Originally Posted by JerryW
Because that is *easy* to check. A software-based switch will be detected in the first teardown, we'll know about it before the product starts shipping in volume. Even without a teardown, the second the xbone reacts to something in the room while the switch is off, the owner will realize the switch is bogus.
Furthermore you seem to be under the impression that MS is deliberately malicious. That's not my point at all, they just don't give a dman. They aren't going to design hardware to deliberately mislead users. The reason the new kinect is always-on is to let the user power-up the system via voice command. It is simply a side-effect of that requirement that would enable 24x7 spying. As the proverb says, the path to hell is paved with good intentions. Thus I would not expect MS to actively mislead people about the switch's functionality.
Slowbiscuit likes to think regular users can connect the dots with respect to egregious abuse. He's right and he's wrong. Something like disobeying the off switch is immediate and in your face enough that it will get noticed quick. He's wrong about long chain abuse where the cause and effect are greatly separated in time - where surreptitious data collection happens now and then 6 months later is used by an apparently unrelated party. He's already shown how he was unaware of the 8 trackers watching people read this very post.
Here's another example of how egregious abuse doesn't get fixed because most people aren't even aware of it - how many of you work for someone other than yourself? Do you expect your employer to send copies of your paystub to these same tracking companies? I'm sure there will be a handful of people who will enthusiastically and perversely embrace it, but really who would be happy about some company you've never even heard of knowing where you live and exactly how much money you make? If that ain't an egregious invasion of personal privacy I don't know what is.
Would it really? To put it into perspective Google generates about $24/yr per user of their search services ( http://www.webanalyticsworld.net/2011/01/revenue-per-unique-user-amazon-google.html
) - that's pure advertising - and they are fantastically profitable. Would $2 more per month really make a dent in xbone after-purchase revenue? I doubt it. Subscription pricing is going to be very flexible due to that sunk cost of nearly half a thousand dollars. What are people going to do? Just stop using it and effective throw that money in the trash?
And this all assumes that not-spying on users isn't a selling point. If you have no money, then sure all you've got to pay with is your privacy and maybe it is a good deal for you. But if you've got half a grand for an xbone then you aren't poor. A sales campaign promising no annoying ads, and no creepy big brother spying on you may well sell more units and generate more subscription revenue than use of overt and secretive marketing tactics.
I just don't get why offering a software switch to disable Kinect isn't enough for those of us that don't want to use it. Whether its a hardware switch or in software, anyone could easily check to see if Kinect is still functioning when those switches are in use.
You bring up a good point about ignorance. I guess we all have it to some degree, but you forgot the other part of it: Caring. To many people, they simply don't find the issues as serious and are happy to participate in these services.
As far as the value of advertising for MS, do we have any facts on the value of their advertising services across the board? Not just the X1, but company wide. I don't know if its a big money maker directly, but it seems like many content provider groups value companies that have a robust advertising system.
When I say its a problem against the competition, I mean I think that many content providers value a strong advertising system to push their products. This would definitely apply to tv, movie and music providers, but even game developers/publishers have a vested interest in good advertising. If MS were to drop all of their advertising services from the X1, it might upset some or all of those camps and push them to work with competing products instead. Maybe your right and the loss of such things could be easily outweighed by the public image that MS could show. If consumers really value that type of feature, then content providers would have no choice but to support the X1 due to the huge adoption rate by consumers.
I'm just not sure how any company, MS, Sony, etc, can advertise that they aren't spying on you, etc, and have people believe them. Heck, we didn't know about the NSA stuff, how would we know what to believe?
Originally Posted by JerryW
wrote one of the longest posts regarding this topic drift that you are now complaining about.
That sure sounds like, "I'm right now shut up."
I'm sorry but your way off on what I meant by my post. In fact, how could you take that as me saying I'm right? I haven't even argued against your main point.
My point was that I want to discuss more media related topics concerning the X1.
I think its funny that I get attacked for voicing an opinion about wanting to hear more about a topic in a forum supposedly all about said topic. I never said you have to stop or that anyone should be forced to change topics. I even joined the debate since that is what you guys are talking about and I wanted to share my thoughts on it. But no, because I'd also like to talk about other things, I'm seen as yelling "I'm right, now shut up"
Originally Posted by cybrsage
It did at the start, then again when MS changed their plans, but there is no new information to share so people are discussing their fears and likes about the X1. If this thread is still active after the launch date, people will be discussing their problems and solutions with the X1. It is the natural progression of things.
Look, I haven't said once that I think its wrong to discuss these things, in fact I pointed out how important they can be, I just like discussing other topics as well. Why is it so wrong to say that? I didn't think my comment would be so crazy.