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Digital projection cine 1000 led discussion - Page 5

post #121 of 211
Well there's three options, which two are you meaning by "both"?
post #122 of 211
You said everything equal distance for example the LENS will give more brightness then you you go on to say zoom and VP (squeeze) is equal brightness. So I read that as they are the same ????
post #123 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by mmiles View Post

You said everything equal distance for example the LENS will give more brightness then you you go on to say zoom and VP (squeeze) is equal brightness. So I read that as they are the same ????

Zoom and using the video processor gives equal brightness. The A-lens will give an increase in brightness.
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post #124 of 211
There's still time to get in on the special Cine 1000 LED deal - just FYI. smile.gif
post #125 of 211
Just preordered this one and am going to do a shootout with the Sony 1000. Couldn't pass up that Cedia special price on a .95 chip LED DLP! Here's hoping the brightness is as good as the reports make it out to be.
post #126 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

Just preordered this one and am going to do a shootout with the Sony 1000. Couldn't pass up that Cedia special price on a .95 chip LED DLP! Here's hoping the brightness is as good as the reports make it out to be.

I was wondering why you was looking at the Optoma anyways. I'm ordering the VIP 3D Theater Plus to make mines 3D for just $400
post #127 of 211
Hmm that device sounds interesting. I have never looked into it and thought such things were gimmicks. So it really works to turn a PJ into an active 3D one?
post #128 of 211
Supposedly, ill be finding out soon
post #129 of 211
At 60hz I would expect the flicker to be intense. Is the cine 1000 limited to the same input freq?
post #130 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

At 60hz I would expect the flicker to be intense. Is the cine 1000 limited to the same input freq?

I been trying to get a reason to not buy it, but I'm going to get as much info as I can. I'm hoping a return policy or something. All I need is a day to go through my 3D to see how well it works
post #131 of 211
Anyone else that wants to get on board the Cedia M - Vision Cine 1000 LED projector deal, call us by Friday - the train is about to leave the station !!
post #132 of 211
I can't wait to get this thing. Other than 3D the specs and reports suggest that it's as good as and brighter than a Mico 150 at a third of the street price.
post #133 of 211
We have enough buyers to meet the group buy requirements, but there is room for more buyers. Great price for this projector. smile.gif
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post #134 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

Other than 3D the specs and reports suggest that it's as good as and brighter than a Mico 150 at a third of the street price.

hmm guess I missed that
post #135 of 211
Really looking forward to reading owners impressions, too bad I can't get onboard for the deal at the moment
post #136 of 211
+1
post #137 of 211
There is one more of these projectors available under the special CEDIA deal, just FYI. smile.gif
post #138 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

The Cine 1000 LED uses Dark chip 4. I was asked this and a few other questions, so I thought I would post the answer here. When I get the rest of my answers, I will post.
.

I spoke with Tom Wilmers, a DP territorial manager today, and asked for Darkchip 4 confirmation. He said he couldn't confirm that, and after speaking with the DP engineers sent me the following response:

"I was told we don't specify number of Dark Chip because there are very minute differences between chip numbers. In one of our manufacturer literature papers the projector in question is using the number 3, however our technical people would challenge anyone to tell the difference, hence the reason we only specify Dark Chip and not number. Hope this helps."

So, in all likelihood it's a Darkchip 3. Mike, who was the source that confirmed Darkchip 4?
post #139 of 211
Dam. So it is Darkchip 3 only frown.gif And no full CMS either.
Edited by Spizz - 11/12/13 at 4:01am
post #140 of 211
It does seem odd that they wouldn't want to boast about it using DC4 if that was the case. You also can't say for sure that it doesn't use DC4 though. It could just be a company wide policy to not make DMD information public. It would be silly not use the DC4 DMD though as the DC4 chips inherently reflect more light over the DC3. This would give Digital Projection an easy head start on the issues with LED projector brightness. Unless they've found an even cheaper way to increase the brightness I don't see why they wouldn't spend the premium for the DC4 DMD. He does have a point, though, in saying that a graded DC3 DMD will perform very close to a DC4 DMD. If it is truly DC3 this doesn't make this projector a deal breaker as the 20% increase in contrast the DC4 has is almost all in peak white level brightness anyways, not black level. I think you guys are making this more of an issue than it needs to be.
post #141 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spizz View Post

Dam. So it is Darkchip 3 only frown.gif And no CMS either.

Where did you read it does not have a cms?
post #142 of 211
Meant to say doesnt have a full CMS (have edited the post)-
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Added 10/09/13
The DPI projectors with Colormax have full CMS. The M series, which includes the Cine 1000 LED, does not have full CMS. You do have controls for gain and lift of RGB and you also have control of hue, saturation and gamma. Of course a meter and software is needed..
post #143 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post

You also can't say for sure that it doesn't use DC4 though. It could just be a company wide policy to not make DMD information public.

Well you have Mike being told one thing, and Tom Wilmers from DP saying it ain't so according to their " manufacturer literature papers" for this specific projector as having a DC3. That seems quite definative IMO.
Quote:
It would be silly not use the DC4 DMD though as the DC4 chips inherently reflect more light over the DC3. This would give Digital Projection an easy head start on the issues with LED projector brightness. Unless they've found an even cheaper way to increase the brightness I don't see why they wouldn't spend the premium for the DC4 DMD.

Agreed.

Guess time will tell either way when we start seeing the reviews. Still keeping me eye on this projector for now.
post #144 of 211
I was under the impression that TI didn't call their chips DC3/DC4 etc anymore.
post #145 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post

I was under the impression that TI didn't call their chips DC3/DC4 etc anymore.

 

Ditto

 

I'm under the impression that DC4 was a running process improvement change from DC3 occurring somewhere around 2007/2008; just as DC3 was a processing improvement from DC2+, etc.  It makes little economic sense (to me) for a chip manufacture to run a manufacturing line to produce lessor or inferior chips when the goal of the technology is to produce higher levels of reflectivity and contrast with the highest yields possible.  This is especially true for a commodity like chips.

 

Or perhaps it is a grading scheme for chip production; and it's no secret that chips are graded.  What ever it is, TI is very tight lipped about it.  The last reference I could find from TI talks about it as a comparison and one can read it as DC3 is no longer produced:  http://e2e.ti.com/support/dlp__mems_micro-electro-mechanical_systems/f/94/t/35944.aspx

 

Because of the process change and the fact its been 5-6 years since the introduction of DC4 one might wonder if there are any .95" DC3 chips still manufactured, other than grading the chip as DC3.  It would be great to have someone who could post more information.

post #146 of 211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verbow View Post


I spoke with Tom Wilmers, a DP territorial manager today, and asked for Darkchip 4 confirmation. He said he couldn't confirm that, and after speaking with the DP engineers sent me the following response:

"I was told we don't specify number of Dark Chip because there are very minute differences between chip numbers. In one of our manufacturer literature papers the projector in question is using the number 3, however our technical people would challenge anyone to tell the difference, hence the reason we only specify Dark Chip and not number. Hope this helps."

So, in all likelihood it's a Darkchip 3. Mike, who was the source that confirmed Darkchip 4?

 

I would also ask the question, how old were the "manufacturer literature papers"?  Up until just a few weeks ago DP's web site only talked about the Cine 1000 in their news section and it was not listed as a current projector.  You can also find reference to an MSRP of $10995 vs. MSRP of $12995 on the DP web site.

 

Just pointing out that it's hard to know what to believe or accept as accurate information even from the manufacturer.


Edited by b curry - 11/12/13 at 8:37am
post #147 of 211
We still have one of these awesome projectors available. smile.gif
post #148 of 211
From DPI Application Support:
We trust you will be very pleased with the image this projector will create.

I believe the 10000:1 contrast ratio is defined with the Dynamic Black “On” and with an “4x” setting.

Although this projector doesn’t have the user color alignment presets offered by ColorMax, you do have considerable control over the color alignment.

By setting the color gamut to native (under the Advanced tab) you have access to hue, saturation, and gain adjustments (also under Advanced) called HSG.

These will allow you to set the color point of the primary and secondary colors.

Once this has been done to your satisfaction, you can use the RGB Adjust settings (also under Advanced) to set the white color point.

These settings are “per input”, meaning they affect all signals coming into that input number.

If your screen and room don’t affect the color of the image too much, you can use the color gamut “REC 709” and color temperature “6500”.

These values will give you a very nearly calibrated image.

Of course the factory calibration cannot predict any color shifts that may be caused by the screen or the room. (These are possible.)

This is one of the reasons you may decide to use the manual settings.

Another reason is that you may desire to take advantage of the wider color gamut offered by the LED illumination unit.

The LED illumination unit can produce much more saturated primary colors than any of the lamped units can produce.

There is no plan to offer an upgrade to HDMI 1.4.

In fact, we would not expect you to miss it, since 1.3 supports all the currently used color spaces and resolutions, and the LED is not 3D.

We use Dark Chips in all of our 0.95 inch DMD products. We don’t call the specific Dark Chip level out, but we are always looking at the next generation, and what we used yesterday may not be what we use tomorrow.

I have seen different specifications referring to different Dark Chip levels, but whenever I see them I have to know that they may be superseded.

All of the Dark Chip levels that we use have outstanding contrast ratios, so I am sure you will not be disappointed.

In all models, the functions selected are carefully considered and a balance is attempted between the cost of the function and the desire of the marketplace for that function.

Although I was not involved in that conversion, I imagine that the preset for REC709 was considered to be the desired setting for the most of the installs, and the manual settings for the installs that needed more detailed tweaking.

The cost of the unit would have needed to be higher to cover the inclusion of the ColorMax system. You can achieve the same thing with the M-Vision Cine LED 1000, but you must do it manually, and you cannot create presets of the settings.

I hope this helps to answer your questions.

Best regards,

Mark
post #149 of 211
Even if they aren't using the DC4 DMD this projector will perform great. Overall it's going to be one of the best under $10000 (street price) DLP projector out there. I think it's only competition would be the Runco LS-3 and LS-5 in picture quality.
post #150 of 211
Can anyone who looked at this projector at Cedia comment on fan noise? Their site has it listed as 30 dB. That seems very high compared to most competing models that are in the low 20s.

How was it on the older 600 lumen model? Probably lower since less lumens likely means less heat to dissipate.
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