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A 3 way 99db multi configurable SEOS design - Page 6

post #151 of 696
Isn't the sensitivity of the TMW version 3dB lower because there is half the woofer Sd?
post #152 of 696
Thread Starter 
Yup.
post #153 of 696
However, unless I am mistaken, the TMW can have less than full bafflestep compensation, where the TMWW 3.5 will have full and will need a good amount of wall spacing.
post #154 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtg90 View Post

Isn't the sensitivity of the TMW version 3dB lower because there is half the woofer Sd?

Another reason I enjoy having my parasound amp. If I decide to change my speakers It doesn't matter if the are 85-99 db sensitive . How doed the sound differ versus the double woofer ? Is it say 90% similar ?
post #155 of 696
Thread Starter 
Ya, it just has less low end grunt. And to be honest, its not even noticeable. I wasn't expecting the same XO to work. It's a total fluke. But I still may change things. That's just where I am now.

They seem like they're more than 90% similar. I previously stated the extra woofer cost of the WTMW was well worth it. Now considering the smaller size, now its a toss up. I'd still take the extra woofer, but if I wanted more WAF and save a few bucks, I wouldn't feel shorted going with the 10A.
post #156 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

Ya, it just has less low end grunt. And to be honest, its not even noticeable. I wasn't expecting the same XO to work. It's a total fluke. But I still may change things. That's just where I am now. They seem like they're more than 90% similar. I previously stated the extra woofer cost of the WTMW was well worth it. Now considering the smaller size, now its a toss up. I'd still take the extra woofer, but if I wanted more WAF and save a few bucks, I wouldn't feel shorted going with the 10A.

Less building , less finishing and very close to same performance . If I put my tv on the wall I could put the center version standing up as well . Nice to have a choice .
post #157 of 696
Estimate on when we can buy it ? A month , three months ....
post #158 of 696
Production is going right now for the waveguides. I was told they're going to be done in a couple weeks, then shipped here. So hopefully less than 2 months.
post #159 of 696
Man...



Can we please hurry the fck up!
I could only hold it for so long!

Thank you for understanding!
post #160 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freniata View Post

Man...

Can we please hurry the fck up!
I could only hold it for so long!

Thank you for understanding!

Have you preordered the SEOS-10?
post #161 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erich H View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freniata View Post

Man...

Can we please hurry the fck up!
I could only hold it for so long!

Thank you for understanding!

Have you preordered the SEOS-10?

ok major confused now.
I thought I can just order a kit when available.
Kit = Everything needed except assembly

Will the TUX-1099 be available in a kit form? (Again everything included (all speakers, crossover, flat pack, etc...) EXCEPT assembly)
That's what I'd like...is this possible?

I wouldn't want to order everything separately as that would be very discouraging and I probably wouldn't bother. sorry
post #162 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freniata View Post

ok major confused now.
I thought I can just order a kit when available.
Kit = Everything needed except assembly

Will the TUX-1099 be available in a kit form? (Again everything included (all speakers, crossover, flat pack, etc...) EXCEPT assembly)
That's what I'd like...is this possible?

I wouldn't want to order everything separately as that would be very discouraging and I probably wouldn't bother. sorry
The SEOS-10 waveguide mentioned is only just now starting to be manufactured in bulk. Tux's speaker-in-development seems to be using a pricey fiberglass waveguide shipped in from Autotech in Poland. The first people who may be in a position to build this speaker are going to be the ones who pre-ordered the plastic waveguide, which will be available in a month or two. A complete kit would be up to Erich and Tux, and would also involve more preparations including having the baffles and cabinets fully designed and manufactured by the CNC shop. Patience is required at this point.
post #163 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freniata View Post

ok major confused now.
I thought I can just order a kit when available.
Kit = Everything needed except assembly

Will the TUX-1099 be available in a kit form? (Again everything included (all speakers, crossover, flat pack, etc...) EXCEPT assembly)
That's what I'd like...is this possible?

I wouldn't want to order everything separately as that would be very discouraging and I probably wouldn't bother. sorry

Yes, a kit will be available, but there's a preorder going on right now for the SEOS-10 and SEOS-15 made in plastic to help cover the initial costs. It's a big community effort, which is how everything got done with the SEOS-12. You need to go back and read that big thread. smile.gif

You said "Can we hurry the fck up". You might not know that all of this is being done because the DIY community is working together to get it done. The designers do the speaker work to help out. I'm doing what I can to get the waveguides made up. People preorder to help get it done, or done quicker.

Getting injection molds carved and plastic parts made costs tens of thousands of dollars. The SEOS-12 was over $25,000 when prototypes and everything else was added up. But there were a couple hundred pre-orders from other forum members to help cover part of the initial costs and get them produced quicker.

One reason the current SEOS-10 and SEOS-15 waveguides are taking a little longer is because the cost was quite high and the pre-orders aren't as high as they were with the SEOS-12. That was expected simply because the 12" is the average size. Plus the newer guys on the forum don't realize how all of this is being funded, or the costs involved. So if you want things to move faster, preordering to help with the initial costs makes sense. wink.gif


Parts Express is nice enough to give discounts on components used in the speakers that the designers come up with. I use that discount to help cover the 'free shipping' on the kits, packaging material, and Paypal fees, then package things up in my spare time. But even after the waveguides get here, think about the extra costs. I order enough parts for 10 speakers for each design. If a speaker costs $200 - $300 each, you can see how much that is. Now multiply that by 20 different designs. Then figure in flat packs for some of the designs.

Most guys here know that I actually run a landscaping company in Ohio and had extra storage space to help keep all this stuff. If this gets much bigger, I will eventually have to hire some help and those costs will need to be added in to still break even. I don't think anyone would mind, but the decision hasn't been made yet.
post #164 of 696
Quote:
So if you want things to move faster, preordering to help with the initial costs makes sense.
Great! On the web site I can only preorder the SEOS-10, but I would like to instead preorder one complete center MTM kit (including flat pack) and am willing to submit payment right now, regardless of how long it will take. Just let me know how much it will cost and I will get the money to you ASAP in order to help with the funds needed for the waveguide preorder.
post #165 of 696
On the kits, you can indicate that you already have the SEOS horn and not have to pay for it. ..so pre-order now and get kit (without SEOS) when ready smile.gif
post #166 of 696
Quote:
On the kits, you can indicate that you already have the SEOS horn and not have to pay for it. ..so pre-order now and get kit (without SEOS) when ready
I know, but I want to send more money than just the price of the SEOS-10 in order to help out....wink.gif
post #167 of 696
Thread Starter 
well im happy people are pumped about this design smile.gif Unfortunately there was a delay because of a change in the seos 15. Ill take your money though biggrin.gif Just kidding, Erich takes the money. It'll happen soon. Full kits. Erich is in deep, so its slower than a full blown for profit company can make things happen.
post #168 of 696
Tux and Erich,

My apologies to you both!
I was only trying to be being funny when I said I wanted it now!
I do but am willing to wait for the complete package when available.
I'm too lazy and uninformed to know what to order and where.
I need it the simplest way possible...that's all.

Thanks for understanding


Erich...no I did not know about the SEOS stuff...sorry
post #169 of 696
Thread Starter 
No problem dude. I knew you were kidding around. I think Erich was just trying to explain why it's a slow go smile.gif
post #170 of 696
well, I think I'll be following suit and pre-ordering a trio of the seos 10s for an eventual LRC. Now, I just need the TM designed. Chop chop, tux! :P (j/k)

Technical question: How do the nulls manifest with the T to MM transition. The arrangement is a bit different than typical and wasn't sure the consequences of doing such.
post #171 of 696
Thread Starter 
You mean by reversing polarity, moving horizontally, or moving vertically? Polarity is the same. Vertically it's a taller window/lobe. Horizontally is a little more difficult to explain. I have measurements of it somewhere on my computer. They start to cancel really abruptly.
post #172 of 696
I'm just trying to mentally map 3D radiation pattern at and near the crossover point under normal operation.
post #173 of 696
Thread Starter 
I see. The first polar in post one shows you what it'll look like horizontally. I didnt measure the vertical in any detail, but I know the nulls will be around 35 or 40 degrees above and below axis.
post #174 of 696
Hey tux ,
Any chance you could bring your 3 way speakers to this ?

Hi Folks!

First I would like to thank Bob with Creative Sound Solutions for telling me about this forum and inviting me to post our event here.

There will be an audio fair and swap meet at the Cultus Lake Community Hall, 4220 Columbia Valley Highway, Cultus Lake, BC on Sunday, September 29th from 10AM to 4 PM.

CSS (Creative Sound Solutions) is a sponsor of the event.

The focus will be on good DIY and commercial gear, vinyl, CD's, speakers parts and cables.

If you are bringing gear as a user, we would like to know as we need to coordinate efforts to keep things tidy and not an acoustic mess with several systems playing at once.

There will be one showcase area where you can choose an amplifier, preamp, speakers, etc. If you have music on CD or vinyl, you may bring it.

Admission is free (but feel free to donate).

As I cannot yet post links or email addresses, pics of the hall and directions can be found by Googling "Cultus Lake Community Hall"

There are accommodations for out of town folk in the form of local hotels, motels and cabins.

Coffee and tea will be provided by donation and we're working on getting a food cart to attend.

More info to come as available.

Please post questions and we will be able to get back to you as soon as possible.

Cheers!

EDIT by Mike P.

Pics of the hall can be found here:
Facilities

Questions and/or vendor inquiries can be sent to:
info@classicsound.ca
or
classicvalve@gmail.com

They are full for vendors but anyone who brings there diy speakers are welcome to hook them up for people to hear.. this thread is from hometheatreshack.

I am going , should be good.
post #175 of 696
Thread Starter 
Ya I saw that and would like to go, but I can't make it. Have fun there.
post #176 of 696
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuxedocivic View Post

Ya I saw that and would like to go, but I can't make it. Have fun there.

Crap ! Hoping to hear those bad boys. Well after a few beers most speakers sound good.
post #177 of 696
Thread Starter 
Single woofer version



TM speaker (SEOS10/DNA205/Delta10A)



I should have cut off my graph higher up on that one, but wasn't paying attention. Also, that's the padding I landed on while listening, but the tweeter level does look high, so I'll try a couple things. It does look worse than it is though cause the graph should be cut off at 200hz.

This theatre package is nearly in the bag. Kind of relieved and kind of sad. I've been working on it a long time. Very fun and very nice speakers. But I do need to clean up my personal system a little, so that's welcomed smile.gif Time to install these permanently biggrin.gif
post #178 of 696
I have a large space under my 82" Mitsubishi. The size of this of 40-12-12; if I have the ability to go larger on the depth to say 15" or 16" deep, would I be able to tune it to dig deeper?
post #179 of 696
Thread Starter 
Probably a little bit, but not a tremendous amount. You could use the tuning I have and bring up the output a bit.
post #180 of 696
Cool. If that's the case then I'll just go with a flat pack. If I could gain a sizable amount (20 hz deeper or more output) by going 1 or 2 cu ft more, I'd do it.
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