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Official Panasonic VT60/VT65 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 117

post #3481 of 13986
I have been asked by a number of members to disclose the settings that go with the calibration results posted here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1467563/official-panasonic-vt60-vt65-series-discussion-thread-no-street-price-talk/3360#post_23532035

During the past seven years, I have noticed a significant increase in the variations among units of the same model/size. Therefore, I don't know how well these will work with your set. In particular, I haven't determined how the calibration results behave with a change in the Contrast value.

And before I get my head chopped off, the Brightness setting of +6 is not a typo. It has been checked and double checked using various test disks, three different DVD/BD players, and the TV screen itself (finding the point where the dithering noise vanishes.)

Larry

07142013 -- 65VT60 -- i1 D2 profiled to i1 Pro

result: gamma = 2.21, max out = 25.9 ftL

Picture Mode: Custom
Contrast: 75
Brightness: +6
Color: 50
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0
Color Temp: Warm2
Vivid Color: Off
C.A.T.S: Off
Video NR: Off
MPEG NR: Off
Motion Smoother: Off

---- Pro Settings ----
Panel Brightness: Mid
AGC: 0
Black Extension: 0
Color Gamut: Rec.709

---- W/B Detail Adjustment ----
High R: +2
High G: 0
High B: +3
Low R: +3
Low G: 0
Low B: +3

---- (W/B) More Detail Adjustment (R, G, B) ----
10: -4, 0, +5
20: +3, 0, +1
30: -5, 0, +7
40: -1, 0, +1
50: +3, 0, 0
60: +2, 0, -1
70: 0, 0, -1
80: -1. 0, 0
90: -6, 0, +3
100: -6, 0, +1

---- Color Detail Adjustment (H, S, L) ----
Red hue: +2, 0, -5
Green hue: +4, -5, -1
Blue hue: +4, +10, -7
Cyan hue: -2. 0, 0
Magenta hue: 0, 0, +2
Yellow hue: -1, +1, -2

---- Gamma Detail Adjustment ----
Gamma: 2.4
Gamma More Detail Adjustment (Gain)
10: -11
20: -8
30: +1
40: +12
50: +13
60: +7
70: +4
80: +1
90: +2
100: 0

---- Advance Picture ----
3:2 PullDown: Auto
HDMI Content Type and auto detailing: all OFF
HDMI/DVI RGB Range: Standard (16-235)
Black Level: Light

---- Screen settings ----
Screen format: Full
Overscan: Off
H Size, 1
Screen display: On
4:3 side bars: user's choice
Pixel orbiter: user's choice
post #3482 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

I have been banned for much less than some of the posts here. Im amazed that the mod simply says to update your ignore lists. Just goes to show that you cant count on fairness. It is entirely up to the mods. Everyone should keep that in mind.
Hopefully I wont get banned for this post.
I have no "inside" information, but I don't see how you could be. wink.gif

For much longer than you may realize, I've thought that you are an energetic, cheerful (almost all the time), and helpful contributor. Enjoy. smile.gif
post #3483 of 13986
Thanks so much!
post #3484 of 13986
Ok that was a painful read through of "posts".

Can we get out of kindergarten and return to adulthood?
post #3485 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post

its supposed to look that bad.

I think you might want to look into a good visio LCD. Have heard great things about those recently. You'll likely save a lot of money as well.

Goodluck!



I'm afraid I don't understand your answer. Am I doing something wrong by asking these questions? Am I out of place here by doing so? I mean is your answer, "It's supposed to look that bad" for real?
I wasn't trying to cause any problems just get some advice from people who know alot more than I do.
post #3486 of 13986
Well, my VT60 arrived today. Unfortunately, I had a horrible experience with Amazon's 'White Glove" service with Pilot. I politely asked the two guys if they would help me, or if, at least, ONE of them could help me move my current Panasonic V10 off my TV stand onto the floor so I could make room for the new TV. A simple two-man task. They refused. Too much to ask, I guess. I was already getting irritable at this point.

So, they partially unboxed my VT60 and plugged it in so I could check for damage. I use the term "partially" because they wouldn't even lift the TV out of the box - they only removed the top half. When I asked why they wouldn't unpack the whole TV, they said it was because that would require them to attach the TV to its stand, and that they don't do that. By this point, I was angry. I live alone and don't really know anyone around me who could help me do the assembly. I just kind of assumed they would. I mean, it's not like I'm asking them to calibrate the TV for God's sake!

I was so put off by their attitude that I refused the delivery and told them to box it back up.

I'm wondering, is this normal? Back when I lived in an apartment, I had two guys take a 58 inch plasma up three flights of stairs, attached the stand, and I had absolutely no problems. But these guys seemed a bit more stubborn. Not cool!
post #3487 of 13986
Larry - if you keep up with the European thread - AVForum - for our display a number of calibrators post that they have found a variance of between 0 to 7 when setting brightness depending on the panel. It appears there is that much of a difference with the panels - so I am not surprised where you've set your brightness. It also validates what a lot of members say regarding using someone else's settings. Your actual results may vary rolleyes.gif
post #3488 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by alettiere View Post

Well, my VT60 arrived today. Unfortunately, I had a horrible experience with Amazon's 'White Glove" service with Pilot. I politely asked the two guys if they would help me, or if, at least, ONE of them could help me move my current Panasonic V10 off my TV stand onto the floor so I could make room for the new TV. A simple two-man task. They refused. Too much to ask, I guess. I was already getting irritable at this point.

So, they partially unboxed my VT60 and plugged it in so I could check for damage. I use the term "partially" because they wouldn't even lift the TV out of the box - they only removed the top half. When I asked why they wouldn't unpack the whole TV, they said it was because that would require them to attach the TV to its stand, and that they don't do that. By this point, I was angry. I live alone and don't really know anyone around me who could help me do the assembly. I just kind of assumed they would. I mean, it's not like I'm asking them to calibrate the TV for God's sake!

I was so put off by their attitude that I refused the delivery and told them to box it back up.

I'm wondering, is this normal? Back when I lived in an apartment, I had two guys take a 58 inch plasma up three flights of stairs, attached the stand, and I had absolutely no problems. But these guys seemed a bit more stubborn. Not cool!

I don't blame you for sending it back. Id get in touch with Amazon. From memory, the white glove does include unboxing, plugging it in and verifying there is no damage. Either get ALL your money back or tell them you want what you paid for.
post #3489 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post

its supposed to look that bad.

I think you might want to look into a good visio LCD. Have heard great things about those recently. You'll likely save a lot of money as well.

Goodluck!





I'm afraid I don't understand your answer. Am I doing something wrong by asking these questions? Am I out of place here by doing so? I mean is your answer, "It's supposed to look that bad" for real?
I wasn't trying to cause any problems just get some advice from people who know alot more than I do.

I was 'for real'. Dithering is a plasma limitation as well as flickering. Since you've apparently tried all the settings that could be dealing with brightness being the cause, I recommend an LCD to you. Make sense?
post #3490 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by alettiere View Post

Well, my VT60 arrived today. Unfortunately, I had a horrible experience with Amazon's 'White Glove" service with Pilot. I politely asked the two guys if they would help me, or if, at least, ONE of them could help me move my current Panasonic V10 off my TV stand onto the floor so I could make room for the new TV. A simple two-man task. They refused. Too much to ask, I guess. I was already getting irritable at this point.

So, they partially unboxed my VT60 and plugged it in so I could check for damage. I use the term "partially" because they wouldn't even lift the TV out of the box - they only removed the top half. When I asked why they wouldn't unpack the whole TV, they said it was because that would require them to attach the TV to its stand, and that they don't do that. By this point, I was angry. I live alone and don't really know anyone around me who could help me do the assembly. I just kind of assumed they would. I mean, it's not like I'm asking them to calibrate the TV for God's sake!

I was so put off by their attitude that I refused the delivery and told them to box it back up.

I'm wondering, is this normal? Back when I lived in an apartment, I had two guys take a 58 inch plasma up three flights of stairs, attached the stand, and I had absolutely no problems. But these guys seemed a bit more stubborn. Not cool!
Not sure normal is the term I would use but they are not required to do anything more than what they did. All that is required is to bring it inside the door, take the top of the box off, plug it in and power it on.
Sometimes they will do more but they dont have to. When mine was delivered the guy showed up in a van by himself and I had to help him carry it up 3 flights of steps. That would be something to complain about. He wanted to put it on a 2 wheeler and bang it up the steps and I told him he wasnt going to do that with my tv. So I was just glad to get it inside.
post #3491 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Not sure normal is the term I would use but they are not required to do anything more than what they did. All that is required is to bring it inside the door, take the top of the box off, plug it in and power it on.
Sometimes they will do more but they dont have to. When mine was delivered the guy showed up in a van by himself and I had to help him carry it up 3 flights of steps. That would be something to complain about. He wanted to put it on a 2 wheeler and bang it up the steps and I told him he wasnt going to do that with my tv. So I was just glad to get it inside.

That was pretty much the same experience I had with Paul's tv last week but the two guys were very nice about everything. I already knew Paul's policy before they arrived, so I had a neighbor come over that night to help me get it up on to the stand. They were patient though as they let me go over the whole screen with a flashlight to check for damages.
post #3492 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post

Larry - if you keep up with the European thread - AVForum - for our display a number of calibrators post that they have found a variance of between 0 to 7 when setting brightness depending on the panel. It appears there is that much of a difference with the panels - so I am not surprised where you've set your brightness. It also validates what a lot of members say regarding using someone else's settings. Your actual results may vary rolleyes.gif

Thanks for the feedback, Murray (I assume that's your name.)

I have the avforums site loaded in one of the tabs in my browser. But I haven't really paid much attention to it since the days when we were dealing with the fluctuating brightness in the 2011 D series Samsungs. I will start skimming the VT65 threads over there.

Larry
post #3493 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

I have no "inside" information, but I don't see how you could be. wink.gif

For much longer than you may realize, I've thought that you are an energetic, cheerful (almost all the time), and helpful contributor. Enjoy. smile.gif
Thx
post #3494 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by alettiere View Post

So, they partially unboxed my VT60 and plugged it in so I could check for damage. I use the term "partially" because they wouldn't even lift the TV out of the box - they only removed the top half. When I asked why they wouldn't unpack the whole TV, they said it was because that would require them to attach the TV to its stand, and that they don't do that. By this point, I was angry. I live alone and don't really know anyone around me who could help me do the assembly. I just kind of assumed they would. I mean, it's not like I'm asking them to calibrate the TV for God's sake!
The level of service you describe is the minimum for "white glove delivery" (a terrible misnomer, IMO). However, the drivers should have been willing at least to unbox the TV, because box/debris removal is included, and they can't exactly do that with the TV still inside. Attaching the TV to its stand might be considered an extra-cost assembly service (Pilot's Premier vs. Deluxe service), but Amazon doesn't specify whether or not they include this service, so you might try working it out with them.
post #3495 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Michael,

It really would be helpful if you posted all your settings. Without that information, there is nothing we can do for you. You seem to be the only owner that has these problems.

Larry

My settings. For the most part I'm on standard and adjusted below the half way points. I can calm down the flickering by using the custom setting and detailing settings to what looks better.
As far as anything else. ANY settings that could alter the picture have been tried on and off. There is so far nothing I have been able to do that eliminates this grainy screen door look over darker environments. A lot of people are just getting their TV. When I got mine a couple of months ago they were some of the first batches. I've never seen a picture morf from chrystal clear to grainy/fuzzed out look then disappear only to re-appear at any given time when an environment gets dark. Maybe this is a commonality with plasma. I'm hoping it's not.
Given the short time you've been here at AVS I can understand why you think that you answered LarryInRI's question. I don't know about him, but I would need more precise details in order to have any chance to help.

For instance when you say that you are "on standard" does that mean you are using The Standard Mode option, or are you using default settings?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mo949 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

To recap......I've had my VT for about 2 months. Problems I'm having, flickering/brightnees during sporting events especially hockey games when action on rink.
Second and much worse. Any time scene revolves around dark or very dimly lit scenes picture at any given time grains out in the dark areas.
A lot of you know a lot more about calibrating than I do. Do any of my problems sound like they could be corrected with this?
Here's an example. Yesterday watched the latest Die Hard. About an hour into the movie they're in a car, it's raining and there having a conversation while driving.
It's at night so it's pretty dark. The whole time the scene is dark, the areas that are dark totally grain out. Almost unwatchable. .
Last night watched a concert I saved on my DVR. Concert is in doors and dark. Many times the picture just unloaded to thisn horrible grainy mess. I want to make sure you understand
that this isn't just sligtly noticable. It's really bad. In fact watching the concert for the first time on this set showed how bad the picture can really get.
If any body out there is experiencing any of the similar problems I'm stuck with I would really appreciated some feed back. Any body that might have a suggestion, I'm listening. This just can't be
how the picture is supposed to look.


its supposed to look that bad.

I think you might want to look into a good visio LCD. Have heard great things about those recently. You'll likely save a lot of money as well.

Goodluck!
I am happy to help you if you are willing to answer questions about your entire setup, the source material that's bad, the source material that's good and room conditions. At the moment, my impression is that you may be more interested in finding folks with the same complaints that you have than finding out how to get your set to perform better.

I don't think it's likely, but there is a reasonable chance that your TV needs repair.

Actually, even though I prefer plasma to LCD, I have recommended LCD sets to several people in my extended family, and they are happy with the results. If you want some help with your set PM me, and I'll start asking questions. wink.gif
Edited by htwaits - 7/16/13 at 8:03pm
post #3496 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by dingo99 View Post

The level of service you describe is the minimum for "white glove delivery" (a terrible misnomer, IMO). However, the drivers should have been willing at least to unbox the TV, because box/debris removal is included, and they can't exactly do that with the TV still inside. Attaching the TV to its stand might be considered an extra-cost assembly service (Pilot's Premier vs. Deluxe service), but Amazon doesn't specify whether or not they include this service, so you might try working it out with them.

Good point. If this is the case, Amazon uses the "Premier" service, and then I guess if you get delivery guys who take pity on you, they'll throw in some "Deluxe" tasks as well. I already e-mailed Amazon. I have never had a negative customer service experience with them - so I'm sure they'll work something out.
post #3497 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdanderson View Post

That was pretty much the same experience I had with Paul's tv last week but the two guys were very nice about everything. I already knew Paul's policy before they arrived, so I had a neighbor come over that night to help me get it up on to the stand. They were patient though as they let me go over the whole screen with a flashlight to check for damages.
For me the Pauls TV delivery was very smooth. The delivery guys did tell me that the aren't required to put the tv on the stand, but I requested them to do it and also to move my old (super heavy) plasma tv to the basement (and that I will pay them $25). They agreed and did all that and were very nice overall.
post #3498 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by alettiere View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dingo99 View Post

The level of service you describe is the minimum for "white glove delivery" (a terrible misnomer, IMO). However, the drivers should have been willing at least to unbox the TV, because box/debris removal is included, and they can't exactly do that with the TV still inside. Attaching the TV to its stand might be considered an extra-cost assembly service (Pilot's Premier vs. Deluxe service), but Amazon doesn't specify whether or not they include this service, so you might try working it out with them.

Good point. If this is the case, Amazon uses the "Premier" service, and then I guess if you get delivery guys who take pity on you, they'll throw in some "Deluxe" tasks as well. I already e-mailed Amazon. I have never had a negative customer service experience with them - so I'm sure they'll work something out.
Many people tip the delivery guys in order to get the kind of help that you needed.
post #3499 of 13986
Amazon has ambiguous wording on 'Enhanced Delivery' all over their site. I'm not surprised the service offered by Pilot or Ceva may vary depending on who is delivering the set. Below makes it sound like they should take the TV to any room in your house (regardless of floor) and plug it in to ensure it turns on. They should also take it out of the box so you can visually inspect everything and offer to take away the packaging. I know when I bought the set last week I read some reference to them not placing it on a piece of furniture and also not being responsible for attaching the base. I just can't find that now for some reason.
Quote:
About Free Enhanced Delivery for Televisions
Free enhanced delivery means that a representative of the specialty shipper will deliver your TV during the delivery window you choose to any room of your choice, unpack it, ensure that it's working properly, and dispose of all packaging material.

You'll have the option of keeping all the packing materials. Otherwise the specialty shipper will dispose of all the materials for you.

A visual inspection is performed to ensure that, if necessary, we can replace a damaged TV as quickly as possible. If the TV displays any physical damage to the screen or casing at delivery, please refuse the delivery and contact Amazon.com Customer Service to arrange for a replacement to be delivered.

If you don't want the condition of your TV inspected at delivery, please contact Amazon.com Customer Service prior to signing for your TV. We highly recommend inspection as a way to ensure that, if necessary, we quickly replace a damaged TV as well as confirm its condition for return eligibility after delivery.

An adult signature will be required at the time of delivery.

My TV is being delivered tomorrow. Hopefully it's not being delivered to any room in my house by one guy and a dolly...

Oh I just found this elsewhere on the site. Here's where the ambiguity kicks in. If you read this one it sounds like they could deliver it just inside the front door provided there's an outlet nearby to check for power.
Quote:
FREE Enhanced Delivery
We offer FREE Enhanced Delivery through one of our specialty shippers when you purchase most HDTVs 52 inches or larger from Amazon.com. A representative of a common carrier will deliver your HDTV to any room suitable for testing, unpack it, ensure that it is working properly to guarantee no damage occurred during transportation, and dispose of all packaging material.

Edited by Fingolfin269 - 7/16/13 at 8:46pm
post #3500 of 13986
I forgot theyre supposed to take the box and packing material. I told them to leave it. I left mine in the base of the box in the hallway for the 100 hrs that I ran the slides.
If they take the box and refuse to put it on the stand, what do they usually to do with it? Lean it against the couch?
post #3501 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

I forgot theyre supposed to take the box and packing material. I told them to leave it.
If they take the box and refuse to put it on the stand, what do they usually to do with it? Lean it against the couch?

I haven't seen how the set is packaged but would assume it will be in some type of protective shipping material that would allow you to pull the set out of the exterior packaging and still let it sit upright. Could be wrong.
post #3502 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

To recap......I've had my VT for about 2 months. Problems I'm having, flickering/brightnees during sporting events especially hockey games when action on rink.
Second and much worse. Any time scene revolves around dark or very dimly lit scenes picture at any given time grains out in the dark areas.
A lot of you know a lot more about calibrating than I do. Do any of my problems sound like they could be corrected with this?
Here's an example. Yesterday watched the latest Die Hard. About an hour into the movie they're in a car, it's raining and there having a conversation while driving.
It's at night so it's pretty dark. The whole time the scene is dark, the areas that are dark totally grain out. Almost unwatchable. .
Last night watched a concert I saved on my DVR. Concert is in doors and dark. Many times the picture just unloaded to thisn horrible grainy mess. I want to make sure you understand
that this isn't just sligtly noticable. It's really bad. In fact watching the concert for the first time on this set showed how bad the picture can really get.
If any body out there is experiencing any of the similar problems I'm stuck with I would really appreciated some feed back. Any body that might have a suggestion, I'm listening. This just can't be
how the picture is supposed to look.

I can tell you that the Problem you're having I am not seeing on my VT60 the blacks are the blackest no grainy at all. Can you post a pic of this?
post #3503 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fingolfin269 View Post

Oh I just found this elsewhere on the site. Here's where the ambiguity kicks in. If you read this one it sounds like they could deliver it just inside the front door provided there's an outlet nearby to check for power.
Quote:
FREE Enhanced Delivery
We offer FREE Enhanced Delivery through one of our specialty shippers when you purchase most HDTVs 52 inches or larger from Amazon.com. A representative of a common carrier will deliver your HDTV to any room suitable for testing, unpack it, ensure that it is working properly to guarantee no damage occurred during transportation, and dispose of all packaging material.

To me, "unpacking" implies removing from box, and not providing a mickey mouse service, which I hope is a fair assumption, implies putting it on its stand as opposed to what, leaning the bare panel against a wall? To me, "disposing of all packaging material" means getting rid of the box, which reinforces what I believe "unpacking" means. It would be interesting to hear Amazon clarify its policy.
post #3504 of 13986
I just figured out where I read the delivery details. It wasn't on Amazon's site. It was in the email Pilot sent confirming delivery time:
Quote:
Your TV delivery will be completed by a representative of Pilot Freight Services. Here is what the service entails:
1. The representative will deliver your TV into whichever room in your home is suitable for testing the TV.
2. They will remove the TV from its packaging.
3. They will test the TV for power and blue screen. Please note: When the outside temperature is below 50 degrees, the power check cannot be performed as the unit must be plugged in only when it comes up to room temperature.

Pilot Freight Services is not authorized to perform the following services:
1. Placement of the TV on an existing stand, table or entertainment center;
2. Assembly of the base of the TV;
3. Hooking the TV up to your cable box for you;
4. Mounting the TV or assemble any wall unit or stand;
5. Moving furniture to gain access to the power outlet. The Pilot representative must have clear access to the power outlet to check if the TV powers up properly.
post #3505 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

To me, "unpacking" implies removing from box, and not providing a mickey mouse service, which I hope is a fair assumption, implies putting it on its stand as opposed to what, leaning the bare panel against a wall? To me, "disposing of all packaging material" means getting rid of the box, which reinforces what I believe "unpacking" means. It would be interesting to hear Amazon clarify its policy.

I agree with you. I didn't start digging deeper into the details until I received the email from Pilot that I just put in the previous post. I'll follow up tomorrow with how things go in my delivery.
post #3506 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fingolfin269 View Post

I haven't seen how the set is packaged but would assume it will be in some type of protective shipping material that would allow you to pull the set out of the exterior packaging and still let it sit upright. Could be wrong.
There is a fitted styrofoam base that is supported by cardboard that forms the bottom of the box. That will hold it upright but would be considered packing material and part of the box. If they take that then there is nothing to support it.
post #3507 of 13986
Well, I guess if I would have accepted it, they would have removed the boxing - which would have basically meant that yes - they'd have to leave it on the floor lent up against the wall. Nice!

I'm wondering if maybe Ceva was the service that I used several years back with Amazon for my older Panasonic.

I pulled this from the Ceva website.

'white glove' - delivery or collection by appointment to or from the room of choice with a menu of value added in-home services, including:

- unpacking
- packaging removal
- light assembly
- installation/set-up
- instructions
post #3508 of 13986
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Thanks, ss. But I've been doing this a bit longer than you. Please don't take this the wrong way. I'm just trying to establish a basis for a discussion. There is no hostility on my part since your suggestions may help some newbies with no technical background.

WRT the 32-35 ftL: Some of us have eyes that cannot take that level in the dark. That's why there is no specification for maximum output.

Larry

NP.
Please don't take this the wrong way.
I know nothing about you or how you calibrate or what hardware or software you use until now looking at your settings.
You may want to upgrade your old I12 meter to a I1display Pro. As you know color meters need to be re-calibrated and in the case of a old meter like yours It may be more cost effective to upgrade. Or just use your I1pro meter and not profile, yes I understand that the I1pro also has a problem reading low light levels but that seems to be a problem you are having using your I12. Beware even if you do upgrade your color meter you still will have a problem with low light readings, but you should get some relief from your color meter drifting.

Yes you are correct In this thread I post mainly for the folks that just want to adjust the basic's.
It would seem that so many folks on this thread want to know the optimum brightness and contrast settings, and the range I posted is just that.

Yes I understand that some folks have a problem with eye fatigue, but why drop contrast so low only to raise your Gamma gain so high or Red to get close to what your Gamma target is. You may want to drop your brightness setting down, there by giving better detail and a less washed out picture in your low light scenes.
For folks that do have a special need for dark room viewing and there for get eye fatigue, I would suggest getting a smaller 15W florescent 65K bulb and mount it behind and towards the top of the VT60 using its light diffuser. This way you can have better contrast and a brighter picture with no eye fatigue.

Hope this helps.smile.gif

ss
post #3509 of 13986
Pilot didn't install base for me; ceva did. Also bought off amazon.
post #3510 of 13986
Amazon uses a local delivery service according to where you live. Mine was Pilot. I assume they all adhere to Amazons rules though.
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