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It finally begins! The UXL-18 Build - Page 6

post #151 of 260
With all the reading and studying you’re doing, I’ll be asking you for tips if I ever use that type of veneer. I really like the select ability it offers.
post #152 of 260
Thread Starter 
Boy, got a price quote on the veneer and it's not gonna be cheap. It's nearly 200 bucks; nearly 70 bucks to ship!

Still haven't quite decided on the grill plan, but I quickly threw on the speaker cloth to see what both would look like:



I couldn't really get the fabric too tight on this one but you can get the idea



Mind the copious amounts of dog hair hah
post #153 of 260
Quote:
Boy, got a price quote on the veneer and it's not gonna be cheap. It's nearly 200 bucks; nearly 70 bucks to ship!

$70 shipping! bummer.. looks like good stuff though. Don't mess it up now smile.gif lol
post #154 of 260
Where are you buying your veneer from? Tapeease has 4x8 sheets of NBL or two ply flat cut ash for $70 or paper backed for $43. Two 4x8 sheets would be far less than $200 and shiiping should be less too vs. a 5' piece. Not to mention you would have extra veneer left over in case of screw-ups or for the next sub.
post #155 of 260
Thread Starter 
I need a 5x8 sheet (since all the pieces are 25 inches wide in some direction) which I was planning on getting from formwood. The sheet is $112 (for NBL flat cut white ash). Paper backed version is 83 bucks.

Shipping is 72 bucks...which still amazes me. They said the package would be 75 pounds

I can get it to fit on a 4x10 sheet as well, but I would need to join more edges. The benefit of the 5x8 sheet is I won't need to do any extra veneer matching
post #156 of 260
I like the round grill. It would be a shame to hide all that symmetry. cool.gif
post #157 of 260
Hey Hot do you mind sharing your thought process, or maybe I ought to say conclusion in choosing NBL. I think I pretty much know, but wouldn’t mind reading your thoughts regarding. Do you plan on rounding over the top?

Oh.. with all four ports blowin, what do you figure the tune to come out at, and do you plan on investigating plugging one or two?
post #158 of 260
Thread Starter 
Sure, no problem Steve.

I still haven't decided on whether or not I'm going to roundover the edges. I had planned on doing it and I think the roundovers look better, but none of my other speakers have any rounded over corners, so that would be the only reason I wouldn't do it (to match the other speakers). I did cut out a test piece and used the 3/4" roundover on it and I'm going to use that to test how I think it will look.

I had a tough time deciding between the two and got some samples of both to help choose. Paperbacked is crazy thin and really flexible. The NBL is about 1/3 thicker but isn't as flexible, but would still be fine on a 3/4" roundover so that shouldn't cause a problem.

There ended up being several reason I ended up going with the 2ply though. This is the first thing I've veneered (I had to actually buy a clothing iron) and 2ply seems to be more forgiving in terms of showing imperfections in the substrate (smoothness and joints don't show through as much) and it seems to glue up a bit better than paperbacked (less chance of bubbling). Something else that I took into account is 2ply is two thin sheets of wood instead of a sheet of wood and paper so (in my mind at least) it seems to be a bit more...solid? The paperbacked veneer felt really fragile

Something else I thought I saw (but can't seem to find any evidence of now) is that 2ply is slightly easier to finish as well.

The original design of the speaker (without the additional bracing) is around 15Hz. I knew plugging some holes for a different tune was possible, but never really looked into it (probably a bit too much for a first sub). I'll try and recalculate the tune some time this weekend when I know exactly how much bracing it will have.

If anyone has any other questions for me feel free to ask. It's a two way street after all and I've asked a million questions.

Also Grave, that was my thought. I think the front panel being all black with the ports open and the grill on (or off) would look pretty menacing.
post #159 of 260
Wow beautiful work!
It's almost 3 months later since this project began and you haven't heard the sub yet?
wow talk about patience...impossible for me!

Very nice sir.
post #160 of 260
Thread Starter 
Went to pick up the new sheet of mdf today and what I was concerned would happen happened. The mdf they had, once again, was not 3/4". This time it was thicker than 3/4" (the original mdf I got was thinner than 3/4"). It was even a different company than the last stuff I got. Since the dados were cut to the thickness of the original mdf I figured it would stick out.

I used the other back piece as a template to route it to the same size and while it didn't go poorly, it didn't work as well as I'd hoped (some of the corners are a bit sloppy). At least once I had it cut it fit in the hole...aaaaaaaaand it sticks out like 1/16th of an inch mad.gif

I don't have a router dado combo big enough to handle it and there are pieces glued to the inside of the box so I can't run it through the dado on the table saw again so I might just need to sand it.

At least the dowels and the angled braces came out ok.

Not in the best mood so I'm gonna call it a night.
post #161 of 260
Thread Starter 
Tried again cutting out the back piece and it went much better this time. The piece still sticks out the back (a little more than a 16th of an inch or so).

I've spent the last day thinking of the best way to try and make the dados a bit bigger (since I can't run them through the table saw again).

I've come down to 2 ideas at this point: using a circular saw to extend the dado a bit or using a utility knife to extend it.

The saw would certainly be easier but would require a bit more setup.

It's going to cost me 0.0199743 cubic feet of internal volume! mad.gif haha

Pre-post edit: meant to submit this earlier but apparently never did. I ran a test cutting some mdf with a good sharp utility knife and it cuts through great so I'm probably gonna do that instead of going with the circular saw.
post #162 of 260
Thanks for sharing your prior veneer thoughts. Sorry about your current issue though, bummer!.. but it sounds like you’re forming a plan though.
post #163 of 260
Wow, MDF has always been a consistent 3/4 when I've bought it. You could laminate some strips to the outside of the box and then use a flush cut bit to make everything even again. Then your box would just be 1/16th longer.
post #164 of 260
Thread Starter 
Grave, that was similar to what my buddy suggested. I think it would be easier (and less noticeable) to make the dados a bit wider though.
post #165 of 260
Thread Starter 
Quick flare question for everyone.

I was bored today (and too tired to do anything) so I went nuts calculating the exact volume of the sub box (including the roundovers and everything).
The volume (with the angled baffle plywood pieces NOT being rounded over) is 7.525 ft^3

I'm trying to see if I'm going to end up with any port noise using a combination of WinISD and Flare-It

Running that volume through winisd with a port length of 44 inches and flare-it settings of 3 inch port diameter, 4 ports and a 1-1/4 port radius the only way I can get flare-it to give the ok on port noise is running a highpass filter at ~1000 watts.

With those specs I have velocities as follows:
@ 20hz - 12m/sec
@ 25hz - 9
@ 30hz - 6
@ 35hz - 4
which flare-it gives the green light to. If I bump up to 1200 watts it says I'll get port chuffing and up to 1500 watts it says chuffing with turbulence and compression.

I know winisd doesn't take into account flared ports but would the flared ends help run a slightly higher wattage without getting any port noise? Is it just something I'm gonna need to test once it's assembled?

Oh ya, with that info, the tuning comes out to 14.83 Hz
post #166 of 260
Quote:
Quote:
I know winisd doesn't take into account flared ports but would the flared ends help run a slightly higher wattage without getting any port noise? Is it just something I'm gonna need to test once it's assembled?

Following the logic related to flare it will/should help, but in the end only your testing will give you your final answer what you can get away with I would think. The extra wattage will translate to very little extra output as you know though. still.. it’s nice not to leave anything left on the table sometimes.
post #167 of 260
Yeah, that driver has so much displacement that it is really hard to make use of it all without some port velocity issues. I think you are at about the best balance of those factors that can be reasonably achieved. When you are running that thing wide open it will probably be hard to hear the chuffing anyway.
post #168 of 260
Thread Starter 
Haha, sounds good.

Anyway, tired of no real progress lately, but I'm gonna try and get everything needed to start gluing the box up done this weekend.

As a test too a while ago I ran a piece of scrap with the 3/4" roundover and it looks like I am gonna roundover the edge. I think it looks a lot better that way:

(Ignore the front panel gap, I just got it close and clamped it)
post #169 of 260
I prefer rounded edges, but just go with 1/2". It's what works with guitar cab corners so I've carried it over to HT subs.

As an idea, you could round everything but the baffle. I think it would look good with a black baffle with squared edges and the wood grain wrap on the outside.
post #170 of 260
Thread Starter 
I'm only planning on doing roundovers on the 4 long edges connecting the front and back (if you look at a picture of the PB-13 Ultra, I'm going to roundover the same edges)
post #171 of 260
Thread Starter 
At this point I can confidently say the best investment on this project was the drill press hah.

I finished up some markings on the port tubes, got the layout done on the front angled pieces and got the holes for the dowels cut in the bracing. Drill press made it a cinch







The dowels go through the back bracing and are recessed 1/4" in the front bracing and rear panel (haven't done the rear panel yet though). It's a very tight fit

I decided to see what it looked like with the original back in place. You can see it overlaps about 1/4" with the hole for the rear terminal.



I know it's not ideal, but would that really cause an issue? I would need to remove a little of the dowel end so the terminal will fit (mainly being lazy).
Edited by hotsho111 - 11/9/13 at 6:49pm
post #172 of 260
No it will be perfectly fine. You aren't trying to keep a cable bridge aloft for 100 years, it's just a sub box biggrin.gif
post #173 of 260
+1 like N8 says. easy peasy
post #174 of 260
Thread Starter 
Where were you guys with this confidence last week! haha. I went back and looked thinking more people said I should get a new sheet of mdf...nope, it was just me lol.

Nothing like buying a full sheet of mdf, cutting it up and deciding to use none of it.

Anyway, finished up the front plywood bracing pieces.

I've been working on this long enough I now have a professional set up now. Look, it even has dust collection!


Had to square off the ends so they would match up with the front panel correctly:


On the left and right brace pieces they will overlap a bit with the speaker basket so I had to cut out a little notch for them to fit. I used a couple scrap pieces for guides:


Protip: for small pieces that you can't clamp, tape works great.
Protip on the protip: if you are going to tape something down and just loop a piece of tape, you will essentially make a flat wheel, make sure the direction you will be applying pressure to the piece is perpendicular to the direction the 'wheel' would roll. I found this out the hard way as I ended up taking off an extra 1/8" when routing out the clearance for the braces as I didn't notice the piece was moving.

As you guys already know, I'm crazy so I decided to roundover the pieces


Here you can check out the clearance on the basket:


Just gotta drill the 1/4" deep holes in the back panel and time for glue!!!!
post #175 of 260
Quote:
Where were you guys with this confidence last week! haha.

Lol.. I think we have always had it except to say the thread went kind of wacky a few times between posters. smile.gif Although certain aspects are important, a guy can go off the deep end trying to shoot for what is absolutely best when it’s not called for. So in that we leave it up to you to call the shots, it’s your build. There you go rounding over your braces.. looks great though, nice work. Been reading up on your driver some, if I ever decide to add another 18” to the drivers I have on hand, I think that will be the driver? I have found over time that I really appreciate the added SQ not to mention spl with my 12-15” SDX’s. I haven't quite determined if the UXL is better than the mae-x though?? I think it is.. EDIT> yeah it is. I could sell a couple and pick one up.


Something you might want to consider before closing her up, is to veneer the inside.. ok at least the braces and just stain the dowels to match the best you can. mmm what would be the best stain? biggrin.gif Oh! dust collection lookin goood! wink.gif
Edited by steve nn - 11/10/13 at 7:40pm
post #176 of 260
Thread Starter 
Got the back panel glued up and did a dry fit of all the new pieces and it looks good biggrin.gif

Laying out the circles (I traced them from the back brace) and marked them up to find the center


1/4" depth cut complete


Test fitting the doweled bracing


Here you can see the overlap that I'll need to trim up later


All the bracing in the box. A snug fit: the bracing connecting the baffle to the front brace is just wedged in


So, literally all I need to do now is trim that dowel in the back and I'm good to go.

If you see any issues speak up now! smile.gif
post #177 of 260
Quote:
If you see any issues speak up now! smile.gif

That’s one of the nicest looking inside of a sub I can ever remember seeing period!
post #178 of 260
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by steve nn View Post

Something you might want to consider before closing her up, is to veneer the inside.. ok at least the braces and just stain the dowels to match the best you can. mmm what would be the best stain? biggrin.gif Oh! dust collection lookin goood! wink.gif

The sad part about this is I'm so tired, hungry, and delirious I can't tell if you're serious or not.

I know that there are those that recommend veneering both sides of mdf
post #179 of 260
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotsho111 View Post

The sad part about this is I'm so tired, hungry, and delirious I can't tell if you're serious or not.

I know that there are those that recommend veneering both sides of mdf

Oh I'm so sorry Hot! yeah I'm totally just playin, thought you would understand that.. the post would not let me add another smiley for some reason. cool.gif
post #180 of 260
Thread Starter 
Haha, that was my guess, but I needed to make sure :P
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