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DIY center speaker help

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 
In around a year I plan on building these as my L and R. http://www.diysoundgroup.com/waveguide-speaker-kits/fusion12-kit.html

I want to get a head start and get a center channel built this summer. I have been looking around and can barely find any center builds. I found a few center builds on here but they're all absolutely massive speakers. I want to try to stay away from a really tall center so I want to avoid just building a fusion12 as a center. Is there any flat packs for a wider speaker that matches these speakers? Or what do you suggest I do? I don't need a 12" woofer on my center either, as I probably will cross it over at like 100 or 80 hz anyways. If I have to build a fusion12 as the center, would it be ok to sit it sideways, or will that cause any sound issues?

Thanks.
post #2 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by WagBoss View Post

In around a year I plan on building these as my L and R. http://www.diysoundgroup.com/waveguide-speaker-kits/fusion12-kit.html

I want to get a head start and get a center channel built this summer. I have been looking around and can barely find any center builds. I found a few center builds on here but they're all absolutely massive speakers. I want to try to stay away from a really tall center so I want to avoid just building a fusion12 as a center. Is there any flat packs for a wider speaker that matches these speakers? Or what do you suggest I do? I don't need a 12" woofer on my center either, as I probably will cross it over at like 100 or 80 hz anyways. If I have to build a fusion12 as the center, would it be ok to sit it sideways, or will that cause any sound issues?

Thanks.

Well for starters, I would never use a speaker as my center or lcr that was crossed at 100hz, as in my opinion that is taking away from the overall theater experience and limits what bass comes from the lcr's, but, that is just my opinion.

As far as flat packs for a center, no, there are not any. There have been some builds such as the Big Mal, and I believe that you might be able to get a baffle for the Big Mal through DIYSG, but I could be wrong. You can always design your own and have someone help you along the way. I know that with the Big Mal most people were using some mid-woofers that are now out of production.
post #3 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Well for starters, I would never use a speaker as my center or lcr that was crossed at 100hz, as in my opinion that is taking away from the overall theater experience and limits what bass comes from the lcr's, but, that is just my opinion.

As far as flat packs for a center, no, there are not any. There have been some builds such as the Big Mal, and I believe that you might be able to get a baffle for the Big Mal through DIYSG, but I could be wrong. You can always design your own and have someone help you along the way. I know that with the Big Mal most people were using some mid-woofers that are now out of production.

what do you cross yours over at? Do you know if turning the tempest12 sideways has any impact on the sound?
post #4 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by WagBoss View Post

what do you cross yours over at? Do you know if turning the tempest12 sideways has any impact on the sound?


I like to use fullrange speakers for my mains, and I cross them at around 60hz. I just don't understand why anyone would want to cross their mains at 100hz? that seems like you are missing out on a whole lot of sound. I could be wrong though. I have no idea on turning the Tempest sideways. Sorry, you might try PM'ing Tux or MTG90.
post #5 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

I like to use fullrange speakers for my mains, and I cross them at around 60hz. I just don't understand why anyone would want to cross their mains at 100hz? that seems like you are missing out on a whole lot of sound. I could be wrong though. I have no idea on turning the Tempest sideways. Sorry, you might try PM'ing Tux or MTG90.

well, I think the main reason is if you have small bookshelf speakers that can only play flat to 100 hz :P
post #6 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post


I like to use fullrange speakers for my mains, and I cross them at around 60hz. I just don't understand why anyone would want to cross their mains at 100hz? that seems like you are missing out on a whole lot of sound. I could be wrong though. I have no idea on turning the Tempest sideways. Sorry, you might try PM'ing Tux or MTG90.

 

If the speakers are crossed at 100hz then the subwoofer will play everything from 100hz and below, you're not missing out on any sound. I believe someone (Tux?) is working on a 3 way center channel.

 

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1291022/hey-guys-we-need-a-little-rallying-here/7200_100#post_23175811

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Bill and I need to get together to work on that center channel. It will definitely need a different crossover.

Jeff Bagby designed a center channel using two 8" Beta woofers flanking an EOS-8. It uses the same CD as the Fusion-8 though.

There are other center channel designs coming, but the first ones will be 3 ways.

Edited by Mrkazador - 5/22/13 at 12:22pm
post #7 of 16
I wouldn't lay a typical waveguide over woofer speaker on it's side. Your polar response would be crap. Which is the antithesis of what these designs are trying to achieve.

I am working on a center that uses 10's. I'm trying to keep it low key, but I'm busting with excitement. It'll be 12" tall and be quite high output around 99db/w/m. It'll be a while yet though. It's quite complex and I'm trying to do a lot with it. I want to be able to offer multiple configurations, high output, cost effective, etc. I want it to be achieve a lot.

Just imagine it not quite as wide (the final version will be a little different than my test boxes) and raised up off the ground a couple feet.

post #8 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

I wouldn't lay a typical waveguide over woofer speaker on it's side. Your polar response would be crap. Which is the antithesis of what these designs are trying to achieve.

I am working on a center that uses 10's. I'm trying to keep it low key, but I'm busting with excitement. It'll be 12" tall and be quite high output around 99db/w/m. It'll be a while yet though. It's quite complex and I'm trying to do a lot with it. I want to be able to offer multiple configurations, high output, cost effective, etc. I want it to be achieve a lot.

Just imagine it not quite as wide (the final version will be a little different than my test boxes) and raised up off the ground a couple feet.


That looks awesome!! Will it be available as a flatpack from diysoundgroup? So it will be timbre matched to the fusion12?

yeah I figured that a waveguide wouldn't be good on it's side
post #9 of 16
Sounds awesome too wink.gif

I'm not sure if it'll be flat packed or not. Depends how good it is in the end (I'll have to decide that) and if Erich wants to (Erich will have to decide that).

It's not timbre matched to the Fusion 12 in any special way. The Fusion 12 is designed by Jeff Bagby and I'm doing this as a separate thing. Being both SEOS based, it would probably be fairly well matched. The speaker that it's truly timbre matched to is my avatar photo. biggrin.gif

Don't wait on this thing though. I could be a while. And I have yet to take all the measurements I want. And I need to log a lot more listening time.
post #10 of 16
I was eagerly awaiting you letting this particular cat out of its bag. I love this concept. I have tons of questions, but I'll do my best to hold off until you're ready to give it its own thread. biggrin.gif
post #11 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

Sounds awesome too wink.gif

I'm not sure if it'll be flat packed or not. Depends how good it is in the end (I'll have to decide that) and if Erich wants to (Erich will have to decide that).

It's not timbre matched to the Fusion 12 in any special way. The Fusion 12 is designed by Jeff Bagby and I'm doing this as a separate thing. Being both SEOS based, it would probably be fairly well matched. The speaker that it's truly timbre matched to is my avatar photo. biggrin.gif

Don't wait on this thing though. I could be a while. And I have yet to take all the measurements I want. And I need to log a lot more listening time.

how long is a while, lol. But Erich is working on other centers to offer?
Edited by WagBoss - 5/22/13 at 1:53pm
post #12 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by pitviper33 View Post

I was eagerly awaiting you letting this particular cat out of its bag. I love this concept. I have tons of questions, but I'll do my best to hold off until you're ready to give it its own thread. biggrin.gif

Hehe, it's been bouncing around in my head for a while.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WagBoss View Post

how long is a while, lol.

Well, I'll probably only need another month, if that. I'm pretty close actually. If my next big round of measurements go the way I hope, I'll be calling it good. It's Erich who has to much on his plate to do anything with it after that. He's involved and well aware of the design progress, but get it flat packed and everything can take time. You could email him if inclined to wait for it. I'm not sure what other center channel designs are available, so waiting may be your only option eek.gif
post #13 of 16
Awesome project, tux. I've been meaning to harass you about your mysterious new avatar, but in the end decided to just wait and see.

On a different topic related to the OP's question: I seem to remember rumors about a Jeff Bagby-designed toppled MTM center in the works. Anybody heard anything? Normally I'd consider that type of design quite compromised (especially with the added complications of a waveguide smack in the middle of it all, adding inches to CTC), but if Jeff comes up with something he's willing to put his name on, I'm all ears. biggrin.gif
post #14 of 16
WagBoss, just posted here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Bagby View Post


When you are asking for a center channel, what did you have in mind? I have done a a center channel design for Erich that uses dual 8" Beta8-A's and an EOS8 tweeter waveguide (like the Alchemy8). It was voiced to go with the Tempest and has the same sensitivity. However, it is only 4 Ohm and is good to 60Hz.

Jeff
post #15 of 16
Tux,

Have you 'finalized' your design yet? (If it's anything like my typical projects, its never really final.) I really like it, but I'm curious to what you think and *hopefully* a parts list, x-over diagram and enclosure diagram. (If you need some one do do some enclosure drawings, I can draw them up in CAD if you send me a PM with them.)
post #16 of 16
Hey CodyO. Yup, it's "finalized" wink.gif

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1479331/a-3-way-99db-multi-configurable-seos-design

Just gotta sort out a small few details about enclosure layout. Samples for the SEOS10 just came in though, so when it's available as a kit, I dunno. Could be a couple more months. Unless I were to send my parts to someone for a beta build, but I only have the parts for one speaker. They're Erich's parts so who ever would have to run it by him and pay him for them.
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