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Sony PlayStation 4 in U.S. Stores November 15 for $399 - Page 5

post #121 of 153
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

http://3dvision-blog.com/9043-hdmi-forum-has-announced-version-2-0-of-the-hdmi-specification/

HDMI 2.0 is finally official, and it uses the same connectors and cables. That significantly increases the chance that the early PS4s can support it with a firmware upgrade, just like the original PS3. Time will tell if it really happens.

Sony Electronics president Phil Molyneux today said that Sony UHDTVs will update to HDMI 2.0 via firmware, in a direct dig against Samsung. There's a good chance the PS4 will share that capability. smile.gif

Also at today's event, Sony demonstrated 60p UHD video playing through HDMI 1.4 (without explaining how it was done).
post #122 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

But isn't the bandwidth still an issue? Or did the PS3 ship with 1.3?

Nope because MVC subcoding still fits within the bitrate limits prescribed by the BDA rules committee and is still wrapped in a ratified H.264 container.
post #123 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Nope because MVC subcoding still fits within the bitrate limits prescribed by the BDA rules committee and is still wrapped in a ratified H.264 container.

What's that got to do with HDMI though? Its completely decompressed by that point.
post #124 of 153
post #125 of 153
I agree with above statements that 60 frames per second is a far more important thing than UHD. 720p60hz is a better gaming experience than 1080p30hz.
post #126 of 153

Don't really care about the big brother cameras for each system, but those VR headsets would be very cool and immersive. Only issue is what would Sony charge? Also, this would need to be wireless.
post #127 of 153
Wireless is great.
post #128 of 153
Sony's other VR headsets were some of the best, but still crap. A PS4 VR helmet would have to rival the Occulus Rift to get my attention.
post #129 of 153
I can see a VR headset being awesome for flight games or racing with in cockpit views with 360 degree radius! Yea, now I'm really hoping for it.
post #130 of 153
Got $2000 to spare?

http://www.polygon.com/2013/9/6/4700636/sony-reveals
post #131 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

Got $2000 to spare?

http://www.polygon.com/2013/9/6/4700636/sony-reveals

Those aren't the "new PS4" gaming glasses. Those are the "new 3DTV" ones.
post #132 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by mastermaybe View Post

I just texted some of my buddies (~35 yrs old) who were video game whores like me and said: "just imagine how insanely jacked we'd be for the ps4 just 10 years ago" and they pretty much universally agreed.

I understand there are plenty of 30 somethings still huge into video games but it passed me (and these guys, apparently) by so unexpectedly (and quickly) out of the blue around 27-28 that I fear it will never rebound. No Madden. No golf. No nuttin.

Now, just give me/us the other "junk" it will do, lmao. tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

James

There are some 40 somethings into games as well.
post #133 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by NuSoardGraphite View Post

There are some 40 somethings into games as well.

And fifty and sixty year old folks into games too.
post #134 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by NuSoardGraphite View Post

There are some 40 somethings into games as well.

I bought my very first console last year. At age 39.
post #135 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeflonDog View Post

I bought my very first console last year. At age 39.
I -OK my Dad, bought my very first console 36 years ago.... I was a lot younger then ;-)
post #136 of 153
I requested that forum member Kraine ask the Sony reps at IFA last week about the HDMI on the PS4. He was told it is HDMI 2.0 (as is also being used with virtually all of the new Sony UHD TVs and projectors announced at IFA to begin shipping within the next few months. It appears that Sony has come up with a source (either internal to Sony or from an outside supplier) for HDMI 2.0 chips
post #137 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I requested that forum member Kraine ask the Sony reps at IFA last week about the HDMI on the PS4. He was told it is HDMI 2.0 (as is also being used with virtually all of the new Sony UHD TVs and projectors announced at IFA to begin shipping within the next few months. It appears that Sony has come up with a source (either internal to Sony or from an outside supplier) for HDMI 2.0 chips

That would be excellent news, I'd prefer to hear it directly from Sony though.
post #138 of 153
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

That would be excellent news, I'd prefer to hear it directly from Sony though.

Last week at a NYC event, Sony Electronics' president said all Sony UHD products are firmware upgradeable to HMDI 2.0. Since the PS4 is a UHD product, I expect it is included in that blanket statement. Sure, he didn't single out the PS4—but the real point is Sony appears to already have the transition to the new standard worked out. Maybe the PS4 will be the exception, I hope not.
Edited by imagic - 9/10/13 at 10:10am
post #139 of 153
We'll see.
post #140 of 153
<<< 35 years old and can't wait to get it!
post #141 of 153
My parents bought pong when I was very young. We then had an atari when I was in elementry school. I bought an Nintendo with my paper route money when I was in 8th grade, I think my mom played it more than I did. Had the PS1 and played a bunch with my roommates at the time. Ps2 slim was bought for GTA SA and thats when I became a computer gamer. 39 years old still play occasionally on PC (buy about 5-6 games a year) undecided on if I will get a PS4 (I skipped the 360 and PS3 because of PC gaming). My old condo where I used to live had Wii bowling every weekend for the retires. They seemed to be having a blast with it.
post #142 of 153
Traded in a couple of my 360's a few months ago, which paid for my PS4 + BF4 order. I also plan on playing Planetside 2, and Destiny for starters. Really looking forward to the better graphics.
post #143 of 153
Got my PS4 launch day edition pre-ordered with Amazon, and much like my PS3 it will just end up being my blu ray player
post #144 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

That would be excellent news, I'd prefer to hear it directly from Sony though.

I'll be talking to Sony reps next week at CEDIA Expo. I'll see what they are willing to disclose about the PS4 as to HDMI 2.0.
post #145 of 153
Will the ps4 support more multichannel audio formats like DTS Neo 11? Probably yes. The ps3 was the first console to suppport lossless audio as it was a bluray player. Some of the first games to use HD audio were on ps3. The Wii U is the only other console to support HDMI audio. Xbox one will be the first console from microsoft to support the hdmi audio format. With the ps4, 1080p 60fps or even 4k is a possiblity. The added plus of having a one year trial of ps plus packaged with ps4 will allow customers to buy ps plus cards much like xbox live gold cards for 360 and xbox one users. No wonder why sony's stock is the best performing japanese stock this year.
post #146 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kascnef82 View Post

Will the ps4 support more multichannel audio formats like DTS Neo 11? Probably yes. The ps3 was the first console to suppport lossless audio as it was a bluray player. Some of the first games to use HD audio were on ps3. The Wii U is the only other console to support HDMI audio. Xbox one will be the first console from microsoft to support the hdmi audio format. With the ps4, 1080p 60fps or even 4k is a possiblity. The added plus of having a one year trial of ps plus packaged with ps4 will allow customers to buy ps plus cards much like xbox live gold cards for 360 and xbox one users. No wonder why sony's stock is the best performing japanese stock this year.

DTS Neo:X is mainly a matrixed post-processing algorithm (like Dolby ProLogic IIx) found in premium receivers and pre-amps. Even the couple titles with actual Neo:X surround material are matrix encoded into normal 7.1 tracks like Dolby EX of yore (where a mono back surround was encoded into the left and right surround channels of a 5.1 track).

The only new surround formats you'll likely see will come when the UHD broadcast specs. are finalized (or if their is a new UHD disc medium). It will probably be in the form of object-oriented audio (or a channel + objects hybrid like Dolby Atmos). DTS is working on their open source format, called Multi-Dimensional Audio (MDA), and Dolby will probably introduce some version of Atmos to compete. DTS MDA just won the 2013 Hollywood Post Alliance Engineering Award. It's an industry sponsored postproduction ceremony. DTS has also formed a pact with Barco (the distributor of Auro3D) to support a commercial roll out of MDA.
Edited by Dan Hitchman - 9/16/13 at 5:19pm
post #147 of 153

I expect there will be a higher channel version of LPCM before that. Otherwise why even implement 32 channels in HDMI 2?

post #148 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I expect there will be a higher channel version of LPCM before that. Otherwise why even implement 32 channels in HDMI 2?

It's possibly HDMI included this in case a format was decoded in some new player coming down the pike with internal audio decoding to multi-channel PCM. That's how a lot of Blu-ray players were back at the beginning of the format since not all surround processors could accept DTS MA and Dolby TrueHD. That will be true again with any future audio format. It's also possible that it has to be able read any number of potential audio flags and be able to know how to route the signals. I doubt we'd see anything close to 32 channels of anything in homes, though it would be nice if the object rendering processors had the potential.

The industry seems gung-ho about object based audio formats due to the immersive nature of the experience and scalability that you cannot get with just channels, and I would expect it to trickle down to consumers. This happened with DTS and Dolby Digital in the laserdisc era. Of course, it was Blu-ray that had 7.1 discrete channels before it was implemented in theaters (sometimes it works in reverse). Atmos, for example, can address up to 64 speakers... all from one soundtrack.

Consumer hardware can grow and expand as needed, and yet the same object audio track can be used. No need to buy another UHD copy of Star Trek or Oblivion, etc. because there wouldn't have to be another mix created (the metadata is already there for the renderer to read and route to your customized speaker layout). Just update your hardware to allow for more speakers.

Even if there was a channel only format introduced with 9.1 or 11.1 or some other channel number before object audio, it would be lossless compressed to save space.
Edited by Dan Hitchman - 9/16/13 at 5:46pm
post #149 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post


It's possibly HDMI included this in case a format was decoded in some new player coming down the pike with internal audio decoding to multi-channel PCM. That's how a lot of Blu-ray players were back at the beginning of the format since not all surround processors could accept DTS MA and Dolby TrueHD. It's also possible that it has to be able read any number of potential audio flags and be able to know how to route the signals. I doubt we'd see anything close to 32 channels of anything in homes.

The industry seems gung-ho about object based audio formats due to the immersive nature of the experience and scalability that you cannot get with just channels, and I would expect it to trickle down to consumers. This happened with DTS and Dolby Digital in the laserdisc era. Of course, it was Blu-ray that had 7.1 discrete channels before it was implemented in theaters (sometimes it works in reverse). Atmos, for example, can address up to 64 speakers... all from one soundtrack.

Consumer hardware can grow and expand as needed, and yet the same object audio track can be used. No need to buy another UHD copy of Star Trek or Oblivion, etc. because there wouldn't have to be another mix created (the metadata is already there). Just update your hardware to allow for more speakers.

Even if there was a channel only format introduced with 9.1 or 11.1 or some other channel number before object audio, it would be lossless compressed to save space.

 

From a film perspective, sure.  But games are already object oriented when they're internally mixed on the fly, disc space isn't relevant. They'd have no problems using as many discrete channels as HDMI would permit. An object oriented codec would just be pushing the mixing out to the receiver instead of internally within the game. Obviously 32 channels is pretty insane for home, but discrete 11.1 to 15.1 is fairly manageable, I'd hate to think that receivers wouldn't support it.

 

I mean, if HDMI 2 supports 32 channels, isn't that basically saying it supports 32 uncompressed PCM channels? If they're going to skip straight to object oriented, what was the point of implementing all those channels to begin with?

post #150 of 153
It's possible that the 32 channel audio spec. in HDMI 2.0 won't even be used. After all, there isn't even a UHD audio format finalized yet (nothing has been ratified). The cart's before the horse in HDMI land. They're anticipating without knowing what's going to be added in any concrete way.

Another possibility is that the HDMI board is trying to make their interface enticing for professional use as a digital audio transport cable too. Though, their compression fit plug and port are terribly flimsy designs. That should have been updated in HDMI 2.0 as well.
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