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Panasonic TC-65PS64 and TC-50PS64 ~OWNER'S POLL~ - Page 7

Poll Results: Are you glad overall that you bought the PanasonicTC-xxPS64?

Poll expired: Jun 22, 2013  
  • 88% (22)
    Yes, totally glad.
  • 0% (0)
    No, I regret it.
  • 12% (3)
    I'm ambivalent. Serious doubts.
25 Total Votes  
post #181 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdcl View Post

Thanks for the link to fairchild99's settings. I found that when I used his settings, everything looked WAY too RED to me. By changing the color temp to Normal instead of Warm 2 as in his settings, to my eye across various source material, the picture looks MUCH better. I don't have calibration equipment so this is just based on observation. Has anyone else who is using his settings and color temp noticed the very bad Red push? I have the 50" S64.

Hi; I'm one of those S54 owners that has a lot of Red push with Fairchild settings and also with many individual tweaks offered by others.
I primarily watch OTA broadcast TV....which is mostly 480i
Still searching for tweak techniques to modulate the red bias.
post #182 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMichael View Post

This thread - IRT Running Vote Tally:

Adding ajmfuller's vote:

23 Totally glad they purchased an S64

0 regret purchasing their S64


This will be my last mention of the former "ambivalent" vote option since it appears none of those alleged owners ever posted comments. As such, we are left to wonder if they are owners or not.

Future updates will include only: "Glad I bought an S64" or "I Regret it".

At such time as "Glad" is less than 100%, I'll post the percentage split.

Any owners, at any such time as you want to vote "I regret it", just post details so we know you're real and you'll be counted.

To all: I've said it before, but no HDTV ever made (even the mighty Kuro) is perfect OR right for everyone or their would only be one model in production.

There is at least one guy in the S60 thread who is not happy with his S64 and is going to something else. He's a good guy, it's just not for him. My point: I'm hoping we'll all show respect if a real owner posts in here that the S64 wasn't for him or her and that he/she went to something else.

It happens with all TV's; it'll eventually happen with this one and that's OK.

For now, the thread vote remains at a stunning 100%.

mm


I am a legit 50S64 owner (will post pix as soon as I get chance)...bought at Costco June 27.
My significant gripe is the Red push which so far I've been unable to modulate. I've tried several Fairchild settings and some tweaks from others. However the red push remains....very frustrating. The red push is very obvious in inaccurate facial tones, Blue ski looks purplish, etc.
I keep hoping someone can suggest some tweaks that can help.
My viewing is primarily OTA broadcast...most are 480i. I use my 27"CRT TV as a comparison monitor and 'Shakespeare In Love' DVD for flesh/facial tone accuracy.
I have never posted this forum but I have on the 'Official Panasonic S60 Series Discussion Thread'.

So my 'vote' at this point is I'm not 100% happy nor do I regret it...so far. I've got 7 weeks left to try further tweaking before return deadline.
post #183 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caely View Post


I went to the Panasonic website and found out the dimensions of the shipping box for this item, and it will easily fit into my Firebird with its back seat folded down. I'm taking lots of blankets & pillows to protect it during the 13-mile drive home (over all good roads); and I actually feel safer than trusting the $99 shippers to take as much care. And who knows whether or not they'd really transport it standing upright? Or even moreso, do I even know it got to the store standing up? No, I'll be slow and careful, and feel better about the whole thing. After it gets here, it'll be unloaded and set up by my friend who's a professional furniture/equipment assembler, so I'm very lucky in that.

For others, you can shave a few inches off the height if you take off the top box and have the TV in just the cardboard base. I put on a real show with my dad in front of costco, trying to fit it into the Odyssey. I asked, and a nice Costco lady told me that I can leave the top box around the corner.
Edited by stuartlee - 8/4/13 at 9:29pm
post #184 of 758
I haven't tried Fairchild's settings yet, but noticed red push with the factory settings. The red push went away when I changed from Standard to Cinema mode and Warm to Normal color. Most of the other picture settings are the defaults, but I turned off noise reduction and other extraneous processing including CATS and Power Saving. I think I still have to go through some color patterns to calibrate with the AVS HD709 DVD.
post #185 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig-Paul View Post

Added External Speakers powered by the internal amps of a Panasonic TC-65PS64

Last week I removed the back cover of the TV. There are two very small 8 ohm speakers for L and R channels. I removed the amplifier +/- leads at the speaker terminals. I made a number of custom extension cables. One pair is attached to the speaker leads. A second pair is attached to the amplifier +/- output leads. Each cable run contains a red/black 16 gauge copper speaker wire inside an outer protective sheath. I ran my extensions from the internal speaker leads and the amplifier leads out through the small stamped holes in the back panel.

I used a Niles Audio DSP-1 A/B switch box to make all my connections. The amp leads are connected to the switch box's common 4 inputs (L+ L- R+ R-). I have the TV speakers connected to the 4 inputs of the A side. I have external speaker leads connected to the other 4 inputs of the B side which are connected to my external speakers.

My external speaker cabinets are high quality with an 8 ohm output. Since the internal speakers were 8 ohm and my speaker cabinets are rated at 8 ohms, the TV's amp is happy. I am able to depress the A/B selector switch on the Niles unit to toggle between the internal and external speakers. It is remarkable difference.

On the TC-xxPS64 there is not an option to turn off the internal speakers. So if that were something I now wanted to do, then I would disconnect the 4 leads into the A/B switching box coming from the internal speakers.

It works great.

Is it possible to run those internal speaker leads directly to an older amplifier/receiver (non optical input) A/B sockets to power external speakers?
post #186 of 758
Could someone please give me the exact dimensions for their TC-65PS64? I'm mainly concerned about the width. I know the websites say it's 59.1", but I've been to B&M stores and measured TV's and their dimensions differed from the manuf. given dimensions. Thanks in advance.
post #187 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by vr6veedub View Post

Could someone please give me the exact dimensions for their TC-65PS64? I'm mainly concerned about the width. I know the websites say it's 59.1", but I've been to B&M stores and measured TV's and their dimensions differed from the manuf. given dimensions. Thanks in advance.

The width is spot on at 59.1". I had a 60" opening to work with and it fits perfect.
post #188 of 758
Thanks Hock20, my opening is 58 3/4" so I'm screwed. Now I have to figure something out. I have a 60" Sony SXRD in there now, but wanted to move up to a 65". Part of me was hoping Panasonic's measurements were off even by 1 inch lol.
post #189 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by vr6veedub View Post

Thanks Hock20, my opening is 58 3/4" so I'm screwed. Now I have to figure something out. I have a 60" Sony SXRD in there now, but wanted to move up to a 65". Part of me was hoping Panasonic's measurements were off even by 1 inch lol.

Sure thing, that might actually fit to be honest lol. I can almost fit my fingertip along each side but just the tip of my finger. You may be able to fit with nothing to spare.

I would go for it as I upgraded from a 60" to a 65" and it's so much better.
post #190 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by hock20 View Post

Sure thing, that might actually fit to be honest lol. I can almost fit my fingertip along each side but just the tip of my finger. You may be able to fit with nothing to spare.

I would go for it as I upgraded from a 60" to a 65" and it's so much better.

Yeah, only the front edge is the maximum dimensions. It curves down on the edges so that if you can have the last few millimeters of the bezel protruding out your opening, it could work.
post #191 of 758
You very well might be right, the outer edges of the media niche I have are rounded so that might give me the clearance. My only concern is the stand the TV comes with. I protrudes forward of the tv, which would cause the tv to have to sit into the niche not on the edge of the niche opening. Pulling the media cabinet I have out of the niche is not an option (wife cant stand the non flush look and young kids running into the corner of the media cabinet. My other option (requires more $$) is to find a mount that extends over 30" out of the nice. Not many are out there, I just am a little freaked out about a 75-80lb tv on a wall mount that is extended away from the wall full time.
post #192 of 758
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fibonacci3 View Post


I am a legit 50S64 owner (will post pix as soon as I get chance)...bought at Costco June 27.
My significant gripe is the Red push which so far I've been unable to modulate. I've tried several Fairchild settings and some tweaks from others. However the red push remains....very frustrating. The red push is very obvious in inaccurate facial tones, Blue ski looks purplish, etc.
I keep hoping someone can suggest some tweaks that can help.
My viewing is primarily OTA broadcast...most are 480i. I use my 27"CRT TV as a comparison monitor and 'Shakespeare In Love' DVD for flesh/facial tone accuracy.
I have never posted this forum but I have on the 'Official Panasonic S60 Series Discussion Thread'.

So my 'vote' at this point is I'm not 100% happy nor do I regret it...so far. I've got 7 weeks left to try further tweaking before return deadline.

Your input is appreciated.

I haven't tried them, but some have liked CNET's S60 settings... possibly one alternative to try.

If you can afford it, a pro calibration may be your best option if the red push is your main concern and you can't dial it out. Panel variance may mean that shared settings aren't going to suffice for your current set without custom calibration. Additionally, if you possibly have a panel where red push outright cannot be dialed out, the calibrator could let you know that so that you could consider whether you want to try a swap to another before the return privilege is up.

I'm hoping some others active in this thread may have some suggestions that may be of help.

HDTS input appears to me to be a good idea worth trying, too.

If you scan back a few weeks in the S60 thread, fairchild99 gave some detailed suggestions on how to attempt to adjust for red push using the AVCHD test patterns and screens. Those are available for free download in a dedicated thread here in AVS, fwiw.

Moshock's settings are pretty bright, but if you find those in the S60 thread and try them, it may prove diagnostic to see whether those give red push on your set or not. I believe Moshock published those settings when his panel had very low hours on it, so it might help with new buyers versus fairchild99's and my panels being significantly more aged than that... which leads to this:

Question for fairchild99: If memory serves, your set's phosphor aging is at 1100 or more hours now. Mine is over 600 hours, probably. Do you think phosphor aging may explain why later iterations of your calibrations are causing more complaints of red push from persons with much newer or less aged TV's? If you think that might hold water, I have all your calibrations done at various hours of aging... I'd be happy to supply them if you think publishing something like that might be worthwhile.

That is, listing the settings with the number of hours that were on your panel when you worked up that calibration. I kept track of some of the hours notes.. This way, people seeing red push could try settings from earlier so their panel/phosphor aging is closer to when whichever specific calibration was done.

mm
Edited by MountainMichael - 8/5/13 at 5:58pm
post #193 of 758
Thread Starter 
A few thoughts about slides to age phosphors:

First off, people like D-Nice know WAY more about TV's than I do, so none of this is intended as criticism. Furthermore, I sure would not wish to offend; to the contrary, I sincerely thank people like D-Nice for sharing their work with us.

Having said that, some notes:

With my former 55ST60, I did the slide aging 100% as recommended with no content usage at all. I had the red push problem some report with D-Nice's settings in the ST60 thread. I read the ST60 thread and utilized some other's ideas how to dial that back and had it where I was OK with it. However, I had decided I was going to bite the bullet for a pro calibration even though I live out in the sticks and it would cost a lot. Then my ST60 developed an intermittent electronic fault, so I decided to try an S64 as they had just become available.

Emphasis added: When I began slide aging with my S64, I did NOT follow the guidelines to the letter, so that may be why I saw some problems. I have no way of knowing. Instead, I would run slides all night after bedtime but watch content during the day. I believed I was seeing red push increasingly creeping into the grey Amazon instant vids menu screen, so I stopped slides at 66 hours. It took another 200 hours for that red in the Amazon grey screen to fade out but it did. I cannot prove that my improper slide usage was contributing to the red push, it was just my resolute layperson opinion that I was definitely seeing more red over time - so I stopped slides.

My point in all of this: If we can get fairchild99's shared settings published with rough hours figures, fairchild99 said he did not use slide aging. So some owners may get more pleasing results by not using slides if they plan to use fairchild99's settings. As a panel ages, one might then try later settings that fairchild99 worked up to touch up his settings as his panel aged......

Thoughtful suggestions appreciated. Mainly, I'm seeing enough red push complaints now that I wonder if some sort of stepped or tiered publication of settings by age might help. Especially since the data exists..

mm
post #194 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Note doing this will absolutely throw off the calibration, especially the grayscale changes. Once you deviate from any setting, you run the risk of having the entire calibration null. The reason is that the changes to the grayscale were done using the warmer picture of the Warm 2 picture mode, and any subsequent changes you make will take you further away from the calibration goal of Rec709/D65 for color gamut and color of white.

If my settings don't work for you, I suggest you just pick up one of the many calibration discs (there are both paid versions and free versions) or in MP4/MKV and run them and at the very least calibrate the contrast/brightness for your particular set to make sure you are not clipping or showing too much information (extra dithering in the black/brightness clipping pattern). At least like this you won't have an image that is washed out or has the shadows/black crushed in movies.

The color of gray/white (grayscale) and the colors will not be able to be calibrated by eye and thus any changes you make here will just be for your eyes and what you feel looks natural. But don't fool yourselves, without hardware + software + patterns, you will not actually be performing a calibration for these 2 areas which are usually the more important if your goal is a picture that is as close as possible to what the director and creator's of the movie you are watching intended you to see.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMichael View Post

A few thoughts about slides to age phosphors:

First off, people like D-Nice know WAY more about TV's than I do, so none of this is intended as criticism. Furthermore, I sure would not wish to offend; to the contrary, I sincerely thank people like D-Nice for sharing their work with us.

Having said that, some notes:

With my former 55ST60, I did the slide aging 100% as recommended with no content usage at all. I had the red push problem some report with D-Nice's settings in the ST60 thread. I read the ST60 thread and utilized some other's ideas how to dial that back and had it where I was OK with it. However, I had decided I was going to bite the bullet for a pro calibration even though I live out in the sticks and it would cost a lot. Then my ST60 developed an intermittent electronic fault, so I decided to try an S64 as they had just become available.

Emphasis added: When I began slide aging with my S64, I did NOT follow the guidelines to the letter, so that may be why I saw some problems. I have no way of knowing. Instead, I would run slides all night after bedtime but watch content during the day. I believed I was seeing red push increasingly creeping into the grey Amazon instant vids menu screen, so I stopped slides at 66 hours. It took another 200 hours for that red in the Amazon grey screen to fade out but it did. I cannot prove that my improper slide usage was contributing to the red push, it was just my resolute layperson opinion that I was definitely seeing more red over time - so I stopped slides.

My point in all of this: If we can get fairchild99's shared settings published with rough hours figures, fairchild99 said he did not use slide aging. So some owners may get more pleasing results by not using slides if they plan to use fairchild99's settings. As a panel ages, one might then try later settings that fairchild99 worked up to touch up his settings as his panel aged......

Thoughtful suggestions appreciated. Mainly, I'm seeing enough red push complaints now that I wonder if some sort of stepped or tiered publication of settings by age might help. Especially since the data exists..

mm

Hey Mountain Michael, Thanks for your last 2 posts and ideas re investigating how to modulate the Red bias that some of us are having.
I've tried several of the Fairchild calibration settings and have tried, by eye ball, to diminish the Red bias... but it almost seems impossible to neutralize.
For comparison purposes, I view the "Shakespeare In Love" DVD on both the S64 and my old 27"CRT (Phillips Magnavox which has very good facial skin tones) simultaneously side by side.

I found the Fairchild post you referred to (#177 see top quote) where he commented about using the AVCHD disk.... but basically that would only be for the basic settings like contrast/brightness.
He said to do the Pro Settings, W/B and Color Detail, you need the Hardware+software+patterns. So for many of us without the special hardware and expertise, the only way to tweak the Pro Settings is by trial and error. I've been trying to do that but I have no idea of which of the W/B and Color Detail parameters should be adjusted and in what sequence and how much. It would be helpful if some of the more experienced tweakers on this forum could post some guidelines on how to methodically manipulate the Pro settings to diminish the Red bias.

I have ~ 250hrs on my 50S64 and I ran the slides for 120hrs after I had 80hrs initially on the panel
.

I'm thankful to have these Panasonic forums available for information and help.
post #195 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by vr6veedub View Post

You very well might be right, the outer edges of the media niche I have are rounded so that might give me the clearance. My only concern is the stand the TV comes with. I protrudes forward of the tv, which would cause the tv to have to sit into the niche not on the edge of the niche opening. Pulling the media cabinet I have out of the niche is not an option (wife cant stand the non flush look and young kids running into the corner of the media cabinet. My other option (requires more $$) is to find a mount that extends over 30" out of the nice. Not many are out there, I just am a little freaked out about a 75-80lb tv on a wall mount that is extended away from the wall full time.

Ah, I forgot that the stand protrudes out about a foot. I think wall mounts are designed for the full weight no matter where the arm is extended. That is probably your best option, assuming you can find the right length extension.
post #196 of 758
Looks like Im taking mine back to Costco to exchange it.

TV has developed a single horizontal line of stray pixels from the edge to edge. When i say stray, these pixels flip between red, blue & green and do not conform to the picture on the screen. Its like a rainbow colored line thats permanently on the screen, regardless of content or source.

Disappointed I have to take it back for another one. But so glad I bought it from Costco where exchanges and refunds are no hassle.



I also purchased a 50" PS64 at the same time I purchased the 65". And the 50" has been working with no issues.

For those 50" PS64 owners, be advised Costco has dropped the price to $599. Which means you are due a $30 refund if you are within the 30day pricematch guarantee. Or due the a $30 difference if you are within the 90day return window guarantee. With the return, you simply need to state that you are "not satisfied" the price has dropped since you purchased it. And the customer service counter should be able to take your reciept, refund your $629. And you turn right back around purchase the same tv for $599. I do not believe you need to actually bring your set to the store to do this. Just simply bring in your reciept.
post #197 of 758
Were u able to exchange your 65"? Most locations & costco.com are sold-out........................
post #198 of 758
I wont know till this weekend. I need a friend with a truck to help me get it back to the store, neither of which would be available until Friday at the earliest.

I'm hoping it comes back into stock before then or sometime in the next few weeks, if not Im buying a 70" LCD. I'm not in a huge rush to get a replacement set, as I already have the 50" to watch and Verizon will not come to install FIOS until the 26th. Meaning I have another 2 and half weeks to go with no cable tv frown.gif
post #199 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daekwan View Post

I wont know till this weekend. I need a friend with a truck to help me get it back to the store, neither of which would be available until Friday at the earliest.

I'm hoping it comes back into stock before then or sometime in the next few weeks, if not Im buying a 70" LCD. I'm not in a huge rush to get a replacement set, as I already have the 50" to watch and Verizon will not come to install FIOS until the 26th. Meaning I have another 2 and half weeks to go with no cable tv frown.gif

Called the Arlington Costco Sunday early morning and they had 3 in stock . . . . I went Sunday afternoon and saw two sets on a pallet and I snagged one.

Good luck!
post #200 of 758
Is it just me, or did Costco stop selling the S64...
post #201 of 758
I was wondering the same thing, even the 50" is gone from their webpage
post #202 of 758
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fibonacci3 View Post


Hey Mountain Michael, Thanks for your last 2 posts and ideas re investigating how to modulate the Red bias that some of us are having.
I've tried several of the Fairchild calibration settings and have tried, by eye ball, to diminish the Red bias... but it almost seems impossible to neutralize.
For comparison purposes, I view the "Shakespeare In Love" DVD on both the S64 and my old 27"CRT (Phillips Magnavox which has very good facial skin tones) simultaneously side by side.

I found the Fairchild post you referred to (#177 see top quote) where he commented about using the AVCHD disk.... but basically that would only be for the basic settings like contrast/brightness.
He said to do the Pro Settings, W/B and Color Detail, you need the Hardware+software+patterns. So for many of us without the special hardware and expertise, the only way to tweak the Pro Settings is by trial and error. I've been trying to do that but I have no idea of which of the W/B and Color Detail parameters should be adjusted and in what sequence and how much. It would be helpful if some of the more experienced tweakers on this forum could post some guidelines on how to methodically manipulate the Pro settings to diminish the Red bias.

I have ~ 250hrs on my 50S64 and I ran the slides for 120hrs after I had 80hrs initially on the panel
.

I'm thankful to have these Panasonic forums available for information and help.

fibinacci3,

YW. Sorry to hear the red problem is continuing.

There were quite a few complaints about red push using D-Nice's settings in the ST60 thread. Some guys talked about how they knocked that back though it was with some "Oklahoma windage", not with instrument proven adjustments.

Have you tried the CNET S60 settings yet? Looking now to see if I have that link...

Ok, I'm back. The link I had no longer works, but here is a copy/paste of the settings they had published. All credit to Katzmaier and CNET. These are for dim room so they may not serve for the long term but may prove diagnostic regarding red push:

"CNETs S60 Custom Calibration
Panasonic TC-P50S60 picture settings
by katzmaier - 4/19/13 7:37 AM

Related products:
Panasonic TC-P42S60
Panasonic TC-P55S60
Panasonic TC-P60S60
Panasonic TC-P65S60

Calibration report using these settings: [see post below]

TV software/firmware version tested: 2.206

Below you'll find the settings I found best for viewing the Panasonic TC-P50S60 in a dim room via the HDMI input. Your settings may vary depending on source, room conditions, and personal preference. Check out the Picture settings and calibration FAQ for more information.

(old link that doesn't seem to work for me; mm) http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-9996461-1.html

Calibration notes: The S60's most accurate preset picture mode, as expected, was Cinema, and in fact its default picture was significantly better than Cinema on the more expensive ST60. Grayscale and gamma were admirably linear and good throughout the scale. On the other hand color was only average.

As with the ST60 the CMS worked better than the grayscale controls during calibration. I was able to get half of the six colors under the delta error target of 3, and the others, driven by an errant blue, weren't too much worse.

Grayscale was a bit more problematic. As with the ST60, I experienced relatively large fluctuations from one measurement to the next. The midpoint (50 IRE) was particularly volatile; the blue spike seen in my chart could be much midler or even worse from one measurement to the next without me changing any settings. In the end I was able to slightly improve the rest of the scale, and overall it was still well within the range of Good. It's also worth nothing that I didn't miss the multipoint adjustments found on the ST60 much, since they weren't all that effective anyway.

My TC-P50S60 was aged 130 hours before calibration and review, but there's no reason you need to similarly break it in before you apply the settings below.

--Picture menu
Picture mode: Cinema
Contrast: 83
Brightness: 0
Color: 50
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0
Color temp: Warm 2
Vivid Color: Off
C.A.T.S.: Off
Video NR: Off
MPEG NR: Off

-- Pro settings submenu
Panel brightness: Low
AGC: 0
Black extension: 0
Color Gamut: Normal

W/B detail adjustment menu:
W/B high R: -4
W/B high G: -2
W/B high B: 0
W/B low R: 0
W/B low G: 0
W/B low B: -6

Color detail adjustment menu:
Red hue: -1
Red Saturation: 5
Red luminance: -8
Green hue: 4
Green Saturation: -9
Green luminance: -4
Blue hue: 3
Blue Saturation: 30
Blue luminance: -10

Gamma detail adjustment menu:
Gamma: 2.2

--Advanced picture submenu
Game mode: Off
24p Direct in: 60Hz
3:2 pulldown: On [often grayed out depending on source]
1080p pixel direct: Off [often grayed out depending on source]
HDMI content type: [all Off]
HDMI/DVI RGB range: [all Standard (16-235)]
Black level: Light"


Here are Cadett's ST60 settings that some people have liked on their S60's as well as on ST60's. Of course, some of the settings won't be available on an S60/64. If memory serves, these were not done with instrumentation but were based on D-Nice's ST60 settings with some nudges to knock back red push:

Originally Posted by cadett

Here are the settings a arrived at for dim lit room on my 60"ST60.
Software: Calamn 4
Meter: Eye One Pro Retail

Picture Mode: Custom
Contrast: 87
Brightness: +1
Color: 50
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0
Color Temp: Warm2
Vivid Color: Off
C.A.T.S: Off
Video NR: Off
MPEG NR: Off
Motion Smoother: Off


Pro Settings
Panel Brightness: Mid
AGC: 0
Black Extension: 0
Color Gamut: Normal

W/B Detail Adjustment
W/B High R: 0
W/B High G: 0
W/B High B: -6
W/B Low R: 0
W/B Low G: 0
W/B Low B: 0

(W/B) More Detail Adjustment
10 W/B R: -8
10 W/B G: 0
10 W/B B: 4

20 W/B R: 21
20 W/B G: 0
20 W/B B: 0

30 W/B R: 19
30 W/B G: 0
30 W/B B: 3

40 W/B R: 10
40 W/B G: 0
40 W/B B: -3

50 W/B R: 9
50 W/B G: 0
50 W/B B: -4

60 W/B R: 5
60 W/B G: 0
60 W/B B: 0

70 W/B R: 0
70 W/B G: 0
70 W/B B: -2

80 W/B R: -2
80 W/B G: 0
80 W/B B: -1

90 W/B R: -1
90 W/B G: 0
90 W/B B: 4

100 W/B R: -6
100 W/B G: 0
100 W/B B: 8

Color Detail Adjustment
R-Hue: -4
R-Sat: -9
R-Lum: -3

G-Hue: 2
G-Sat: -50
G-Lum: -2

B-Hue: -1
B-Sat: -15
B-Lum: -6


Gamma Detail Adjustment
Gamma: 2.4

(Gamma) More Detail Adjustment
10 Gain: -16
20 Gain: -5
30 Gain: -7
40 Gain: -3
50 Gain: -2
60 Gain: -3
70 Gain: -2
80 Gain: -1
90 Gain: -1
100 Gain: 0

Advance Picture
3:2 PullDown: Auto

HDMI Content Type
***Leave settings in this menu at their default***

HDMI/DVI RGB Range
***Leave settings in this menu at their default***

I had saved Moshock's settings from 5-2013 where he went more moderate with brightness, but some detail settings appear to be missing. Maybe pm Moshock if you want to try those settings. I don't believe those were created with instrumentation.
Edited by MountainMichael - 8/7/13 at 10:56am
post #203 of 758
MountainMichael: Re Red Bias on my P50S64

Thanks for the CNET S60 and Cadett ST60 Settings.....I'll try those and report back.
BTW, after some extensive searching I did find the CNET S60 review which has the calibration settings.

http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/panasonic-tc-p50s60/4505-6482_7-35558333.html


Per your suggestion I did try Moshock's settings..but they were WAY off (way too much) re Red push.
Probably due to Color setting of 68. Mode was 'Home Theater'.

I'm very appreciative of your efforts to help with the Red bias problem especially as you have the overall knowledge
and awareness of relevant information and posts.
post #204 of 758
Using ST60 settings on an S60/S64 is kinda pointless since they use different panels. That and to achieve their calibration you have to do changes to 10-pt WB + 10-pt gamma. Really red push has to do with a combination of things such as the white balance, the color setting, the color detail (aka color management system/CMS) setting, possibly the tint as well. Trying to adjust by eye is probably pretty pointless unless you are using reference material, such as a reference blu-ray disc that you know has it's skin tones spot on in a particular scene which you can go to and tweak. Trying to adjust for other sources is pointless and will make you go barking mad. This is the point of using an actual physical meter + software to interpret the results which the meter is reading off of the reference patterns which are being used to measure the performance of your particular display device + display source.
post #205 of 758
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fibonacci3 View Post

MountainMichael: Re Red Bias on my P50S64

Thanks for the CNET S60 and Cadett ST60 Settings.....I'll try those and report back.
BTW, after some extensive searching I did find the CNET S60 review which has the calibration settings.

http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/panasonic-tc-p50s60/4505-6482_7-35558333.html


Per your suggestion I did try Moshock's settings..but they were WAY off (way too much) re Red push.
Probably due to Color setting of 68. Mode was 'Home Theater'.

I'm very appreciative of your efforts to help with the Red bias problem especially as you have the overall knowledge
and awareness of relevant information and posts.

YW. Unfortunately, if neither of those get you into the ballpark, I'm out of ideas. I'd say at that point, your best option may be a pro calibration. If you do that, it appears you may be asked not to share such settings but maybe you could let us know if pro calibration fixed the problem - or whatever you had to do.

For whatever reason, it appears increasing numbers of buyers are seeing red push with fc99's settings. I've no idea why. Maybe some parts sourcing changed in production? Or reportedly, typical panel production variance is likely to be the sole reason. Whatever, maybe someone with red push will buy home calibration equipment and provide some settings that might help others seeing this problem.
Edited by MountainMichael - 8/7/13 at 5:12pm
post #206 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Using ST60 settings on an S60/S64 is kinda pointless since they use different panels. That and to achieve their calibration you have to do changes to 10-pt WB + 10-pt gamma. Really red push has to do with a combination of things such as the white balance, the color setting, the color detail (aka color management system/CMS) setting, possibly the tint as well. Trying to adjust by eye is probably pretty pointless unless you are using reference material, such as a reference blu-ray disc that you know has it's skin tones spot on in a particular scene which you can go to and tweak. Trying to adjust for other sources is pointless and will make you go barking mad. This is the point of using an actual physical meter + software to interpret the results which the meter is reading off of the reference patterns which are being used to measure the performance of your particular display device + display source.


"Trying to adjust by eye is probably pretty pointless unless you are using reference material, such as a reference blu-ray disc that you know has it's skin tones spot on in a particular scene which you can go to and tweak."

I get your point...and that's what I'm trying to do:

I have a 'reference' (non Blu-ray) DVD, (Shakespeare In Love) which has many good facial tones when I watch on my 'reference monitor', my 27" CRT TV (Phillips Magnavox).
I play the DVD and view the S64 and the CRT simultaneously side-by-side. So at this point, without using hardware, I'd like to vary settings in a logical/methodical fashion to reduce the Red bias and get close to my reference image as viewed on the CRT TV.

So my question is how to tweak the Picture and Pro Settings that have the greatest impact on reducing the Red bias.
I would appreciate if you can give me some guidance on how to procedurally go about doing this.
post #207 of 758
Quote:
Originally Posted by fibonacci3 View Post

I have a 'reference' (non Blu-ray) DVD, (Shakespeare In Love) which has many good facial tones when I watch on my 'reference monitor', my 27" CRT TV (Phillips Magnavox).
I play the DVD and view the S64 and the CRT simultaneously side-by-side. So at this point, without using hardware, I'd like to vary settings in a logical/methodical fashion to reduce the Red bias and get close to my reference image as viewed on the CRT TV.

So my question is how to tweak the Picture and Pro Settings that have the greatest impact on reducing the Red bias.
I would appreciate if you can give me some guidance on how to procedurally go about doing this.[/SIZE]

My first question is, what type of DVD player do you have that has dual outputs, and if it does, what outputs are you using for each device. If one is using composite or S-video or component and the other is using a different output, that might cause a difference. You ideally want both signals to be as close as possible. If the DVD player doesn't have dual-HDMI outputs, then at least you should be doing component on one and HDMI on another or double component.

Secondly, are you ONLY going to be watching Standard def DVD's on your S64 through your DVD player or do you also run HD content through either the antenna for OTA or cable, or are you going to feed it HD programming through another source. The reason is the SDTV is setup with different standards (BT.601 and SMPTE C or a different one for the color gamut vs the HD standards which are BT.709 for both the matrix and color gamut) as a result things will look off from that reason alone. (calibrating by eye for SD sources then noticing that colors are off when viewing HD content through the S64's HDMI or component connection.

Generally to get the skin tones you lower color till you aren't seeing everything too bright, this will desaturate all the colors btw. Then if red is still not looking right you can look into changing the tint. If that still doesn't work then you can also try lowering the red settings for Color detail. I also suggest you stick to Cinema with Contrast at around 80 or 85 and temperature at Warm2, also panel brightness at MId and AGC 0 Black extension 0, color gamut normal with gamma detail at 2.4 Everything else should be at defaults in the Pro menu. In the main menu you should have vivid off, cats off, video nr off and mpeg nr off. These suggestions are only if you are using the S64 as it is intended to watch HD content.
post #208 of 758
Hoping they restock this online soon.

Would prefer to get one at the store, as I have to return the 65" I did grab earlier.. but if not I'll order online and take the free delivery.
post #209 of 758
Same here. Was holding out for the tax free weekend in MA, and now it's out of stock. Serves me right.
post #210 of 758
A CostCo near me has 5 of the 50" S64 in stock....I might have to see if one of the parentals wouldn't mind going on an adventure tonight to pick it up (need the bigger car). I saw the S60 at Best Buy today and thought it looked phenomenal. The ABL doesn't seem to really phase me all that much, especially since I won't be seeing this TV with 10 other TVs nearby. The thing I've noticed on my parents' old TV is that if the screen was at full brightness with the brighter images, my eyes would probably hurt, haha. It's more than worth it for the smooth scrolling images I see in my games. Itching to see what Rayman Legends looks like on it.
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