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Scanspeak B741 build - Page 2

post #31 of 75
Are the speakers up and running yet?
How do they sound?

Do you have any measuring equipment? I'm really curious how these would compare to commercial and ID speakers, ie. Salk Sound speakers.
post #32 of 75
Thread Starter 
This is how far I have gotten. I am as keen as anyone to install the drivers and plug them into my system. But, I will continue to plug along. Will spray them next week and hopefully have them connected by end of week.

Oh, I don't have measuring equipment. That stuff is well beyond my knowledge and expertise.


Edited by dragon666 - 4/27/13 at 2:22am
post #33 of 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by dragon666 View Post

This is how far I have gotten. I am as keen as anyone to install the drivers and plug them into my system. But, I will continue to plug along. Will spray them next week and hopefully have them connected by end of week.

Oh, I don't have measuring equipment. That stuff is well beyond my knowledge and expertise.

Well then I must say you have extremely good taste and intuition for speakers with your "limited" expertise. ;-p
Beautiful work, by the way. Attention to details is fantastic. I can't wait to see how they turn out.

To be honest, I didn't even know these existed until this thread. I must thank you for this.
Now I'm wondering if a sealed version is possible and what would the FR look like as I'm partial to sealed speakers.
post #34 of 75
Thread Starter 
So, what would you expect to be different between sealed and open speakers like these? As mentioned before, my friend built some sealed speakers prior to my project, and they sound amazing. My current Monitor Audio RS6's are open and they too sound pretty good, but not as good. Having said that, my friend has 12 inch subwoofers with HUGE but tight base. Cranked it up last week for the first time and the base could be felt from a fair distance away. Overall very detailed sound across the range.
Edited by dragon666 - 4/27/13 at 5:45am
post #35 of 75
The woofers are low Qts, which means they work best in a bass reflex (ported) alignment. Going sealed would require a sub. I would not be concerned at all about bass quality.... These are among the best 7" woofers period.
post #36 of 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

The woofers are low Qts, which means they work best in a bass reflex (ported) alignment. Going sealed would require a sub. I would not be concerned at all about bass quality.... These are among the best 7" woofers period.
yes your right ..these will produce lots of good tight bass..and they can go down pretty low as well ...this kit is one of the best I have seen so far..they were a bit beyond my budget.. but I really like them...he will enjoy his build for sure..
post #37 of 75
Thread Starter 
I just did a little reading on Qts etc etc and am a little more educated now.
post #38 of 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay1 View Post

The woofers are low Qts, which means they work best in a bass reflex (ported) alignment. Going sealed would require a sub. I would not be concerned at all about bass quality.... These are among the best 7" woofers period.

I'm not so worried about the quality of the bass as the direction of the bass and the ability to position the speakers.
Ports mean they need sufficient distance from a back wall.

Here are two unibox sims I have, one ported, one sealed.
Simulation is of 2 drivers in parallel.



You can see that you wouldn't lose much going sealed, because of the low Qts.
The Qts of this woofer is almost identical to an LMS 5400, yet almost everyone uses the LMS in a sealed configuration, though I realize the application is not the same as one is a subwoofer and the other is just a woofer.

I'm interested how a supercharged version of the B741 would sound using 4 x Scanspeak 18WU drivers in sealed configuration as compared to the original design.
Most likely it's a waste of $650 per speaker, but that's exactly why I'm curious. tongue.gif

Also, how would changing the shape of the cabinet for allow for BSC affect the performance?
It's interesting to see that the the crossover frequency has a wavelength the same as the width of the cabinet.
How does this affect the overall sound?
post #39 of 75
Thread Starter 
Sanding took longer than expected. Now I have to wait a few days before I wet sand and polish. Not far now.

AppleMark
AppleMark
AppleMark
Edited by dragon666 - 5/12/13 at 8:18am
post #40 of 75
coming along nicely man...sweet ....
post #41 of 75
Definitely. Very nice!
post #42 of 75
Sub'd, looking great man!

Scott
post #43 of 75
Thread Starter 
Thx guys. The finish consists of:
1. 3 x MDF primer (rolled on, terrible finish. Should have used a brush instead)
2. 3 x automotive paint primer
4. 4 x automotive acrylic black
5. 10 x clear coat

And a lot of headache/nausea from the fumes. My mate actually did most of the spraying.
post #44 of 75
Holy Cow !!!! That is one pricey kit. I like vintage gear, but give a pro amp a chance at some point and see if the focus improves. Nothing better than getting involved with a project like that and having the right tools to get er' done. Cant wait til you start spinning some CD's and let us know how you like them.
post #45 of 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Holy Cow !!!! That is one pricey kit. I like vintage gear, but give a pro amp a chance at some point and see if the focus improves. Nothing better than getting involved with a project like that and having the right tools to get er' done. Cant wait til you start spinning some CD's and let us know how you like them.

Serious. I like Dragon's style. Go big or go home.
I don't know of any other DIY kit that uses such quality drivers.

I can't wait to see the final result as well. That is some serious paint work going on! biggrin.gif
post #46 of 75
This is definitely shipping up to be a great build! I can not wait to hear the OP's impressions on
how these bad boys sound!
post #47 of 75
Thread Starter 
AppleMark

Gotta get rid of the orange peel. Hopefully the 10 x clear coats will hold up. But...Im pretty happy with the corners. No lines!
post #48 of 75
What's your method to smooth it? 320-440 grit sandpaper each coat? I'm attempting a similar finish with Black Lacquer.
post #49 of 75
Usually you spray a few coats and then wet-sand with 320 grit to get rid of the orange peel. Do NOT dry sand lacquer that is not fully cured. The paper will clog and gouge out the soft paint. Normally you would do some sanding before applying the clear coat to get rid of most of the orange peel. After the final top coat is applied, you must wait about a month for the lacquer to cure. If not, the heat from polishing may cloud the clear coat. Had that happen to me once. A real PIA.
post #50 of 75
Thread Starter 
Thanks for that tip!
post #51 of 75
Thread Starter 
Okay guys. I listened to these babies today and they sound simply amazing.

1. Soundstage is amazing.
2. Separation of instruments incredible.
3. Deep and very tight bass. Loads of it. Doesn't leave me wanting more.
4. Highs are so detailed and clear - Worth $500 a tweeter? You bet.
5. So detailed that some of my reference CDs revealed things I had never heard before, like the 10 second decay of a grand harp.

Unfortunately, I nearly stuffed up the piano black finish by sanding them back too early. Luckily my neighbour, who is a master painter, informed me that I should wait 2-3 weeks for the clear coat to dry before attempting to polish. Lucky that I hadn't gone too far into it like a blind rhino in heat.

I will wait a month before attempting any further work. In the meantime, I will simply have to rediscover my music collection. Oh well, life's tough I guess.
Edited by dragon666 - 5/18/13 at 4:21pm
post #52 of 75
Thread Starter 
BTW, the Pioneer M90 is more than enough amp to power these babies. This along with an Arcam preamp and CD player are a pretty good combo, to my humble ears.


G]
Edited by dragon666 - 5/18/13 at 4:13pm
post #53 of 75
Yes..dargon.. the amp looks sweet...am waiting for one to come in to...nice........smile.gif
post #54 of 75
Thread Starter 
The Buddha Bar series of CDs sound bloody good with my setup too.
Edited by dragon666 - 5/18/13 at 2:11pm
post #55 of 75
Nice! Those speakers look killer.
post #56 of 75
Speaker looks awesome. Need some impressions on the sound compared to other speakers you've heard.
post #57 of 75
Thread Starter 
My opinions above were compared to the Zaph speakers I mentioned at the start of this thread. My friend who built those Zaph sat with me when I first hooked these up. He brought his own reference CDs and agrees with my sentiments above. He has decided to build these B741s as well. Speaker envy. Don't get me wrong. The zaphs sound great. The b741s just have so much more detail and bigger stage.
Edited by dragon666 - 5/18/13 at 4:11pm
post #58 of 75
Thread Starter 
The other speakers I own are the Monitor Audio RS6. Smaller sound stage and much less low end detail and oomph (i still love these speakers tho). Mid and top end not too bad. The B741s have awesome base. I think the 12 inch zaph subs have more presence (possibly a teeny tiny bit too much), but I will need to listen more. You need to sit at least 5-6 metres away from the zaphs for a good experience. With the B741s you can be as close as 3.5m. As I mentioned, I'm pretty satisfied with the entire range with the b741s. So, my 3 points - incredible detail at every section, wide sound stage, balanced low end. I think when you hear something new in a CD that you've owned for 20 yrs, that's gotta say something.
Edited by dragon666 - 5/18/13 at 4:17pm
post #59 of 75
So Dragon, how does the top end of the B741 compare to the Zaph?
What about the upper and lower mid-range?

Which Zaph design did you have for comparison?
post #60 of 75
Thread Starter 
The speakers I refer to are Zaph|Audio SB12.3.

Scanspeak D3004/6640-00 VS SB29RDC-C000-4 tweeter - extremely clear without being harsh. Does not fatigue you at all, which I think the SB Acoustics does after a long while. Detail, detail, detail. Thats what I keep thinking when i listen to these drivers. However, for $50, I think the SB is the best bang for you buck tweeter out there, period. Is the Scanspeak illuminator worth $500? To be honest, I don't know. I sought to make the best pair of speakers possible, using the best parts available. I think I've done well to do so with the Scanspeak illuminators and would probably fork out the same money again. If you put in this much time and effort you might as well go for the best. From what I have extensively read, these are not good value for money at all, but they do sound the best. Would I be happy to put in SB acoustic tweeters into this build? After all this work, probably not.

Unfortunately, I am quite inexperienced with all of this. My personal experience is limited to only a handful of decent sounding speakers. So I cannot really give advice. But, both my friend and I are extremely impressed with how the Illuminators sound.

Having said that, I have only listened for 5 hours with my newly built speakers. Need to listen more before I can comment further.
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