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2013 Panasonic Settings/Issues Thread - Page 80

post #2371 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Bombard View Post

I use Ideal-Lume 6000K lighting behind my Panny and also used it for my old Sony CRT. Highly recommended solution for ambiant lighting for your plasma.

http://www.cinemaquestinc.com/ideal_lume.htm

I won't knock their product, but it is simply a 6500K florescent bulb. One can buy a 6500 daylight bulb or two and get similar benefits for a few dollars...I grow Cannabis and also have T5 lights.....4 in a row, but that would be overkill.
post #2372 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojita View Post

So I finished the 100 hours of break in slides.

Used Controlcal and inputted D-Nice's settings. I haven't tested a blu-ray on it yet, and I'm sure it looks phenomenal, but streaming quality stuff looks really bad, worse than my top of the line Sony from 2 years ago (HX929).

I'm guessing that the Panasonic on D-Nice's settings are showing you exactly how bad the streaming quality is, is there any settings I should be using to hide the imperfections? The lighting level on the set on these settings watching a show that should have lighting usually on the characters, looks kind of dull and not bright.

Also is there any good consensus on modes and settings to use for Gaming and Animation/Anime?

I am running the slides and plan on trying D Nice's settings....Is Controlcal necessary to install settings and what exactly does it do?
post #2373 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by philz662 View Post

Yes I'm aware that settings don't fit all but they are looking pretty darn good on mine with adjustment made to low red.
My shadow detail is no longer hurting so good on that front.
In January I plan on getting pro calibration applied  , Finding the right person that can fine tune D-nice settings on my display will be a challenge I feel.
Any recommendations for the Hampton Roads VA / VA Beach area?

Ask the calibrator to do a run against your current settings. Get the graphs and dEs for this and post them. Be sure to ask first, as I expect any calibrator may want to start over from scratch as SOP.
post #2374 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hughmc View Post

I am running the slides and plan on trying D Nice's settings....Is Controlcal necessary to install settings and what exactly does it do?

It's not necessary, but it makes changing the settings easier. You can run controcal on a laptop and it will connect to your TV wirelessly as long as the laptop and TV are connecting to the same network. You can change and adjust settings on the fly and see the results right away without fiddling with the TV menu. The other benefit is that other people can upload their settings for others to use, and instead of you putting in each setting manually you can just load their file and push it to the TV wirelessly.
post #2375 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by philz662 View Post


Thanks!
Yes I'm aware that settings don't fit all but they are looking pretty darn good on mine with adjustment made to low red.
My shadow detail is no longer hurting so good on that front.
In January I plan on getting pro calibration applied , Finding the right person that can fine tune D-nice settings on my display will be a challenge I feel.
Any recommendations for the Hampton Roads VA / VA Beach area?

D-Nice himself does get up there sometimes on a tour.

Contact him:

Also, check with Touring Calibrators Jeff Meiers, Gregg Loewen and Chad Billheimer (their contact info in the Calibrator list linked in my email).

.
post #2376 of 3303

hey guys,

just powered on my new ST60.  Can someone tell me if I did something incorrectly?  

I powered on the set, set the picture mode to Custom, plugged in the USB, matched D-NICE's slideshow settings and started it.  It's been running for about 20 minutes now.

 

I saw someone mention turning off Pixel Orbiter but it was grayed out for me.  Is this vital?  Thanks for all of your help.


Edited by brenev - 12/3/13 at 4:27pm
post #2377 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbkmog View Post

I believe his setting is recommended in dim dark room viewing.

A few members have mentioned that using his setting makes the screen dark in normal or bright lighting environment.

Just so people are aware, he has posted settings for the VT for both day and night viewing.

People should really post which model they have when asking questions.
post #2378 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by philz662 View Post

Yes I'm aware that settings don't fit all but they are looking pretty darn good on mine with adjustment made to low red.
My shadow detail is no longer hurting so good on that front.
In January I plan on getting pro calibration applied  , Finding the right person that can fine tune D-nice settings on my display will be a challenge I feel.
Any recommendations for the Hampton Roads VA / VA Beach area?

Ask the calibrator to do a run against your current settings. Get the graphs and dEs for this and post them. Be sure to ask first, as I expect any calibrator may want to start over from scratch as SOP.

I'd recommend getting a cal from scratch and keeping the DNice settings. You can always re-enter them. Even if you have someone come in and "tweak" the settings you have, the person would be using a meter to measure the picture and adjust the various levels to get to the proper grayscale/color levels anyway, so the end result should look the same.

Doing from scratch should prove easier because it's a baseline and he wouldn't have to worry about what already adjusted settings are affecting the picture (such as compensating for a color over/under that didn't exist).

I also think it would be interesting to see a "before" graph taken of the DNice settings versus default/baseline Cinema/Custom on your set. There is no science behind using controlled material to influence how a TV ages and how the colors/grayscale drift, so any group of settings you put into the TV that aren't based on measured/visible readings are random at best. You may like how it looks, but that doesn't change the fact that it's random. smile.gif
post #2379 of 3303
Not sure if this is proper or not, but what would be the ball park expected range for cost of calibration of this model tv?
post #2380 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by nehmia View Post

Not sure if this is proper or not, but what would be the ball park expected range for cost of calibration of this model tv?

$300-$400 each calibrator varies.
post #2381 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by jconjason View Post

$300-$400 each calibrator varies.

Thanks!
post #2382 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by philz662 View Post

Yes I'm aware that settings don't fit all but they are looking pretty darn good on mine with adjustment made to low red.
My shadow detail is no longer hurting so good on that front.
In January I plan on getting pro calibration applied  , Finding the right person that can fine tune D-nice settings on my display will be a challenge I feel.
Any recommendations for the Hampton Roads VA / VA Beach area?

Ask the calibrator to do a run against your current settings. Get the graphs and dEs for this and post them. Be sure to ask first, as I expect any calibrator may want to start over from scratch as SOP.

I'd recommend getting a cal from scratch and keeping the DNice settings. You can always re-enter them. Even if you have someone come in and "tweak" the settings you have, the person would be using a meter to measure the picture and adjust the various levels to get to the proper grayscale/color levels anyway, so the end result should look the same.

Doing from scratch should prove easier because it's a baseline and he wouldn't have to worry about what already adjusted settings are affecting the picture (such as compensating for a color over/under that didn't exist).

I also think it would be interesting to see a "before" graph taken of the DNice settings versus default/baseline Cinema/Custom on your set. There is no science behind using controlled material to influence how a TV ages and how the colors/grayscale drift, so any group of settings you put into the TV that aren't based on measured/visible readings are random at best. You may like how it looks, but that doesn't change the fact that it's random. smile.gif

The bold part is exactly what I was getting at. It's an experiment everyone who uses plugged in settings and later gets a real calibration should do and ideally post to the forum.
post #2383 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri


Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish


Quote:
Originally Posted by philz662

Yes I'm aware that settings don't fit all but they are looking pretty darn good on mine with adjustment made to low red.
My shadow detail is no longer hurting so good on that front.
In January I plan on getting pro calibration applied , Finding the right person that can fine tune D-nice settings on my display will be a challenge I feel.
Any recommendations for the Hampton Roads VA / VA Beach area?
Ask the calibrator to do a run against your current settings. Get the graphs and dEs for this and post them. Be sure to ask first, as I expect any calibrator may want to start over from scratch as SOP.
I'd recommend getting a cal from scratch and keeping the DNice settings. You can always re-enter them. Even if you have someone come in and "tweak" the settings you have, the person would be using a meter to measure the picture and adjust the various levels to get to the proper grayscale/color levels anyway, so the end result should look the same.

Doing from scratch should prove easier because it's a baseline and he wouldn't have to worry about what already adjusted settings are affecting the picture (such as compensating for a color over/under that didn't exist).

I also think it would be interesting to see a "before" graph taken of the DNice settings versus default/baseline Cinema/Custom on your set. There is no science behind using controlled material to influence how a TV ages and how the colors/grayscale drift, so any group of settings you put into the TV that aren't based on measured/visible readings are random at best. You may like how it looks, but that doesn't change the fact that it's random.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

The bold part is exactly what I was getting at. It's an experiment everyone who uses plugged in settings and later gets a real calibration should do and ideally post to the forum.


$300-$400 each calibrator varies

Now here lies the rub. For $400, will you feel there is enough difference from a picture you were already happy with to a calibrated picture to justify the expense? What's more, will you even like the $400 calibrted picture? Fact is not everyone walks away totally satisfied with the $400 calibration. Why? Personal viewing preference is why! Just as there is variation in each Panny plasma, there is also variance in everyones preference in what they consider to be a great picture.

Taking all that into account, IF you are satisfied with the picture quality that was obtained from internet posted picture settings, is it worth $400 to try and improve what you're already happy with? Good question if you ask me. smile.gif
post #2384 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojita View Post

It's not necessary, but it makes changing the settings easier. You can run controcal on a laptop and it will connect to your TV wirelessly as long as the laptop and TV are connecting to the same network. You can change and adjust settings on the fly and see the results right away without fiddling with the TV menu. The other benefit is that other people can upload their settings for others to use, and instead of you putting in each setting manually you can just load their file and push it to the TV wirelessly.

Ok so I have the same set as you....I went to the calibration forum that Turbe and others recommended to download setting for the 60VT65....I don't have excel..I have open office..anyway when I download it is hard to read on the spreadsheet. I have other ways of getting it to work, but since you mentioned...what you are saying is you can simply share the file, I can upload and done? Although I am 52, I'm back in college..dropped out 30 years ago...anyway...I am fairly PC literate...
post #2385 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Bombard View Post


$300-$400 each calibrator varies

Now here lies the rub. For $400, will you feel there is enough difference from a picture you were already happy with to a calibrated picture to justify the expense? What's more, will you even like the $400 calibrted picture? Fact is not everyone walks away totally satisfied with the $400 calibration. Why? Personal viewing preference is why! Just as there is variation in each Panny plasma, there is also variance in everyones preference in what they consider to be a great picture.

Taking all that into account, IF you are satisfied with the picture quality that was obtained from internet posted picture settings, is it worth $400 to try and improve what you're already happy with? Good question if you ask me. smile.gif
It's actually possible to find owner's reports from people who didn't expect that a professional calibrator could make their picture quality noticeably better. For flat panel displays go to post number two in the thread that's linked in the signature area at the bottom of my post.

In case you're wondering, I've collected links from every post about owner's experience with a professional calibrator that I've found since the thread was started. The only requirement is that the post must include the AVS user name of the calibrator. I've made one exception in order to collect some posts about having a calibration done by BB.

It's always amazed me how many folks get a calibration who say they can't imagine how their picture quality can be improved. The number who are then amazed is amazing. smile.gif

My personal feeling is that the more interested a person is in movies, and seeing them as close as possible to what the director intended, the more likely that person will be happy with their calibration. It's very possible that the folks who wouldn't appreciate a well calibrated display just decide that it's not for them, and don't think it's worth the money. That may be why it's been pretty hard for me to find an unhappy calibration customer. tongue.gif
post #2386 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

It's actually possible to find owner's reports from people who didn't expect that a professional calibrator could make their picture quality noticeably better. For flat panel displays go to post number two in the thread that's linked in the signature area at the bottom of my post.

In case you're wondering, I've collected links from every post about owner's experience with a professional calibrator that I've found since the thread was started. The only requirement is that the post must include the AVS user name of the calibrator.

It's always amazed me how many folks get a calibration who say they can't imagine how their picture quality can be improved. The number who are then amazed is amazing. smile.gif

My personal feeling is that the more interested a person is in movies, and seeing them as close as possible to what the director intended, the more likely that person will be happy with their calibration. It's very possible that the folks who wouldn't appreciate a well calibrated display just decide that it's not for them, and don't think it's worth the money. That may be why it's pretty hard to find an unhappy calibration customer. tongue.gif

Guess that's why the education from the calibrator is just as important than the actual calibration. But there will always be those who want that bright showroom picture that is pretty much the opposite of a properly calibated picture. It took me a few weeks to acclimate me to the lower light output from my Sony CRT but in the end, I loved that picture. Then again I had no internet picture settings to try out beforehand back then. smile.gif
post #2387 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Bombard View Post

Now here lies the rub. For $400, will you feel there is enough difference from a picture you were already happy with to a calibrated picture to justify the expense? What's more, will you even like the $400 calibrted picture? Fact is not everyone walks away totally satisfied with the $400 calibration. Why? Personal viewing preference is why! Just as there is variation in each Panny plasma, there is also variance in everyones preference in what they consider to be a great picture.

Taking all that into account, IF you are satisfied with the picture quality that was obtained from internet posted picture settings, is it worth $400 to try and improve what you're already happy with? Good question if you ask me. smile.gif

Food for thought?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael TLV View Post

Greetings

You generally have a less than 4% chance of doing better than the stock settings in the cinema/movie mode when you plug in random values from someone else. Which also means you have a greater than 96% chance of winding up no better than stock or with something worse than stock.

Now the only way people are going to know if they lucked out and made it into that 4% club is to have instrumentation to verify the result. This is a catch-22 of course. If you have the gear, why would you plug in random numbers? biggrin.gif

So people that plug in the numbers are not able to verify anything and it simply becomes just a game of finding something you like ... and that has nothing to do with what calibration is about. Even if they were in the 4% club ... it wouldn't matter one bit because they would not know it. There is no special detector built into humans that goes off when presented with an accurate image. People do not inherently recognize what a good image actually is. Education is always needed.

http://www.tlvexp.ca/2012/12/the-fruits-of-copying-settings-the-pioneer-lottery/

This article is about what actually happens when people plug random numbers into their TVs.

regards

When "something you like" turns out to be inaccurate, while it may make certain material look good or simply not abnormal, it may have the opposite effect on other material, and you'll always wonder why, and you won't enjoy your TV as much. The reproducibility of the "reference settings" deserves to be studied, given how much forum traffic they generate in every plasma thread and the endless stream of people who think they can't watch their TV for 100 hours or more of slides else they'll taint it forever for the settings, which for all we know (see quoted message), would be inaccurate for their TV no matter what they did, and this is bolstered by the numerous accounts by people who've followed the procedure of "red push" and overly dark scenes for the 2013 settings.
post #2388 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Bombard View Post

Guess that's why the education from the calibrator is just as important than the actual calibration.
Yes. I've always wondered if the best calibrators avoid customers who's expectations won't be satisfied.
Quote:
But there will always be those who want that bright showroom picture that is pretty much the opposite of a properly calibrated picture.
That's right, and I doubt that a good calibrator would try to "sell" someone with those expectations.
Quote:
It took me a few weeks to acclimate me to the lower light output from my Sony CRT but in the end, I loved that picture. Then again I had no internet picture settings to try out beforehand back then. smile.gif
Another common experience that folks report is that it took a week or two to fully enjoy their calibrated set. Still, I doubt that folks who appreciate "pop", "extra vivid colors", and "very bright images" would adjust to seeing what the director intended in one or two weeks.
post #2389 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

Food for thought?
When "something you like" turns out to be inaccurate, while it may make certain material look good or simply not abnormal, it may have the opposite effect on other material, and you'll always wonder why, and you won't enjoy your TV as much. The reproducibility of the "reference settings" deserves to be studied, given how much forum traffic they generate in every plasma thread and the endless stream of people who think they can't watch their TV for 100 hours or more of slides else they'll taint it forever for the settings, which for all we know (see quoted message), would be inaccurate for their TV no matter what they did, and this is bolstered by the numerous accounts by people who've followed the procedure of "red push" and overly dark scenes for the 2013 settings.

Sqweeky wheel gets the grease,,, always. For everyone who posts complaints here in this thread, I wonder just how many folks are using these internet posted settings and are estaticly happy with their picture quality, enough so that they've gotten what they needed from the internet and simply move on? I wonder cuz I'm one of them happy people, who has had the benefit of an ISF- calibration education on a twice calibrated Sony, yet am now happier with the Panny ST60 picture quality using both CNET's Cinema setttings and DNice's Custom setting than I ever was with the 9 years I lived with the calibrated Sony who's picture quality I also considered very good. Now I have no doubt that a better picture would most likely be obtained from that $400 calibration, no disputing that from my past experience. But is it $400 better and money well spent? Maybe for someone dealing with red push or overly dark scenes. Fortunately I'm not one of them. smile.gif
post #2390 of 3303
For those who don't know him, Michael TLV is the AVS user name for Michael Chen who is an outstanding calibrator working in Canada and some parts of the US. He also teaches calibration.
post #2391 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Bombard View Post


Sqweeky wheel gets the grease,,, always. For everyone who posts complaints here in this thread, I wonder just how many folks are using these internet posted settings and are estaticly happy with their picture quality, enough so that they've gotten what they needed from the internet and simply move on? I wonder cuz I'm one of them happy people, who has had the benefit of an ISF- calibration education on a twice calibrated Sony, yet am now happier with the Panny ST60 picture quality using both CNET's Cinema setttings and DNice's Custom setting than I ever was with the 9 years I lived with the calibrated Sony who's picture quality I also considered very good. Now I have no doubt that a better picture would most likely be obtained from that $400 calibration, no disputing that from my past experience. But is it $400 better and money well spent? Maybe for someone dealing with red push or overly dark scenes. Fortunately I'm not one of them. smile.gif


No complaints here.

Cnets & D-nice needed a little tweak on my display taming the red , Other then that all is swell.

Michael Chens are pretty sweet as well no tweak needed on push.

 

Am I happy with the above? Heck ya!

But Is the 400.00 better & money well spent? Maybe maybe not.

Ive owned 4 plasmas slacking on pro calibration. Since the 60ST60 will be my last Plasma  its worth it to me.

 

Anyway this is a great forum , great topic I'm hooked

post #2392 of 3303
Just to do a comparison I entered in Dnice's settings for my ST60, you know the refrence setttings. Well let me tell you compared to my calibrated cinema mode. I have a id3pro and chormapure software that I used. I only did a 2point and 10poiny white balance calbiration. I don't have enough hours on this set yet to do a" full" calibration including gamma and color gamut. On the AVS HD709 black clipping pattern I can see below black all the way to 15. The settings don't work at all for my TV. Copying settings is a shot in the dark , a needle in the hay stack just wanted to reaffirm thisf
Edited by hungro - 12/4/13 at 1:42pm
post #2393 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by hungro View Post

Just to do a comparison I entered in Dnice's settings for my ST60, you know the refrence setttings. Well let me tell you compared to my calibrated cinema mode. I have a id3pro and chormapure software that I used. I only did a 2point and 10poiny white balance calbiration. I don't have enough hours on this set yet to do a" full" calibration including gamma and color gamut. On the AVS HD709 black clipping pattern I can see below black all the way to 15. The settings don't work at all for my TV. Copying settings is a shot in the dark , a needle in the hay stack just wanted to reaffirm thisf
Of three tv's I calibrated, this one is the most finicky. The littlest adjustment can cause a drastic swing. This is why I think when you see Michael's settings that got posted, he doesn't even touch the detailed gamma settings. Your just chasing your tail.
post #2394 of 3303
Agree on the Finicky calibration behavior
post #2395 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post


This is why I think when you see Michael's settings that got posted, he doesn't even touch the detailed gamma settings. Your just chasing your tail.

 

Chen calibration is good stuff resembling my G20 THX setting.

Raise contrast some for comfy day time viewing and its a winner for many.

post #2396 of 3303
Where could one find Chen's settings (for the VT60 I presume)?
post #2397 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by nehmia View Post

Where could one find Chen's settings (for the VT60 I presume)?

I own 60ST60 using his ST60 goods.

I haven't came across VT60s with his name on them.

post #2398 of 3303
I ran the 100 hours of D-Nice slides and am now running C|net settings and I like it. I already reached out to Jeff Meier and he will be calibrating my 65ZT60 in January for a perfectly calibrated set. I can't wait!!!
post #2399 of 3303
I saw where D-Nice stated he was going to post 3-D settings but does not look like that ever happened. Any suggested tweeks for the 3D settings? 55VT60 here.
post #2400 of 3303
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwick View Post

I saw where D-Nice stated he was going to post 3-D settings but does not look like that ever happened. Any suggested tweeks for the 3D settings? 55VT60 here.

For the VT60, you can find them on this thread. You will need to be registered to download the .ZIP file (post #3), which has the day, night, and 3D VT60 settings he used.
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