitor that some of us used with the first IBM PC model B computer. biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRWalker View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Yellow doesn't work well on my monitor wink.gif.

Just select the text with your mouse and it will be readable.
I didn't know that still worked. wink.gif

Given my age and the twenty nine years I've used personal computers it's a wonder I still remember my name. tongue.gif

Yellow on a white background would have failed the HDMI class that I once taught. eek.gif

Anyway, the hidden message was very worthwhile. cool.gif
Edited by htwaits - 5/22/13 at 12:43am
post #6817 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watcher12 View Post

Set Top Box Pt. 1 - Screen Size
The first issue I'm having with my DirecTV HR23-700 DVR and the F8500 is one of screen size. With the F8500 in Screen Fit mode, when playing Blu-rays or content from my HTPC or the set's Smart Hub the material fits perfectly to the screen with only the normal small black border of screen space around it (as is usual for plasmas). However, when my DirecTV HR23-700 DVR is playing back there is extra empty black space on the top of the screen, maybe quarter to a half of an inch. I've tried using the set's screen move utility to move the picture up, but still it looks a little off.

All devices are connected to my Pioneer receiver via HDMI which in turn is connected to the F8500's HDMI Input 1. Could this screen fit issue be due to my specific receiver? Anyone had a similar issue?

Let me guess... You're using 1:1 pixel mode for broadcast TV, and if you're paying attention, the border(s) varies in size and location as you change channels, and sometimes contains junk. If so, the border(s) would be hidden by engaging overscan, which many broadcasters assume is in effect. (And it's not just SD channels that show junk in the overscan areas; my local NBC HD channel shows some white pixels in it at all times in HD content.) I always engage overscan for broadcast TV, because I hate the glitches and the varying borders, and I can't tell any difference in sharpness for this source. For Bluray and other non-broadcast content, I always disable overscan.
Quote:
Buzzing
My F8500 absolutely buzzes, no question about it. It is about the same as my 5020FD but is much more directional. In fact, it greatly increases in volume and pitch when I turn my heard hard left so that my right ear is squarely facing the screen. And the buzz all but disappears when I turn my head hard right so my left ear is facing the screen. Weird. I'm wondering, does anyone under the age of 40-ish have a set that absolutely does not buzz? I ask because of the typical high frequency hearing loss starting with adults around 35-40. I wonder if those who claim their set does not buzz are over 40 and simply cannot hear the buzz (which begs the age old question, if you cannot hear the buzz, does the plasma actually buzz?).

And. Here. We. Go.
Quote:
Blacks
I've got an HDMI splitter hooked up to send equal signals to my F8500 and my 5020FD, and much to my surprise, the Samsung held its own against the Pioneer. I should qualify that statement by saying I have no light meters or scientific instruments of any kind and that neither set has been professionally calibrated (although both were tweaked with the Disney WOW disc). What I saw was the F8500 actually showed better black level where the screen was mostly black, like when credits roll and such. Blacks levels otherwise were damn close and difficult to discern between the two with both sets appearing slightly stronger in various scenes. The F8500 did not have a reddish tinge to its blacks which my Pioneer does exhibit quite obviously (which affects black bars and also on screen content).

One aspect of the F8500's blacks that I'm disappointed in, however, is how they hold up at night in my very dark living room. When there is bright content on screen black bars absolutely disappear (which is the affect I am after) giving the illusion that the image is floating since the bezel completely disappears as well. However, when there is moderate to dark content on screen the black bars look a shade of dark grey and are clearly visible.

To be fair, the 5020FD performed basically the same (albeit with an undesirable reddish tinge), and I am not sure if the VT/ZT 60 would perform any better given the similar MLL numbers that I've read in various reviews. Or would said MLL, however small it may be, make a difference in a case like black bars in a very dark room?

My thinking is that it would not make a huge difference. I have an ST60, which is between the F8500 and ZT60 per HDTVtest, and the black bars are as you describe.
Quote:
Contrast
When I tweaked the set from the WOW disc I found that I was not able to make the white stars disappear in the test pattern, even with the Contrast set to 100, so that's where I've left it. Thoughts?

Following the Contrast setting procedure WOW recommends (making the two rightmost white bars merge) results in my ST60 outputting 54 fL for a 5% white window, which is way too bright for dark room viewing. I'm not sure about the stars, but with Contrast at 100, you're probably maximizing the buzzing and may have a picture that's too bright.
post #6818 of 11459
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

Let me guess... You're using 1:1 pixel mode for broadcast TV, and if you're paying attention, the border(s) varies in size and location as you change channels, and sometimes contains junk. If so, the border(s) would be hidden by engaging overscan, which many broadcasters assume is in effect. (And it's not just SD channels that show junk in the overscan areas; my local NBC HD channel shows some white pixels in it at all times in HD content.) I always engage overscan for broadcast TV, because I hate the glitches and the varying borders, and I can't tell any difference in sharpness for this source. For Bluray and other non-broadcast content, I always disable overscan.
And. Here. We. Go.
My thinking is that it would not make a huge difference. I have an ST60, which is between the F8500 and ZT60 per HDTVtest, and the black bars are as you describe.
Following the Contrast setting procedure WOW recommends (making the two rightmost white bars merge) results in my ST60 outputting 54 fL for a 5% white window, which is way too bright for dark room viewing. I'm not sure about the stars, but with Contrast at 100, you're probably maximizing the buzzing and may have a picture that's too bright.

Thanks for the replies. I am using 1:1 mode for TV through my DVR. I do not see any junk you or white lines at all, just the empty space on top of the screen. I do not watch SD, though.

Reducing Contrast even down to 40 makes no difference in the buzz.
post #6819 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watcher12 View Post

Thanks for the replies. I am using 1:1 mode for TV through my DVR. I do not see any junk you or white lines at all, just the empty space on top of the screen. I do not watch SD, though.

That's broadcaster variance, and again, it's not limited to SD, which I rarely watch. Border noise is ever-present on my local NBC station in all HD programs and has been for at least six years. I've also seen different border garbage on CBS and Palladia, also HD channels. Anyway, there doesn't have to be garbage in the borders for there to be borders, which the broadcaster expects to be hid by overscanning. Some people put up with the glitches and borders because they think it gives them the most perfect picture, never mind all the processing and compression applied to broadcast TV. Like I said, I hate the glitches and changing borders, and I can't tell the difference in sharpness or composition for this source, so I always use overscannning for broadcast TV (and only broadcast TV).
Quote:
Reducing Contrast even down to 40 makes no difference in the buzz.

Then that's different than the two ST60s and one S60 I've had in the house. Their buzz tracks the APL, such that dark scenes have negligible buzz, while bright scenes can buzz pretty loudly even at 10'. Reducing Contrast decreases the buzzing in bright scenes. So do the Samsungs have a constant buzz? A good test would be D-nice's slides, which go from dark gray to white.
post #6820 of 11459
Quote:
That's broadcaster variance, and again, it's not limited to SD, which I rarely watch. Border noise is ever-present on my local NBC station in all HD programs and has been for at least six years. I've also seen different border garbage on CBS and Palladia, also HD channels. Anyway, there doesn't have to be garbage in the borders for there to be borders, which the broadcaster expects to be hid by overscanning. Some people put up with the glitches and borders because they think it gives them the most perfect picture, never mind all the processing and compression applied to broadcast TV. Like I said, I hate the glitches and changing borders, and I can't tell the difference in sharpness or composition for this source, so I always use overscannning for broadcast TV (and only broadcast TV).

I don't watch broadcast TV and 95% of the TV I do watch are not the major networks. Having said that, my issue is not with garbage or junk on the top of the screen (never seen that), but rather its the small black gap of empty space at the top which is there on every single channel and with what enabling Motion Judder Canceller does to text and the DirecTV guide which leads me to believe its an issue with my DVR. FWIW I did not have these issues with the same DVR on the 5020FD.
Quote:
Then that's different than the two ST60s and one S60 I've had in the house. Their buzz tracks the APL, such that dark scenes have negligible buzz, while bright scenes can buzz pretty loudly even at 10'. Reducing Contrast decreases the buzzing in bright scenes. So do the Samsungs have a constant buzz? A good test would be D-nice's slides, which go from dark gray to white.

The buzz is about the same on all of the slides.
post #6821 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Watcher12 View Post

I don't watch broadcast TV and 95% of the TV I do watch are not the major networks. Having said that, my issue is not with garbage or junk on the top of the screen (never seen that), but rather its the small black gap of empty space at the top which is there on every single channel and with what enabling Motion Judder Canceller does to text and the DirecTV guide which leads me to believe its an issue with my DVR.

I thought I was pretty clear in stating that borders don't need to have noise in them to be borders, and Palladia, which I mentioned, is not a "major network". I really don't know what other channels it occurs on beyond the ones I mentioned, as I solved these problems about six years ago by enabling overscanning for broadcast TV so I never see them. I recently re-verified why I'm doing that by checking NBC, CBS, and a handful of other other channels, which is where I observed borders of various sizes and positions, with noise in NBC and CBS. And to be clear, by "Broadcast TV" I mean all TV channels from major networks to AMC to ESPN to whatever.
Quote:
FWIW I did not have these issues with the same DVR on the 5020FD.

Was the 5020FD overscanning? If so, there's your answer. If not, I have no idea.
post #6822 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Then tell me this, Mark. The ZT max's out at 30 FtL. The headroom is where?????

The Cnet review referred to a 43.3 ft/L output on the ZT60 in THX Bright Room with a window pattern. I was basing it off that.

I haven't seen a ZT live, but my VT50 is calibrated to low 40s for ISF Day and -- again -- the vast majority of the time, the effect of ABL is either (a) not even there or (b) not noticeable without some A/B testing. Clearly, there are some people who have developed a sensitivity to this and wish to make it seem like it's the only important feature in a plasma purchase. But since the tens of millions of plasmas purchased until weeks ago did not include the Samsung F8500, there is a very strong reason to believe the vast, vast majority of buyers do not find this particularly important.

More significantly, there is substantial reason to believe that by last year, the effects were already mitigated on real content for the vast majority of real viewers.

Please note that if you indeed calibrate to max light output -- whatever that is -- and then display even substantially white screens, ABL will kick in. The question is not whether one can notice this, it's whether this is an unqualified "bad". Often times, it just isn't and, in fact, the alternative of just having searing whites at, say, 60 ft/L would in fact be worse.
post #6823 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

I thought I was pretty clear in stating that borders don't need to have noise in them to be borders, and Palladia, which I mentioned, is not a "major network". I really don't know what other channels it occurs on beyond the ones I mentioned, as I solved these problems about six years ago by enabling overscanning for broadcast TV so I never see them. I recently re-verified why I'm doing that by checking NBC, CBS, and a handful of other other channels, which is where I observed borders of various sizes and positions, with noise in NBC and CBS. And to be clear, by "Broadcast TV" I mean all TV channels from major networks to AMC to ESPN to whatever.
Was the 5020FD overscanning? If so, there's your answer. If not, I have no idea.

The 5020FD was not overscanning. It was in dot-by-dot mode which is the same as Samsung''s Screen Fit mode. I have no idea what 'border' you're talking about. I',m not seeing a border. Again, I'm geting a black row of 'blank' pixels on the top of my screen when watching any content from my DirecTV HR23-700. I know someone with a 64" F8500 and a DirecTV HR24 and he does not have this problem in Screen Fit mode. Therefore, I assume my issue has something to do with my DVR and I'd like to see if others with similar setups have seen the issue.
post #6824 of 11459
Update:
- OK I heard the buzz biggrin.gif. very very slight but not in normal condition. I had to move the TV in the cabinet and place my head right behind the screen biggrin.gif and heard very very slight buzz
Now I know what is a plasma's buzz. biggrin.gif Was curious to hear it just to know about it as this is my first plasma. However I cannot hear anything from the front of the screen even when I place my ear on the screen while the volume is on mute

- The TV is hot from behind specially when touched on the upper left, but I guess that is normal for a plasma

- Last night was watching The Queen on my queen and it looked magnificent wink.gif
Been playing it on loop just to get more hours.

- One more thing, The bezel is plastic, Can't remember who said that but he was right. Cheap looking? No, Looking at it just looks it is the same as the Aluminum stand.

The camera doesn't show the beauty of the set.
The light that comes through the door is affecting the camera lens, In real that effect is totally not there and the blacks are inky and beautiful.



post #6825 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSIG1001 View Post

Do you plan on watching white scenes the whole time you own this set?

I don't watch colors be it black or whites. I watch movies with the different colors they come in.
post #6826 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by cooknl View Post

Hali,

Glad to see you got youre Baby (tv)... I wish you the best of luck with the new KING.

Rob

Thank you Rob, Appreciate it
post #6827 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by edgeh2o View Post

My 60F8500 just got delivered. Starting to open the box and figure out which size bolts I need for my mount.

Couple quick questions- What are the blanking brackets for? And is everyone using the ferrite cores?

Congratulations and good luck with your set
post #6828 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

90, really? That would burn images into my brain for years. I don't think I could bare to look at it with such a high contrast setting.

Also, from my personal observations, the more you push a panel, the easier it gets IR depending on the content. For example, a cross hatch pattern on a Panny at 30 fL didn't really leave stubborn IR, but as soon as I switched to service mode, which for some reason increases panel brightness by about 10 to 15 fL and of course defaults to Vivid pushing the set into about 60 fL, that cross hatch was on my screen for about an hour from simply browsing all the service menu options.

Halimali, congrats on your TV today. Let me know if you see any line bleed will you? Thanks!

Hey Moon thank you. No line bleed here.
This TV is so bright. In a dark room I have reduced the contrast and cell light to make it more comfortable. During day I increase them to a good level.
As long as you have the control then no need to worry.
post #6829 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by mightymouseusf View Post

Hali, congrats on the new set. Please to enjoy it. With regards to banding and buzz...don't LOOK for it. If you don't notice it while watching regularly, you have nothing to gain by LOOKING for problems. I can't tell you the amount of times in my life I've had a product I've loved, and then someone mentions a flaw I never noticed, then I can't notice anything else. Just sit back and enjoy your new awesome tv.

Thank you mighty. I was just curious about the buzz. At least to hear it once to know what people are talking about. I looked for banding but did not see anything. I guess in slides nothing was showing as well as in that episode of Planet Earth. So I'm fine.
Will not look for trouble anymore biggrin.gif
post #6830 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Sounds great Hali. I can check off those first 3 too. smile.gif

Robert delivered mine this afternoon via Lisandro, who did his typical great job moving and wall-mounting my Sharp Elite in the bedroom. Thanks to Robert, Wendy and crew for another job well done.

Hali, not sure why yours is going back to dynamic. Mine updated the camera twice when I turned it off and back on again, but it's stable now.

BTW, I can attest to the fact that one of the updates rolled in an improvement in judder mitigation. I didn't let it update at the beginning to establish a baseline and I noticed a significant amount of judder that bothered me. The judder controls just gave me a bit more of the SOE than I would have liked. I then let it go through the firmware update and noticed a very dramatic reduction in judder. I now can leave the judder reduction off. Nice. smile.gif

Robert called me early this evening to see how things were going and he confirmed that the update did have an improvement to judder.

I've got a business trip tomorrow, so I won't have any time to play before the weekend. Thus far, I'm really happy with this panel. smile.gif

Hey Ken, Glad that you got your set and glad to see you happy.
Mine was going to dynamic because it was in store mode. So changed it now and it is great.

Thank you for the good news on the update. You are our main source for good news smile.gif
I hope you will have a blast this weekend with the TV
post #6831 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

Update:
- OK I heard the buzz biggrin.gif. very very slight but not in normal condition. I had to move the TV in the cabinet and place my head right behind the screen biggrin.gif and heard very very slight buzz
Now I know what is a plasma's buzz. biggrin.gif Was curious to hear it just to know about it as this is my first plasma. However I cannot hear anything from the front of the screen even when I place my ear on the screen while the volume is on mute

- The TV is hot from behind specially when touched on the upper left, but I guess that is normal for a plasma

- Last night was watching The Queen on my queen and it looked magnificent wink.gif
Been playing it on loop just to get more hours.

- One more thing, The bezel is plastic, Can't remember who said that but he was right. Cheap looking? No, Looking at it just looks it is the same as the Aluminum stand.

The camera doesn't show the beauty of the set.
The light that comes through the door is affecting the camera lens, In real that effect is totally not there and the blacks are inky and beautiful.



Y needs a serious calibration takes seriously 'cause the image to Magenta / Blue ... eek.gif
You have calibrated your camera ? wink.gif
post #6832 of 11459
I know I will be killed now for saying this biggrin.gif
But last night I watched two episodes of The Golden Girls (DVD) on the set. And they looked fine. However when I used the advanced options i.e. MPEG Noise Filter and Digital Clean View and set them both to auto it made a big difference to the picture quality. All the noise and artifacts were gone and it smoothed the picture in a huge way. I also applied the SOE biggrin.gif i.e the Judder canceler and it even became smoother.
I feel for DVDs specially TV shows this will be very beneficial at least to me. I know many here hate the SOE and I do too for movies but I can see it makes a huge difference when it comes to SD material. Specially when the source is not that good. It improves it by making it smoother, so you get a cleaner looking picture minus the artifacts and the unwanted noise.
post #6833 of 11459
I've been playing with my F8500 for about 12 hours now.

Buzzing: I'm sitting 11.5ft away, dead center of the screen. It's not like I can merely hear a sound introduced that is the difference between dead silence and not silent. It's highly audible, annoying, and distinct. If I lean 10" to the left, the buzzing is practically non-existent and becomes merely the difference between dead silence and not silent. If I lean 10" to the right, the buzzing becomes even more apparent, all the way until about 2ft to the right, when it becomes a non-issue again. I'm hoping I'll get used to the buzzing to the point where it wont bother me.

Handshake: My Onkyo TX-SR707 hates my F8500. I have my F8500 connected to my Onkyo's HDMI OUT. I have my PC, Bluray, and Uverse connected to my Onkyo's HDMI IN's. Receiver is set to pass-through. It took me 20 minutes to get a picture on my TV of my computer. I tried 2 different HDMI cables, and what finally did it was randomly turning on and off my receiver multiple times in a row. I then noticed my computer's image was too dark, it was in some other pixel mode, so I went into AMD's Catalyst Control Panel and set it to RGB limited. After this the TV could not bring up the image again, and said could not find source or whatever. I had to turn my receiver on and off about 10 times for the image to come back on the screen. The picture settings at least looked good now that I changed it to RGB limited. I then switched to my Bluray player input on the receiver. No picture. Turned off and on my receiver numerous times to get it to come up. Started playing a movie and noticed I didn't have any Cinema Smooth control (was curious). My Bluray was set at 60p, not 24p, so I changed it to 24p but then again, the TV said it couldn't find the source. Turned receiver on and off more than 10 times for the picture to come back up. In fact, every time I switch to a new input on my Onkyo, it says no signal. Ridiculous. I'll probably get a new Denon receiver soon, if my Onkyo is any indication of how it is going to treat newer TV sets.

Black screen: On a completely black screen, my TV is not quite uniform. There are 2 horizontal whitish bands across the screen that can be seen. Enabling black optimizer 'dark room' helps significantly.

Brightness: This TV is super bright. Changed to movie mode and cell light 16, brightness 49 (anything less and bar 17 won't flash on the AVS calibration video file), contrast 93 (still playing around). Can't see anyone ever needing a TV brighter than this.

96hz/60hz: 60hz is definitely the way to go. 96hz introduced a little too much judder. After switching back and fourth for a while, and finally leaving it on 60hz, there were some artifacts that weren't there before I started switching back and fourth. Might be my bluray player.

The only movie I've completely watched so far is Run Lola Run, with some friends. It definitely isn't anything special video quality wise, but it did look spectacular. Colors seemed spot on. Watched a bunch of Uverse also, which looked very good (for Uverse). When watching Uverse, I can set Film Mode to off, auto1, or auto2. A few searches find some people using auto1 and some using auto2. Cnet said they couldn't get 1080i sources to deinterlace properly without using auto1. I don't think I notice a different between any of them for Uverse, is that normal? I inputted pie's and then cnet's color space/white settings, but when watching John Carter the landscape looked too yellow. I changed back to default and it looked better, but a bit too red. I then changed to warm1 which made it look slightly better again.

The Smart suite is great. I've tried out the Youtube, Pandora, TED, and Web Browser. Everything was smooth, fast, and great quality. It could almost replace my computer... which I use for music and youtube/hulu/etc. I also hooked up a wireless keyboard/mouse to the USB and found it worked great.

Over the next few days I plan on watching Drive, Tron, Prometheus, the Fountain, the Fall, District 9, and Children of Men.



The only thing that would make me want to return this TV is the buzzing... I have the ferrite core installed and a Panamax power conditioner but that doesn't seem to help.

For anyone using a receiver, have you run into this crazy handshake problem and if not, what receiver are you using?
post #6834 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Urga View Post

Y needs a serious calibration takes seriously 'cause the image to Magenta / Blue ... eek.gif
You have calibrated your camera ? wink.gif

Haha. you are right. The cam is not good. Its snapped from my phone.
I can see the difference when I'm taking the picture from phone and from real. I will try a different cam next time
post #6835 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post




Congrats I'm glad to hear you are enjoying your set.

Question. How much light is in your room here. It looks like you have a window or something directly across from the display almost. slightly off to the left but no direct light really coming in. Looks like it is coming in from the side (right side). How often are you getting reflections like that when you have dark images on screen?

Also your not one of those people that leave the stickers on right biggrin.gif
post #6836 of 11459
if you work in manual on your camera, you must provide recreate the image you have of your screen as fair as possible ... cool.gif
post #6837 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammie2980 View Post

Congrats I'm glad to hear you are enjoying your set.

Question. How much light is in your room here. It looks like you have a window or something directly across from the display almost. slightly off to the left but no direct light really coming in. Looks like it is coming in from the side (right side). How often are you getting reflections like that when you have dark images on screen?

Also your not one of those people that leave the stickers on right biggrin.gif

Thank you.
From the right side there is a door which is half glass and the light comes through it. Then I have two big windows. What you are seeing in the picture is because the light is hitting the camera lens and creating a fog like effect. The TV's screen is not exposed to direct light as it is in the cabinet.

biggrin.gif No I don't leave the stickers. But will keep them for the next 3 days just in case there is any problem so they can take back the TV in the same condition as it was set. This looks like a keeper so far.
post #6838 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Hi Pie - You make a good point, and as I said, 90 +/- 5 for Samsungs.

The 2012 Shootout had all displays at 35 Foot Lamberts peak luminance so it would be "fair". With the 2013 ZT60 outputting 30 FtL vs 59 for the F8500 everything changed and the Shootout became a little, ummmm, disingenuous. None the less, the calibrators have integrity and I think the 90 Contrast number was a trade off for the best way they could work the 10 point although that was not specifically stated that I am aware of. The bottom line is that the new Samsung PDP pixel technology beats everything this year, but, if a customer who is going to view in a totally light controlled environment asks, I'll tell him to get a ZT60. For all other environments, even with one light bulb illuminated, I say get the 8500.

Teaser - I "hear" that it is possible to get the 64 for less than 28 hundred. n/k eek.gif

Buzzard in your opinion at what lux in room light would one calibrate a display to 59ftL Or is this even factored in. I would assume one would have a a reference point. Instead of just going as high as possible before it starts clipping whites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Notes: Quote: Me

Windows - Pan 10-18% non APL // Samsung use APL patterns (and, duh?) LCD - full screen....... tongue.gif

I thought with panasonics you can use APL as long as it would trigger a consistent ABL. That was the case for the VT30's at least. never calibrated a 50 and I haven't received my 60 yet. I know they said they behave similar to the 2011 models.

Does the Samsungs use Small or Large patterns or does it even matter since it doesn't have the aggressive ABL like Panasonic's do?
post #6839 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by edgeh2o View Post

I've been playing with my F8500 for about 12 hours now.

Buzzing: I'm sitting 11.5ft away, dead center of the screen. It's not like I can merely hear a sound introduced that is the difference between dead silence and not silent. It's highly audible, annoying, and distinct. If I lean 10" to the left, the buzzing is practically non-existent and becomes merely the difference between dead silence and not silent. If I lean 10" to the right, the buzzing becomes even more apparent, all the way until about 2ft to the right, when it becomes a non-issue again. I'm hoping I'll get used to the buzzing to the point where it wont bother me.

Handshake: My Onkyo TX-SR707 hates my F8500. I have my F8500 connected to my Onkyo's HDMI OUT. I have my PC, Bluray, and Uverse connected to my Onkyo's HDMI IN's. Receiver is set to pass-through. It took me 20 minutes to get a picture on my TV of my computer. I tried 2 different HDMI cables, and what finally did it was randomly turning on and off my receiver multiple times in a row. I then noticed my computer's image was too dark, it was in some other pixel mode, so I went into AMD's Catalyst Control Panel and set it to RGB limited. After this the TV could not bring up the image again, and said could not find source or whatever. I had to turn my receiver on and off about 10 times for the image to come back on the screen. The picture settings at least looked good now that I changed it to RGB limited. I then switched to my Bluray player input on the receiver. No picture. Turned off and on my receiver numerous times to get it to come up. Started playing a movie and noticed I didn't have any Cinema Smooth control (was curious). My Bluray was set at 60p, not 24p, so I changed it to 24p but then again, the TV said it couldn't find the source. Turned receiver on and off more than 10 times for the picture to come back up. In fact, every time I switch to a new input on my Onkyo, it says no signal. Ridiculous. I'll probably get a new Denon receiver soon, if my Onkyo is any indication of how it is going to treat newer TV sets.

Black screen: On a completely black screen, my TV is not quite uniform. There are 2 horizontal whitish bands across the screen that can be seen. Enabling black optimizer 'dark room' helps significantly.

Brightness: This TV is super bright. Changed to movie mode and cell light 16, brightness 49 (anything less and bar 17 won't flash on the AVS calibration video file), contrast 93 (still playing around). Can't see anyone ever needing a TV brighter than this.

96hz/60hz: 60hz is definitely the way to go. 96hz introduced a little too much judder. After switching back and fourth for a while, and finally leaving it on 60hz, there were some artifacts that weren't there before I started switching back and fourth. Might be my bluray player.

The only movie I've completely watched so far is Run Lola Run, with some friends. It definitely isn't anything special video quality wise, but it did look spectacular. Colors seemed spot on. Watched a bunch of Uverse also, which looked very good (for Uverse). When watching Uverse, I can set Film Mode to off, auto1, or auto2. A few searches find some people using auto1 and some using auto2. Cnet said they couldn't get 1080i sources to deinterlace properly without using auto1. I don't think I notice a different between any of them for Uverse, is that normal? I inputted pie's and then cnet's color space/white settings, but when watching John Carter the landscape looked too yellow. I changed back to default and it looked better, but a bit too red. I then changed to warm1 which made it look slightly better again.

The Smart suite is great. I've tried out the Youtube, Pandora, TED, and Web Browser. Everything was smooth, fast, and great quality. It could almost replace my computer... which I use for music and youtube/hulu/etc. I also hooked up a wireless keyboard/mouse to the USB and found it worked great.

Over the next few days I plan on watching Drive, Tron, Prometheus, the Fountain, the Fall, District 9, and Children of Men.



The only thing that would make me want to return this TV is the buzzing... I have the ferrite core installed and a Panamax power conditioner but that doesn't seem to help.

For anyone using a receiver, have you run into this crazy handshake problem and if not, what receiver are you using?

How about the faint horizontal band issue? Is it there? Do you have it?
post #6840 of 11459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

Thank you.
From the right side there is a door which is half glass and the light comes through it. Then I have two big windows. What you are seeing in the picture is because the light is hitting the camera lens and creating a fog like effect. The TV's screen is not exposed to direct light as it is in the cabinet.

biggrin.gif No I don't leave the stickers. But will keep them for the next 3 days just in case there is any problem so they can take back the TV in the same condition as it was set. This looks like a keeper so far.

OK so you don't get light, but what about reflections. I guess that is from the camera angle and light in the room. I'm just trying to get an idea of what is causing those reflections in the dark area. The 8500 is still on short list if ZT doesnt work out lol
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