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UPSTREAM COLOR - Blu-Ray looks and sound great, but has serious audio sync issues.

post #1 of 25
Thread Starter 
I was only able to sample this and I only sampled because of what I read here...

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Upstream-Color-Blu-ray/66046/#Review

and elsewhere.

The 5.1 mix for the film goes out of sync just after the 28 minutes mark and apparently drifts in and out the rest of the way. I only sampled for about 15 minutes, but yep. It's an issue. This is not something that can be ignored, especially since the 2.0 track is less out of sync and from the 5 minutes of the DVD I sampled, not out of sync at all.

Caruth is a perfectionist so I cannot imagine he will want to let this slide, but as he is self distributing... frown.gif

My copy literally arrived a few hours ago and I don't think I'll be able to sit down and watch it straight through until the weekend. But I wanted my fellow AVSers to know. A damn shame because I loved the film (I saw it at the IFC in NYC last month).

UPDATE: Well, I watched the first 45 minutes straight through. Couldn't help myself. There are two scenes where it smacks you in the face. There are other spots where it seems off, but the lack of dialog or distinctive sharp sound foley means it isn't disruptive.

Now I am going to bed. smile.gif
Edited by Matt_Stevens - 5/7/13 at 8:14pm
post #2 of 25
The Upstream Color twitter account replied to a message and said the manufacturer was aware and was looking into it, and there was also a Facebook message from what I assume is the manufacturer themselves (Cinedigm, previously named New Video) saying they're looking into it.

So good news on two fronts: 1) it's being looked into, and 2) it may just be Cinedigm / New Video's fault and not Carruth's, meaning Carruth shouldn't take the financial hit for a replacement program. Hopefully it works out this way.
post #3 of 25
Yep, same audio sync issues here!

My copy arrived today and I was about to post regarding the matter but found this thread. Will be watching for a solution.

Thanks.
post #4 of 25
Bummer - I just bought this at Best Buy today and haven't unwrapped it. Is it so bad that I would be best to return it while I can?
post #5 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayF View Post

Bummer - I just bought this at Best Buy today and haven't unwrapped it. Is it so bad that I would be best to return it while I can?

Hello

I wouldn't classify it as unwatchable, but it is distracting and certainly defective. I might return my copy to Amazon, but was hoping a quick solution would come before having to do so.
post #6 of 25
Thread Starter 
I've watched the film maybe three times now and it is exceedingly distracting for the scenes where the problem pops up. I am not holding my breath on a fix. In the end I may be forced to rip the sucker, rip the DVD and then create a custom BD using the inferior DD5.1 from the DVD. Not the best solution, but better than out of sync sound.
post #7 of 25
Is anyone having trouble with this BD on an Oppo?
post #8 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Is anyone having trouble with this BD on an Oppo?

I watched it last night on an Oppo 95 and didn't have any issues playing it.

I'm embarrassed to admit that I didn't notice any audio sync issues. I'll have to check the specific scene called out in the review on BR.com. I'm using 5.1 analog outputs so wonder if that has anything to do with it.
post #9 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayF View Post

I watched it last night on an Oppo 95 and didn't have any issues playing it.

I'm embarrassed to admit that I didn't notice any audio sync issues. I'll have to check the specific scene called out in the review on BR.com. I'm using 5.1 analog outputs so wonder if that has anything to do with it.
Great, thanx for the info.

I have an 95 and 83SE.
ALWAYS use the analogs.
post #10 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Is anyone having trouble with this BD on an Oppo?

Yes, I experienced the previously described audio sync issues with this blu-ray disc played on the Oppo 93.
post #11 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozar View Post

Yes, I experienced the previously described audio sync issues with this blu-ray disc played on the Oppo 93.
Bitstream or analogs?
post #12 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Bitstream or analogs?

that would be bitstream
post #13 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozar View Post

that would be bitstream
Sometimes that makes a difference regarding these issues.
Usually, the analogs are less prone to problems of this sort.
post #14 of 25
So I had previously been talking with both Shane Caruth and a New Video / Cinedigm rep named Jess about the sync issue. Shane said Cinedigm was looking into the issue, and Jess from Cinedigm said they were going to reauthor. I reached out in June and was told the reauthoring was under way, and they'd contact me when replacement discs were ready. Still no contact from them since, so I reached out again last week for a followup - and have received no reply this time.

i don't know if it's just an off week or something, but I am definitely concerned that the replacement program idea has been abandoned...
post #15 of 25
Thread Starter 
It would appear to me they are just letting it go. It's a shame, really. Upstream Color will never have another BD release. This is it.
post #16 of 25
Just a side note, but Upstream Color was shot on cheap, hacked Panasonic GH2 consumer DSLR's at 1080p/24. Not bad, eh? In the right hands, they're actually more capable cameras than the far more expensive Canon 5D mark II's (used for the IFC series Portlandia).

Too bad about the synch issues.
post #17 of 25
Thread Starter 
The image looked a-ok in a theater. I was lucky enough to see it in NYC on a pretty darned big screen. It does not feel like a DSLR shoot.
post #18 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens View Post

The image looked a-ok in a theater. I was lucky enough to see it in NYC on a pretty darned big screen. It does not feel like a DSLR shoot.

Ahh, but it was.
post #19 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Ahh, but it was.
I think you misunderstand what I meant. I am aware it was shot with a DSLR (a hacked GH2). It just doesn't look like what one would think of when they imagine a DSLR film. Carruth pulled it off.
post #20 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens View Post

I think you misunderstand what I meant. I am aware it was shot with a DSLR (a hacked GH2). It just doesn't look like what one would think of when they imagine a DSLR film. Carruth pulled it off.

I've seen what a GH2 can do in the right hands many times. I have one myself, though I can't say I'm more than a newbie at cinematography. The hacked image quality can be superb given how cheap it was. Not bad for learning the ropes (since you can have interchangeable lenses) as long as you know its strengths and limitations. Canon had to come out with a 5D mark III just to compete with a $700 camera!
post #21 of 25
Thread Starter 
Dan, too true. And Canon crippled all of their DSLR's since Magic Lantern RAW is showing us what they can actually do. Granted, the workflow on Magic Lantern hacked DSLR's is a bear. But we are soon to have PQ from sub 5k cameras that can rival the current RED MX. In ten years, the cost will be below a grand.

I have a feature in pre-production and we are considering the ALEXA. I'd rather shoot on film, but for a variety of reasons that is not even in the cards.
post #22 of 25
Yeah, the RAW stuff I've worked with from the Canon 5D MKIII approaches Arri Alexa levels of detail. It's THAT good. Not to mention the obvious improvements to recorded color space and dynamic range. It's really sad when compared to the native H264 footage, but as you said, the workflow is a chore.

The sad truth is that a standard GH2 still has better video quality than a stock Canon camera. I would've purchased a GH2 had the price not sky-rocketed after the Driftwood hack came out.
post #23 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Brad View Post

Yeah, the RAW stuff I've worked with from the Canon 5D MKIII approaches Arri Alexa levels of detail. It's THAT good. Not to mention the obvious improvements to recorded color space and dynamic range. It's really sad when compared to the native H264 footage, but as you said, the workflow is a chore.

Eventually someone will come out with a camera that will give us what we know we want and what we understand is possible. BlackMagic looked to be it, but it has so many irksome issues and conundrums that it's really just a B cam. I can't even get my DP to consider it for a behind the scenes camera on the shoot.
Quote:
The sad truth is that a standard GH2 still has better video quality than a stock Canon camera. I would've purchased a GH2 had the price not sky-rocketed after the Driftwood hack came out.
Ain't that the truth. I wanted to grab a GH2 myself but up up and away it went.

And yet I'm willing to drop 5 grand on a brand new Super8 camera that is now in prototype, so go figure.
post #24 of 25
Thread Starter 
Just received this. mad.gif
Quote:
Hello –

Thanks very much for your interest in UPSTREAM COLOR. Over the past several months Cinedigm and Shane Carruth, the director of the film, have worked together to diagnose and repair the Blu-ray disc issue. Unfortunately the issue has been more difficult to pinpoint than we first thought. A full 3rd party quality control check using national brand players was conducted and the report delivered was not able to determine the exact cause. The feedback indicated that likely a combination of the disc and certain players is the culprit. Unfortunately due to the variety of players and configurations in the market, we cannot guarantee that new mastering would solve the problem. Thereby we are unable to create replacement Blu-ray copies.
Again, we appreciate your interest in the film.

Thanks,
Cinedigm
post #25 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Stevens View Post

Just received this. mad.gif

It has to be the mastering software package they're using. Most studio releases don't have this level of screwyness. The translation from the PR department reply was: blah blah blah yadda yadda yadda... it's not a big enough title release to warrant the expense of a re-mastering and re-pressing. So go f--k yourselves.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › Blu-ray Software › UPSTREAM COLOR - Blu-Ray looks and sound great, but has serious audio sync issues.