or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › F8500 Recommended Settings Thread.....
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

F8500 Recommended Settings Thread..... - Page 48

post #1411 of 2098
^ Yes kudos! smile.gif

Especially when many of the Pro cals have 10p all over the shop eek.gif

You'll have to upgrade your meter if you're going in this deep!
post #1412 of 2098
I did have one Boo Boo. I was just about to call it good on the Calibration because everything looked good on the charts and too the Eye. I had the Samsung HDMI level set to Low and calibrated to RGB Digital, Rec 709, and a Gamma of 2.2. I then went to my Directv HR20 and found out that the HR20 puts out YCbCr which crushed the Blacks and I don't know yet what happened to the Colors yet, until I set everything back up and take some readings. I hope I just have to adjust brightness, but I got a funny feeling this alone isn't going to do it. It seems that when the Samsung defaults to the Normal HDMI Black level, I have to move Brightness way to high to get out of the crushed range. There is no way to change output on the H20. I don't have this problem at home with the HR25's because they put out RGB.
Edited by Glenee - 11/1/13 at 6:43am
post #1413 of 2098
Well got it done. It didn't mess with gray scale all that much, but it tore saturation and Hue up. When I got those right Black levels were at the point they were meant to be. I set the Accupel to output YCbCr 4.2.2. 1080i 60. I then set Brightness and contrast and went to work at 75% . When I got done with Gray scale, Hue and Saturation. I double checked Brightness and contrast made a couple of small adjustments. I then checked against a Gamma curve of 2.2 and pick the Gamma mode that set the gamma closest to 2.2. I then rechecked all setting and made proper adjustments. I then increased to 100% and ran thru saturation and Hue as would be expected they needed some fine tuning, mostly at Red. Rechecked 75% it was lovely across the board. Delta E came in at less than 1% and hue and saturation came in at the most 0.9%. I don't know how accurate these are with the meter that I am using but it was Calibrated against a Klein and Jetti.
That's what I got and it looks good to me.
post #1414 of 2098
Hi guys - about the HDMI black level... it may have been explained before in this thread but here it is

Input YCbCr > HDMI BL defaults to grayed out Normal which is 16-235 ---- I know, Samsung is playing with your head.
Input RGB > you get a choice of
Normal or Low. LOW is 16-235. Normal is PC level.

Hope that helps. smile.gif

Edits
Edited by buzzard767 - 11/2/13 at 2:47am
post #1415 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Hi guys - about the HDMI black level... it may have been explained before in this thread but here it is

Input YCbCr > HDMI BL defaults to grayed out High which is 16-235 ---- I know, Samsung is playing with your head
Input RGB > you get a choice of High or Low. LOW is 16-235. High is PC level.

Hope that helps. smile.gif

I assume when you say High that you mean Normal? I don't see High as an option.
post #1416 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by caeguy View Post

I assume when you say High that you mean Normal? I don't see High as an option.
That's exactly what he means High is listed as Normal and Low as Low. It did make a difference in my Calibration. I just thought that since it let me set it at low it would hold. What I was doing was I had a DVDO Duo in use. I was using the Auto Calibration with Chromapure software and the Duo to judge my Limited abilities as a Calibrator. When my Calibration's out performed the DVDO Duo's, I took the Duo out of the chain and plugged the DirecTV HDDVR straight into the Display and that's when I discovered some more of my limited knowledge and Forward thinking Limitations.
But I will try real hard to never make that mistake again. Just chalk it up to the Learning experience.
The Video setting's of the Calibration Test Equipment have to match the output of the Device to be used on that input. You need to know if it outputs in YCbCr or RGB, and then you have to decide YCbCr 4.2.2. or 4.4.4.
I think.
Bye the way anything I say takes a back seat in the back of the Bus to what Buzz say's.

Buzz Don't Play He Quit School Cause of Recess.
post #1417 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by caeguy View Post

I assume when you say High that you mean Normal? I don't see High as an option.

Oops, yeah - had Panasonic PNL BRT on the brain.
post #1418 of 2098
Samsung F8500 Settings OCT 31.docx 59k .docx file

Here is something to Play with since it's been a while.
post #1419 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenee View Post

Samsung F8500 Settings OCT 31.docx 59k .docx file

Here is something to Play with since it's been a while.

These are for your 51" set?
post #1420 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by WantsNWarrants View Post

These are for your 51" set?
Yep. I used Chromapure Plus Software, Accupel DVG5000 Test Generator, i1 Pro 3 Calibrated to a klein K10A and this is what I finally come up with.
Cowboy Calibration done with all the Know How of a Beginner.
post #1421 of 2098
^Glenee what was your target gamma?

I threw on your settings last night. Look good.
I've just put up v5 cal using a PS3 and Spears and Munsil slides. It would be nice to know what you think.
post #1422 of 2098
I like my Picture a little more Pop so I shot for about 2.2 Gamma. Tell me where to find your settings and I will try them. Are you just editing your settings in your original Posted settings.
Edit: I found them and how in the hell do you do 3D settings ? I'm just curious.
I also have a new big respect for you guys that can do these calibrations without a software driven pattern generator. I can't even begin to think of the time it would take to get it right.
Edited by Glenee - 11/13/13 at 3:37pm
post #1423 of 2098
^ Yeah 2.2 is nice. I prefer more 'depth' in grayscale with 2.25. For me it helps blacks be black. this cal is from the ground up (hence 5.0). Any tweaks I will add something after the decimal. I've also chosen to go a bit darker with this one and adjust our den lighting to match.

The 3D cal is a first go and isn't very good IMO. I have seen some tricks pros have used and may be trying them sometime. It is way better than stock though. I don't watch much 3D.
In any mode (Movie / CAL-DAY etc), play a 3D movie, then whilst it's playing, go into the settings to change the values. They will be remembered the next time you watch 3D content, but you must be in the original 2D mode (that's where the 3D settings will be stored).

I've been trying with many different source materials, and they all present slightly different readings. Recently got hold of the S&M2 disc and the readings I get from the equal energy slides work really well with this TV and the meter. By far better results.. Doing it manually isn't fun biggrin.gif you're right lol.
post #1424 of 2098
Forgot to ask, Glenee,- do you always see funny stuff at 90% grayscale on your TV? I always read anomalies at this point and decided not to even attempt to calibrate it this time. Doing so allowed tighter values either side and I think overall a better grayscale top end.
post #1425 of 2098
What I do is, I try to get the 80& 30 as close as I can get to start with. I then take a White Balance( Gray Scale) reading across the board. I then make small adjustments in the 80 Range to see how it effects the rest of the scale. I then try to get 80 & 70 to play together well. The last adjustments I make is a trade off on the offsets to get the Low end 40, 30, 20 with the least amount of error average among the 3. I don't trust my meter for readings 10 and below. I just figure that if 20,30, and 40 are averaged out that the rest of the low end has to be non perceptable by the Human eye. (I don't know if this is right but it's all I got). What I get by doing this is a very good reading across the gray scale with NO 10 point applied. I then go to Color Saturation and Hue ( Color Space). I take readings of all. I find the most out of whack one and work that one first. Then the next out of whack one, and so on. I always do Yellow last. I spend most of my time with it. Of all the Secondary Colors I try to get yellow perfect,(I think it has the biggest effect on Flesh Tones of the secondaries) and then tune up the others.
Until I make a purchase of a Klein k10-A or something of this accuracy I think this is the best I can do with the meter I have.
I did go into 10 point on my last Calibration and used interval 10 to bring 100 somewhere into spec. This did help with gray scale above 80. Of course I had to take a full set of readings and then make small 10 point adjustments in other intervals, but nothing dramatic.
The hardest thing for me is getting Brightness and Contrast levels correct at the start. I know these are supposed to be the easiest to set and are if your not doing a full Calibration. They have such a huge effect on the final Calibration that I have never got it right from the start and have always had to go back thru everything Gray scale, Color space, Gamma, Brightness and Contrast in the end to get it right in the end.
This is all coming from a Beginner and I have never achieved a perfect Grayscale or Gamma in the end. It is better than the DVDO Duo Autocalibrate but it's not NUTS ON.
I am working with a UN55ES8000 LED right now and it is quite the nightmare. I still don't have it right using the same pattern described above. It looks good to the average Eye but not to me. I am getting closer with it after 4 attempts. Each time it's getting better, but it's no where near the same Calibration as the F8500.
As to your Post above I shoot for a 2.2 Gamma, but it always measures out at 2.25 to 2.3. Close enough for my limited skills.

Nobody Said this was easy and Damn It they meant It.
Edited by Glenee - 11/14/13 at 6:31am
post #1426 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

^Glenee what was your target gamma?

I threw on your settings last night. Look good.
I've just put up v5 cal using a PS3 and Spears and Munsil slides. It would be nice to know what you think.
I just got your settings entered into my Movie Mode and they are looking real good. I think I just found my Movie mode settings.
Thanks P&C
post #1427 of 2098
^ smile.gif Nice thanks! You will probably have to tweak CMS and grayscale with your meter and software to be accurate for your TV but I think the cell, brightness, contrast are just right for the 51".
I use the settings for day time viewing too, only I have the ECO feature activated which flips the cell up a notch in sunny weather. It works well where I have the TV located in our den. The room can get quite bright during certain hours of the day and ECO seems to be doing the job.
Edited by pieandchips - 11/14/13 at 5:50pm
post #1428 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenee View Post

What I do is, I try to get the 80& 30 as close as I can get to start with...

Yes same here but I think it's best not to touch green in 2 point. Leave them both at 25. Green is the equivalent to contrast at the high end and brightness at the low end. In 10 point you only touch green if you need to correct gamma and you increase green to decrease gamma and vice-versa, then balance each point adjusting blue and red. I think it's okay on these panels to tweak 10 point quite a bit.

/edited.- rephrased 2p and 10p.
Edited by pieandchips - 11/15/13 at 6:22am
post #1429 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

Yes same here but I think it's best not to touch green in 2 point. Leave them both at 25. Green is the equivalent to contrast at the high end and brightness at the low end. In 10 point you only touch green if you need to correct gamma and you increase green to decrease gamma and vice-versa, then balance each point adjusting blue and red. I think it's okay on these panels to tweak 10 point quite a bit.

/edited.- rephrased 2p and 10p.
Thanks for the Excellent Tip's. I bet by the time We get this all figured out and people like yourself giving those excellent Tip's. We will have a Top Notch Step by Step instruction Manual for Calibration's for us Average Joe's. Without all the Foo Foo. The problem lie's in the fact that, the way one display responds to calibration may be totally different on the next model or manufacture. I am finding this out with the ES8000 and it's from the same manufacture.
What a Great Hobby.
Edited by Glenee - 11/15/13 at 6:54am
post #1430 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenee View Post

Samsung F8500 Settings OCT 31.docx 59k .docx file

Here is something to Play with since it's been a while.

I entered these settings into my 64in. The only change I had to make is turning the cell light up to 18. Looks good. Thanks smile.gif
post #1431 of 2098
A bit bit of off topic (please bare with me) : last night a vertical line across the panel, almost in the middle of it, appeared .
The color changes but it's still there.
Any suggestions ?!
Thank you in advance !

P.S. It's a 51'er.
post #1432 of 2098
^Take it back / call Samsung. Warranty.
post #1433 of 2098
Monday I'll have them come and pick it up.
As I've learn during my searches on the web, it's the panel and it only get worst (it adds a line to the original one every now and then until it becomes an inch wide and then it becomes black) ...
Hope you guys don't go through this kind of mess ...
Otherwise is a great tv so content with the performance of it !
post #1434 of 2098
Gains and Offsets: what are the percentage grey levels to put up re matching 30%, 80%, 100% for the Gains and Offsets?

Gains 100% or 80%
Offsets 30%
Edited by p5browne - 11/18/13 at 9:24pm
post #1435 of 2098
^ Now I understand your question, I'm glad you've answered it wink.gif
post #1436 of 2098
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

^ Now I understand your question, I'm glad you've answered it wink.gif

Not quite: are Gains 100% or 80%
post #1437 of 2098
If you are doing a 10pt I think it is generally recommended to adjust at 100% for gains.
post #1438 of 2098
If I am understanding the question correctly. 100-70 % use gains and for 40 to 10 % use offsets. For white balance or grayscale.
post #1439 of 2098
If the TV has 10point you measure 30 and 100 not 30 and 80.
post #1440 of 2098
30 is an offset.
80 and 100 both gain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by p5browne 
Gains 100% or 80%
Offsets 30%

Yes, correct wink.gif
Edited by pieandchips - 11/19/13 at 1:11pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Plasma Flat Panel Displays
AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › F8500 Recommended Settings Thread.....