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Channel Master DVR+ Owners Thread - Page 10

post #271 of 3061
Quote:
My theory is that these companies use USB HDDs for simplicity. Joe Sixpack knows what a USB cable and port look like and doesn't have trouble connecting the two
I understand this, but there should be the ability to add an internal drive through a sliding type mount like the Divico has. Actually that option is available with PC's a front mounted add on for a removable HDD.
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That's also my theory behind why S-Video died (aside from its only marginal improvement in quality over composite): the cable can only be inserted one way and is easily damaged when misused,
That was not the only poor connector made. wink.gif

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I saw a reference on CM website about being able to mount this to the back of flat panel displays
Very limited benefit to a very limited amount of users. rolleyes.gif
post #272 of 3061
.[/quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiscojim View Post

If you'd looked at the Channel Master page you would have seen the external drive in the pictures.

http://www.channelmasterstore.com/v/vspfiles/assets/images/Specs_750x250.jpg

and

http://www.channelmasterstore.com/v/vspfiles/assets/images/acc750x200.jpg

Here are the three drives they recommended on the sale page "Seagate Models, STCD500102, STBU1000100, and STCA300010".

I'd shop around for them, and not buy from Channel Master. For example they want $159.99 for the 3-TB drive,that you can buy directly from Seagate for $119.99.

http://www.channelmasterstore.com/CM_7500_compatible_Seagate_Backup_Plus_1_TB_USB_3_p/stca3000101.htm

http://www.seagate.com/external-hard-drives/desktop-hard-drives/backup-plus-desk/?sku=STCA3000101

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Thanks for the info. This may look like a stupid question, but I really don't know about external hard drives. Would there be any special formatting that comes from CM in order to save programs on the external unit?

Also, do we have any assurance that Rovi won't pull its program from this unit the way they did with the Pal/CM? Because really, the programming is the only reason I would consider spending $400 on something I already have.
post #273 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by ko220 View Post

Thanks for the info. This may look like a stupid question, but I really don't know about external hard drives. Would there be any special formatting that comes from CM in order to save programs on the external unit?

Also, do we have any assurance that Rovi won't pull its program from this unit the way they did with the Pal/CM? Because really, the programming is the only reason I would consider spending $400 on something I already have.

The drive setups are most likely just plug and play.

No guarantee on the program guide. And how could there be? Clearly it's beyond Channel Master's control.

See http://www.channelmasterstore.com/DVR_p/cm-7500gb16.htm?Click=32508 Footnote 5: "Availability of guide data is not controlled by Channel Master and is subject to change without notice."

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post #274 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

I understand this, but there should be the ability to add an internal drive through a sliding type mount like the Divico has. Actually that option is available with PC's a front mounted add on for a removable HDD.
Provision for an internal HDD would add to the cost and destroy the form factor of thin, light box with no heat problems. The box was designed to be hidden. It can easily be mounted vertically behind a flat panel with little more than Velcro tape. One of the options is an IR extender for peaking around the back of the display.
Quote:
Very limited benefit to a very limited amount of users.
I can say exactly the same thing about provision for a user insert-able internal HDD.
post #275 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by ko220 View Post

I really don't know about external hard drives. Would there be any special formatting that comes from CM in order to save programs on the external unit?
The drive is formatted to ExtFS as soon as you plug it into the CM-7500. You can use a small 1TB WD USB-powered drive that you can get for $60 of so if you shop around.
post #276 of 3061
I haven't looked at the manual, but I hope they provide discrete on & off IR codes.
post #277 of 3061
Hey All, I have been monitoring this thread for a while, pretty much since I found out CM was going to release a new DVR a couple months ago. But I finally decided I wanted to participate in the discussion.

I have to say I am a little disappointed with the DVR+, the 2 must haves I really wanted was a Free Guide, which they nailed with the help of Rovi and at least 4 tuners… which they fell flat here and offered what has been offered in most DVRs in the past 5 years. Having 2 tuners is not the future but the past. Not that I would use 4 tuners often but I have had a need for 3 tuners a whole lot. I have been doing a lot of research and most DVRs on the market offers 2 tuners, except TIVO. Which I really don’t want to pay their ridiculous price of $500 for lifetime service (I don’t want to pay any monthly fee so the$15 monthly fee is not an option), but they are the only game in town offering 4 tuners. Also what is the point of creating a DVR that can’t do what it was meant to do without making additional purchases? CM could have at least included a 500GB hard drive in the thing, it defeats the purpose to have such a slim unit if you have to add additional storage to the unit… just to use it, this slim design is nice but pointless when having to add external storage. I would have taken a bulky unit as long as it had internal storage.

I guess my real question besides the rant above is do you think CM will release a higher end model with 4 tuners and external storage? If not I think I will just bite the bullet and buy the TIVO Roamio. I have been waiting for the announcement of the DVR+ and was expecting 4 tuners, but this 2 tuner device is a real disappointment. I don’t know how much longer I can wait for CM to cater to those who are not novices in the DVR game; I am willing to pay for a good device… just not TIVO prices.
post #278 of 3061
Thread rolled back to the most recent on-topic post.

Let's stick to discussions regarding the CM products from here on out. TiVo products have their own threads. Thanks.
post #279 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmn1 View Post

Don't hold me to this but I seem to remember that it takes about 8GB to store one hour of HD content on one of the other brands of DVR. It would stand to reason that the space requirement is most likely about the same. smile.gif

A CBS O&O (KCNC Denver in my case) takes 7.5 GB per hour of programming on my iView 3500STB. On the other hand the 720p CW coming from KXTU, which runs two 720p signals (CW and Mundo Fox) is only 3.5 GB per hour of programming. KKTV, which is the CBS affiliate for Colorado Springs drops the file size to under 7 GB per hour (they have a SD dot 2 station). The file size will always depend on the bit rate the broadcaster chooses to use with CBS O&Os being the highest.
post #280 of 3061
i"m wondering is there any recording speed options?
post #281 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickinct View Post

i"m wondering is there any recording speed options?
You are thinking of DVD recorder technology which re-encodes everything that comes into the box. A digital DVR has no encoders and simply spools the untouched broadcast transport stream as it comes in. That's why playback is identical to the original. The bitrate of the broadcast, hence the size of the file, depends on the broadcaster.
post #282 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post


You are thinking of DVD recorder technology which re-encodes everything that comes into the box. A digital DVR has no encoders and simply spools the untouched broadcast transport stream as it comes in. That's why playback is identical to the original. The bitrate of the broadcast, hence the size of the file, depends on the broadcaster.

 

Not always the case. As an example Simple.tv states...

 

Storage use

1.5GBytes/hour - adjustable

https://www.simple.tv/faq

post #283 of 3061
Simple.TV is an autonomous capture card, not a DVR. The difference between Simple.TV and a Hauppauge card is that Simple.TV doesn't need PVR software to make its recordings. Simple.TV is closer to the HD HomeRun than a DVR, as it also has no video outputs: it communicates with a display device over your network.
post #284 of 3061
Quote:
Provision for an internal HDD would add to the cost and destroy the form factor of thin, light box with no heat problems. The box was designed to be hidden.
Little cost increase, well worth it.
Who cares about a "thin form factor". This isn't one of those portable electronic toys these zombies walk around with staring at the screen. Why hide your equipment? Accessibility is far more important than hiding that. beside taping it to the back of a TV is as bad as placing a TV over a fireplace.
Quote:
I can say exactly the same thing about provision for a user insert-able internal HDD.
Instead of one device, you have four;
This pancake,
The PS for it,
The external HDD & enclosure,
The PS for that.
And all the extra cables.

Are you going to tell me you would tape all of that to the back of a TV?? All I see is more of a mess behind the TV no matter where you place this. Four devices when one could of done the same thing and probably more efficiently with one PS..
post #285 of 3061
FROM post 1 There are two models being proposed:

Lower end with 16GB internal storage and no HDD (CM-7500GB16, $250)
Flat form factor to easily mount on rear of flat panel DTV (IR extender available)
No fan, runs cool
Higher end model with internal HDD; size = TBD (CM-7500GB320)
Both models accept an external USB HDD to expand storage -- at least 3TB
The CM-7500GB16 will be released first
post #286 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleron Ives View Post

The difference between Simple.TV and a Hauppauge card is that Simple.TV doesn't need PVR software to make its recordings.

 

I guess since it doesn't require anything else to be a Digital Video Recorder it isn't... wonder how I made that mistake. Rather let's leave it at we disagree.

post #287 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

The external HDD & enclosure,
The PS for that.
And all the extra cables.

Why would you buy "an enclosure" and external power supply for it? Get a normal USB HDD that's powered from the USB port, connect it, set it behind, beside, or on top of the DVR, and you're done. That requires only one cable and not much space.
post #288 of 3061
Sorry for this rambling post, but I'd rather get it all in one post rather than several separate posts.

You'd think a company like Channel Master who has so much at stake depending on the future of broadcast TV (they were once a leader in TV antennas) would go the extra mile to ensure that their product was not only acceptable, but exceptional. Looks like the DVR+ is already stumbling over it's shortcomings.

I would really liked to have seen the following items in the DVR+, maybe they will make it into the 2nd version:

4 tuners is almost a must, even though I don't live in a large market. Often when big news events occur, I like to be able to see and archive at least the 3 major networks newscasts and/or all the local coverage of area events. Now I have multiple PalDVRs hooked up to my main TV to allow recording more than 2 channels at once.

The ability to program remotes to specific DVR+ units, to allow the use of more than one DVR+ in the same room. The kids could then have their own DVR attached to their TV to use without having to mess with the parent's audio/video system. And if they still only have two tuners, there is a need for many of us to have multiple DVR+ units hooked up to the same system. The earlier DISH/Echostar/CM units had this feature. From looking at the user's manual, the DVR+ doesn't seem to have this feature.

A much more detailed user manual. It appears there are many things this box may be able to do that aren't mentioned at all.

Free and frequent updates to make sure that the boxes stay leading edge, rather than getting ignored when the next year's products come out.

A lot more internet functionality from the get go. This device should have had Netflix, YouTube, etc. ready to go from the start. Now we are just looking at what may be empty promises for future services. We've all learned that customer support for the previous units was extremely lame.

RF out for bypass directly to a TV, composite and component out. Nothing wrong with making it backwards compatible. Additional cost can't be much, the last of their DVRs had this.

A simple way to download recorded programs to our computers that can then be edited, stored, and played back on a variety of devices.

Build in the wifi instead of having to use a dongle. It's ridiculous to expect people to have to use one of these, when so many (cheaper) devices have them built-in.

The ability to use a customizable program guide like TitanTV to program the DVR+'s recordings directly from the home computer/laptop/tablet/phone etc. Much easier to program the DVR at one sitting via the internet than have to page/scroll through the program guide offered that shows only a few channels/hours at a time. I can currently go through looking at the TitanTV schedule and put a star on all the programs I want to see in the upcoming week in about 15 minutes. If the DVR+ had a guide that worked so well, it would be great. However from what I see you can only view a few channels at once over a few hour period. I don't want a guide that makes you do so much scrolling and jumping back and forth left and right to see all the schedule. Maybe make the DVR+ interactive with our computers?

Plug-in swappable drives, even if it means making the case larger. The DVR should come with a small drive installed for those that don't need a lot of storage, but the drive should be easily swappable without opening the case for those with greater storage needs. As long as this DVR+ really needs an added drive to operate, why not have the built-in slot for one rather than requiring outside add-ons?

The slim factor is really a worthless feature. It still takes a large footprint, so why not just make it thicker and include all that was left out of previous units (drive, fan, more connections, power supply). They should easily be able to overcome the heat build-up problem. Other manufacturers have.

There are probably many more things I'd like to see, I'll only really know when I get mine and actually experience the shortcomings.

Hopefully the next model will be more of an all-purpose OTA/Internet DVR instead of a compromised unit as this appears to be. I think we were all hoping for a little more. God knows we would have been glad to contribute ideas if Channel Master would have been willing to listen and communicate back with us. They may have been lurking on the forums, but they could have been much further ahead by actually engaging in the conversations. All they would have needed to do was ask for our wish lists, and then poll us to see which features the majority of us would have liked to see. Is their marketing research department really overlooking something so obvious?

Any way, I wish them luck. It's in all our best interests for them to create a successful product that meets all of our needs.



(edited for spelling errors)

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Edited by wiscojim - 12/18/13 at 2:42pm
post #289 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by mickinct View Post

FROM post 1 There are two models being proposed:

Lower end with 16GB internal storage and no HDD (CM-7500GB16, $250)
Flat form factor to easily mount on rear of flat panel DTV (IR extender available)
No fan, runs cool
Higher end model with internal HDD; size = TBD (CM-7500GB320)
Both models accept an external USB HDD to expand storage -- at least 3TB
The CM-7500GB16 will be released first

I am pretty sure that one of the members here with a unit in hand indicated that channel master has rethought the strategy and will only offer the 1 mode
post #290 of 3061
Quote:
Why would you buy "an enclosure" and external power supply for it? Get a normal USB HDD that's powered from the USB port
If it is a 3 1/2" drive it will have to be powered. Cost per GB is less with a full size drive and there is more of a possibility of one having a spare full sized drive.
If it is a 2 1/2" drive you don't know if the port has the reserve capacity for the drive without causing a problem down the road. If it did, you still have three devices instead of one and how about the external drive, where is that going to be hidden?

I might, just might see if this was just a tuner, nothing else, but a multi piece DVR, not a chance of hanging it on a TV.

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Quote:
Higher end model with internal HDD; size = TBD (CM-7500GB320)
Yet to be seen. If it will have a internal drive, then it will have to be in a different enclosure unless the circuit board does not occupy the entire enclosure and it can be sandwiched in. If it is in a different enclosure, that added to production costs. If it is in the same enclosure, then it would be little cost of provide that interface that would be in this step-up model in both. Sorry, the slim idea seems to be a marketing thing than anything else. Not as bad as the 'LED TV scam".
post #291 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiscojim View Post

Looks like the DVR+ is already stumbling over it's shortcomings.

 

I disagree. Virtually every advance feature you desire takes it further and further away from their target market. To a large degree if are here you aren't their market. It's that simple. :) 

post #292 of 3061
Quote:
4 tuners is almost a must
That would really jack the price up. If they cut corners by using a external PS and HDD, the two additional tuners would break the bank. wink.gif

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A much more detailed user manual. It appears there are many things this box may be able to do that aren't mentioned at all.
It's almost as bad as TiVo's skimpy manuals (unless things change with this new model).

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Build in the wifi instead of having to use a dongle.
Not everyone uses wireless or wants to. Why pay for something that is of no use. This was one problem with their 7400.
post #293 of 3061


Sorry guys - this single low res photo is the best I can do given limited free time. Removed the board and processor heat sink, didn't mess with the tuner shielding - looks like Kingston flash memory and a Broadcom brain. (Yes, I do believe that cutout, along with vents and dimples in the enclosure, is where additional internal storage may have lived if they hadn't killed the 320GB model.)
Edited by davezatz - 12/18/13 at 3:09pm
post #294 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

Not everyone uses wireless or wants to. Why pay for something that is of no use.

Well. if it's going to be a DVR with internet capability, I'd rather have it wireless than to have to run an ethernet cable from my router in one room to the DVR+ and TV in another room. I sincerely believe that most people would want to be using the internet features wirelessly.

If you're not planning on using the internet functions, maybe you don't want to be paying for that either?

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post #295 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by videobruce View Post

If it is a 3 1/2" drive it will have to be powered.

If you're buying a USB HDD specifically for a device that has only two USB ports, you should buy one that is designed to be powered from USB ports. If you want to save money by adapting a drive you already have, then you can't really complain that the kluge necessary to make it work lacks elegance.
post #296 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by davezatz View Post


Sorry guys - this single low res photo is the best I can do given limited free time. Removed the board and processor heat sink, didn't mess with the tuner shielding - looks like Kingston flash memory and a Broadcom brain. (Yes, I do believe that cutout, along with vents and dimples in the enclosure, is where additional internal storage may have lived if they hadn't killed the 320GB model.)

Seems to be a large unpopulated area at the upper left of the board. I wonder what functions were designed to have been there?

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post #297 of 3061
post #298 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by davezatz View Post



Sorry guys - this single low res photo is the best I can do given limited free time. Removed the board and processor heat sink, didn't mess with the tuner shielding - looks like Kingston flash memory and a Broadcom brain. (Yes, I do believe that cutout, along with vents and dimples in the enclosure, is where additional internal storage may have lived if they hadn't killed the 320GB model.)

Dave-the ChannelMaster is for sure a re-badged Echostar 610 offered in the UK, but with US tuners.

The Echostar offers 500GB of internal storage, so the cutout in the PCB is a surely there to clear a 2.5 inch HDD or SSD.

Can you tell us what happens if you connect 2 hard drives to the DVR either through a USB hub or to each of the 2 USB ports on the backside of the unit?

Also, can you remotely mount the hard drive from your PC-in other words doest the CM expose the partitions as SMB/NFS shares?
post #299 of 3061
Quote:
Originally Posted by qz3fwd View Post

Also, can you remotely mount the hard drive from your PC-in other words doest the CM expose the partitions as SMB/NFS shares?

Yes, it's two EXT3 partitions with MPEG2 .ts files... that I haven't been able to play yet. But I haven't invested much time in it.

Update: Let me revise my statement - I read the question too quick. I didn't access the drive across my network. Rather, I connected it to a computer. Haven't tried looking for it on the LAN. I can't imagine they'd make it visible at this point...
post #300 of 3061
You could also try FTPing into the DVR to see if the drive is accessible that way.
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