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Olive One - Page 2

post #31 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View PostProblem with just giving it a 3.5mm stereo out is it basically puts it to the equivalent of an ipod ! Seriously what kind of amp theyre likely to pack in there anyways ? your only probably going to be able to drive some puny speakers off it. kind of thing people often drive off an ipod.

I dont get it. the idea of a quite simplified device that docked into something with all the dacs and power amp and connectivity made more sense to me. people like wse are just going to look at it now and say well I might as well use my ipod or ipad as control interface and use something else. why couldn't they have just stuck with this original idea ?


would have gone for it ! now will pass on it instead.

Yes they blew it!  I passed as well 

 

$499 for the 1TB, now $599 I can get a Mac Mini for $599 and do so much more such as using Audirvana, watching HD Movies, Looking at Pictures and control it with my iPad :)

post #32 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by nontechy77 View PostI am also one of the campaign backers, putting in $399 and hoping that the campaign would reach its $500k target within the stipulated time frame. It did and I was very happy because I would get a free 1TB hard-drive, according to the campaign promise.

Then the notice came (pasted in one of the posts here) that the hard-drive would now be taken away. If you read the post carefully, this action was not explained. If it was due to increased cost in redesigning the Olive, then I would argue that there was nothing in the Indiegogo website in the first place that stated that perks could be removed if costs went up. The perk was stated as a sure thing. The fact of the matter was that Olive has clearly reneged on a promise. It unilaterally removed a promised perk after it reaches its campaign target.

I know I can still order a hard disk and pay for it. But my point is that such action has affected my faith in Olive. They can promise tonnes of goodies, show you nice photos of prototypes, but be aware that you may not end up with what you thought you are paying for.
 
This has left a very bitter taste in my mouth. If there are other backers out there in this forum who feel the same way, perhaps we can unite and seek recourse.

Any lawyers who bought one? This is called false advertising, unless they said they can make what ever changes they want and then you are sol

post #33 of 109
This is from Indigogo's terms of use:

Special Rules Regarding Perks
You agree:

All Perks must be lawful and otherwise comply with this Agreement.
To fulfill all Perks and to respond promptly to all questions and comments regarding Perks. If you are unable to fulfill a Perk, you will work with the Contributor(s) to reach a mutually satisfactory resolution which may include, without limitation, issuing a refund promptly.
Indiegogo is not liable nor responsible for the fulfillment of Perks, the failure to fulfill Perks, the quality of the Perks and as otherwise disclaimed or limited by this Agreement.

So it looks like they can change the perks but that you may be able to negotiate a happy medium or receive a refund. Seems simple enough. My recommendation would be to ask them for the $25.00 bonus they are currently offering to new pre-orders.
post #34 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Ok so I could either get a Mac mini for $599 or an Olive One! Hum I think I will get a Mac mini and control the music with my iPad

Interesting thought. What software would you choose to use on the iPad?
post #35 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by clpetersen View Post

Interesting thought. What software would you choose to use on the iPad?

Count me as interested what you can use as well
post #36 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by clpetersen View PostInteresting thought. What software would you choose to use on the iPad?

I use apple Remote and it works great, but if I want more control then one of these are good as well:

 

Rowmote Pro: Remote Control for Mac

 

http://applesliced.com/app?n=rowmote-pro-remote-control

 

or

 

http://appadvice.com/appnn/2011/06/how-to-remotely-control-your-mac-from-your-ipad

 

- Screen VNC

 

- iTeleport for iPad  https://itunes.apple.com/app/iteleport-vnc-rdp/id286470485?ign-mpt=uo%3D6&mt=8

 

an expensive alternative is Logmein Ignition https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/id299616801?mt=8

 

There might be others but that should get you started!

post #37 of 109
I thought you were saying the Mac Mini had a music server type interface program. I had a windows version similar to a mini and the interface was way too clunky as I assume the Mini would be. I want something where I don't need the TV on to control it and where the navigation is intuitive since I'll be using this mainly for music and around the whole house. It will be placed somewhat near a TV so the Mini idea would be pretty neat to browse and such but just have not seen anything software wise to get anywhere what the Olive One looks like it will be capable of.
post #38 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by akbungle View Post

I thought you were saying the Mac Mini had a music server type interface program. I had a windows version similar to a mini and the interface was way too clunky as I assume the Mini would be. I want something where I don't need the TV on to control it and where the navigation is intuitive since I'll be using this mainly for music and around the whole house. It will be placed somewhat near a TV so the Mini idea would be pretty neat to browse and such but just have not seen anything software wise to get anywhere what the Olive One looks like it will be capable of.

I thought so too. here is a contender, 'Channel D - Pure Music'. Works with itunes but plays native FLAC etc.

http://www.channld.com/puremusic/
post #39 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by clpetersen View PostI thought so too. here is a contender, 'Channel D - Pure Music'. Works with itunes but plays native FLAC etc.

http://www.channld.com/puremusic/

JRiver app

post #40 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by alebonau View Post

problem with just giving it a 3.5mm stereo out is it basically puts it to the equivalent of an ipod ! eriously what kind of amp theyre likely to pack in there anyways ? your only probably going to be able to drive some puny speakers off it. kind of thing people often drive off an ipod.

I dont get it.

the idea of a quite simplified device that docked into something with all the dacs and power amp and connectivity made more sense to me.

people like wse are just going to look at it now and say well I might as well use my ipod or ipad as control interface and use something else.

why couldnt they have just stuck with this original idea ?


would have gone for it !

now will pass on it instead.

Their original idea was that the One became the centerpiece of your music experience in the house. With speakers directly connected to the One. So the built-in amplifier was always there. The point was that there is no docking needed as everything you need is already in your One and everything that it connects with or streams from, can be connected wirelessly.

I had also worries about their choice for the 3.5mm stereo analogue output. I contacted Olive about this. They assured me that a 3.5 mm stereo output is not necessarily bad quality and the same audio quality will be had from this output as with standard RCA L+R output.

I am no technician so I cannot confirm or refute that claim, but Olive is a company that directs itself toward audiophiles who want to digitalize their music (with products like the 04HD for example) but who do not feel comfortable with NAS, seperate DAC's etc. Someone like me really.
The One is a more mainstream product, easy to fit in your home, interesting one-solution-for-all stream capabilities and with HD if you want. So personally I do not think that the One will be lacking in sound quality (at least I hope it will at least match my 04hd for sound and musical qualities).
post #41 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tochtgenoot View Post

Their original idea was that the One became the centerpiece of your music experience in the house. With speakers directly connected to the One. So the built-in amplifier was always there. The point was that there is no docking needed as everything you need is already in your One and everything that it connects with or streams from, can be connected wirelessly.

I had also worries about their choice for the 3.5mm stereo analogue output. I contacted Olive about this. They assured me that a 3.5 mm stereo output is not necessarily bad quality and the same audio quality will be had from this output as with standard RCA L+R output.

I am no technician so I cannot confirm or refute that claim, but Olive is a company that directs itself toward audiophiles who want to digitalize their music (with products like the 04HD for example) but who do not feel comfortable with NAS, seperate DAC's etc. Someone like me really.
The One is a more mainstream product, easy to fit in your home, interesting one-solution-for-all stream capabilities and with HD if you want. So personally I do not think that the One will be lacking in sound quality (at least I hope it will at least match my 04hd for sound and musical qualities).

I honestly dont mind if they want to fit whatever into it. but simple things like L&R rca outputs. having a proper network connector, not needing a wall wart, a coax connector for digitla are all pretty basic things these days from any media source. otherwise just make it like an iPod with its 3.5mm connector and a dock and be done with it. they have been caught out wiht a product trying to please everyone with polls and the like I think. doing that you end up with the equivalent of the car that is the homer mobile.



pass ...
post #42 of 109
Agreed-

The original connection proposal seems much better. If you are going to spend $500/$600 on a music server, you want to be able to hook it into your integrated amp and hear it over your good speakers. Spdif output sounds good if you have a dac to go into. Wish they would keep the wifi though...

I ordered the 1 TB version pin Jume 30. I figure that when it eventually come, if I don't think it's worth the money then I'll send it back...

HEY OLIVE!

Please keep the wifi, analog L/R out, digital coax output, external power wart.
Please drop the integrated amp, and build a separate digital amp/speaker product.

Bring on the music!
post #43 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdjaye View Post

Agreed-

The original connection proposal seems much better. If you are going to spend $500/$600 on a music server, you want to be able to hook it into your integrated amp and hear it over your good speakers. Spdif output sounds good if you have a dac to go into. Wish they would keep the wifi though...

I ordered the 1 TB version pin Jume 30. I figure that when it eventually come, if I don't think it's worth the money then I'll send it back...

HEY OLIVE!

Please keep the wifi, analog L/R out, digital coax output, external power wart.
Please drop the integrated amp, and build a separate digital amp/speaker product.

Bring on the music!

Agree 100%
post #44 of 109
I just pre-ordered an Olive One 2TB edition. I had to pay a bit more but I also got a $25 dollar code to ease the pain a bit.

I have a Rotel RB-1080 power amp and RC-1070 preamp going into Vandersteen 3A Signature speakers,
so I'm obviously not looking to use a dinky integrated amplifier in the Olive.

What I was wondering is if the internal amplifier is being bypassed, will it still generate heat inside the housing?

Is it true that there are no RCA outputs on it?
post #45 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Kim View Post


What I was wondering is if the internal amplifier is being bypassed, will it still generate heat inside the housing?

Is it true that there are no RCA outputs on it?

Correct on the no RCA, only a 3.5 mm stereo jack and a Coaxial digital out. Not sure on the ability to turn off the internal amp when using a different power source, great question though. I asked a question on the Indigogo discussion page about streaming music sources and here was their response:

"We plan to ship end of September and you should receive an update email on Saturday (if you have ordered recently). We probably won’t have any of the music services implemented natively at this time, but will release them shortly afterwards (plan is to start with Deezer and Spotify). Thanks.

P.S. It is faster if you send us requests directly to info@olivehd.com. we monitor the forum only 1-2 times a day."

So I recommend you email your question to info@olivehd.com and report back what you find out.

Now here was an update I received last Saturday from Olive:

Olive ONE Home Music Player
Status Update

Thank you for ordering an Olive ONE at www.myoliveone.com. We are sending you a quick update to inform you about some important changes in the specifications and the estimated shipping date of your product. Since the launch of the Olive ONE campaign with Indiegogo we have received a lot of feedback from our supporters how the perfect Olive ONE should look like.

Based on the information we have gathered from our surveys and forum discussions, it is clear that Olive ONE needs the following features:

Analog output
RCA connector for digital coax output (instead of 3.5mm)
Standard USB connector (instead of Micro USB)
Although these changes will undoubtedly increase production costs, we have decided to implement them at no additional cost to you. We have spent the last few months analyzing the effect of these changes on the product design and have initiated the redesign of the PCB, change in tooling, EVT and DVT test plans, as well as redefined the certification and test requirements.

We estimate that these changes will delay the first shipments of Olive ONE by 6-8 weeks to end of September, beginning of October. We will do our best to reduce this shipping estimate and will update you when we reach key milestones.

To be fair with our early supporters from Indiegogo we will ship their products first. However, we can still increase the production quantity and include the orders we have received directly through www.myoliveone.com. In order to include your order with the first shipment you would need to authorize us to charge your credit card/PayPal account now. This way all customers that receive their Olive ONE with the first shipment are treated equally.

Please reply to this email only if you want to be included in the first shipment. The second shipment of Olive ONE is estimated to ship in November.

We hope you are as excited as we are! As always, please feel free to contact us directly if you have any questions or concerns. We look forward to your feedback.

Best regards,
Olive ONE Team

__________________________________________________

Summary of changes to Olive ONE

We have added:
Analog output (3.5mm connector)

Gold-plated RCA connector for digital output

USB A connector (instead of USB Micro)

Gold-plated speaker binding posts to allow end-users to use their own high-end speaker cables & connectors (Olive PAC will no longer be required).

We have removed:

WiFi Direct & Miracast (our surveys indicated that less than 3% intend to use this feature). However, we will implement most of the features provided by WiFi Direct/Miracast through a standard web interface, which allows for a wider compatibility with networked TVs.

For some reason it strikes me odd that they are trying so hard to have me pre-pay, kinda makes me nervous but with a currently working solution in the Squeezebox Duet and with their response of zero online streaming content for launch I'm sorta looking at my further delay as bit of a benefit at this point (also if they run into say a shielding or a software update snafu having the second iteration of product hardware can truly be a benefit) . I sure hope this comes out and knocks everyone's socks off but I'm now willing to hold off a tad longer to get others' first impressions.
post #46 of 109
I will wait and see, never like buy first generation always over priced, nasty surprises and disappointment! This thing is a moving target!
post #47 of 109
Here was the response, with my questions in quotes.
Quote:
Hi, I just have a few important questions about some features
in the Olive One.

1. Internal Amplifier Potential Heat Issues

I read that there is an internal amplifier built into the Olive One.
As I have a Rotel RB-1080 power amp and RC-1070 preamp,
I have no use for it. What I am wondering is if the amp will be
completely bypassed and deactivated, so that it doesn't generate
any heat or circuit noise.
yes, if you use analog out the DAC is bypassed. It doe snot produce much heat anyway as it is a Class D amp. (Comment: I think Olive meant to say that the amp is bypassed)
Quote:
What I would highly suggest is to put the amp in the add-on
speaker unit and leave it out of the Olive One. I would assume
that there are few people who will use passive speakers directly
connected to the Olive One. The people who use the add-on
speaker are more likely to be the kind of people that don't have
an amplifier. Instead of allocating the budget toward a low powered
built-in amp, the display should be upgraded to a high res OLED screen.

it is unfortunately too late to change that at this phase. Our surveys however have shown that more than 60% of our customers use the amp (some of them probably for 2nd room), so it doe shake sense.
Quote:
I also have legitimate concerns about the ability of the Olive One
to dissipate heat in such a small enclosure with other heat-generating
sources such as the hard drive and display. I don't see any heat
sinks or fan ports, and it could cause the One to crash or decrease
the lifetime of the circuits on the PCB. Have you guys run extensive
temperature tests inside the enclosure?
yes we have. we also use the metal enclosure as a heat sink. but again, the Class D amp does not create much heat and is very efficient.
Quote:
2. Single Conduit (3.5mm) vs. Separate Conduit Transmission (Dual RCA)

I also don't understand why the analog outputs don't include a
stereo RCA pair. For an audiophile network/storage player with
a high quality DAC, there is a potential bottleneck if the output to
an audiophile system if the signal originates from a 3.5mm output.
A 3.5mm plug uses the same conduit for both the left and right
signals.
we unfortunately did not have space for 2x RCA any more. It was already a challenge to out the standard RCA port (S/PDIF) and USB port in there. "Hardcore" audiophiles will use the S/PDIF or SUB out to connect to a separate high-edn DAC anyway so we think this solution is fine.
Quote:
For a quality stereo transmission, it is important to keep physically
separate conduits for left and right channels. Some of the higher
end amplifiers and receivers also accept XLR outputs, which would
also be a welcome addition. It appears that you have XLRs on your
high end media players 06HD. If this is not possible due to cost or
model feature structure, an RCA pair would be sufficient. Since it
appears that a dual RCA was part of the original spec, it doesn't
seem like it would be difficult to re-implement them into the core
design.
Dual RCA was never part of the spec (actually analog out was only added later on as any backers wanted it).

Thanks!
post #48 of 109
Forget it buy yourself a Mac mini with USB out or HDMi output and use your iPad smile.gif. In addition you can use Audirvana or JRiver and get much better sound
post #49 of 109
Forget it buy yourself a Mac mini with USB out or HDMi output and use your iPad smile.gif. In addition you can use Audirvana or JRiver and get much better sound
post #50 of 109
It is really disappointing to see how this thing ended up. It seems so obvious that the amplifier should be a separate add on like the HD drive (which is something that I can't imagine anyone actually using in 2013 - seems like a 2009 design - on the other hand, and add-on amp makes perfect sense). The cost of the amp, both in dollars and heat is a deal killer for me.

I am waiting for someone to make a simple device that passes hi-res digital audio with a hi-resolution screen to replace my Logitech Squeezeboxes (which at the time that they were released were amazing). I will not keep music locally on the device but rather stream from a NAS and from the cloud - not exactly a novel idea in 2013. When that comes out I will literally buy 10 of them.

The early designs of this had a lot of promise. Then it sounds like they started taking surveys and they ended up with a compromised piece of equipment that they think will make everyone happy.

The idea that you can buy a matching 2TB HD but can't run RCA audio out of their high quality internal DAC shows you the kind of people they chose to survey.

Can you guys imagine what the iPad would look like today if Steve Jobs ran focus groups and surveys before he released it? It would've had a pop out keyboard.
post #51 of 109
Yeah, I'm seriously contemplating cancelling my $700+ Olive One 2TB order right now. I'm looking at the alternatives out there, and one possibility that I see is the Logitech Squeezebox Touch, which also has an iPad control app. The one issue with that I'm concerned about is the lack of internal storage. I need a great deal of space to house my music library.

At this point, I've bought Vandersteen 3A Signature speakers, a Rotel RB-1080 200 watt/channel stereo amp, a Rotel RC-1070 preamp so now need is a good quality media player with a top notch DAC or an external DAC. Then I have to convert/update my music library into FLAC and I will be in business. I don't really want to spend another 300-800 on a dedicated DAC when I have other more pressing costs in my music studio. With a 32-bit 384KHz Burr Brown DAC, you would think that would be good enough to compete with most dedicated DAC's out there under 800 dollars. But having it run out of a 3.5mm jack...what on earth is Olive thinking? Is there any way to modify the Olive One to create a breakout panel with paired RCA's and XLR outputs? Damn, why couldn't it look just like this?

post #52 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Kim View Post

Yeah, I'm seriously contemplating cancelling my $700+ Olive One 2TB order right now. I'm looking at the alternatives out there, and one possibility that I see is the Logitech Squeezebox Touch, which also has an iPad control app. The one issue with that I'm concerned about is the lack of internal storage. I need a great deal of space to house my music library.

At this point, I've bought Vandersteen 3A Signature speakers, a Rotel RB-1080 200 watt/channel stereo amp, a Rotel RC-1070 preamp so now need is a good quality media player with a top notch DAC or an external DAC. Then I have to convert/update my music library into FLAC and I will be in business. I don't really want to spend another 300-800 on a dedicated DAC when I have other more pressing costs in my music studio. With a 32-bit 384KHz Burr Brown DAC, you would think that would be good enough to compete with most dedicated DAC's out there under 800 dollars. But having it run out of a 3.5mm jack...what on earth is Olive thinking? Is there any way to modify the Olive One to create a breakout panel with paired RCA's and XLR outputs? Damn, why couldn't it look just like this?


Its quite ironic that people are considering the Logitech Squeezebox Touch over the Olive One - the SBT came out years ago and was discontinued (mostly because Logitech seems like they are managed by a bunch of morons) and the Olive One is supposed to be the thing that SBT people are going to move to.
post #53 of 109
Thread Starter 
absolutely ridiculous they say theres no room for simple analog out via RCAs when they go and include a whole class d digital power amp and speaker outputs !

FAIL !

when you go to their website they still dont have a picture showing connectivity offered. instead they say designed by you. when it should say designed by morons ! rolleyes.gif
post #54 of 109
Yes I was going to buy one, but then figured I am better off with a Mac mini and my iPad smile.gif
post #55 of 109
I just ordered a pair of Canare speaker cables with banana plugs and spade lugs on each end of 4 strands.
I wanted to check how quickly they would get here, and ended up talking to Kurt from Blue Jeans Cable.
I figured he would be somewhat of an authority on cables and interface jacks. When I told him my predicament
with the Olive One's lack of RCA analog outputs, he said that it makes no difference whether you have a 3.5mm
or RCA jack, that the quality from the PCB line will be the same. When I thanked him for his opinion, he said it's
not an opinion, it's fact.

So evidently a well-respected cable manufacturer doesn't think the 3.5mm jack on the Olive One is going to be
an issue at all. Anyone thoughts on Kurt's opinion/facts? tongue.gif
post #56 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny Kim View Post

I just ordered a pair of Canare speaker cables with banana plugs and spade lugs on each end of 4 strands.
I wanted to check how quickly they would get here, and ended up talking to Kurt from Blue Jeans Cable.
I figured he would be somewhat of an authority on cables and interface jacks. When I told him my predicament
with the Olive One's lack of RCA analog outputs, he said that it makes no difference whether you have a 3.5mm
or RCA jack, that the quality from the PCB line will be the same. When I thanked him for his opinion, he said it's
not an opinion, it's fact.

So evidently a well-respected cable manufacturer doesn't think the 3.5mm jack on the Olive One is going to be
an issue at all. Anyone thoughts on Kurt's opinion/facts? tongue.gif

actually whats on the pcb is quite different whether a headphone jack or rca. and L&R RCAs are quite different in connectivity and cables used are quite different vs a simple headphone plug and leads. that is fact !

and so now rather than simply hook up via rca leads to 2ch gear we have to use either a headphone to RCA adapter or cable thats RCA and headphone at other end.
post #57 of 109
I think that the problem with the olive one is that they are trying to build 2 products in one box.
There are people who need a easy to use source for their existing stereo system ( like me) that want ethernet, 2 rca audio out and the possibility to upgrade it with an external usb or coaxial dac. They don't need the amplifier or the internal hdd and they think that these add noise and heat. Even if you want a multiroom sysyem is better to have a nas with 2 or three olive one connected to it via powerline o wifi. And if you need an all in one system just add powered usb speakers like the b&w or the kef x300a (or powered digital coaxial speakers like dynaudio)that sound much better with their internal custom amplifier that with any class d external amplifier.
In other words: if you own an hi fi you already have an amplifier. If you don't have it, powered digital speakers sounds better than a basic class d amplifier connected to passive speakers.
On the other side there are people who want an all in one system.
My suggestion is to give the internal amp as an option or to put it in a second stackable round case and to add 2 rca stereo output and ethernet.
Bye
Alessandro
(Ls3/5a speakers, audio research vsi 60 amp, synology 112+ nas, pc with foobar dlna renderer and m2tech young dac)
post #58 of 109
Thread Starter 
thats the thing kevin if look at the original ideas where it was just a source pod.



that could stack onto other things eg an internal hard drive unit, or a speaker unit which was also presumably with power amp built in.

would have been a great money spinner for them. sell the control/source pod. and then depending on peoples needs let them buy any of the other pods eg the hard drive, nas one, speakers,



amps etc as they see their needs and requirements.





instead now we have an all in one thing. thats trying to be too many things and ended up as typically with a jack of all trades really a compromise and a master of none !

I do hope they still some day consider a control/source pod style "olive one" can still do it. woudl just be a stripped back version of what they have currently released smile.gif
post #59 of 109
If things are in this way in october i will probably buy a cambridge sonata np30 or a naim unitiqute!
post #60 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by alex kelvin View Post

If things are in this way in october i will probably buy a cambridge sonata np30 or a naim unitiqute!

I could see the Cambridge unit but that Naim device looks pretty expensive.

So why aren't more people going to the Cambridge NP30? What is the Olive supposed to have to one up this device?
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