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Is the End of Physical Media Inevitable? - Page 23

Poll Results: Is the End of Physical Media Inevitable?

 
  • 2% (23)
    Yes, physical media will quickly disappear altogether
  • 18% (198)
    Yes, physical media will slowly disappear altogether
  • 34% (369)
    No, new physical formats will continue to be developed
  • 44% (470)
    No, but physical media will become a niche market for enthusiasts
1060 Total Votes  
post #661 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post


I guess you are the dream consumer for the content providers. They have been trying to kill streaming services like Netflix, so that then they can milk you (and me) $3 for each episode you watch, or $7 per movie.

Because it is naive to think that if subscription services like Netflix (for movies) and MOG and Spotify (for music) go away, the studios will keep physical media around.

There is a reason why they claim that you do not own the content and it is because they want you to pay per view. They can't easily do this with physical media.

But if they choke Netflix and the likes, then there WILL come a day when you will find that the latest content becomes available ONLY on iTunes, or on HBO-Go, or whatever proprietary, overpriced and DRM-ladden sites the studios come up with.

Frankly, the only reasons why this day may not come is if they cannot completely choke off piracy, or the content providers break up (although the trend is clearly toward consolidation and don't expect Congress to stop it).

To reiterate, the studios do not want you to use Netflix (that's why they are not renewing agreements, going to iTunes, Amazon Prime and their own sites) -- they would rather stay in bed with the cable cos and pay per view resellers.

But, they do not like physical media either -- and the day will come, when they will force you to stream, just not on your terms the way it is with Netflix now, but on theirs.

 

I am the dream consumer of anyone who wants to provide high-quality content via online distribution.

 

The reason studios claim you don't own content is because you don't. It's copyrighted work, all you can ever do with a copy of a copyrighted work is license it. 

 

The day when content that I want to watch is only on iTunes or Vudu is already here. That's where the early digital releases are. That's where the high quality online distribution rentals are found.

 

I don't like physical media—I like the quality it provides, but I don't like the media itself.

post #662 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by fritzi93 View Post

I have zero interest in wasting time trying to find some crap pirated videos. Those warez kiddies are incompetent when it comes to encoding.

At my other hangout we get one-post wonders asking questions like the following all the time:

"OMG, I just downloaded a great quality 1 GB 720p BD rip of (insert latest blockbuster title here). How do they do it?"

Before the lock, answers are usually along the following lines:

1) It's not great quality and you're a moron.
2) What are you watching this on, a 4" screen?
3) Didn't read the forum rules on warez, did you?

And I just don't see how piracy benefits the law abiding consumer, as was mentioned earlier. Not at all.

That's true in many cases, however there are good ~6GB 720p and ~10GB 1080p rips out there. It just depends on the ripping group. 1-2GB will look like crap for a feature film.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel_BMS View Post

Physical media can't end. Distributing movies and TV shows over the Internet is going to to choke the Internet.

OMG! It's a series of tubes! It's not just something you dump something on!

Seriously, have you been living under a rock for the past 5 years? DOCSIS 3.1 will be bringing gigabit to HFC soon, and backbones are use 40gbps fiber, with faster on the way. Oh, and Netflix and ********** are two of the largest bandwidth users, depending on the country and time of day you look at.
post #663 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

I am the dream consumer of anyone who wants to provide high-quality content via online distribution.
...

The day when content that I want to watch is only on iTunes or Vudu is already here. That's where the early digital releases are. That's where the high quality online distribution rentals are found.

...

Ugh, I forgot, you can see pixels on a 60" 1080screen from 12 feet or something.... biggrin.gif

But joking aside, I am glad that you see the writing on the wall for physical media. Where we differ is that your world is one where we end up paying $6 per 720p title and $7 per 1080p title (both current Skyfall rentals on Vudu). Thanks, but no thanks.

I personally think the Netflix subscription model is the future. It has a wide variety of great movies (not everyone thinks that Skyfall is great entertainment) and the quality, even at 720p, is absolutely fine on a 60" and unless one is pixel-peeing freeze frames, it is largely indistinguishable from an average seating distance from 720p Vudu.

I do think Netflix is probably too cheap and I would pay a bit more for a bit wider selection. But at $7 per limited rental, I'd imagine many otherwise law-abiding citizens (particularly younger ones) will stray to the dark side -- and that is probably the only reason the studios are not asking $10....
post #664 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post


I don't like physical media—I like the quality it provides, but I don't like the media itself.

I don't like the hassle of having to schlepp a physical disc around any more than you do. One area though were physical media reigns supreme (at least for the time being) is archival capability, which, to date, online purchasing services do not offer.

The studios aren't moronic. They know that quality has to continue to improve in order to lure customers away from physical media. However, they also know that consumer attitudes about "ownership" are changing, in some cases drastically and that it's only a matter of time before physical media can be retired.

That really does put things on their terms. While consumers normally vote with their wallets, I'm not sure how they will "vote" if there aren't alternatives.
post #665 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post


Ugh, I forgot, you can see pixels on a 60" 1080screen from 12 feet or something.... biggrin.gif

But joking aside, I am glad that you see the writing on the wall for physical media. Where we differ is that your world is one where we end up paying $6 per 720p title and $7 per 1080p title (both current Skyfall rentals on Vudu). Thanks, but no thanks.

I personally think the Netflix subscription model is the future. It has a wide variety of great movies (not everyone thinks that Skyfall is great entertainment) and the quality, even at 720p, is absolutely fine on a 60" and unless one is pixel-peeing freeze frames, it is largely indistinguishable from an average seating distance from 720p Vudu.

I do think Netflix is probably too cheap and I would pay a bit more for a bit wider selection. But at $7 per limited rental, I'd imagine many otherwise law-abiding citizens (particularly younger ones) will stray to the dark side -- and that is probably the only reason the studios are not asking $10....

 

With Netflix, that is rather dependent on the platform used to view the movie, and the movie itself. I cannot agree that 720p Netflix is in any way competitive with the offering from Vudu. Netflix video typically exhibits gross, obvious compression artifacts. Banding and macroblocking are standard issue. At least with Vudu HD 720p the only thing that is lost is sharpness.
 
I've seen great-looking Netflix streams, but it is strictly through devices that support 1080p streaming. Even then, in the best possible scenario, something about how Netflix encodes their video causes obvious banding, far more often than ought to be the case.
 
I do have really good eyesight, but 12 feet away from a 60 inch screen is outside of the THX recommended viewing distance.

Edited by imagic - 5/1/13 at 5:13pm
post #666 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

With Netflix, that is rather dependent on the platform used to view the movie, and the movie itself. I cannot agree that 720p Netflix is in any way competitive with the offering from Vudu. Netflix video typically exhibits gross, obvious compression artifacts. Banding and macroblocking are standard issue. At least with Vudu HD 720p the only thing that is lost is sharpness.
 
I've seen great-looking Netflix streams, but it is strictly through devices that support 1080p streaming. Even then, in the best possible scenario, something about how Netflix encodes their video causes obvious banding, far more often than ought to be the case.
 
I do have really good eyesight, but 12 feet away from a 60 inch screen is outside of the THX recommended viewing distance.

I have not seen banding or macroblocking on Netflix in years, streaming on Apple TV and before that, Roku. It generally looks as good as, and sometimes better, than stuff bought from iTunes and Amazon.

As far as viewing distance, the average US consumer seats about 9 to 10 feet from their 50" TV, so I don't know what we are discussing. THX recommendations are irrelevant to 99% of the market, although once screens of about 80" are cheap enough, THX recommendations may become more relevant (see http://myhometheater.homestead.com/viewingdistancecalculator.html).

I really do not think that the studios wanting to kill fixed pricing and subscription services like Netflix has anything to do with improving PQ or THX specs, but everything to do with removing alternatives so that they can make everyone pay $7+ per viewing. Oh, and get ready for the 4k titles to push this to $10+. Not that at 10" feet there would be much difference between 2k and 4k on a 60", or even 80" screen (see calculator link above), but marketers get paid for a reason.
Edited by Ryan1 - 5/1/13 at 6:59pm
post #667 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post


I have not seen banding or macroblocking on Netflix in years, streaming on Apple TV and before that, Roku. It generally looks as good as, and sometimes better, than stuff bought from iTunes and Amazon.

As far as viewing distance, the average US consumer seats about 9 to 10 feet from their 50" TV, so I don't know what we are discussing. THX recommendations are irrelevant to 99% of the market.

I really do not think that the studios wanting to kill fixed pricing and subscription services like Netflix has anything to do with improving PQ or THX specs, but everything to do with removing alternatives so that they can make everyone pay $7+ per viewing. Oh, and get ready for the 4k titles to push this to $10+.

Are they relevant to you?

post #668 of 920
Well, thank God THX viewing distance is relevant to all of my clients. If not, I won't have enough client. Just a quick glance of the number of clients I've dealt withthus far, at least 2,000 households in Canada do care about THX recommendation (and i'm only one of at least 15 people doing the same thing in Canada. So that means 30,000 households in Canada (and based on reverse statistic: 600,000 households in the US) do care about THx recommendation.

How those numbers translates to percentage I have no clue. Maybe it's only 1 percent, maybe more, maybe less. wink.gif
post #669 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Are they relevant to you?

Eh, depending on the position of my head, I usually sit between 8 and 9 feet from my 60" screen, so I am certainly within SMPTE and close enough for THX. smile.gif

And Netflix still looks great.
post #670 of 920
We should run a poll on how many people agree with you. This is AVS not Walmart, we are a "picky" bunch. I haven't watched a Netflix title in about a year, but last time I did, 9 feet away from my 65VT the quality was pretty lackluster with obvious motion artifacts, banding, the works. By comparison titles viewed on a tiny ipad 2 screen looked great. That must be their target demographic.
post #671 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

We should run a poll on how many people agree with you. This is AVS not Walmart, we are a "picky" bunch. I haven't watched a Netflix title in about a year, but last time I did, 9 feet away from my 65VT the quality was pretty lackluster with obvious motion artifacts, banding, the works. By comparison titles viewed on a tiny ipad 2 screen looked great. That must be their target demographic.

I don't know where you are, or what you are watching, or what you are streaming Netflix on. It may be be your provider or your equipment (not speaking of your TV). Netflix streams at just short of 4mbps and actually just started using a more efficient compression.

Is it the best I've seen? No. Is it more than adequate on my 60" Kuro? Yes.

Do I ever think in the middle of a good movie about how it may be better if it was BR? Generally not, unless it's something like Avatar and even then I don't think it's more the idea than the actual experience. But Netflix is getting more 1080p titles, so things will only get better.

People who make a living out of this obviously feel differently and I am not saying that they are necessarily wrong.

But slamming Netflix as being good enough for an iPad only is either disingenuous, or due to factors other than the original stream itself.

As far as a poll, there are plenty of people here who against logic claim to be golden ears or golden eyes, so polls in "high-end" audio, and I guess video, are pretty pointless. ABX tests, on the other hand, are always welcome.
post #672 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

We should run a poll on how many people agree with you. This is AVS not Walmart, we are a "picky" bunch. I haven't watched a Netflix title in about a year, but last time I did, 9 feet away from my 65VT the quality was pretty lackluster with obvious motion artifacts, banding, the works. By comparison titles viewed on a tiny ipad 2 screen looked great. That must be their target demographic.

Agreed. At 9ft from a 65", Netflix is unwatchable. The only time Netflix (even SuperHD) is acceptable is when I watch it on my 50" from about 14' away. Essentially the same screen-size to viewing distance ratio as watching Netflix on an iPad 2 screen from about 2 feet away.
post #673 of 920
The THX recommendations are a nice academic exercise, and are probably fine for most streamed content, but with cable HD looking as bad as it does, it would be painful to be at the THX distance.
post #674 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

Agreed. At 9ft from a 65", Netflix is unwatchable. The only time Netflix (even SuperHD) is acceptable is when I watch it on my 50" from about 14' away. Essentially the same screen-size to viewing distance ratio as watching Netflix on an iPad 2 screen from about 2 feet away.

"The only time Netflix (even SuperHD) is acceptable is when I watch it on my 50" from about 14' away" -- Bold words! We are all duly impressed! Particularly by someone still apparently using a 56kbps modem.... biggrin.gif
post #675 of 920
You don't seem to comprehend that it's not the customers problem if Netflix is underperforming. I have a 20mbps Comcast connection in a newer neighborhood, but it is a hugely dense neighborhood with literally thousands and thousands of kids who probably do nothing but watch streaming video when they get home from school. I'm not going to run around trying a variety of different devices to do the streaming (tried several in the past) or start shoveling money into switching internet service providers.

Again, it's not my problem that Netflix can't deliver. It's a Netflix problem.

You can scoff as much as you like, but the situation I have is the same thing that is faced by millions of people who either can't get better broadband, or won't due to cost issues. As much as you would love to put the final nail in the physical media coffin, it's going to be a while before that happens.

I'm happy that you are completely satisfied with the video quality of Netflix on your Kuro. Might want to get that Kuro calibrated or go see an optometrist sometime.
post #676 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

You don't seem to comprehend that it's not the customers problem if Netflix is underperforming. I have a 20mbps Comcast connection in a newer neighborhood, but it is a hugely dense neighborhood with literally thousands and thousands of kids who probably do nothing but watch streaming video when they get home from school. I'm not going to run around trying a variety of different devices to do the streaming (tried several in the past) or start shoveling money into switching internet service providers.

.... Might want to get that Kuro calibrated or go see an optometrist sometime.

Might want to move to a better neighborhood sometime. Without "thousands and thousands of kids watching streaming video" (damned kids).... eek.gif

I do get about 50mbps steady where I live, but as I said, Netflix streams 720p at just under 4mbps (and their new codec is more efficient), so perhaps you should try to figure out if there is a problem somewhere else in the chain.

Also, with all due respect, I have attempted to support my arguments on measurable guidelines (the several distance and resolution calculators I have already linked to). All I keep hearing from you guys is how Netflix sucks, even at 1080p, (yet many of you happily watch cable or satellite) and how all of you can tell individual pixels at great distances, which is statistically unlikely.

Ironically, you are adamant about not "shoveling money into switching internet service providers" to improve your Netflix experience (which would cost you $9 per month for as much as you can watch), while in the same breath praise $7 pay per view rentals and the ability to purchase $30 BRs of Ironman. rolleyes.gifrolleyes.gif
post #677 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post


I don't know where you are, or what you are watching, or what you are streaming Netflix on. It may be be your provider or your equipment (not speaking of your TV). Netflix streams at just short of 4mbps and actually just started using a more efficient compression.

Is it the best I've seen? No. Is it more than adequate on my 60" Kuro? Yes.

Do I ever think in the middle of a good movie about how it may be better if it was BR? Generally not, unless it's something like Avatar and even then I don't think it's more the idea than the actual experience. But Netflix is getting more 1080p titles, so things will only get better.

People who make a living out of this obviously feel differently and I am not saying that they are necessarily wrong.

But slamming Netflix as being good enough for an iPad only is either disingenuous, or due to factors other than the original stream itself.

As far as a poll, there are plenty of people here who against logic claim to be golden ears or golden eyes, so polls in "high-end" audio, and I guess video, are pretty pointless. ABX tests, on the other hand, are always welcome.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post


Eh, depending on the position of my head, I usually sit between 8 and 9 feet from my 60" screen, so I am certainly within SMPTE and close enough for THX. smile.gif

And Netflix still looks great.

 

And I suppose there's always going to be someone who's going to bust out the double-blind A/B testing challenge, even in a situation where it is completely unnecessary—the quality difference is self-evident.

 

Netflix video simply does not hold when viewed on a large 1080p television. It certainly does not hold up on pioneer Kuro.

 

Was there some other issue preventing the viewer from seeing the superior quality—that even the premium online distribution formats possess relative to Netflix? The superiority of Blu-ray versus Netflix is glaringly obvious. 

 

As for seating distance, face it that's what's makes it home theater! If you just want to discuss watching TV, that's fine. If you want to discuss watching a movie in a home theater, then seating distance becomes a relevant factor. If you watch a movie from the proper distance range, a Netflix 720p stream is not going to cut it.
 
You keep making fun of other people's eyesight, and yet you are the one who cannot see the significant quality issues with Netflix!eek.gif
 
Well, now you know that I'm going to include Netflix in a future online delivery format quality comparison.biggrin.gif

Edited by imagic - 5/2/13 at 4:53am
post #678 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Might want to move to a better neighborhood sometime. Without "thousands and thousands of kids watching streaming video" (damned kids).... eek.gif

I do get about 50mbps steady where I live, but as I said, Netflix streams 720p at just under 4mbps (and their new codec is more efficient), so perhaps you should try to figure out if there is a problem somewhere else in the chain.

Also, with all due respect, I have attempted to support my arguments on measurable guidelines (the several distance and resolution calculators I have already linked to). All I keep hearing from you guys is how Netflix sucks, even at 1080p, (yet many of you happily watch cable or satellite) and how all of you can tell individual pixels at great distances, which is statistically unlikely.

Ironically, you are adamant about not "shoveling money into switching internet service providers" to improve your Netflix experience (which would cost you $9 per month for as much as you can watch), while in the same breath praise $7 pay per view rentals and the ability to purchase $30 BRs of Ironman. rolleyes.gifrolleyes.gif

You seem to be mistaking me with someone else as I don't pay $7 to rent any title (Red Box is about $1 and Blockbuster is about $10 a month for about 6-8 rentals) and I haven't paid $30 for a new release BD in many a year.

I'm teasing a bit about you not being able to tell the difference between 720P Netflix and BD on your Kuro, but I'm not really joking. 720P Netflix doesn't even hold a candle, not just in resolution, motion artifacts, etc, but even in things like shadow detail and color depth. BD spanks Netflix. 4mbps is not enough, BD is about 30-45mbps.
post #679 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post



And I suppose there's always going to be someone who's going to bust out the double-blind A/B testing challenge, even in a situation where it is completely unnecessary—the quality difference is self-evident.

Netflix video simply does not hold when viewed on a large 1080p television. It certainly does not hold up on pioneer Kuro....


Ah, the dreaded double-blind test, hated and dismissed by all "golden ears/eyes"!

While it may be evident when pixel-peeping, it is not not so self-evident as you think when viewed from about 9-11 feet, which is just short of the average for the US market.

And it does look perfectly fine on a 60" at that distance, if you have an internet pipe which can handle 4-5mbps.
...
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Well, now you know that I'm going to include Netflix in a future online delivery format quality comparison.biggrin.gif

And I'd love to see it for educational purposes and as long as you can check to make sure that your stream is not getting throttled or something.

I personally truly do appreciate your pixel-peeping tests, even though I am not sure they are of much relevance to general viewing at normal screen size/distance ratios.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

...

I'm teasing a bit about you not being able to tell the difference between 720P Netflix and BD on your Kuro, but I'm not really joking. 720P Netflix doesn't even hold a candle, not just in resolution, motion artifacts, etc, but even in things like shadow detail and color depth. BD spanks Netflix. 4mbps is not enough, BD is about 30-45mbps.

Obviously I am not arguing that at close seating positions (and particularly if one is pixel-peeping) the difference between 720p and BR is not readily apparent.

What I am arguing is that Netflix at 720p is perfectly enjoyable on a 60" (much, much better than most cable or satellite channels) and for me at least, it exhibits virtually none of the artifacts you guys claim are so glaring.

Of course, at close distances 720p will be softer than full-blown BR and that will likely be apparent, but it still hardly a terrible experience.

Once you move to about 8 or so feet away from your 60" (and of course even less in the case of a smaller screen), the resolution differences quickly start dissipating.
Edited by Ryan1 - 5/2/13 at 11:36am
post #680 of 920
If I was going to sit really far away like that I wouldn't have bought a higher end TV in the first place.
post #681 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nebiroth View Post

You only need to buy another physical format if it's better. A heck of my stuff will never be any better than it is on DVD, because the source material isn't good enough. There is just no benefit in putting something like the original Doctor Who series on BluRay because the source material was made in SD anyway.

I have to disagree with this. With the higher video data rates and better compression technology, and the ability to store progressive scan data with BluRay, even old TV quality content would look better if released on BluRay.
post #682 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

If I was going to sit really far away like that I wouldn't have bought a higher end TV in the first place.

Just curious, how far do you sit from your screen to be having such problems?
post #683 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Just curious, how far do you sit from your screen to be having such problems?

I sit about 9' away from a 65" screen but I have several seating positions, so I can actually be sitting anywhere from around 4' to as far away as 12'. Even at the further positions the difference in sharpness between 720P and 1080P is noticeable. In the case of Netflix the compression artifacts, motion artifacts and banding were quite obvious. Even in the case of Vudu 1080P (with the quality meter pegged) it was apparent that it was not "blu-ray' quality but it was certainly much better than Netflix. In fairness it's been a year or so since I watched a Netflix "HD" title, but I never saw anything on Netflix that popped on my TV, whereas I have certain BDs that are flat out jaw dropping, especially from those 8' "sweet spot" seating positions (the TV actually has a mount that lets me bring it another 18 inches or so closer when watching something "really good" but admittedly it's a bit too in your face for casual TV viewing.

I'm glad that you don't have any of these problems. Honestly you seem to be trying to "pick a fight" over this, because it's incredulous to you that people don't have the same perception of streaming quality that you do.

To put it to you another way, if the super low bitrates at 720P you are seeing are acceptable, then one must wonder why BD was even bothered with. A 720P 4mbps video would easily fit on a dual layer DVD.

I would have zero problems doing a double blind test of Vudu or Netflix vs the source BD in my own setup.
Edited by jmpage2 - 5/2/13 at 4:41pm
post #684 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post


I sit about 9' away from a 65" screen but I have several seating positions, so I can actually be sitting anywhere from around 4' to as far away as 12'. Even at the further positions the difference in sharpness between 720P and 1080P is noticeable. In the case of Netflix the compression artifacts, motion artifacts and banding were quite obvious. Even in the case of Vudu 1080P (with the quality meter pegged) it was apparent that it was not "blu-ray' quality but it was certainly much better than Netflix. In fairness it's been a year or so since I watched a Netflix "HD" title, but I never saw anything on Netflix that popped on my TV, whereas I have certain BDs that are flat out jaw dropping, especially from those 8' "sweet spot" seating positions (the TV actually has a mount that lets me bring it another 18 inches or so closer when watching something "really good" but admittedly it's a bit too in your face for casual TV viewing.

I'm glad that you don't have any of these problems.

That is totally consistent with my experience. About the only difference is that I sit a bit closer to 55 inch screen — Typically 6 feet but optionally 7 feet.  

post #685 of 920
The studios are going to end up killing the online distribution model with their greedy agenda of paying every time the viewer pushes play. When consumers eventually realize that they have little control with digital purchases they will lose interest in it.
post #686 of 920
I think consumers will do anything for the convenience of instant gratification via streaming.
post #687 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

I think consumers will do anything for the convenience of instant gratification via streaming.
Then how come the streaming rental companies are keeping the numbers from those transactions so close to their vest. Sure disc sales are down but I bet the number of Redbox rentals are far surpassing the number of streamed rentals.
post #688 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmpage2 View Post

I sit about 9' away from a 65" screen but I have several seating positions, so I can actually be sitting anywhere from around 4' to as far away as 12'. Even at the further positions the difference in sharpness between 720P and 1080P is noticeable. In the case of Netflix the compression artifacts, motion artifacts and banding were quite obvious. ...

OK, so you are sort of in the ballpark, although if you have what is statistically considered "perfect" sight, you need to be at about 8.5 feet from that 65" screen to fully resolve 1080p.

At your 12 feet position, for a normal person, there shouldn't be much of an apparent resolution difference between 720p and 1080p. You may be an "eagle eye," but you are more likely seeing the results of different encoding, since yours is obviously not a controlled test, or just imagining things.

As far as "compression artifacts, motion artifacts and banding" on Netflix streams, as I said I have not seen these in years, so it's either your equipment (what are you using to stream Netflix?) or your internet pipe sucks. Or you are comparing I Love Lucy on Netflix (no, it's NOT the fault of Netflix that it is in B&W) to the Live of Pi on BR.

Again, to each their own. I am simply objecting to people stating as fact opinions which are at the very least unlikely to apply to the average person, such as seeing pixels from impossible distances, or swearing that they can tell the difference between lossless and high bit-rate compressed audio under controlled conditions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toknowshita View Post

Then how come the streaming rental companies are keeping the numbers from those transactions so close to their vest. Sure disc sales are down but I bet the number of Redbox rentals are far surpassing the number of streamed rentals.

Well, there is a difference between the pay per view streaming services, which are what the studios want, and the flat fee streaming services like Netflix, which is what most sane consumers want.

Netflix is perfectly open about its numbers. From AP:

"Here's a breakdown of Netflix Inc.'s subscribers as of March 31 and details on its forecast:
Streaming:
— 29.2 million in U.S., gain of 2 million during the first quarter
— 7.1 million outside the U.S., gain of 1 million
— 36.3 million total, gain of 3 million
DVD:
— 8 million in U.S., loss of 241,000. DVD service is not available in other countries."


Redbox is actually getting into streaming with Redbox instant, but I personally have not tried it (and I personally dislike Verizon, its owner, so it may take a while before I try it). But yep, streaming is the way forward, just not streaming $10 pay per view rentals.
Edited by Ryan1 - 5/3/13 at 1:15am
post #689 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartMan01 View Post

I have to disagree with this. With the higher video data rates and better compression technology, and the ability to store progressive scan data with BluRay, even old TV quality content would look better if released on BluRay.

Theoretically yes, in practise, the difference is marginal, espescially in show where the source material is poor. You're not going to stick a show like Dark Shadows onto BluRay and go "wow, it looks so much better".

Certainly, the difference is not going to be enough to make anyone buy something a second time in the latest format. It's not a big enough incentive to double-dip.

On the other hand, there is of course every reason why you might want to buy a show like Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, because it was made on real film; Fox evidently went back to the original (or close to it) for the DVD's which look great, and would look even better on BluRay.

But a lot of my collection just isn't like that. I wouldn't bother with re-buying it on a new format
post #690 of 920
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

That certainly makes a lot more sense than improving your Internet connection.

My internet from Cox clocks in at 30 down, 20 up on http://speedtest.net/. I don't think internet connection is the problem...
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