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Further Modernizing my HT Experience

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
I used to have a HTPC many years ago and it always took up lots of my time tweaking and fixing things, and it was noisy. Also, I used to have lots of time to tinker back then but now lack the time and patience for all that. I'd rather pay more to just have something work good out of the box.

I've heard things have changed since then with HTPCs.

Since those days (6+ years now) I've been using two networked media tanks (Popcorn Hour A110 & A200), and they really do work great for mkv file playback from my 4TB NAS server.

However, the PCHs do not do (or do well) a few things I would like. Mostly these things are about what modern smart TVs do, and that's where I'd like to move my media experience towards.

Here is a list of the more important ones:

1. easy access to youtube (and maybe other sites) and display with better quality than what I geet from hooking my ipad up via apple a/v hdmi cable
I should mention I live in Canada, so some great content (like Hulu, etc.) is not available here

2. Nice slick GUI interface with movie art, music album art, music playlists, etc. without need to do endless tweaking to get it right.

3. FLAC music file playback with iPad/iPhone control - or at least from some display (so I don't need to turn my projector on)

4. Capability to access paid content beyond my mkv files

5. Control of entire system via iOS device (but I would settle for a good solution invovling harmony remote or even HT keyboard/mouse/trackball) - but user interface is a key part of this solution for me...currenlty using Harmony remote and it works good

6. Improve picture quality over PCHs (currently use Epson 1080UB projector)


As secondary options I would consider (depending on ability to get these functions all in one box or not):

A. PVR for cable TV - but don't necessarily want to go to huge expense to do this with separate card and local HDD, etc.

B. Bluray disc player - i don't own many as most content


Options I've considered and would like some opinion on:

1. Keeping one PCH and replacing other with a HTPC
If this is the best option, I'd like ot hear about which HTPC option is best.
Are Assassin's builds the best guides to follow?

2. Keeping my existing PCHs and adding Apple TV or Roku

3. Keeping my existing PCHs and adding a Sonos Connect (would only fix my music need, albeit in a fantastic manner)

4. Replacing PCHs with newer PCH boxes (A300, A400 or C300)
post #2 of 21
You don't mention what your current audio system is. Current generation receivers include many of the features you mention, including control by iOS Apps and Web interfaces. They don't provide direct access to networked video sources, though, just to networked audio.

The least expensive thing to try might be Sony's new Blu-ray player, the BDP-s5100, which is already readily available in Canada. It costs slightly over $100 and includes support for YouTube HD, for example, as well as many other networked sources, including local DLNA servers.

HTPCs are still finicky. While one can be made into a simple push-button experience for the rest of the household, the person configuring it has many choices to make. (Personally, I use a laptop with an FHD display, Nvidia graphics and DisplayPort/HDMI output connected to a receiver, but my expectations are more limited than yours.)
post #3 of 21
Thread Starter 
My audio system is just the flac files on my NAS streamed through my popcorn box to my marantz sr7002 receiver.

Video is the same but the files of course are mkv.
post #4 of 21
Thread Starter 
Ok, so I've ventured down the road of building an HTPC:

Parts:
i3-3225
Gigabyte H77M-D3H
G.Skill RipjawsX 1600 2x2GB
Silverstone GD05B case
Antec 380w Greenwatts PSU
AData 120GB SSD (50GB for boot partition)

So far I'm using Assassin's guides and have installed Windows 7, an dconfigure MCE and MediaBrowser.

I also purchased one of those Lenovo RF Keyboard/Mouse things but I'm 25 feet away from the HTPC and it isn't working very well at all (not very smooth and often doesn't respond).

I'm wondering if anyone can suggest a solid keyboard/mouse/trackball keyboard for couch use that works well?

But I'll likey get a Harmony remote for regular navigation of MCE and Mediabrowser.
post #5 of 21
I've never had the trouble you mention with my Lenovo keypad (I've used both of them). Perhaps you could try a USB extension cord. A 15 foot one is less than $2 on monoprice and might be able to help you position the receiver a bit closer to your viewing location.
post #6 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sittler27 View Post

Ok, so I've ventured down the road of building an HTPC:

Parts:
i3-3225
Gigabyte H77M-D3H
G.Skill RipjawsX 1600 2x2GB
Silverstone GD05B case
Antec 380w Greenwatts PSU
AData 120GB SSD (50GB for boot partition)

So far I'm using Assassin's guides and have installed Windows 7, an dconfigure MCE and MediaBrowser.

I also purchased one of those Lenovo RF Keyboard/Mouse things but I'm 25 feet away from the HTPC and it isn't working very well at all (not very smooth and often doesn't respond).

I'm wondering if anyone can suggest a solid keyboard/mouse/trackball keyboard for couch use that works well?

But I'll likey get a Harmony remote for regular navigation of MCE and Mediabrowser.

Where is your RF receiver located?
post #7 of 21
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post

Where is your RF receiver located?

I put it right into the back of my HTPC, but it is about 20 feet behind me as I sit on the couch. Thinking maybe the USB extension cord idea might be a good idea to try.

Overall though, I would think it' slikley best to have a Harmony remote for most uses, and then to use the Lenovo when you need to do any desktop navigation or typing?
post #8 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sittler27 View Post

I put it right into the back of my HTPC, but it is about 20 feet behind me as I sit on the couch. Thinking maybe the USB extension cord idea might be a good idea to try.

Overall though, I would think it' slikley best to have a Harmony remote for most uses, and then to use the Lenovo when you need to do any desktop navigation or typing?

Put it in front of the case or use a USB extension cord to place is discretely in a better location. I like to route it with a USB extension underneath the case and have it near the front. You can even tape it to the bottom of the case near the front if there is no where else you can put it.

I have a Lenovo and a Harmony and I use the Lenovo a lot more often. So does my wife. Tip: Navigate with the left and right arrow keys when viewing your library instead of trying to use the mouse.
post #9 of 21
Out of curiosity why did you go with WMC/MB ?

Sorry to everyone for asking this ad nauseum lately, but it looks like XBMC suits your needs better right now

Airplay target
Youtube (easier to setup IMO)
Push youtube links to XBMC
iOS commander
Music library import (tag based)
post #10 of 21
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Slayer View Post

Out of curiosity why did you go with WMC/MB ?

Sorry to everyone for asking this ad nauseum lately, but it looks like XBMC suits your needs better right now

Airplay target
Youtube (easier to setup IMO)
Push youtube links to XBMC
iOS commander
Music library import (tag based)


Good question. Mainly because just following Assassin's build advice.

My first HTPC build in 8 years.

Could you elaborate further on exactly what each of the above items listed is and how it works? Maybe XBMC is the better option then, but I'll likely see this WMC/MB build through to see if it works well for my needs....will it give me youtube though? I am after that whole smart tv functinality and not just replicating in a nice gui mkv file playback (albeit that is a critical piece).
post #11 of 21
If you use my guides I show you how to setup and use both. Decide which one you like better. There is no substitute for first hand experience.
post #12 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sittler27 View Post

Good question. Mainly because just following Assassin's build advice.

My first HTPC build in 8 years.

Could you elaborate further on exactly what each of the above items listed is and how it works? Maybe XBMC is the better option then, but I'll likely see this WMC/MB build through to see if it works well for my needs....will it give me youtube though? I am after that whole smart tv functinality and not just replicating in a nice gui mkv file playback (albeit that is a critical piece).

Mediabrowser (in it's current state) is essentially a "nice-looking" WMC addon. While they duplicate WMC functionality (to make it nicer) in some areas like Movies, Music, and Games, they ignored others that were requested in the community tracker saying "A WMC plugin already exists" (i.e. Youtube)

Between the guides and the sticky (I'm not looking through them) there should either be a reference to a "Macrotube" WMC addon, or a tool by Patchou called MC Themer. With the themer tool you can add a custom strip to WMC and point to a website. It used to be youtube.com/xl but that has since been replaced by youtube.com/tv. Both solutions appear (from my perspective) to be the minimal required effort to say "look I have Youtube" rather than a polished experience that you'll find with Roku, ATV, etc. I don't know of any Mediabrowser youtube solution that exists currently

Airplay is a nice feature (even though the only iOS device I use it from is the wife's iphone) that lets you "push" content (pictures, music) to XBMC for "big-screen" display LINK

If your music library is already organized with IDv3 tags, they should import fine into XBMC. They would also import fine into WMC in this case, but as Assassin mentioned if you try both you can determine which one you prefer
post #13 of 21
Thread Starter 
Hmmm. I'm wondering then what using an HTPC gets me above just using my popcorn hour boxes and adding an aptv? I was hoping for a full integration of youtube and other video sources like vevo, etc. into my HTPC alongside my slick gui/playback of mkv and my extensive flac audio file collection (not sure if they have IDv3 tags...how would I check this?)

I just spent $500+ on HTPC parts, so wondering if maybe a $100 APTV3 purchase might just have been enough, which would also give me airplay from my iOS devices.
post #14 of 21
perhaps Kylo would be a good thing for you to look into.

http://kylo.tv/features/

post #15 of 21
Sittler27,

It really depends on how much you value the time you'll be spending trying all the different computer-based player options until you find the ones that best match what you're trying to accomplish. $100 for an APTV3 is only 20% of what you've spent. You probably owe it to yourself to try it regardless.
post #16 of 21
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Sittler27,

It really depends on how much you value the time you'll be spending trying all the different computer-based player options until you find the ones that best match what you're trying to accomplish. $100 for an APTV3 is only 20% of what you've spent. You probably owe it to yourself to try it regardless.

I don't mind spending the time trying the different computer-based player options, and I think I will at least finish that exercise.

I was just in the meantime (since I'm just killing time at work here smile.gif wondering what above/beyond using a Popcorn Hour & APTV/Roku solution I get with an HTPC.

I was hoping to have a media solution that integrated all kinds of streams and interesting content into one slick GUI and possibly then adding a tv tuner card one day to also do away with my cablebox which I could then have one box that does it all.

Guess the next couple days of configuring and trial/error will tell me that.


It seems that if my PCHs stream my mkv content, and aptv streams my flac content (right?) and aptv also gets me youtube and a few other online streaming sources than that would be the far cheaper and easier way to go, no?
post #17 of 21
Indeed that's my impression. HTPCs really are for people who like to tinker with computers.

FWIW, at the other end of the audio chain, there are people who like to measure and apply electronic equalization to get the most accurately calibrated sounds possible. That can be an infinite sink of time, too.
post #18 of 21
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Indeed that's my impression. HTPCs really are for people who like to tinker with computers.

FWIW, at the other end of the audio chain, there are people who like to measure and apply electronic equalization to get the most accurately calibrated sounds possible. That can be an infinite sink of time, too.

But, would you agree that after spending the time to set it all up it works better than any of the various device ht setups (aptv + popcorn hour, etc?). Where I would think after setup you wouldn't need to tinker any longer and it would look and sound superior?

Also, what about the picture quality on hd mkv files? Is it improved over what a pch can do?

And of course for flac music file playback. I would think bit streaming out to avr is better than going through pch box to avr?
post #19 of 21
So long as you are transferring digital video (or audio) through from the source file to the display device, the quality of the image should be the same. If it isn't, then one of the intermediate devices (PCH or HTPC) is using defective decoder software, which is certainly possible, or it's configured to manipulate the data (enhance edges or contrast, roll-off high frequencies, etc).

In principle, with an HTPC, you know or can find out exactly what the decoder software is doing and can replace it with something better. Being able to choose appropriate server and user interface software is both an advantage (you can install something better) and disadvantage. They're all slightly different, and none of them will do exactly what you want.
post #20 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sittler27 View Post

Hmmm. I'm wondering then what using an HTPC gets me above just using my popcorn hour boxes and adding an aptv? I was hoping for a full integration of youtube and other video sources like vevo, etc. into my HTPC alongside my slick gui/playback of mkv and my extensive flac audio file collection (not sure if they have IDv3 tags...how would I check this?)

I'm not sure how integrated these are going to be, but I think you're best bet would be XBMC or Plex.

Plex channels are easiest to configure, but I don't know if all of your "online" sources are integrated into a plex channel

As for HTPC vs PCH, I was impressed to read that the PCH can accommodate so many file types but my opinions are as follows . . .
  • The interface is extremely lacking compared to an HTPC running Plex, XBMC, or even mediabrowser
  • I'd spend/ebay/recoup cost differences to get to an HTPC interface just to avoid having to swtich inputs and use multiple "remotes" (big personal pet peeve)
  • I'm not sure that the ATV brings you flac support outside of a jailbroken ATV2 running firecore or xbmc (may be wrong on this)
post #21 of 21
Thread Starter 
Thanks and yes, I've decided to stick with building my HTPC and so far Mediabrowser is awesome. I also launch XBMC from within MB when I want to get to Youtube.

Currently tagging all my music properly to use the MBMusic plugin.

Finally, and most importantly, I don't know what it is but I find the picture quality HUGELY improved playing the same file on my HTPC vs. on the popcorn hour. The PCH was very flat colour and almost life-less compared to what I have now on my HTPC which almost takes on a 3D quality to it. Colors pop right out.
I've set it up using Assassins guides, which includes using the LAV codecs.

Any feedback on this last point?
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