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BDA to Determine if 4K Blu-ray is Feasible - Page 2

post #31 of 109
Maybe my wife will be able to tell the difference between dvd and 4k blu-ray at 100". I won't hold my breath.
post #32 of 109
Snap !

Good one
Quote:
Originally Posted by macks View Post

Maybe my wife will be able to tell the difference between dvd and 4k blu-ray at 100". I won't hold my breath.
post #33 of 109
What's really needed is a good ol format war. HD DVD 4K vs. Blu ray 4K.
rolleyes.gif
post #34 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

It does.

Unless you have some inside info, you can't know this for sure.

I believe all Sony has said thus far is that the PS4 will support 4k video (for movies. Games will not be in 4k) but they did not mention what format that would come in...whether through BD or Download.
post #35 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by VinnyS View Post

I think that is the major problem. Technology development didn't move that fast even a decade ago. A format expectancy was supposed to lat 10 years as VHS and DVD did. Even today though DVD still is available on the market even though prices on Blu-rays and players have gone down in price.

Today we are simply trying to catch up all time. It took the Chinese a couple of years before they started replicating technology and now, it only takes a few weeks. 4K was announced at Vegas in January. By the end of the month, Seiki at announced a UHD display a 10th of the price of most large name manufacturers. Technology doesn't last as long anymore because of the constant development in the industry.

I think by the time it comes out, I will probably pick one up. The time I pick one up will probably coincide with the death of my current Blu-ray player. tongue.gif

But don't forget though, 4K have been shown as early as CES 2011 and have been showcased at Tokyo Tower (by NHK) back in 2004. So in teRms of technology, 4K have been around for almost a decade before we get it.

Just to add, 8K have even already been standardized since 2007.
post #36 of 109
Having watched The Dark Knight Rises on a 1080p projector, the detail 1080p is capable of is quite a revelation when watching the Imax scenes, the 35mm scenes are soft in comparison.....however I doubt the industry will bring that level of detail to 1080p Bluray accross the board even if it existed in the original source.......4k will be the platform they present that level of quality.
post #37 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

But don't forget though, 4K have been shown as early as CES 2011 and have been showcased at Tokyo Tower (by NHK) back in 2004. So in teRms of technology, 4K have been around for almost a decade before we get it.

Just to add, 8K have even already been standardized since 2007.

I say we just skip 4k and go straight to 8k when ready. That's the smart thing to do, for the consumer. Obviously the manufacturers would never allow this to happen, tney want to make some on 4k, and then make some again on 8k, hahah, I'll wait..
post #38 of 109
Yeah, I agree. Why bother with 4K when 8K was already established when blu-ray was released! (Other than greed, of course)
post #39 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

God I hope this happens.

+1 smile.gif
post #40 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

But don't forget though, 4K have been shown as early as CES 2011 and have been showcased at Tokyo Tower (by NHK) back in 2004. So in teRms of technology, 4K have been around for almost a decade before we get it.

Just to add, 8K have even already been standardized since 2007.

True that. rolleyes.gif
post #41 of 109
The video codec we are waiting for is HEVC.
H.264/MPEG-4 AVC is part of bluray today.

HEVC got first stage approvals this year in Jan.
Just look up the Broadcom BCM7445.
It should be ready when HDMI 2.0 silicon starts to be readily available for next year.
Those players should be backward compatible with current blurays, but I just don't see how it could be the other way around.
Edited by bootman_head_fi - 5/4/13 at 9:53am
post #42 of 109
I bought a TEA-BDW26SSB Blu-ray drive for my HTPC last year. It reads and writes 3 layer (100GB) and 4 layer (128GB) Blu-ray disks. You can buy the 3 layer disks (BD-RE XL or BD-R XL) on ebay but I haven't seen 4 layer disks yet.

Interesting that only 3 layers is needed for 100GB - at least for rewritable disks.
post #43 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by dew42 View Post

I bought a TEA-BDW26SSB Blu-ray drive for my HTPC last year. It reads and writes 3 layer (100GB) and 4 layer (128GB) Blu-ray disks. You can buy the 3 layer disks (BD-RE XL or BD-R XL) on ebay but I haven't seen 4 layer disks yet.

Interesting that only 3 layers is needed for 100GB - at least for rewritable disks.

I thought it was:

1 layer: 25GB
2 layer: 50 GB
4 layer: 100 GB

No ?
post #44 of 109
Check out the specs for the drive or the disks.
post #45 of 109
For the vast majority of people, 4K is going to be a very tough sell, as there are no tangible benefits for anyone with a screen size smaller than about 80".

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57366319-221/why-4k-tvs-are-stupid/
post #46 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

I thought it was:

1 layer: 25GB
2 layer: 50 GB
4 layer: 100 GB

No ?

No.

1 layer BD: 25GB
2 layer BD: 50GB
3 layer BDXL: 100GB
4 layer BDXL: 128GB
post #47 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by sytech View Post

No.

1 layer BD: 25GB
2 layer BD: 50GB
3 layer BDXL: 100GB
4 layer BDXL: 128GB

Interesting, thx !
post #48 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

I say we just skip 4k and go straight to 8k when ready. That's the smart thing to do, for the consumer. Obviously the manufacturers would never allow this to happen, tney want to make some on 4k, and then make some again on 8k, hahah, I'll wait..

It's due to the law of diminishing returns. The preceived difference between 1080p and 4k is probably greater than the difference between 4k and 8k. In pursuit of the 8k resolution, every other parameter of picture quality improvement would need to be deferred. That would include deep color, too because the bits would need to reallocated to 8k. Eventually someone will claim that a 12k standard needs to be implementd because of the improvement in resolution is necessary to beat the competition. That will never end, Then we'll have a 12k vs. 16k debate.
post #49 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazishere View Post

It's due to the law of diminishing returns. The preceived difference between 1080p and 4k is probably greater than the difference between 4k and 8k. In pursuit of the 8k resolution, every other parameter of picture quality improvement would need to be deferred. That would include deep color, too because the bits would need to reallocated to 8k. Eventually someone will claim that a 12k standard needs to be implementd because of the improvement in resolution is necessary to beat the competition. That will never end, Then we'll have a 12k vs. 16k debate.

It's gotta end at some point, hopefully.... eek.gif
post #50 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tazishere View Post

It's due to the law of diminishing returns. The preceived difference between 1080p and 4k is probably greater than the difference between 4k and 8k. In pursuit of the 8k resolution, every other parameter of picture quality improvement would need to be deferred. That would include deep color, too because the bits would need to reallocated to 8k. Eventually someone will claim that a 12k standard needs to be implementd because of the improvement in resolution is necessary to beat the competition. That will never end, Then we'll have a 12k vs. 16k debate.

Only when companies get tired of turning a profit...not gonna happen.
post #51 of 109
post #52 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

It's gotta end at some point, hopefully.... eek.gif

Just like still photography, 4K (8 MP), I find it to be the sweet spot for all of MY professional applications. I really wish the studios will improve further by start using 4:4:4 12-bit colour and FbF compression though.

note: I wrote "MY" application because I don't assume that everybody have the same applications as myself.
post #53 of 109


Interesting. The article is from 2010, if they are considering this for 4K BR.
post #54 of 109
Won't be surprised if the plan is true. They had blu-ray (but in cartridge casing) a couple of years before launching the final disc form.
post #55 of 109
That would be an awesome PC backup medium (rewritable preferable).
post #56 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

Interesting. The article is from 2010, if they are considering this for 4K BR.



I'm not sure but it would have enough space for 4K BR. I just thought it was interesting.
post #57 of 109
1 TB is more than enough for 4K BD. Sony's current HDD server for 2 hour movie with lossless soundtrack is "only" about 140 Gb. So theoretically even a BDXL should be enough. Now if we take H.265 into consideration, the theoretical need for space for a two hour movie can go as low as 70 GB.
post #58 of 109


This Fujifilm disc development has a better chance to become a disc standard for BD. Not that 4K BD standard need more than 50GB discs.
Quote:
Fujifilm will introduce 1TB optical disc in 2015
Nov 18, 2012

According to Fujifilm, the procedure can bring about a recording density of 25 Gbytes per layer, the equivalent to the recording density of a Blu-ray Disc (BD), in addition to 20 layers per side of a disc. A double-sided optical disc with a 1TB storage capacity is possible. Fujifilm foresees bringing a 1TB optical disc to market in 2015.

Fujifilm simplified the manufacturing process by using "web coating" to form the recording, ultraviolet curable resin and adhesive material layers and sticking them together.

With BD, spin coating and sputtering are needed for each layer."It takes 147 seconds to form a four-layer BD," the company said. "With our method, it takes only 58 seconds to form eight layers."

Overall, Fujifilm said that the new disc's manufacture will be cheaper than BD discs currently available.

The two-photon absorption disc has a cost as low as that of a magnetic tape. A company spokesperson said that, "We will continue the development of the disc with help from drive makers."
post #59 of 109
What I think the BDA should do is push Blu ray a little bit more before they determine if 4K Blu is feaseable. Blu has been around for awhile but so is dvd and wasnt Blu supposed to be the format that replaced dvd? I have said it once and I will say it again and that is to much to soon. Some of the people out there have yet to replace their dvd's for Blu ray yet for heavens sake!
post #60 of 109
If they haven't by now, will they ever? We're talking six years into the format's life, ffs.
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