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New front stage, new to DIY

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 
Hello all,

I'm relatively familiar with HT and Mobile audio, I have recently dipped my toes into the DIY (though thusfar, DIY for me has been DIFM). Mainly due to tools, time, space, patience, hauling materials, patience and time.

My recent setup was Pioneer VSX-1015tx, eD 6t6 towers, eD MTM6 center, Dayton surrounds and a Klipsch RW-12.

Almost a year ago I had someone more involved with DIY build me a 28" BFM Tuba HT (Dayton DVC 385-88 loaded) and I have since added that to my system, i'm currently running that off a Crown Xti2002. LPF @ 18hz HPF @ 78hz.

I recently moved into a large loft so i've added all the audio equipment that i've had all of the years to fill the huge space I now have. I'm doing something I have heard is a no-no, but to my ears and cheapo dB meter, it's louder, so i'm running it for the time being. I split the subwoofer signal at the receiver, one running to the Klipsch, other running to a mixer (voltage output of the receiver is way low for the Crown to drive beyond low listening with every gain cranked) that runs to the Crown which is running my THT and a 2.2 cu^3 Adire Tempest @ 28hz. So I essentially have 3 low end sources at the moment, I have used that to my advantage by placing the THT and Tempest stacked in the front corner, and the Klipsch in the opposing corner which helped eliminate the most significant dead spot in the room. I'm also now running Infinity Beta 60's as my rears/5 channel stereo. I am also now using a Denon AVR-1909.

I'm looking to get past the, what I assume, is a bit of a cluster and unnecessary bottom end configuration. As well as upgrade my front stage in the same swing.

I'm in a pickle and trying to decide what to do here. My current idea is to add a pair of small sized horns focused more on the 40-150hz range, and a pair modest sized cinema speakers to stack and hoping that's feasible as a true full range speaker. (Something like an Autotuba and the DIY Karma-12) for some reason, I like the idea of having a small set of horns up front and still having the big guy in the corner

Or would I be better pressed to do something like a dual woofer version of the Karma's? (hope i'm not leaking info here, but I heard they had some designs of these in the works)


A few other minor questions I have are

...is there a true reason to it being "bad" to mix horns in conjunction with ported enclosures, or even sealed? Is there a non book length to this question?

I've picked up that there is ALWAYS a common answer to this question, but im going to ask anyway, SWAPPING THE SPEAKER IN THE THT... as loud as it is, I want more. As I understand, the crucial parameters in a horn is fs and qts. So I ask you, Dayton DVC vs. SI HT 15", viable option to switch them out for the extra extension that the SI offers?

I have included the driver in question, along with 2 of Bills current recommended drivers
T/s SI DVC Tempest
Re 3.7 2.8 3.5
Fs 18.5 19 18.8
Qes 0.37 0.38 0.4
Qms 6.3 8.66 6.7
Qts 0.35 0.36 0.39
Le 3.5 1.82 2.9
Sd 804.5 829.6 779
Vas 220 232.2 317
BL 18.9 16 14.2
MMS 309 297.1 195
CMS: 0.239 0.24
SPL 87.4 90 89.1
Xmax 22.5 15.1 16.4

Thanks in advance for all your responses
Edited by DesmoBanana - 7/3/13 at 1:31pm
post #2 of 8
Email Bill. He can tell you what drivers are best suited to the horn he designed.
post #3 of 8
Originally Posted by DesmoBanana View Post

I'm also now running Infinity Beta 60's as my rears/5 channel stereo.

What are those?
post #4 of 8
Ok, as far as the speakers are concerned, for your left+center+right, I would recommend any of the Seos designs as they are high efficiency and should be able to fill that large room just fine. I am not exactly sure what the best Seos kit would be, thats up to you as you have several to pick from, but rest easy knowing that all of the ones with the Seos-12+DNA-360 will perform very well.

As for the woofers, I would sell your Klipsch RW-12 and that also sale that Adire Tempest 12" sub as well. Take the money that you make off of those and either buy two of the Dayton HO18;s or a pair of Stereo Integrity 18's and build some ported enclosures with what ever your desired tune may be, (if it were me, I would shoot for a 16hz tune).

Another thing that might be holding your back in a big sort of way is that you stated that you have your THT low passed at 18hz and the high pass at 78hz. That is all wrong as the high pass filter is what prevents lower frequencies from being sent to the driver and the low pass filter is what keeps the driver from going above and beyond on the top end. I am not all that familiar with the THT and what its ideal high pass filter would be, but I have always been under the impression that the THT should be high passed above 20hz, but I could also be wrong about that. Another issue that you might be having, is the Adire sub and the THT running off of the same amp with identical filters for both the high pass and low pass? This isn't good, as they are two completely different beast, and need to be properly setup if you want to get the best overall performance.

That Crown XTI amp is a great amp, keep that and buy some of the Dayton or SI 18's!
post #5 of 8
Thread Starter 
Beta 60's are tower speakers, they we're mine, I sold them to a friend, and now were roommates. So now we're using them as the rears, as well as turning the amplifier to 5 channel stereo for music/while entertaining guests.

I typed that wrong, LPF is 78, HPF is 18.

The ported Tempest I have set differently, 120 and 35, respectively.
post #6 of 8
Go for a SEOS design from diysoundgroup.com
post #7 of 8
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

I have always been under the impression that the THT should be high passed above 20hz, but I could also be wrong about that. !
THT does not require high passing, as excursion peaks at 22Hz, dropping below that.
I'm in a pickle and trying to decide what to do here.
Add a second THT for room mode smoothing, get rid of the rest. Mixing different subs offers no advantages, while greatly complicating the amp and processing requirements.
post #8 of 8
I agree with Bill about mixing different subs. Adding a second THT would most likely help with your desire to have better bass. If it were me, and if I had the funds, I would build two Dayton HO18's or two Stereo Integrity 18D's, sell those 12;s and that Klipsch to fund the two Dayton or SI 18 builds. I would be so envious if you had duel Dayton HO18's with a THT, or better yet, duel Dayton HO18's with duel THT's, all powered by your Crown XTI amp. That would be a killer setup!
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