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squeezing in to a new dedicated home theater - - Page 2

post #31 of 72
Every step you take will help and I'm not suggesting it is all or nothing. But, unless you do all the walls, ceiling and floor, address all the holes for electrical service/lighting (putty pads and backer boxes), isolate the HVAC and have a well sealed beefy door you won't achieve the level of isolation demanded by those with high standards.
post #32 of 72
Thread Starter 
while i appricate the need for high standards my goal is to soften the sound for the surrounding rooms...i am mot expecting isolation...as great as that would be. we are budgeting appx 15k for everything...to me that is a lot for one room....the seating, av equip, and riser and stage, as well as lighting all add up. i am ok with sound leaving the room but am trying to figure out what each thing is worth....will having 3 walls with sound proof drywall dampen the sound enough to be worth bothering if the forth, ceiling and floor are not done? will the r13 make a difference...knowing that the only sound dampening i will do is through the builder or maybe accoustical treatments which i know is more for inside the room. with a 420k house and 5 kids things like this need to be kept in check as there are a lot of things to keep in mind besides this room.
post #33 of 72
totally understand your perspective, It is a tough call to advise you on what you will get for the extra $1500. Certainly it will make a difference.
post #34 of 72
I am no expert but followed the good advice of fellow AVS members and John from Sound proofing company. First it is cheaper to just put 2 layers of 5/8” (fire rated) drywall on all four walls and the walls of the adjoining rooms as well as the ceiling. This will give you the mass you need but not the decoupling which it appears the contractor does not want to do. The R13 in all walls along with R 19 in the ceiling will help. Try to get putty pads for all wall receptacles both in the room and all adjoining rooms. Insure that no receptacles for adjoining rooms are in the same 16” on center stud space. Hope that makes sense. This is what we did for our in-law suite since it is next to the great room and it does make a huge difference.
post #35 of 72
Thread Starter 
so at this point i am doing r13 in the 4 walls. i will hold off on the dry wall. they came back at 2200 for sound proof dry wall on all 4 walls. i am now considering doing the 2nd layer my self. though i would rather not deal with it i will see how the room and adjacent rooms sound and go from there. i am not sure how the 4th wall doubled the price- they had quoted me $1100 for 3 walls...so i will wait and see what i think when it is built and speakers are installed then decide at that time.

on another note they said our lot will be leveled and prepared for construction next week...very happy about that. and i drew up some plans for the movie room riser and stage and have started looking at colors. the carpet will be a dark brown....
post #36 of 72
Sorry for late reply if you have any skills at all I would just acept the room as unfinished with no drywall at all and do the sound proffing your self. That way you can decouple and put 2 layers of DW with GG. At least have them put 5/8" up if you decide to let them do it.
post #37 of 72
I haven’t been around much lately or I would have jumped in here sooner. Our home was built 2 years ago using the "jumper" method for cold air returns as well. I hate it. Our room is 16x13 and heat is the number one issue with our room.

The following are the steps I have done to try to make it comfortable in our theater.

1) I highly recommend getting all electronics but the projector/tv out of the room . Invest in a RF remote like the Harmony 900.
2) Ceiling fan. The air movement makes a world of difference.
3) When we turn on the theater we also change the HVAC fan from auto to ON to force air into the Theater.
4) after sundown leave the door open to the theater and the game room lights off.

We have known from the start that we would only be in this house for 4-5 years so I am not investing the $$$ for a better solution.

Expect to be hot. Jumpers are crap. Look at an inline duct fan to pull more air out of the room. Start looking at mini-splits now. There are some that are no more intrusive to the room than an oversized ceiling vent. I understand that you will have to experience this for yourself like I have. A mini-split can be installed after you have moved in and experienced the heat of the room. Sorry to be a downer but I hope some of this helps.
post #38 of 72
the HVAC was turned on in the house Thursday and the theater room with the 4 supply’s and the cold air return was the coldest room on the upstairs unit. We were going to make some dust so I was blocking off the returns. As soon as I put my hand up there I could feel the air being sucked/pushed through them so splitting the single return into one on each side through the soffit really worked well.
post #39 of 72
Thread Starter 
I need to suscribe to my own thread so i dont miss everyones helpful info.

We are set on the jumper return as that is the only option with the builder so i will need to see what happens and adjust after the build.

Same with the walls...everything has to be in finished condition to pass inspection.i am ok with compromises. I am.just glad we will have it set up.

I just started using sketchup...what a great program. I need to figure out how to save as a jpg so i can share my room layout.

One question i do have is about the surrounds. I am looking to do a 7 or 7.5 deep riser, 12 in tall and 10 or 10.5 ft wide. Based in the seating numbers a row of 3 is 8.5-9 ft long depending on the chair and are 40" deep. With 2 rows of 3 how far from the back wall and side walls would you place them. And should they be facing each other or angled toward the front? Keep in mind these are in ceiling speakers and the room is 17 4 long by 12 6 wide. Ceiling is 10. I just want them in best possible spot since i cannot move them later.
post #40 of 72
Thread Starter 
here is the sketchup - it is not done but i need to solidify the speaker locations as they will be installed soon - i will post another one that shows the door, windows and stage later on - i think i have the LCR in good locations i just want to make sure the surrounds are are in the best spot since they are ceiling mounts. there will be about 2 feet on the right side of the chairs where the door is and on the other side has 2' 6" to gove me some buffer room in case my seats are a bit wider. the left side will be a small walkway to access that side of the stage - the riser will be 10' 6" wide, 12" tall and 7' deep to let me have them all recline - i could do 7 and a half but that will eat up more room and bring me that much closer - i am planning on a 16:9 106" screen. Any input would be great - mainly for the speakers at this point - thanks!!

post #41 of 72
Thread Starter 
i need to let them know placement today - i think that the surrounds will be 16" from the side walls and 4' 6" from the back - any suggestions if that is good or bad? i want the best for both rows with a focus on the front - i have 5 kids so all rows will be used but front is ideal seating.
post #42 of 72
Thread Starter 
Any thoughts?
post #43 of 72
Thread Starter 
ok so here is an updated sketchup showing all the details with the doors, stage and speaker (i did not add the 2 windows since i do not have the measurements but they will be on the left wall and blacked out/filled)- i am trying to split the difference on the surrounds as much as i can - my last HT had them on the ceiling just above the rear row (from previous owner) and they were not really that great for the front or back row - the front i could not really hear them and the back seemed a bit off so i am hoping that the position i have them in will work -

any thoughts? anything i should change? i wanted the riser deep enough for the chairs to recline out in both rows but did not leave much room to walk in between but that is not that important to me. i considered adding a step on the far left for the riser but i think it was spacemans build that mentioned that there was a small gap that he was concerned about between the seat and step - with 5 kids they can just climb up -

av equip needs to be in the room at the front. i am not willing to take up space anywhere else in the house (the adjacent bonus room) - my front wall will be very similar to my old ht with floating walls to block the equip and movies - it had a black fabric over the floating walls - it kept them light when sliding, let my remote work through it and i could not see the lights of the equip - any idea what material that would be and where i would get it? I will be building a wood frame and stapling the fabric to this. The determining factor in the size of the floating walls is my existing av rack - it is wider then most of what i am seeing on here but i bought it before i know much and it was not that inexpensive - so since i am using in the same way i did before it will work for my needs.

As for the screen i had a da lite 106" 16:9 in my last home- since i need a new one anyone have thoughts on carada? they seem to get a lot of talk on here and is about $300 less than the da lite - BW seems to get the higher praises - the da lite i had was a gray screen since my kids like to have some lights on when playing xbox - any reason i need that color or would a Brilliant white work from carada - projector will be the panny 8000 -

I will add an equip list later as well as color scheme and some pics of our house build -

post #44 of 72
Thread Starter 
Well I talked to the home systems company and they recommended to keep the surrounds near the back wall - i wish i had a better idea on this. I showed him my sketchup and that i had seen more people use the surrounds in between the rows to split the difference but he said that since they are in ceiling that i will be able to hear them in both rows without issue. I hope he is right but i am concerned about this since i cannot move them again without a lot of effort -
post #45 of 72
Thread Starter 
Here are a few pics of the build - we do not have basements here due to the water table and our first floors are always block due to hurricane codes - new homes are now required to have the attachments to add the hurricane covers over the windows and doors to seal the house up in the event of a storm making landfall - i like that feature -

so here is the foundation being laid -

the first floor blocks -

another view from the lanai looking at the pool bath on the other side (far right of the house)-

2nd floor added -

and with a roof!

the rooms are all framed and the hvac crew have been there for a few days- the roofers started on the shingles yesterday -

very excited - this is our 3rd home but the first as a new build so there is a lot to go though - luckily we had some options to customize a lot of the features and locations of doors and such - like i mentioned they do not decouple walls and double dry wall was a big expense so we just went with insulation on all 4 ht walls - due to budget i think that will be the extent of the sound treatments in the walls - our last ht did not even have a door and did not have added insulation so we will see how it compares :-) i can just keep the vol down when needed -

besides the HT build we will have a the largest yard in the community (chosen to accommodate all my kiddos) and the kids have asked me to build a real playhouse so that will be a lot of fun designing and building - and we are hoping to add a pool shortly after move in - a must when living in fl -

I will have a planned equipment list soon - nothing fancy but it will work well for our fam -
post #46 of 72
You want the rear seats off the rear wall if possible take a look at this thread a lot of good information
post #47 of 72
Hi. I am going through same scenario as you. Building, and getting far less than ideal scenario for media room. I started a thread early this morning. My room is very similar to yours, it is slightly wider, but I have an unfavorable door situation/location. Take a look and let me know what you think. Also, why is the front row only at 8.6 from screen? You have over 17 feet with a 7 foot platform, are your eyes on in your seating area for first row not as far back as possible?

My scenario:

post #48 of 72
Thread Starter 
i just did a quick measurement - i had 8' 7" typed in but just measured from a random spot in the middle of the seating to the screen but in the sketch up i had the screen a bit off the wall so it would be seen better - i think i am looking at about 9' to the screen but i am seeing some ideas on other threads that may work for my build with a shallow false wall to clean it up a bit so i may end up at about 8 feet viewing distance - if that is the case i may consider having the riser 6' 6" deep to compensate though i would rather not do that.

since my av equip will be in the room my original plan was to have the screen on the wall and have floating walls 25" out on each side to hide my equip and movies. but after seeing this post i am liking the crown molding with rope lighting and would like to try and make that work - if i do that i would still want the screen to be as far back as possible - maybe 21" or 22" off the wall so the gear will fit - but would need to ensure that i have access to get behind it when needed - then i can have the crown molding go around the room with a cleaner look - i would probably build the shelf for the movies and av equip to keep costs down and so that i can keep the size as trim as i can - looks would not matter just function since i would cover these areas with some fabric panels.

just some ideas i have been thinking about - i am trying to get as much of the measurements and designs done now so when i am moved in i can start the room with out delay -
post #49 of 72
I am new to all this, so I don't think I want to mess around with any kind of false wall or anything like that. Although I do like the idea of hiding speakers and equipment. I am going to wire my equipment out of the room. Especially after reading everyone talking about the heat issue. If you were not doing a false wall what type of speakers would you use? Are in wall bad? I like the look, but most seem to complain around here about them. I am not too fond of the stand speaker next to a huge beautiful screen, but it is probably what I will be doing. The wife hates it.

I have to decide on my build NOW. We have our final meeting with the builder tomorrow, and they have already started. I think I will keep the door as is, but try to get them to build small 6" step outside of room. That is a hallway there, but with a 6" inch step the stair depth should only need to be about 10" inches, and I think we are ok with that. if the builder will not do it, I will have them leave it and we will do it after.

I am wanting to do about a 120 inch screen with a 17'3" depth, and a 6-7' riser. I have sat in a 16:9 120" screen at around 9' and it did not bother me at all.

Now I need to decide on speaker wiring tonight. Difficult process.
post #50 of 72
Thread Starter 
I am using ceiling speakers. The paradigms have a 30 angle and are being installed by our builder. I decided on ceilings due to the room size, since i am keep my av eqiup and movies in the room and i have 5 kids...my last system had towers and i was fishing toys out if them too much. So the ceilings solved this.

Thank you for the link cw5billwade. That gives me something to consider not only for seat placement in the back row but i am now wanting to design in ways to add a 2nd pair of fronts on the floor and another pair if surrounds. Not something i will hook up or buy with my initial build but something that has the locations built in too add later.

I am not that handy but feel that i can take this on...
post #51 of 72
I got a lot from that I ran wires for 11.2 but will most likely only be doing 7.1 in the interim. Just the placement of the seating is the main issue for your shorter room the in ceilings will help with this I guess as they are directional from what you were saying. All my research indicated are a couch or chairs against the rear wall there is too much base and not very good surround as it will be going over your head. Also whatever you do, don’t put front row in the exact middle of the room as there will be a base null.
post #52 of 72
Thread Starter 
thanks for the input about the bass null - i did not know that - so i may need to scoot the riser back to 6 and a half - anyone else have thoughts on this? i really wanted to have both rows fully recline at the same time should the people want to - the ceilings can be rotated to aim at my listening position and they are already angled so that the sound comes to the viewer and not the floor - i like the idea of having the ceilings as they are a real space saver since my sides will be taken up - but i also like the idea of maybe adding a pairs of bookshelf speakers at the front just below the screen for and additional L and R - based my my ceiling position it would be reversing the locations from the diagram so i wonder if that would make a difference. i have some very basic ones that i could hook up to see if it is worth bothering.....but all of that would be something down the line - need to recoup the costs of the new house, theater, pool and kids playhouse before i get more theater money!

i went into the house today - took some pics and will post later - after using sketchup and finally standing in the room i need to make sure that every measurement is perfect - i have things designed so that everything i need fits in nice and snug and with the small room size i do not want to be off - i am really glad to have found sketch up as there is no way i would get this done correctly with out trial and error - this makes it a lot easier to digest, plan and build. when i am done with my tweaks on the theater i will use to design the playhouse -
post #53 of 72
Thread Starter 
Here are a few more pics of the house -

this is looking at the HT from the bonus room to get an idea on size - the riser is on the left near the doors and the stage and screen are on the right- the doors will swing out with the left on locked - this will givem e more room for the riser.

Here are to images of the a/c and return - i like how they positioned the a/c vent near the riser so that it will blow cool air on use and the projector that will be mounted in that area - the return is in the stage corner just above where the equipment will be housed so i am hoping that will help in sucking the heat out more efficiently. - not worried about heat in the winter since this is FL and there is not much of a winter to worry about.

one more angle of the HT

and just to show another part of the house - the living room looking down from the stairs.

Today they were working on the electrical - it is great watching the process of my home being built!
post #54 of 72
Thread Starter 
I have lots of pics i need to add! the house is looking great -

just one question about the pj mount. At my old house the mount was attached to a pole (maybe 12in long??) is this needed? based on my measurements does anyone know if i would need the extra length? I will be using the panny 8000 and am planning on a 106" 16:9 screen. ceiling height is 9ft. no tray ceiling. riser is planned to be appx 12" high. I want to make sure i buy the correct mount and would prefer not using the pole if it is not needed -

adding to the same line of question how far below the ceiling should the screen be mounted?

Edited by iamjason - 11/28/13 at 8:16pm
post #55 of 72
Thread Starter 
Ended up buying the panny 8000 yeaterday. They had a $550 rebate, $100 off and it came with 2 3d glasses and the panny streamer that gets bad reviews..i had planned on waiting but i knew this would be the new pj for me anyway so the rebate made it an easy decision. I also added a mustang mount that was free after rebate so as long as i do not need the pj lower i should be set..but if i do i am not out any money.
post #56 of 72
good choice you will love it We did nothing but watch movies this week. smile.gif My son came down from West VA and said no need to go to the theater anymore. Every time my son who lives here in GA wants to watch a movie it has to be in 3D. We just love our theater with the Panasonic AE-8000 and my DYI Seymour 125" wide AT 1.3 gain Center Stage screen. In 2D it is amazing biggrin.gif and 3D is like right there in your face. eek.gif I have a 17' throw and sit 10'6" for first row and 16' for second row. tongue.gif
post #57 of 72
Thread Starter 
I am looking forward to it - had the 4000 at our last house and loved it but it was negotiated with the sale of the house. I ended up canceling the order with pp and ordered it though b and h - with the $550 rebate, $200 off from b and h (pp was $100) and no sales tax (since pp is here in fl) i ended up saving close to a total of $900 - the extra stuff that pp offered was just fluff that i had no use for so i am quite happy -

here are some updated house pics - we have a closing of 12-23 and it is coming along nicely - landscaping and appliances should be in next week then we have the walk though the week after...and my rate is a bit lower than expected to that is an added bonus!


home theater - doors waiting install - need to figure out how to block the windows - i am thinking the one near the screen wall will be filled and have an acoustic panel over it with a matching one across the room and the other window will have a slumber shade in case we want light in there.....

like i mentioned all speakers are ceiling mounted - the first pic is the back of the room with the surrounds, ac vent and the plug and ceiling tube for the projector. the second pic is showing where the front r speaker is with the air return near it - i have some design ideas to make it all work to my advantage. based on my space i am really liking the ceiling speakers but will see what it sounds like shortly after i move in....they sounded great in the showroom so i hope that translates well in my home.

kitchen -

love the backyard - with 5 kiddos we needed the big yard!

front of the house with most of the stone work completed - they are measuring the hurricane shutters (that is what is over the windows) - that is now a requirement for new builds here in fl.

Edited by iamjason - 12/7/13 at 8:27am
post #58 of 72
beautiful home
post #59 of 72
You never even had to mention you were in florida....fellow froridian here. Built my home four years ago, your pictures seem like just yesterday for me. where in florida are you ? I can add that i too have the saddle return and it is awful. The room is the end of the a/c run too, just hotter then hell when watching a movie and the whole family is in the room. HAVE FUN!
post #60 of 72
Thread Starter 
i am just outside of tampa - it is fun documenting the house progress - for the ht i am hoping that with the return above the av rack and the vent near the pj that the heat will move out of the room.....but i will have to wait and see what happens - in our last house the ht was the coldest room but it was a different setup -

i stopped by today and they were putting in all the lights, wall plates and fixtures.....13 days till closing!
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