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Rythmik E15 vs SVS SB13 Ultra - Page 2

post #31 of 130
As you can see, people are seriously opinionated/ passionate about subwoofers around here:cool: The moral of the story is that you will be thrilled with either one, that I am sure of. Just let us know what you decide and how you like it. That's really all that matters...
post #32 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

There are a few driver differences between the sb13u and the Pb13u... Pbc detailed them in his audioholics review.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

There are a few driver differences between the sb13u and the Pb13u... Pbc detailed them in his audioholics review.



"I would have expected the PB13-Ultra to have had slightly higher deep bass measurements (below 25Hz) than the SB13-Ultra given the same amplification, similar drivers, but much, much larger box. Again, we'll see how close these are once Josh puts the SB13-Ultra through his battery of tests."

I based my post off this statement from audioholics review.
post #33 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post


"I would have expected the PB13-Ultra to have had slightly higher deep bass measurements (below 25Hz) than the SB13-Ultra given the same amplification, similar drivers, but much, much larger box. Again, we'll see how close these are once Josh puts the SB13-Ultra through his battery of tests."

I based my post off this statement from audioholics review.

yup... read that. earlier in his review, he lists a number of driver differences that Ed Mullen stated were specifically for application to a sealed enclosure. As far as the comparison to the PB13U, keep in mind those numbers are for the PB13U are in its sealed configuration... at 20Hz tune, the PB13U is MUCH louder at the low end than the SB13. So, while the PB13U sealed may be on par with the SB13U at 20Hz, it is 13dB louder in the 20Hz tune config... there is a reason people without enclosure size considerations still pay the extra for the PB13U biggrin.gif

All the discussion has been helpful, but, alas, inconclusive... would somebody please loan Josh Ricci their SB13U already?!
post #34 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

yup... read that. earlier in his review, he lists a number of driver differences that Ed Mullen stated were specifically for application to a sealed enclosure. As far as the comparison to the PB13U, keep in mind those numbers are for the PB13U are in its sealed configuration... at 20Hz tune, the PB13U is MUCH louder at the low end than the SB13. So, while the PB13U sealed may be on par with the SB13U at 20Hz, it is 13dB louder in the 20Hz tune config... there is a reason people without enclosure size considerations still pay the extra for the PB13U biggrin.gif

All the discussion has been helpful, but, alas, inconclusive... would somebody please loan Josh Ricci their SB13U already?!

i know that the pb13 is louder in port mode, i have done my research and plenty of it...you are simply missing the point.

"In terms of “value”, the SB13-Ultra is in a difficult price bracket. There are other Internet Direct subwoofers readily available that would likely rival the clean output of the SB13. Including the likes of the HSU ULS-15, Epik Empire, Rythmik Audio F15HP Direct Servo subwoofer, all at lower price points. Having said that, most of these subwoofers are larger than the SB13-Ultra (the Rythmik some 30-40% more volume and the HSU much closer at about 15% more volume after taking into account the wall thickness), and simply do not offer the same amount of signal shaping, amp power, and in some cases fit and finish that the SB13-Ultra does. Further, in the case the Epik Empire (and possibly other comparable sealed subs), we have seen that the frequency response of these sealed subwoofers have been modified and have a much steeper roll-off than the SB13-Ultra, almost like a ported subwoofer. At the end of the day, what you need for your own room and listening habits is really going to dictate which subwoofer is best suited for your particular application. In my opinion, once your room starts to get larger than 1,900-2,000 cubes, if you want reference level bass at 15-20Hz, either look at larger ported systems, or multiples of the smaller sealed variety.In closing, I did want to thank Audioholics for setting up this incredible and fun contest, and SVSound for allowing us “regular Joe's” a chance to review their subwoofer! Most of all, I have to thank Ed Mullen for his patience in answering all of my questions, I had lots as you can see from the above!"

This quote above is my point. all we can do is post the information thats available and go with that. i doubt anybody has legit direct comparisons between the e15 and sb13. You might be waiting for a long time before ricci gets his hands on them. why not just buy both and return the one you do not like?
post #35 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

i know that the pb13 is louder in port mode, i have done my research and plenty of it...you are simply missing the point.



This quote above is my point. all we can do is post the information thats available and go with that. i doubt anybody has legit direct comparisons between the e15 and sb13. You might be waiting for a long time before ricci gets his hands on them. why not just buy both and return the one you do not like?

I think you and I have many similar tendencies regarding research and (at least in my case) over-analysis. Dale at HTS is the only person I know of that has tried both (assuming the F15HP and E15 are very similar in performance... giving the E15 the benefit of the doubt here) and he held the SB13U in very high regard (awaiting his comments on the differences that led to his decision to purchase the SVS over the Rythmik). The only other person claiming to have listened to both I do not hold as trustworthy, as none of the conditions of the listening were disclosed (just a statement that they'd heard both and held the SB13U to be in a different (higher) class altogether). I completely understand your value proposition argument... not missing the point there. really. But, value is also a subjective assessment... even if one were to quantify it somehow, the criteria chosen would vary from person to person (i.e., how you weight THD vs extension vs. headroom vs fit/finish would likely be different than how I or anyone else would do so). For me, the ~$300 difference between the two is no big deal... not saying price is no object, but I'd certainly be willing to pay the extra if I knew I was getting a little more in performance (both have nice fit/finish and the warranties are both good enough). I just want the most satisfying sub (admittedly subjective) for mixed music/ht use that is smaller than 18" cubed, has top-quality finish and is less than ~$2k (gotta place a limit or I'll be divorced with really good bass)... my research has led me to these two subs (and to a lesser extent the ULS15).

You are probably correct that I'd be waiting a long time for any number of direct E15-SB13U comparisons... didn't hurt to ask though biggrin.gif
Edited by dougri - 5/8/13 at 10:23am
post #36 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by DualMono View Post

You can base your purchase on the warranty. I base my purchase on the performance.

What sub or subs do you currently have now?

I have the ones you are constantly sniping at.
post #37 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by DualMono View Post

I have the ones you are constantly sniping at.

Sniping at? The only sub that comes to mind when you say that is Epik Empires, is that right?
If that's the case I personally think those are great subs, just sad to see what's happening with Epik.
Edited by jbrown15 - 5/8/13 at 2:16pm
post #38 of 130
They are both great units and in a typical home theater will be working at about 50% or less of there capacity. So, either would do a good job, now comes price and choice. IMHO, max spl or extension are the only major considerations other than choice or price. Even then they will be so close in performance that it may not be audible.
post #39 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

I think you and I have many similar tendencies regarding research and (at least in my case) over-analysis. Dale at HTS is the only person I know of that has tried both (assuming the F15HP and E15 are very similar in performance... giving the E15 the benefit of the doubt here) and he held the SB13U in very high regard (awaiting his comments on the differences that led to his decision to purchase the SVS over the Rythmik).

I wouldn't necessarily say Dale is the only person to have heard both of them... wink.gif
post #40 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I wouldn't necessarily say Dale is the only person to have heard both of them... wink.gif
Care to comment?
post #41 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I wouldn't necessarily say Dale is the only person to have heard both of them... wink.gif

what are your thoughts on the two jim?
post #42 of 130
I bought both an E15HP and SB13U for my own personal HT system. It was done with the intent of trying them myself and seeing which I felt was the best for me. I put the SB13U through it's paces already and I'm now doing the same with the E15HP. At this point I haven't decided anything yet, but I will only be keeping one (the other I'll sell).
post #43 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I bought both an E15HP and SB13U for my own personal HT system. It was done with the intent of trying them myself and seeing which I felt was the best for me. I put the SB13U through it's paces already and I'm now doing the same with the E15HP. At this point I haven't decided anything yet, but I will only be keeping one (the other I'll sell).
Fantastic! How long have you been evaluating them, and can you describe your room and listening preferences?
post #44 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I bought both an E15HP and SB13U for my own personal HT system. It was done with the intent of trying them myself and seeing which I felt was the best for me. I put the SB13U through it's paces already and I'm now doing the same with the E15HP. At this point I haven't decided anything yet, but I will only be keeping one (the other I'll sell).

Awsome! Keep us updated please!! are you going to do a review on the E15?
post #45 of 130
How about a review comparing both of them? wink.gif
post #46 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I bought both an E15HP and SB13U for my own personal HT system. It was done with the intent of trying them myself and seeing which I felt was the best for me. I put the SB13U through it's paces already and I'm now doing the same with the E15HP. At this point I haven't decided anything yet, but I will only be keeping one (the other I'll sell).
wow
!!
any short comment??
post #47 of 130
Since this is for me personally I hadn't really planned on doing a review. I wasn't even going to mention anything about what I was doing, but then I saw this thread...

Frankly, I'm not even 100% sure why I'm doing this at all. For the better part of 2 years I have gone from reviewing one sub to another (nice problem to have, eh? tongue.gif). The only time I actually listen to any of the units I own are when I dust one off and use it for a few days, just to make sure it still works. AAMOF, I sold all but one of them for that very reason; it was killing me to watch them collect dust like that. Why I'm buying something else is beyond me, but I'm sure most reading this can sympathize. smile.gif

After reviewing the PB1000 I found myself longing for the SB13U, so I picked one up. However, the E15HP has always been in the back of my mind and like so many others I started to hear that voice say "are you sure the SB13U is the right unit?". That lead me to pick up the E15HP as well, so I could do a comparison on my own time, in my own environment.

I haven't drawn final conclusions at this point, but some quick observations are that the SB13U cabinet seems to be a bit more inert, and the amp stays much cooler when pushed. The E15HP has more ability to fine to it's performance, and I think I like the sound better because of it.
post #48 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post


The E15HP has more ability to fine to it's performance, and I think I like the sound better because of it.

I'd love to hear your take on the adjustability offered by both... they both have a ridiculous number of adjustments and I'd like to hear why you found the E15's more useful.
post #49 of 130
Interesting. I figured the SB13s amplifier has more adjustments to be able to fine tune performance. I actually own a pair and looking to sell them soon, the upgrade bug hit and some sealed Cap's are calling my name. wink.gif
post #50 of 130
The SB13U has dual PEQ's, while the E15HP has just one, which gives an advantage to the SVS. However, the Rythmik has the ability to set the rumble filter, lower extension and damping to preference. For someone like myself that's a real advantage. I can dial in the sound to my liking with a bit more detail.
post #51 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

However, the Rythmik has the ability to set the rumble filter, lower extension and damping to preference. For someone like myself that's a real advantage. I can dial in the sound to my liking with a bit more detail.

Regarding the rumble filter/extension aspect, doesn't the SB13U also offer something similar with the room compensation control? While ostensibly to correct for room gain, I'm not aware of it being any different from a normal high pass filter adjustable for frequency (25, 32, and 40Hz) and slope (6 or 12dB/octave).
post #52 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve1981 View Post

Regarding the rumble filter/extension aspect, doesn't the SB13U also offer something similar with the room compensation control? While ostensibly to correct for room gain, I'm not aware of it being any different from a normal high pass filter adjustable for frequency (25, 32, and 40Hz) and slope (6 or 12dB/octave).

You could indeed consider them to have a similar function. The Rythmik implementation works a little differently though, and for me at least it's more in tune to my needs.
post #53 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

You could indeed consider them to have a similar function. The Rythmik implementation works a little differently though, and for me at least it's more in tune to my needs.

why dont you try JTR cap s1??
post #54 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremymak View Post

why dont you try JTR cap s1??

Given that he has reviewed a dozen or so subs on that other site, and all of them have 12" drivers or smaller, I'm guessing he prefers subs that don't dominate his modestly-sized room (<2k cu ft). If I'm not mistaken, I think the current two are among he largest, if not the largest, of those he's reviewed. Jim?
post #55 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremymak View Post

why dont you try JTR cap s1??

I believe Jim has been trying to get a Cap S1 from Jeff at JTR to review.
post #56 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Given that he has reviewed a dozen or so subs on that other site, and all of them have 12" drivers or smaller, I'm guessing he prefers subs that don't dominate his modestly-sized room (<2k cu ft). If I'm not mistaken, I think the current two are among he largest, if not the largest, of those he's reviewed. Jim?

That's a pretty accurate statement; for the most part I've stuck with subs that aren't huge, trying to emulate what most would probably use in a room this size. I do have an MFW Turbo sitting here now - which is anything but small - and I'm negotiating for a few other units that are larger then I've reviewed in the past, so there might be some more potent subs in the future. For the most part I'll probably stick to the more modestly sized units though. For example, the Martin Logan Dynamo 1500 will be the next one published. It's pretty small but does contain a 15" driver, so I'm moving up! tongue.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

I believe Jim has been trying to get a Cap S1 from Jeff at JTR to review.

I have indeed, several times actually, but Jeff is keen on me reviewing a Cap1000 instead. I personally think there's a larger market for the S1 then he currently has, and perhaps exposure would resolve that, but I always defer to the company to decide what they want reviewed. I make suggestions, but if they counter with something else I go with that instead.
post #57 of 130
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I wouldn't necessarily say Dale is the only person to have heard both of them... wink.gif

Far from it... YOU may be the only one wink.gif turns out Dale reviewed the FV15HP, not the sealed version. Thought the SB13U sounded tighter and preferred the smaller enclosure and finish of the SB13U (to be fair, the FV15HP was the black oak, not the piano black). So... eagerly awaiting further comments from you, Jim biggrin.gif
post #58 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post

I have indeed, several times actually, but Jeff is keen on me reviewing a Cap1000 instead. I personally think there's a larger market for the S1 then he currently has, and perhaps exposure would resolve that, but I always defer to the company to decide what they want reviewed. I make suggestions, but if they counter with something else I go with that instead.

I guess that's because the Cap1000 would be his cheapest powered sub, which could be argued in also the best value sub JTR has to offer.
post #59 of 130
Jim- You could always just call him up and place an order for an S1. That would be the quickest way to review one. smile.gif
post #60 of 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Far from it... YOU may be the only one wink.gif turns out Dale reviewed the FV15HP, not the sealed version. Thought the SB13U sounded tighter and preferred the smaller enclosure and finish of the SB13U (to be fair, the FV15HP was the black oak, not the piano black). So... eagerly awaiting further comments from you, Jim biggrin.gif

Oh sure, no pressure...
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