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Gran Turismo 6 - Page 3

post #61 of 167
I have no issue with them putting another GT on the ps3, but I do have a problem with what looks like a game that has had very little improvements done to it.
post #62 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash44 View Post

As for the car damage, I believe that Yamauchi just plain doesn't want damage in his game. Like you said, it's been 15 years, and the PS3 certainly has the horsepower to do detailed damage. They use the penalty system in its place, but it's not quite the same. Maybe when Yamauchi retires we'll get some flying fenders.

Someone said it, and I tend to agree. When a car takes weeks to complete, why waste time on damage modeling and stuff that in the end isn't going to effect gameplay much at all. Especially on a game that each iteration strives to be more of a Sim? Which in the end means racing, not crashing. You crash, your games is over IRL.

Physics, handling, car detail, and realism of the tracks and road surfaces need to be priority number 1.

Now if that means 100 Nissan SKYLINE again, well no. Yamauchi REALLY needs to get over his Nissan boner and treat all the manufactures the same.
post #63 of 167
Damage is more than eye candy. It's a gameplay element and is an encouragement to properly drive and race by being a penalty when you exercise poor judgement, make a mistake, or get caught in a mistake. And it's very much a fact of life in real-life as well with professionals.

It's there for more than just for spectacular replays. If I take something like a high curb on a street course a bit too greedily I want my suspension to get hurt and force me to compenstate with my steering wheel afterwards, if I take an excursion on the grass with a LeMans prototype I want the nose to dig in and fill my radiator with grass forcing a return to pit lane to clear it so I don't overheat or even knock the entire nose and splitter off and force me to pitlane for repairs like you frequently see in sportscar racing. And so on and so on.

A proper damage model is an element to a simulation, even with these toned down console simcades that have to be playable with gamepads and encompass so much material that they could never be as realistic as a full on simulation that mandates the proper equipment with a much more narrow focus.

It's for more than just watching sheet metal get bent and carbon fibre fragments flying in replays that I never watch after the first time just to check out how nice the replays are. Replays got boring in console games as soon as their novelty wore off after early games like Gran Turismo on the PS and F1 World Grand Prix on the N64.

Heck, it's not even all contact related. Things on racecars break even just by proper driving, things break by improper driving beyond contact related damage, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMII View Post

Personally I think PD didn't milk GT5 nearly as well as they could have, I assume it was going to have DLC up the ying-yang but instead it only got a handful of cars and few (worthless IMHO) tracks.

Yeah, I'm surprised they didn't milk it more like Turn 10 does. I think at one point before release, the plan was even for no DLC with the series creator speaking publicly as being against downloadable expansions to it. But at least we got tracks.

Hard to get excited over new cars in a game with many hundreds of them. The community enjoys them, the economics point to it making more sense, and they're easier to utilize throughout the game than incorporating tracks into things like career mode so I understand why a company like Turn 10 is all about new vehicles for their DLC. But it's new tracks that would actually be what extends the life of these games for me. I'm bored after 20 hours when I'm at the same track for the 10th time. Upping the car count when I'm only going to be using a few dozen cars from the hundreds that shipped on day 1 doesn't excite me.

For the two real tracks GT5 got, Motegi is a fairly interesting place in some ways. And Spa is a modern classic that is very popular (Only the La Source hairpin which used to be the old last turn before the start/finish line moved behind it and the run down and through the famous Eau Rouge complex are still there from the old Spa with the rest modern construction from the 1980's after the classic 9 mile track was deemed too dangerous for racing).

I'm surprised you didn't like Spa. I didn't think anyone didn't like Spa.

Edited by Leo_Ames - 5/25/13 at 2:50am
post #64 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

Someone said it, and I tend to agree. When a car takes weeks to complete, why waste time on damage modeling and stuff that in the end isn't going to effect gameplay much at all. Especially on a game that each iteration strives to be more of a Sim? Which in the end means racing, not crashing. You crash, your games is over IRL.

Physics, handling, car detail, and realism of the tracks and road surfaces need to be priority number 1.

Now if that means 100 Nissan SKYLINE again, well no. Yamauchi REALLY needs to get over his Nissan boner and treat all the manufactures the same.

I'd consider damage especially important if the game wants to call itself a sim. It's something I can't believe most modern console racers don't take seriously enough. Well I mean I understand why they don't but come on, don't call yourself a sim racer and not involve one of the most important aspects to simulation racing. At least give us the option; it doesn't have to be on by default. It's one thing I hate about GT and Forza. For all their "sim-ness" they are essentially glorified arcade racers because the threat of real failure is never there.
post #65 of 167
When I was talking damage, I meant the visual, beat the car up kind. I absolutely agree with physical damage and car performance needs to be realistically modeled.

But it seem when we talk damage, most normal people are just expecting visual modeling and uber crashes ala Motostorm of DIRT. And it is a resource hog to do that.
post #66 of 167
I go back and forth on the damage modeling thing. On the one hand, damage is a real part of racing--even at the highest levels. But on the other, the GT series has always privileged lap times over everything else. It's about perfect lines and throttle. Unfortunately, judging by the reaction of the press and gamers (in the US), most folks want more damage.

It's funny, I've been switching between watching Sky and BBC coverage of F1 this season. And the opening sequence that introduces the race for each channel appeals to a totally different crowd. The Sky intro emphasizes clean racing. The one on BBC emphasizes crashes and hairy moments. I feel like gamers (especially in the US) really want a game more like what that BBC intro shows, but most other folks are totally fine with the "clean" racing of Sky.
post #67 of 167
The no damage stuff kind of sucks, but I don't race online so it won't affect me. I just want to know if they are taking the need to constantly grind in this game.
post #68 of 167
Grinding has been part of this formula since the original Gran Turismo. So I would expect that it's alive and well when Gran Turismo 6 eventually ships.
post #69 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by TyrantII View Post

When I was talking damage, I meant the visual, beat the car up kind. I absolutely agree with physical damage and car performance needs to be realistically modeled.

But it seem when we talk damage, most normal people are just expecting visual modeling and uber crashes ala Motostorm of DIRT. And it is a resource hog to do that.

Ah ok I see. Well I think there can be a happy medium there. I know it takes extra resources and the manufacturers don't like seeing their cars beat up but come on, Sony and MS have enough sway in the matter; if they really want to ensure a realism to the game they can make it happen. I just want the option to enable damage (cosmetic and physical).
post #70 of 167
Thread Starter 
Gotta put the E3 movie in here. GT always has great trailers:



Probably the last disc I buy for PS3. Great way to go out.
post #71 of 167
Thread Starter 
GT6 E3 game play from the show floor:


Dude cant drive, but gives a good view of the HUD:

Matterhorn returns:


Matterhorn was driven by a GTPlanet guy hence the better driving.
post #72 of 167
How is it possible that GT6 looks about 2x better than Drive Club? I saw the DC gameplay from E3 and it's not impressive at all.
post #73 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defcon View Post

How is it possible that GT6 looks about 2x better than Drive Club? I saw the DC gameplay from E3 and it's not impressive at all.

Possibly because they're future proofing it?


http://gematsu.com/2013/06/ps4-gran-turismo-6-naturally-appear
Quote:
A PlayStation 4 version of Gran Turismo 6 will likely appear, according to series creator Kazunori Yamauchi.

Speaking with 4Gamer.net at E3, Yamauchi said, “I think a PlayStation 4 version will appear naturally.”

He teased, “We won’t keep you waiting too long, but it won’t be too soon either.”

Yamauchi’s thoughts on the new console? “Basically I think it’s a good neutral machine,” he said. “It’s balanced hardware with no quirks, so it’s just about how to make the software.”
post #74 of 167
post #75 of 167
post #76 of 167
Thread Starter 
North America release pre-order bonuses:
Quote:
Pre-ordering the game will give you the following vehicles in what’s being called the “4 Car Pack”.

BMW Z4 GT3 ’11
Nissan GT-R NISMO GT3 ’13
Tesla Model S Signature Performance ’13
Chevrolet Corvette Stingray (C7) ’14
Quote:
Retailer GameStop is offering additional bonuses, called the “15th Anniversary Edition Upgrade”

Here’s a complete list of cars available in GameStop’s 15th Anniversary Edition Upgrade:

BMW Z4 GT3 2011
Nissan GT-R NISMO GT3 2013
Chevrolet Corvette Stingray (C7) 2014
Tesla Motors Model S Signature Performance 2013
Alfa Romeo TZ3 Stradale 2011
Alpine A110 1600S 1968
Aston Martin V12 Vantage 2010
Audi R8 LMS ultra 2012
Ford Focus ST 2013
Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 2013
Honda HSV-010 (SUPER GT) 2011
KTM X-BOW R
Lamborghini Aventador LP 700-4 2011
Lexus IS F Racing Concept 2008
Lotus Europa (type54) 1968
Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG GT3 2011
Renault Sport Megane Trophy V6 2011
SRT Viper GTS 2013
TRD 86 Racing 2008
Volkswagen Scirocco GT24 Race Car 2008

Finally, an interesting special promotion with Amazon.com has been announced: pre-order the game with the online retailer, and you’ll receive a special bonus of 1 million free in-game credits to help you get started.

Edited by Crash44 - 6/26/13 at 11:06am
post #77 of 167
Thread Starter 
Lightweight Car Company Rocket at Autumn Ring Mini:

One of the new cars in game. The sound seems better even in the low quality state of this vid, so that's promising at least. Plus it's nice to see someone do one of these play demos that can actually drive.
post #78 of 167
Thread Starter 
Friendly reminder: GT6 Demo due July 2nd.

Demo Details:
Cars- Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Nissan Leaf, 370Z, GTR

Tracks/Locations: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
The GT Academy, Silverstone

Link.
post #79 of 167
Anyone know if those are cars you get, or cars you "get an opportunity to buy with in-game credits"......I'm assuming the latter...
post #80 of 167

GT5 vs GT6 demo comparison

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnr6zuCctP8

 

I know its not the final game, but there graphically I don't see much improvement - shadows look better, and maybe lighting. There physics model is much better, you can now see car shift weight realistically.  Also the engine noise sounds exactly like GT4 and GT5.

post #81 of 167
Have you tried it yet or read impressions from those that have?

If you haven't, that the weight of the vehicle visually shifts more naturally doesn't necessarily mean that there has been a major physics advancement in that area. It could easily just be little more than a mere graphical upgrade to better reflect the vehicle's shifting of its center of gravity rather than a real physics advancement. And unless you drive from chase view or heavily view your replays, it's a rather minor visual touch at that. Hopefully it's a sign of a major advance with the underlying physics engine though.

Other than that and preferring the blue hue they used for the sky in this GT6 demo over their selection for GT5 (Which isn't an advancement, I simply prefer their selection in the GT6 demo), they're indistinguishable looking to me. I thought I could tell that there was a minor lighting/shadow advancement in an older video comparing the Nurburgring, but I sure can't tell with this latest video.

Did anyone watch any of Le Mans two weekends ago? For the first time that I can recall in quite a few years, the heavy amount of Gran Turismo advertising in areas like the Mulsanne straight were gone. In their place was Forza advertisements. I'm curious if Microsoft simply outbid them at the end of the contract or if Sony just decided not to renew and opened the door for its competitor to take its place.

I imagine that's one area that Polphony won't want to go for 100% graphical realism with Gran Turismo 6. smile.gif
Edited by Leo_Ames - 7/2/13 at 3:33pm
post #82 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo_Ames View Post

Have you tried it yet or read impressions from those that have?

If you haven't, that the weight of the vehicle visually shifts more naturally doesn't necessarily mean that there has been a major physics advancement in that area. It could easily just be little more than a mere graphical upgrade to better reflect the vehicle's shifting of its center of gravity rather than a real physics advancement. And unless you drive from chase view or heavily view your replays, it's a rather minor visual touch at that. Hopefully it's a sign of a major advance with the underlying physics engine though.

Other than that and preferring the blue hue they used for the sky in this GT6 demo over their selection for GT5 (Which isn't an advancement, I simply prefer their selection in the GT6 demo), they're indistinguishable looking to me. I thought I could tell that there was a minor lighting/shadow advancement in an older video comparing the Nurburgring, but I sure can't tell with this latest video.

Did anyone watch any of Le Mans two weekends ago? For the first time that I can recall in quite a few years, the heavy amount of Gran Turismo advertising in areas like the Mulsanne straight were gone. In their place was Forza advertisements. I'm curious if Microsoft simply outbid them at the end of the contract or if Sony just decided not to renew and opened the door for its competitor to take its place.

I imagine that's one area that Polphony won't want to go for 100% graphical realism with Gran Turismo 6. smile.gif

I'm going to try it tonight or tomorrow. So my impression is based just on that youtube video. The videos I remember seeing from E3 were a lot more impressive than this, like you said it pretty much looks like GT5. I read on another forum that it does drive better, so maybe the new tire model makes an actual difference? Since I don't have a wheel yet, probably will be hard to tell with a DS3, but I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

 

There's only so much you can do in a racing game though, most of it comes down to intangibles.

post #83 of 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defcon View Post

GT5 vs GT6 demo comparison

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnr6zuCctP8

I know its not the final game, but there graphically I don't see much improvement - shadows look better, and maybe lighting. There physics model is much better, you can now see car shift weight realistically.  Also the engine noise sounds exactly like GT4 and GT5.
When i played the demo I noticed the same thing and also I noticed that the frame rate in the cockpit view wasn't that high (I know its just a demo). Other than that I thought it wasn't that bad, but i would have liked a better variety of cars to really test out the new physics
post #84 of 167
I ran through the GT Academy 2013 content tonight. In general, the menu system is much more navigable, and it seems that levels load quite a bit quicker. There is still far too much diddling around in menus before actually hitting a track with too many layers of "Yes, I really want to race", but it's better than GT5 was.

It feels like it's rendering at 960x1080p. V-sync is finally on, probably double-buffered, but it really struggles to maintain anything approaching 60fps. Dropped frames are really common, with the average likely in the 45-50fps range. The modelling and general rendering is all perfectly serviceable. The lack of FXAA is pretty bad, as heavy aliasing is readily apparent everywhere you look.

In render quality and user interface, Forza 4 is still the far more polished product. There may be more content and possibly better physics in GT6, but it's shaping up to still be just as ugly and hard to use as it has been since GT4.
post #85 of 167
Anyone want to compare GT6 Demo times? I've got all gold in the races and tests expect the final one (full lap 370Z) and in the bonus GT-R ones were I can only manage silver (for now). Glad I could buy a virtual '08 370Z in the same color as my real life '03 350Z biggrin.gif Pretty enjoyable little demo but I'm sick of seeing the black flag for running off course wink.gif
post #86 of 167
I got gold in all of races and test also, but I haven't been able to get a medal for the GT-R races because of the annoying message saying that my lap is invalid for going of the course (I only went a couple of inches into the green pavement outside of the track )
post #87 of 167
Thread Starter 
Goodwood Hill Climb course unveiled:
Quote:
Most people who love Gran Turismo love cars and so most of you, especially those in the UK, will be familiar with the Goodwood Festival of Speed. Founded 20 years ago by the Earl of March on his family’s beautiful Goodwood estate in West Sussex, England (www.goodwood.com), it attracts over 185,000 people. At the centre of it all is the now-famous Hill Climb course that each year sees top F1 drivers, celebrities and invited guests driving up at break-neck speed in a huge variety of cars. From classic exotica and modern race cars to the latest supercars, innovations or everyday family cars – they all head ‘up the Hill’ in front of a very knowledgeable and enthusiastic crowd.

Yamauchi-san feels a great affection for the Goodwood Festival of Speed. Its setting, in front of the beautiful old home of British aristocrats, is pretty quirky and very special, but it is really the variety and range of all things automotive on display that appeals. The atmosphere – providing the British weather behaves – is amazing. For that reason, Polyphony Digital has partnered with the 2013 Goodwood Festival of Speed (11th to 14th July) and has announced that the Goodwood Hill Climb course will feature in GT6 when it is released later this year.

Polyphony has also developed a special new GT6 demo featuring the Hill Climb and a variety of cars. Attendees at Goodwood will have the opportunity to play the demo and race ‘up the Hill’ on GT pods dotted around the Festival. In case you are going, you’ll find them at the Goodwood Road Racing Club, The Family Area and Goodwood Hotel; on the Nissan and Alfa Romeo stands; on the Mercedes-Benz, Ford and Nissan Moving Motor Show displays. There is also a chance for the drivers and media to have a go in the drivers’ club and media center. The target they’ll be aiming for is Nick Heidfeld’s 1999 41.6s course record, set in a Formula 1 car. After 1999 they decided to no longer record the time of the F1 cars and the motorcycles up the hill as it was getting a little too competitive!

As it stands, the demo will only be available on-site at Goodwood, and there are no plans for a wider release for the moment. But anyone wanting a flavour of GT6 can still download and play the fantastic GT6 demo that includes this year’s GT Academy qualification. It has proved very popular and is well worth having a go – especially if you fancy becoming a real racing driver.




I'm really liking the new physics. There's much better feel for what each wheel is doing, while control via throttle and braking is much improved. I'm using a Driving Force wheel but I'm sure the improvements come through with controller as well.
post #88 of 167
Seems like a similar thing happened in another game years ago with Goodwood. I'm thinking it was Grand Prix Legends where they commissioned a replica of the hill climb circuit and it was only available on-site during their annual festival for attendees.

I'd love to take a spin on the hill climb circuit in Gran Turismo 6. And they also have an excellent race circuit that is mostly original to the 1960's when racing ended there and the owners didn't want to destroy its character by adding in chicanes. Either (Or better yet, both) would make for a great addition to the track roster of any game.
post #89 of 167
Here's a nice replay of a run on the Goodwood hill climb. I hope Polphony includes this as a standard part of the Gran Turismo 6 package.
post #90 of 167
3D spectators are back in that video and there doesn't look to be any framerate issues in bumper view. Hopefully that signifies the demo issues are ironed out.
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