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Calculations and Design

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
Allow me to introduce myself, my name is Yuriy and I live in Minnesota. I am trying to learn as much as I can about HTS and speakers in general. My goal is to build Sealed Subwoofer Box, 2 Towers and 2 book shelf speakers. As of right now I only know what tweeters, Mid-range, and woofers I would like to purchase. What I need help with is calculating the volume for the towers and center speaker. I know how to do the calculations if I have one speaker, but I have a lot of difficulty figuring out how to properly calculate the interior volume of a tower with multiple speakers. I can provide all the specifications of the speakers that I have in mind (including the Sub).

Thank you in advance for all the help.
post #2 of 19
any driver in a tower that isn't the same should have its own box separate from the others, so mid, tweeter , woofers should all have their own boxs. tweeter only needs its own box if it is open to the back most aren't so they don't usually need their own box. that's the easy part i assume u don't know how to build a xo for it so i would advise against building anything with just random drivers u have. there are tons of kits for people who want to build stuff but cant do the xo. if u wanted to learn all that business u would probably want to go active b/c its much cheaper then passive is.
post #3 of 19
Start here, and after a few months of research you might have learned enough to design your own speaker:
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?219617-The-Speaker-Building-Bible

Better idea, go here:
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?211558-Links-to-existing-DIY-speaker-designs

Designing your own speaker may look easy enough, but it's far from it.
post #4 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Start here, and after a few months of research you might have learned enough to design your own speaker:
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?219617-The-Speaker-Building-Bible

Better idea, go here:
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?211558-Links-to-existing-DIY-speaker-designs

Designing your own speaker may look easy enough, but it's far from it.

What would you recommend making a speaker like this? The tweeter is hard to find and is from a site I don't know. I would still order though if it's reputable. The Woofer isn't available anymore. This causes all sorts of problems which is documented on the site's build. However, it means the original schematics won't work and would require me to do the edits but since they aren't exact an tested it means I'd be guessing, not cool.

They look gorgeous albeit quite tall at 60". I like the WMTMW though it's aesthetic, and chosen for that reason.

I read the thread though and it's supposed to be a hard build to do. Are there any easier links? Especially since the woofer isn't there anymore and it looks like I'd be remodelling and testing.
I found it in this thread which was pretty well documented.

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?28655-A-Guide-to-HTguide-com-Completed-Speaker-Designs
Edited by tential - 4/3/13 at 3:23pm
post #5 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tential View Post

What would you recommend making a speaker like this?
A speaker like what? There are dozens, if not hundreds, of designs to be found via the second link I posted.
post #6 of 19
Thread Starter 
My plan is to build a pair of Dynamic 4TSE, and 4CC. The subwoofer design will come right after this.
1 x Scan-Speak D2608/9130 HDS Tweeter – 1″
2 x Tangband W4-1337 Midrange – 4″
4 x Dayton RS180-8 Woofer – 7″

The center speaker would have all of this as well. I have read many forums and after many months of searching, I finally came across the layout that works best for me. As soon as I figure out how to calculate the volume for each section of the speaker I will start working on the CAD drawing (Google SketchUp ).

I want to have the front of all the towers including the Subwoofers and the Center Speaker to be granite. Ben Daniels did an amazing job on putting the granite on his towers, this can be seen at his website:
http://www.baniels.com/viewing-reverse/

The only thing that I don’t like his design is the shape of the box. So I started to look at other options and came across a wonder box design made by Deewan. This can be found on the following website:
http://clearwave.forumotion.net/t128p15-deewan-s-4cc-and-4t-system

In the end, I want to take the best of both designs and come up with something unique and original.

For the subwoofer I am thinking of going with soundsplinter Rlp18 this will be a completely separate thing. A few online calculators suggested going with a sealed box, so I need to draw that up. Unless you think that Bradley did the right thing and made a ported box with the following dimensions: 26H x 30D x49W. Target net volume 17 cu ft, 14.5 Hz tune. Port I.D. is around 8.375. Bradley’s design can be found here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/920949/rl-p18-meets-the-doh-button
post #7 of 19
Thread Starter 
My plan is to build a pair of Dynamic 4TSE, and 4CC. The subwoofer design will come right after this.
1 x Scan-Speak D2608/9130 HDS Tweeter – 1″
2 x Tangband W4-1337 Midrange – 4″
4 x Dayton RS180-8 Woofer – 7″

The center speaker would have all of this as well. I have read many forums and after many months of searching, I finally came across the layout that works best for me. As soon as I figure out how to calculate the volume for each section of the speaker I will start working on the CAD drawing (Google SketchUp ).

I want to have the front of all the towers including the Subwoofers and the Center Speaker to be granite. Ben Daniels did an amazing job on putting the granite on his towers, this can be seen at his website:
http://www.baniels.com/viewing-reverse/

The only thing that I don’t like his design is the shape of the box. So I started to look at other options and came across a wonder box design made by Deewan. This can be found on the following website:
http://clearwave.forumotion.net/t128p15-deewan-s-4cc-and-4t-system

In the end, I want to take the best of both designs and come up with something unique and original.

For the subwoofer I am thinking of going with soundsplinter Rlp18 this will be a completely separate thing. A few online calculators suggested going with a sealed box, so I need to draw that up. Unless you think that Bradley did the right thing and made a ported box with the following dimensions: 26H x 30D x49W. Target net volume 17 cu ft, 14.5 Hz tune. Port I.D. is around 8.375. Bradley’s design can be found here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/920949/rl-p18-meets-the-doh-button
post #8 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

A speaker like what? There are dozens, if not hundreds, of designs to be found via the second link I posted.

http://speakerdesignworks.com/Statements.html

Sorry, the link didn't post for some reason. Probably why my post didn't make sense.
Edit: @The Chosen One
Wow those look great....Expensive though haha like 500 a speaker at least easily after wood and finishing. Might have to consider doing that if these Statements are impossible to do.
Edited by tential - 4/3/13 at 5:36pm
post #9 of 19
If you want to build a set of Dynamics, I would email Jed at info@clearwavespeakers.com and see if he is still selling the kits. Or at least he could give
you any info you might need about building them.
-Ed
post #10 of 19
Thread Starter 
I have contacted Jed and he informed me that the kits are still being sold. He will provide the speakers and the crossovers. I still need to purchase the wood and build the towers. Before I make any purchases I want to make sure that I have everything ready to start this project. I need to get the drawings done and make sure that they are correct. Right now I am stuck because I don’t know how to calculate volume that the speakers require.
post #11 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by The ChosenOne View Post

I have contacted Jed and he informed me that the kits are still being sold. He will provide the speakers and the crossovers. I still need to purchase the wood and build the towers. Before I make any purchases I want to make sure that I have everything ready to start this project. I need to get the drawings done and make sure that they are correct. Right now I am stuck because I don’t know how to calculate volume that the speakers require.
They didn't give you the speaker design too? I figure if you were buying the cross over and speakers he'd give the dimensions of the box as well?
post #12 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by The ChosenOne View Post

I have contacted Jed and he informed me that the kits are still being sold. He will provide the speakers and the crossovers. I still need to purchase the wood and build the towers. Before I make any purchases I want to make sure that I have everything ready to start this project. I need to get the drawings done and make sure that they are correct. Right now I am stuck because I don’t know how to calculate volume that the speakers require.


Are you building the Statements? I see that you have decided to use the same Tang Band W4 1337 and Dayton RS180 that is used in the Statement, but that tweeter is different. I wonder how these would compare to the Statements?
post #13 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Are you building the Statements? I see that you have decided to use the same Tang Band W4 1337 and Dayton RS180 that is used in the Statement, but that tweeter is different. I wonder how these would compare to the Statements?

That's me. Or well, I'm interested in it but the woofers aren't available anymore which means I'd have to do box calculations and I'm not up to that.
The Chosen One is building Dynamic 4TSE, and 4CC. They're nice as well.
http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?223839-Dynamic-4TSE-and-4CC-speakers-for-sale
That's a link to some pictures of them.
post #14 of 19
woofers were shielded they were replaced with these http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-356&ctab=1#Tabs b/c crt screens are not used anymore
post #15 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieattk View Post

woofers were shielded they were replaced with these http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-356&ctab=1#Tabs b/c crt screens are not used anymore
I know, but those speakers require a redesign of the enclosure. I don't know much of making speakers/modeling at all.

"Looking at the new 8-ohm, non-shielded
driver specs, they are going to be close, but
will they be close enough?

With a little back of the envelope calculating,
and comparing the published specs, it
appears that the new unshielded RS drivers
T/S parameters suggest slightly smaller
enclosures, slightly higher f3’s and (very)
slightly lower sensitivities. The good news is
that I was told by an undisclosed source that
the new drivers were Klippel optimized.

RS225 Shielded vs. Non in the Statements
Initial Thoughts:

The enclosure size is fine and if the tuning is
raised 3 Hz, will come very close to the
transfer function of the shielded woofer. The
maximum modeled difference in dB is less
than .5 dB, and the f3 drops by 4 Hz for the
non shielded version model. In addition, the
enclosure size could be reduced by 20%, to
80 liters, with no increase in f3 over the
original design. The ‘new’ driver sports a
slightly smaller Sd than the ‘old’ driver (which
obviously didn’t change) which is used to
calculate the SPL, so the SPL differences may
be even smaller than modeled."

It sounds like it means I need to make adjustments to the enclosure. If I don't though I'd give it a shot later. The cuts make sense for the most part, although the assembly diagram is a little confusing.
post #16 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by tential View Post

I know, but those speakers require a redesign of the enclosure. I don't know much of making speakers/modeling at all.

"Looking at the new 8-ohm, non-shielded
driver specs, they are going to be close, but
will they be close enough?

With a little back of the envelope calculating,
and comparing the published specs, it
appears that the new unshielded RS drivers
T/S parameters suggest slightly smaller
enclosures, slightly higher f3’s and (very)
slightly lower sensitivities. The good news is
that I was told by an undisclosed source that
the new drivers were Klippel optimized.

RS225 Shielded vs. Non in the Statements
Initial Thoughts:

The enclosure size is fine and if the tuning is
raised 3 Hz, will come very close to the
transfer function of the shielded woofer. The
maximum modeled difference in dB is less
than .5 dB, and the f3 drops by 4 Hz for the
non shielded version model. In addition, the
enclosure size could be reduced by 20%, to
80 liters, with no increase in f3 over the
original design. The ‘new’ driver sports a
slightly smaller Sd than the ‘old’ driver (which
obviously didn’t change) which is used to
calculate the SPL, so the SPL differences may
be even smaller than modeled."

It sounds like it means I need to make adjustments to the enclosure. If I don't though I'd give it a shot later. The cuts make sense for the most part, although the assembly diagram is a little confusing.


yeah but u can use it in same enclosure the tune just changes slightly or u could build the box and stick a foam brick in it or fill the bottom with sand.
post #17 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by The ChosenOne View Post

I have contacted Jed and he informed me that the kits are still being sold. He will provide the speakers and the crossovers. I still need to purchase the wood and build the towers. Before I make any purchases I want to make sure that I have everything ready to start this project. I need to get the drawings done and make sure that they are correct. Right now I am stuck because I don’t know how to calculate volume that the speakers require.

Hi there. The information for the cabinet is now back online. You can download it from my website. The cabinet design is for the current RS180-8 drivers as well.

Best Regards,
Jed
post #18 of 19
Glad to see more Dynamic 4T's and CC's being built.
post #19 of 19
Thread Starter 
Thank you very much for updating me on this!
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