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IFA BERLIN 2013 : Gossip and live report from Germany

post #1 of 241
Thread Starter 
I will cover the IFA show in Berlin as every year. Before the official opening I will post all gossip and news here on avsforum and also here :

http://www.projection-homecinema.fr/?p=1772&preview=true
post #2 of 241
Thread Starter 
ACER, EPSON, JVC, LG, SIM2 and SONY will be there. Panasonic as well but we will discover if this major Brand has really left the homecinema projector market.
post #3 of 241
Thread Starter 
The next génération of the HW50 will be called HW55ES.
Edited by kraine - 7/17/13 at 2:47am
post #4 of 241
Since Sony already had a model called VPL-VW100 (no ES) back about 4 years ago, I doubt the new, lower priced, 4K projector will actually be called the VPL-VW100ES as this could cause some confusion.
post #5 of 241
Thread Starter 
Maybe that will be the HW100 like the HW50 (sony has already an VW50 before).
post #6 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by kraine View Post

Maybe that will be the HW100 like the HW50 (sony has already an VW50 before).

That certainly sounds possible. By the way which area of France do you call alpha 0,0. I used to travel to Toulouse frequently and Paris on occassion before I retired.
post #7 of 241
Thread Starter 
The new entry model from SONY will also have a wiredless 1080p 2D 3D transmission.
Edited by kraine - 7/17/13 at 2:48am
post #8 of 241
I wasn't there but at infocoom They had a special viewing for upcoming stuff. It is all under NDA so nothing really to report.
post #9 of 241
Thread Starter 
post #10 of 241
Any word on the Benq w7500? Is Benq there?
post #11 of 241
The show is not now. What was announced was the Sony 55 being debuted at the Berlin show. I think the show is the first week in September or right around there. Look for more announcements as the show in Berlin gets closer. smile.gif


Maybe you meant will Benq be there? Benq doesn't show at Cedia. I don't know if they show at Berlin.
post #12 of 241
Thread Starter 
post #13 of 241
About what most expected from jvc this fall. Too bad the new standard is not finalized yet. Unless they have some type of upgrade plan, I will be waiting until next fall
post #14 of 241
^^^ Same here.
post #15 of 241

Thanks for the link. Any idea whether this will be a 3D projector, and if so, I wonder if it'll take advantage of the technology discussed a few years ago here: http://global.epson.com/newsroom/2011/news_20110901.html
post #16 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Thanks for the link. Any idea whether this will be a 3D projector, and if so, I wonder if it'll take advantage of the technology discussed a few years ago here: http://global.epson.com/newsroom/2011/news_20110901.html

Not in the R models above. They are a form of LCOS and the technology you linked to is for LCD.
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post #17 of 241
Below is the link to Epson's original press release (from 2010) about producing reflected LCD display chips. I saw a prototype projector demo'ed at CEDIA in Sept. 2011, but they subsequently ran into manufacturing issues, with very low yield rates on the reflective LCD chips, that resulted in Epson putting this technology on the back burner. Also there was speculation that they needed to improve the response time of the chips in order to be able to support 3D. Perhaps they have now got a new generation of the technology ready and have finally figured out how to mass produce these display chips at a cost competitive with JVC's and Sony's LCoS chips.

http://global.epson.com/newsroom/2010/news_20100831.html
post #18 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Not in the R models above. They are a form of LCOS and the technology you linked to is for LCD.

Oh, I see. Thanks. I was getting these mixed up.

Is the LCOS R4000 model going to support 3D? There was no mention of it in his presentation, and I would think that its something they would have touched on.
post #19 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Oh, I see. Thanks. I was getting these mixed up.

Is the LCOS R4000 model going to support 3D? There was no mention of it in his presentation, and I would think that its something they would have touched on.

I'm sure they can implicate 3D with no problems. When they were first announced, 3D was basically new to 1080p projectors
post #20 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

I'm sure they can implicate 3D with no problems. When they were first announced, 3D was basically new to 1080p projectors

Hopefully it does do 3D, because otherwise that's a showstopper for me. The reason why I'm even wondering about it is because from what I recall one of the pjs they were introducing with transmissive technology a year or so ago (perhaps it was the LCD version) was said NOT to support 3D - which was a surprise to me that they'd even bring a new pj to market (even in 2012) without 3D. I don't think that pj made it to market, however.

Assuming the R4000 does do 3D, I wonder if it will do a very good job as far as no ghosting is concerned. The presenter talks about how fast the panels are, so that seems promising. Although I don't know he said what the refresh rate is.

Perhaps I missed it, but do we know what the MSRP of the unit will be?

Also do you think this will have an auto iris? I know some folks love them and some don't. I'm a big fan of an auto iris (I love my Sony VW95) and am in the camp that says that combining the native on/off CR of the JVC with an auto iris would be a great combination. I know Epson is well known for their auto iris in recent models so I wonder if they'll also have it on this one?
post #21 of 241
Press day at the show is Sept. 4. floor opens Sept. 5. I think we are going to have to wait till around then to get many answers. I think this projector will be very price sensitive probably costing a large premium over the normal Epson HT stuff and probably being marketed and sold in only the 6000 channels and not the 5000 channels. The big issue for me is I doubt it will be 4K. I would not buy projector unless it was 4K at this point but that's me and I am sure many feel otherwise. When Epson should this chip technology a few years back on the projector it never brought to market there was mucho hype and great chatter here about it. Frankly, seeing it at.cedia it looked like a good 1080p projector but nothing that was a level above the competition. Of course show conditions do not make for a high reliability observation since limited content presentation and no ability to a/b with the competition.
post #22 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Hopefully it does do 3D, because otherwise that's a showstopper for me. The reason why I'm even wondering about it is because from what I recall one of the pjs they were introducing with transmissive technology a year or so ago (perhaps it was the LCD version) was said NOT to support 3D - which was a surprise to me that they'd even bring a new pj to market (even in 2012) without 3D. I don't think that pj made it to market, however.

Assuming the R4000 does do 3D, I wonder if it will do a very good job as far as no ghosting is concerned. The presenter talks about how fast the panels are, so that seems promising. Although I don't know he said what the refresh rate is.

Perhaps I missed it, but do we know what the MSRP of the unit will be?

Also do you think this will have an auto iris? I know some folks love them and some don't. I'm a big fan of an auto iris (I love my Sony VW95) and am in the camp that says that combining the native on/off CR of the JVC with an auto iris would be a great combination. I know Epson is well known for their auto iris in recent models so I wonder if they'll also have it on this one?

The prototype Reflective LCD projector they demo'ed at CEDIA two years ago did have an dynamic iris. The model they were demoing was a prototype for the higher-end model 61000. My comments from that demo were include in my blog from the show - HERE
post #23 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

The prototype Reflective LCD projector they demo'ed at CEDIA two years ago did have an dynamic iris. The model they were demoing was a prototype for the higher-end model 61000. My comments from that demo were include in my blog from the show - HERE

Thanks Ron. That unit did not have 3D right? Hopefully the R4000 will have 3D, and also have an auto iris.
post #24 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Thanks Ron. That unit did not have 3D right? Hopefully the R4000 will have 3D, and also have an auto iris.

That unit did not support 3D and there was some indication that the LCD Reflective chips, at that point in their development, were not fast enough to be used in a 3D projector. Also the estimated retail price (as to Sept. 2011) was near $5K for a unit similar to what was being shown at that year's CEDIA Expo, Clearly Epson's target was the JVC DILA projectors, but at that same show JVC announced E-shift and they already had been selling projectors with 3D for a year. So I suspect Epson pulled back on their own new LCD reflective projectors because of both low yields in producing the chips and a need to improve the performance (e.g., better response time) and features (e.g., 3D support) of their projectors before going into mass productions.

Who knows, perhaps we will see the introduction of a LCD reflective 4K UHD projector, if not this year then perhaps next.


.
Edited by Ron Jones - 7/20/13 at 5:52am
post #25 of 241
Good morning. Wasn't a 4K 4HD LCD reflective projector introduced a few months short of two years ago? I think it was and is called the Sony VPL-vw1000ES? smile.gif.
post #26 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Good morning. Wasn't a 4K 4HD LCD reflective projector introduced a few months short of two years ago? I think it was and is called the Sony VPL-vw1000ES? smile.gif.

Just another flavor of LCoS. Just speculating that JVC might not be the only 4K LCoS game in town for 2014 (or 2015) to go up against Sony.
post #27 of 241
I think we will see Red demonstrate a coming soon (insider joke) 4K reflective LVD projector with built in Redray player and (my guess) a laser stimulated phosphor light source, factory direct for arounsd $10 to $15K at Cedia. Coming soon meams maybe we will ship it within 6 months, maybe a few, quantity shipping within a year.

JVC will have a 4K projector in my opinion, for MSRP $12,000 and it will street for a lot lot less preorder.

There maybe 2 more 4K projector surprises But the lowest price 4K machine will still cost street price $7 to $8K.
Edited by mark haflich - 7/21/13 at 7:48am
post #28 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I think we will see Red demonstrate a coming soon (insider joke) 4K reflective LVD projector with built in Redray player and (my guess) a laser stimulated phosphor light source, factor direct for arounsd %10 to $15K at Cedia. coming soon meams maybe we will ship it within 6 months, maybe a few, quantity shipping within a year.

JVC will have a 4K projector in my opinion, for MSRP $12,000 and it will street for a lot lot less preorder.

There maybe 2 more 4K projector surprises But the lowest price 4K machine will still cost street price $7 to $8K.

Hopefully you are right
post #29 of 241
I think if JVC would really shake things up and make their mark if their top one was native 4K plus had e-shift for quasi 8K and the next one or two down were native 4K and their entry one or two were all e shift 4K.
post #30 of 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kris Deering View Post

I think if JVC would really shake things up and make their mark if their top one was native 4K plus had e-shift for quasi 8K and the next one or two down were native 4K and their entry one or two were all e shift 4K.

I would think they would do this for next fall but I wouldn't be surprised if it happens this fall
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