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Las Vegas, NV - HDTV - Page 188

post #5611 of 8956
8/31/07 at 11:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chadowe View Post


IMO, if Cox is 10, then DirecTV is 7.

I have a different opinion.
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post #5612 of 8956
8/31/07 at 12:23pm
New "Slim Libe" Dish vs. 5 LNB Dish i got 1 year ago...

any reason to change/upgrade to this new slim one?

I Kinda need some fast answers, installer will be here tomorrow.
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post #5613 of 8956
8/31/07 at 1:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turd View Post

New "Slim Libe" Dish vs. 5 LNB Dish i got 1 year ago...

any reason to change/upgrade to this new slim one?

I Kinda need some fast answers, installer will be here tomorrow.

No, it just looks prettier.
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post #5614 of 8956
8/31/07 at 4:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeLV View Post

An irony of changing technologies is that Cox's PQ will decrease unless they start "compressing it like DirecTV." Are you aware that many new HD channels (the HBO suite is already confirmed) will actually originate in mpeg4? The tables will turn and it will be the cable companies stuck on mpeg2 platforms that are sacrificing PQ by transcoding content.

Sure it might originate as MPEG4, but Cox reencoding to 1920x1080 18mbit/s MPEG2 will still be better than D* reencoding to 1440x1080 7mbit/s MPEG4.
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post #5615 of 8956
8/31/07 at 5:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteaz View Post

Sure it might originate as MPEG4, but Cox reencoding to 1920x1080 18mbit/s MPEG2 will still be better than D* reencoding to 1440x1080 7mbit/s MPEG4.

It's only a matter of days until the new satellite lights up. Let's reserve our judgment until we see it in action.
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post #5616 of 8956
8/31/07 at 7:56pm
As soon as the sat providers provide more, the "COX HAS SUPERIOR PQ" argument comes about.

That is so much BS unless you are a minority in the list of subs who have a screen > 60 inches and sit very close to the TV.

The truth is for most HD owners, the PQ is hardly any difference between the two.
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post #5617 of 8956
8/31/07 at 10:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by foghorn2 View Post


The truth is for most HD owners, the PQ is hardly any difference between the two.

Thanks for the very first sensible thing I've seen you write.
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post #5618 of 8956
9/1/07 at 6:02am
"Thanks for the very first sensible thing I've seen you write".

an insult hidden in a compliment. let's keep it friendly, ok?
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post #5619 of 8956
9/1/07 at 7:40am
Laszlo5.... there has been longstanding strong banter between some members in this forum and most here are used to some sly insults every now and then. Most of us have pretty thick skin here. Sometimes it can add a little spice to the mundane periods of blah postings.
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post #5620 of 8956
9/1/07 at 7:58am
Originally Posted by Turd
New "Slim Libe" Dish vs. 5 LNB Dish i got 1 year ago...

any reason to change/upgrade to this new slim one?

I Kinda need some fast answers, installer will be here tomorrow.

I upgraded to the slim dish, and noticed that it has a slot for a future installation of 2 more future LNBs. Which would then make it a 7 LNB dish.
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post #5621 of 8956
9/1/07 at 4:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by gvc View Post

Laszlo5.... there has been longstanding strong banter between some members in this forum and most here are used to some sly insults every now and then. Most of us have pretty thick skin here. Sometimes it can add a little spice to the mundane periods of blah postings.

yuck fu, speak for yourself

My Erect Tv is better than your Cox....NA....NA na.na...NA
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post #5622 of 8956
9/3/07 at 7:11pm
To all you Cox guys with HD DVRs, does Cox charge you an additional $4.95/mo for the HD DVR's second tuner in the form of an additional outlet fee? Cox has told me that they don't charge it and they do charge it from two different billing people. I'm writing a complaint to the FCC over the BS fees they charge cable card customers and I need to make sure I have my facts straight.
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post #5623 of 8956
9/3/07 at 8:25pm
Here is the fee for an 8300:

DIGITAL SERVICE/DIGITAL GATEWAY 1 @ 7.62
DIGITAL CONVERTER - DVR/HD 1 @ 5.25
COX DIGITAL VIDEO RECORDER SERVICE 1 @ 9.99

So in all you pay 22.86 on top of:

COX LIMITED BASIC 1 @ 10.91
COX EXPANDED SERVICE 1 @ 34.58

or what ever other packages you have.

Does this help?
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post #5624 of 8956
9/3/07 at 8:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by doormat View Post

To all you Cox guys with HD DVRs, does Cox charge you an additional $4.95/mo for the HD DVR's second tuner in the form of an additional outlet fee? Cox has told me that they don't charge it and they do charge it from two different billing people. I'm writing a complaint to the FCC over the BS fees they charge cable card customers and I need to make sure I have my facts straight.

This is not the way the cable co's word it, but in laymans terms, here you go.

There is a license fee appliled to each digital device's MAC address that is put onto the digital router to allow services by the manufacturer. Each cable card or digital device has a unique mac address that has to be licensed on the router to allow services to be recieved. The 8300 and all dual tuner SA STB's only have a single authentication and MAC address and require a single license fee. The 8300HDC, which uses a multistream cable card still only has a single mac address. All 3rd party devices with cablecards at this time are only capable of using single stream cards, so each tuner would need a unique card and MAC address and license fee for each card.
The New TivoHD is the first 3rd party device that may accept multistream cards when they become available in many locals, but initial shipments were made and paired to STB's from the factory to comply with the July Mandate requireing new STB's to use seperable security for decryption. As multistream cards become available TivoHD users may request a multistream card but older devices may never be compatible with multistream cards and require a seperate card and license for each tuner.

vegggas
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post #5625 of 8956
9/3/07 at 8:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by foghorn2 View Post

As soon as the sat providers provide more, the "COX HAS SUPERIOR PQ" argument comes about.

That is so much BS unless you are a minority in the list of subs who have a screen > 60 inches and sit very close to the TV.

The truth is for most HD owners, the PQ is hardly any difference between the two.

I already saw the "Pepsi Challenge" style ads on TV where they pour cola into two glasses and say how even sat users preferred the quality of cable to sat.

vegggas
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post #5626 of 8956
9/3/07 at 10:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas View Post

This is not the way the cable co's word it, but in laymans terms, here you go.

There is a license fee appliled to each digital device's MAC address that is put onto the digital router to allow services by the manufacturer. Each cable card or digital device has a unique mac address that has to be licensed on the router to allow services to be recieved. The 8300 and all dual tuner SA STB's only have a single authentication and MAC address and require a single license fee. The 8300HDC, which uses a multistream cable card still only has a single mac address. All 3rd party devices with cablecards at this time are only capable of using single stream cards, so each tuner would need a unique card and MAC address and license fee for each card.
The New TivoHD is the first 3rd party device that may accept multistream cards when they become available in many locals, but initial shipments were made and paired to STB's from the factory to comply with the July Mandate requireing new STB's to use seperable security for decryption. As multistream cards become available TivoHD users may request a multistream card but older devices may never be compatible with multistream cards and require a seperate card and license for each tuner.

vegggas

Well at least I can get a straight answer about how things work from soneone. Even if I still think its BS and they should give me a $4.95/mo credit on my bill in perpetuity instead of this double standard BS.

I asked the lady in Video support about getting an M-Card and she didnt have the foggiest clue about WTF I was talking about. I'll call later this week and hope for someone brighter to pick up the phone.
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post #5627 of 8956
9/4/07 at 7:39am
Don't ever expect anyone at Cox to know anything about the cable cards. They didn't even bother training the techs on how to use them. I showed three of them last week how they work. The one guy that had the cards told me that they gave him the cards and he had no clue what they were for or how to use them. The real sham is that they won't let you pick them up at the office like they do all the other STB's. Now before Vegggas comes on and says that the guy needs to be there to make sure the auth went through right I can tell the person on the phone that yes channel 700 comes in and so does 200 if you have HBO. Directv has been doing this for years. Also I'm pretty sure the Series 3 TiVo not just the new TiVoHD can use the M-Card's. They might need a software update though. I also told the guy how I've had my Sony SD TiVo running since around 2000 and he was shocked that it was still running after all that time. I guess it shows you how good the SA hardware really is.

But to answer your question doormat yes they charge you a digital gateway fee and rental fee for each cablecard you have.
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post #5628 of 8956
9/4/07 at 8:49pm
Well it looks like those with DVRs with two tuners dont get screwed with the additional charge.. more BS from Cox! On to file my complaint with the FCC...
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post #5629 of 8956
9/4/07 at 9:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by doormat View Post

Well it looks like those with DVRs with two tuners dont get screwed with the additional charge.. more BS from Cox! On to file my complaint with the FCC...

It's a single device (dual tuner DVR), so it has a single MAC address, so it's a single license charge. All other devices need a device for each tuner, so there is a license required for each device based on the licenseing fees of the manufacturer. You didn't mention your hardware requirement, but if it's Tivo, they are working on getting the S3 to be able to use multistream cards, like the TivoHD can. Now, as SA and Moto work on manufacturing multistream cards, they will be available to those devices in time, but most of the inventory is tied with pairings for non-integrated STB's.
The monthly licensing fees are there so that smaller systems and cable co's have access to similar or the same equipment as larger systems and cable co's and have to pay monthly royalties for every digital device connected rather than million$ up front in hardware costs.

vegggas
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post #5630 of 8956
9/4/07 at 9:40pm
So vegggas are you saying the digital gateway is a licensing fee or just the fee they charge for the card?
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post #5631 of 8956
9/4/07 at 10:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvthunder View Post

So vegggas are you saying the digital gateway is a licensing fee or just the fee they charge for the card?

The way I envision it, It is a licensing fee applied by the manufacturer of the digital router equipment so that fees are paid by usage rather than upfront costs. That way, a multi-million dollar piece of hardware can be used by a small cable company without the outlay of cash, but the vendor gets paid based on usage. Equal upstart costs among cable co's of varying sizes allows the vendor to supply similar equipment to various sized systems, but allow them to recoup costs in the long term with licensing fees. It's highy possible that larger systems can use more upfront cash to pay down per device licensing fees than smaller systems so that they can be paid off earlier, but most high dollar equipment would be licensed rather than purchased and obsolete.
Like Tivo, you gotta pay the fees to keep the support and updates active.

vegggas
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post #5632 of 8956
9/4/07 at 10:08pm
I think maybe you misunderstood the question. Is the digital gateway the licensing fee you are talking about or is the licensing fee included in the monthly charge for the card. I always thought the digital gateway fee was for the programming you get like all those Discovery channels.
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post #5633 of 8956
9/4/07 at 10:37pm
As I see it;
The digital gateway would be the licensing fee for each digital device. A digital gateway is required as the minumum fee if you do not subscribe to a digital package, to cover the cost of the licensing, which includes the gateway fee for the first included digital device. Additional devices would require the digital gateway/additional digital outlet/licensing fee prices to pay for the licensing.
The monthly rental price of the card, is the lease price of the equipment, which runs about $150 - $200 per cablecard as some users have had to pre-purchase (but do not own) cards on smaller systems without inventory. They still have to pay the digital licensing fees that allow for the MAC address to be authenticated.
ref - http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/digitalcable/pricing.asp

vegggas
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post #5634 of 8956
9/4/07 at 10:40pm
After re-reading both posts, take a look at the link in the previous post.
A digital gateway @ $5 does NOT include any programming.
Quote:


Digital Gateway - (Does not include any tiers or Discovery Channels) $5.00
45 channels of Music Choice, 6 Talk Radio Networks, Access to Entertainment On Demand and Pay-Per-View, and Interactive Program Guide.

The first tier of programming is Digital Cable Level 1 @ $8.95 which appears to be the gateway fee and programming with:
Quote:


6 new Discovery Channels, 45 channels of Music Choice, 6 Talk Radio Networks, Access to Entertainment On Demand and Pay-Per-View, and Interactive Program Guide AND choose from one of the following Digital options:

Movie Networks (Ch. 300-308)
Sports & Info. Networks (Ch. 320-332)
Variety Networks (Ch. 340-353)

vegggas
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post #5635 of 8956
9/5/07 at 2:46pm
Las Vegas HD Channel Guide September Hype Edition

Note for DirecTV: channel numbers/launch month based on a rumored list

Code:
Broadcast Networks   OTA    Cox   DirecTV   Dish  CMA (Pahrump)
------------------  -----  ----- --------- ------ -------------
ABC  (KTNV)          13-1   732      13
CBS  (KLAS)           8-1   730       8
Fox  (KVVU)           5-1   735       5
NBC  (KVBC)           3-1   733       3
PBS  (KLVX)          10-1   731
CW   (KVCW)          33-1    
MyTV (KVMY)          21-1 

Cable Networks (launching in September) [launching in October]
------------------ 
A&E                        (707)   (265)    9419
Animal Planet                      [282]    9489
Bravo                              [273]
Cartoon Network                    (296)
CNN                                (202)
Discovery                          [278]    9487
ESPN                        704      73     9424   550
ESPN2                       705      72     9425
Food Network HD                   (231-1)   9462
Fox Business                       [359]
FX                                 [248]
HGTV HD                           (229-1)   9461
History                    (703)   (269)    9491
National Geographic        (702)   (276)    9429   570
Science Channel                    [284]    9490
Sci-Fi                             [244]
TBS                                (247)
TLC                                [280]    9488
TNT                         709      75     9420   565
USA                                [242]
Weather Channel                    (362)

HD Only Networks
------------------
Discovery HD Theater        700      76     9421   555
HDNet                                79     9422
HDNet Movies                         78     9423
MHD                         725    (332)    9492
Mojo                        706
MGM                                [255]
Smithsonian                        (267)
Universal HD                708      74     9427   560
 
Specialty Sports
------------------
Big Ten Network                    (220)
Fuel TV                            [612]
Golf/Versus HD                     (604)    9468
NBA TV                            [601-1]
NFL Network HD                     (212)    9464
Speed                              [607]

RSNs
------------------
FSN West                           [652]     367
FSN Prime Ticket                   [653]     361
FSN Arizona                                  365
FSN Bay Area                        

Sports Subscriptions
------------------
MLB Extra Innings HD         no     yes       no
NBA League Pass HD          ???     yes      yes
NHL Center Ice HD           ???     yes      yes
NFL Sunday Ticket HD         no     yes       no

Premium Networks
------------------
HBO East                             70     9456
HBO West                    710    (504)           510
Cinemax East                       (512)    9458
Cinemax West                711    (514)           530
Showtime East                        71     9460
Showtime West               720    (540)           520
Starz East                         (520)    9435
Starz West                  721    (521)   
Starz Comedy                       (519)
Starz Edge                         (522)
Starz Kids & Family                (518)

Voom Networks
------------------
Animania HD                                 9474
Equator HD                                  9471
Family Room HD                              9486
Film Fest HD                                9480
Gallery HD                                  9472
GamePlay HD                                 9485
HDNews                                      9482
Kung Fu HD                                  9479
Monsters HD                                 9481
Rave HD                                     9470
Rush HD                                     9476
Treasure HD                                 9477
Ultra HD                                    9478
World Cinema HD                             9475
WorldSport HD                               9473
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post #5636 of 8956
9/5/07 at 7:29pm
It would be a favor to list the HD channels the carriers actually carry now, not rumored.
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post #5637 of 8956
9/5/07 at 11:41pm
A friend of mine living in the Cincinatti, Ohio area, reports that the new Direct TV satellites became functional at 3 AM yesterday morning.
Would it be too much to suppose that the same is true here in the Las Vegas area?
Goodbye Cox!!. NOT nice to have known ya.
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post #5638 of 8956
9/6/07 at 11:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Word Maestro View Post

A friend of mine living in the Cincinatti, Ohio area, reports that the new Direct TV satellites became functional at 3 AM yesterday morning.
Would it be too much to suppose that the same is true here in the Las Vegas area?
Goodbye Cox!!. NOT nice to have known ya.

D10 (one satellite) has been "functioning" in the engineering mode for a few weeks now. However (according to another forum tracking it) it has not reached it's final "parking space". I checked this am; I have no signal from any of the transponders (103b) and, therefore, no new channels.

Different rumors are all over the net, from D* starting up some new channels as early as 9/7...while others refer to the D* press release of 20-40 by 9/14. In either case, Cox will have a lot of catching up to do.
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post #5639 of 8956
9/6/07 at 1:44pm
Quick Question for OTA users about CW and MyTV HD offerings (out of area again).
What are the resolutuions of each of these channels, and what, if any, programming is HD on either channel?
Online documentation seems to point to 16x9 480p upconverted to 1080i video and they make no mention of actually broadcasting HD anywhere on their websites, TitanTv, or any other online sources.

vegggas
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post #5640 of 8956
9/6/07 at 1:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegggas View Post

Quick Question for OTA users about CW and MyTV HD offerings (out of area again).
What are the resolutuions of each of these channels, and what, if any, programming is HD on either channel?
Online documentation seems to point to 16x9 480p upconverted to 1080i video and they make no mention of actually broadcasting HD anywhere on their websites, TitanTv, or any other online sources.

vegggas

CW is 1080i and KVCW passes it through as such. All scripted programming is HD.

MNTV is 720p and KVMY passes it through as such. The "network" is now focusing on reality tv, so I've only seen movies of the week and a repurposed pilot of the FX series Damages in HD on there recently.

As far as "online documentation", if you search this thread you should be able to catch some bitstream analysis I did of the stations a while back.
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