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Your Home Theater ULF Score - Page 2

post #31 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

So how do I calculate for my JTR Captivators?

They don't play below 15hz, but they'd put a whalloping on many (or most) of the subs on databass. The specs are unpublished.

Follow me on this one...

 

Looking at the SVS PB12 and SB12...at tune of 20hz, the PB12 has 11db increase over it's sealed brother.

 

The closest thing to the JTR Cap driver (30mm xmax) is the UXL-18 (34mm xmax). The UXL at 16hz is 102.1. The tune of the Cap is 17.5 hz. I'd say it's safe to add 8db to the UXL number factoring in the slight loss under tune, and slight difference in xmax.

 

That makes the cap 110.1db at 16hz. Using the ULF Calculator, that equals 4.12 SI's. Since you have two of them, it would be 8.24 SI's @ 16hz.

 

What's your room size? 3500? If so, 3500 / 8.24 = 425@16hz.

 

What do you think?

post #32 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

Who wants to take a shot and giving me an ground plane max output number for the Subm at 10hz? We can certainly get in the ballpark I would think.

Nah, I wouldn't chance it. Might turn this thread into a flame war. This thread is fun so far. Start attempting to "predict" max GP measurements and I "pedict" the thread will take a turn for the worse...not mater how methodical your subjective approach may be. That's just my opinion though.

smile.gif
post #33 of 1882
Thread Starter 

HT ULF Scores updated.

post #34 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post


Nah, I wouldn't chance it. Might turn this thread into a flame war. This thread is fun so far. Start attempting to "predict" max GP measurements and I "pedict" the thread will take a turn for the worse...not mater how methodical your subjective approach may be. That's just my opinion though.

smile.gif

Great point! 

 

I'll ask the question in the "Is the SubM a benchmark sub" thread. cool.gif

post #35 of 1882
JTR had posted an OS to be 120 dBs at 20hz at 1 meter groundplane so 114 dBs at 2 meters. The 10 hz figure seems to be a little optimistic at 101 though. That would be better than dual LMS 5400 and the OS is a single 18 30mm driver below the horn knee. So I would wait on JTR and Seaton stuff. Compression sweeps from Individuals would be helpful.
post #36 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

I just bought my second on craiglist this Sunday for $850! Haven't even integrated it yet!
Remember, this is anechoic measurement. I would think the lower your score, the more extension you will get for your room real world
that's a steal on the Rythmik. Nice pick up. I just now realize it is anechoic. I know how my single FV15hp sounds in my room but look at you guy scores implies I am far behind which I can confirm after listening to Carp's and Archaea's set up. Someday if work sends me to Dom, Pop, MK area, you will hear from me for a demo session.
post #37 of 1882
365.7 at 12.5hz with my 8 190v2's sealed. In room I measured 120 dBs at 10hz. This is where discrepancies become because there is no way dual FV-15hp's would better that system at 12.5hz. I have always had a feeling my 190v2 subs were in a better enclosure and no limits on power compared to the A7s-450.
post #38 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

Thanks. Again, it's all about perspective. Great sub, BTW. smile.gif


I just bought my second on craiglist this Sunday for $850! Haven't even integrated it yet!
Solid score basshead. Gotta like PSA.

Remember, this is anechoic measurement. I would think the lower your score, the more extension you will get for your room real world.

Nice...gotta love the SI's and small rooms!

Talk about ULF on the cheap! smile.gif
 These SI's are no joke. If I had to do it again, I'd build dual opposed SIs I think...

Thanks! Obviously nothing like some of sub systems around here but its decent. also, being Ricci measured 94.4 db @ 12.5hz in room with the xv15, is there a way to calculate that?
post #39 of 1882
^^ 3 XV15's in a 2400 ^3 room are plenty my friend.
post #40 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

So how do I calculate for my JTR Captivators?


They don't play below 15hz, but they'd put a whalloping on many (or most) of the subs on databass. The specs are unpublished.
Follow me on this one...

Looking at the SVS PB12 and SB12...at tune of 20hz, the PB12 has 11db increase over it's sealed brother.

The closest thing to the JTR Cap driver (30mm xmax) is the UXL-18 (34mm xmax). The UXL at 16hz is 102.1. The tune of the Cap is 17.5 hz. I'd say it's safe to add 8db to the UXL number factoring in the slight loss under tune, and slight difference in xmax.

That makes the cap 110.1db at 16hz. Using the ULF Calculator, that equals 4.12 SI's. Since you have two of them, it would be 8.24 SI's @ 16hz.

What's your room size? 3500? If so, 3500 / 8.24 = 425@16hz.

What do you think?

Sounds like some guesswork would have to be in order to come up with any idea. Further complicating the matter is the fact that power handling and sensitivity comparison between the drivers is not really known without comparison measurements. Jeff Permanian, owner of JTR speakers, ran 4000 watts RMS and 7,200 watt peak into the JTR driver in the 2011 Captivators and Orbit Shifters drivers. I've got the older Captivators, from 2011, that were tuned to 20hz, but could use a port plug to get them to 15hz. The UXL-18 is said to be 1,200 watt RMS. The sensitivity on the Captivator/Orbit Shifter drivers was quoted as really high by JTR - at 100dB at 60hz, or 91dB at 20hz as shown in this old capture of Jeff's website from 2011 using the wayback machine.
http://web.archive.org/web/20110419165505/http://jtrspeakers.com/portable/captivator-pro/

The UXL-18 is quoted as 94 dB sensitivity with no frequency given so you can assume it's the peak output frequency?
http://web.archive.org/web/20110419165505/http://jtrspeakers.com/portable/captivator-pro/

So between the sensitivity differences and the power handling differences there will be more confusion than just the cabinet alignment and xmax numbers alone provide.

I guess it boils down the fact that since my sub is unmeasured by Ricci, I'll just stay out of the numbers game in this thread cause anything would be a bit of a guess.

My remaining question is why 10hz was chosen as the measuring stick? It is inaudible, it is below the capability of lots of source, and amplification components, and it seems a bit of an odd benchmark. Any sub but sealed alignment would be producing mostly distortion or harmonics at that frequency - yet - you can't discredit all alignments except sealed -- - especially when evidence exists to the contrary - - - like in the blind KC subwoofer meet of 2012 our group of nine voting enthusiasts couldn't even tell the difference in the alignments with similar similar playback volumes close to reference levels -- with anything from eight 15's in dual opposed sealed, to a pair of ported HSU VTF-15h, to ported Caps, to horn alignment Orbit Shifters etc.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1387178/archaeas-kansas-city-blind-subwoofer-shootout-2012/360#post_21520007

The scoring system being based on 10hz scoring system minimizes subs like the Orthorns (as I understand - these are Ricci's favorite sub he's ever used/measured), the Orbit Shifters, The Captivators, etc. Any THD numbers on any commercial ported subs at 10hz would be darn near worthless - loaded with distortion and harmonics and not really desirable. However. I'd put a pair of JTR Captivators, Orbit Shifters, or Othorns up against a great many of the sealed systems that are touted on this board and I'd wager the majority of auditoners would pick the higher tuned, more powerful horn or ported subs, and never even miss the 10hz stuff (this of course excludes the systems like notnyt, or popalock, or carp, or beast, or etc have). I will stop my rambling with this note: I had considered DIY in the past I was thinking about buying eight Dayton 15's at one point back in mid 2012 when they were on a good sale at parts express. I opened a PM with notnyt, bosso, scott simonian, guys I respect on the forum to know quite a bit about the DIY world and subwoofers in general, and was told that eight Dayton 15's by the math would likely not keep up - or at best just be equitable to my pair of Captivators. That sort of extinguished my DIY flame at the time, and I'm glad the guys were honest with me so I didn't pursue a rabbits trail. When the SI group buy came through I was also considering buying 8 or 12 of them, but by that time I'd been to at least 3 or 4 other meets and pretty much personally and subjectively decided that I didn't care about frequencies below about 15hz because they didn't seem to make any difference to me in the various meets I'd been to when a sub could or couldn't supposedly play those frequencies. The Captivators are already well beyond the volume capability I need and not having much use for the sub sonic frequencies - well I just stayed put.

All the above said - Carp and I agree that his eight SI drivers seem more powerful in his room than my dual captivators, so the math above still doesn't quite work out that two caps are equal to eight 18" SI. I think we also both believe that two orbit shifters would be more powerful than his eight 18" SI if we had to guess based on our past audition experiences. So unless we have the published numbers it really just becomes a guessing game. I think your idea here is cool and I applaud the concept and open request for feedback! I hope the system continues to be discussed and evolves into a very workable metric!
Edited by Archaea - 8/28/13 at 9:14pm
post #41 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post


Sounds like some guesswork would have to be in order to come up with any idea. Further complicating the matter is the fact that power handling and sensitivity comparison between the drivers is not really known without comparison measurements. Jeff Permanian, owner of JTR speakers, ran 4000 watts RMS and 7,200 watt peak into the JTR driver in the 2011 Captivators and Orbit Shifters drivers. I've got the older Captivators, from 2011, that were tuned to 20hz, but could use a port plug to get them to 15hz. The UXL-18 is said to be 1,200 watt RMS. The sensitivity on the Captivator/Orbit Shifter drivers was quoted as really high by JTR - at 100dB at 60hz, or 91dB at 20hz as shown in this old capture of Jeff's website from 2011 using the wayback machine.
http://web.archive.org/web/20110419165505/http://jtrspeakers.com/portable/captivator-pro/

The UXL-18 is quoted as 94 dB sensitivity with no frequency given so you can assume it's the peak output frequency?
http://web.archive.org/web/20110419165505/http://jtrspeakers.com/portable/captivator-pro/

So between the sensitivity differences and the power handling differences there will be more confusion than just the cabinet alignment and xmax numbers alone provide.

I guess it boils down the fact that since my sub is unmeasured by Ricci, I'll just stay out of the numbers game in this thread cause anything would be a bit of a guess.

My remaining question is why 10hz was chosen as the measuring stick? It is inaudible, it is below the capability of lots of source, and amplification components, and it seems a bit of an odd benchmark. Any sub but sealed alignment would be producing mostly distortion or harmonics at that frequency - yet - you can't discredit all alignments except sealed -- - especially when evidence exists to the contrary - - - like in the blind KC subwoofer meet of 2012 our group of nine voting enthusiasts couldn't even tell the difference in the alignments with similar similar playback volumes close to reference levels -- with anything from eight 15's in dual opposed sealed, to a pair of ported HSU VTF-15h, to ported Caps, to horn alignment Orbit Shifters etc.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1387178/archaeas-kansas-city-blind-subwoofer-shootout-2012/360#post_21520007

The scoring system being based on 10hz scoring system minimizes subs like the Orthorns (as I understand - these are Ricci's favorite sub he's ever used/measured), the Orbit Shifters, The Captivators, etc. Any THD numbers on any commercial ported subs at 10hz would be darn near worthless - loaded with distortion and harmonics and not really desirable. However. I'd put a pair of JTR Captivators, Orbit Shifters, or Othorns up against a great many of the sealed systems that are touted on this board and I'd wager the majority of auditoners would pick the higher tuned, more powerful horn or ported subs, and never even miss the 10hz stuff (this of course excludes the systems like notnyt, or popalock, or carp, or beast, or etc have). I will stop my rambling with this note: I had considered DIY in the past I was thinking about buying eight Dayton 15's at one point back in mid 2012 when they were on a good sale at parts express. I opened a PM with notnyt, bosso, scott simonian, guys I respect on the forum to know quite a bit about the DIY world and subwoofers in general, and was told that eight Dayton 15's by the math would likely not keep up - or at best just be equitable to my pair of Captivators. That sort of extinguished my DIY flame at the time, and I'm glad the guys were honest with me so I didn't pursue a rabbits trail. When the SI group buy came through I was also considering buying 8 or 12 of them, but by that time I'd been to at least 3 or 4 other meets and pretty much personally and subjectively decided that I didn't care about frequencies below about 15hz because they didn't seem to make any difference to me in the various meets I'd been to when a sub could or couldn't supposedly play those frequencies. The Captivators are already well beyond the volume capability I need and not having much use for the sub sonic frequencies - well I just stayed put.

All the above said - Carp and I agree that his eight SI drivers seem more powerful in his room than my dual captivators, so the math above still doesn't quite work out that two caps are equal to eight 18" SI. I think we also both believe that two orbit shifters would be more powerful than his eight 18" SI if we had to guess based on our past audition experiences. So unless we have the published numbers it really just becomes a guessing game. I think your idea here is cool and I applaud the concept and open request for feedback! I hope the system continues to be discussed and evolves into a very workable metric!

Archaea, thanks for chiming in. Your feedback is certainly welcome!

 

I agree with the guessing games to a point. The purpose of this scoring system was a 'ballpark' type metric; meaning 1 point lower than another system does NOT mean that "my system is better". I think it's natural to look at it that way because we assign a number to it, but as you have pointed out and I pointed out in the first post; the metric is far from perfect. However, if we keep to the 'ballpark' metric, I think guestimating output of the Cap will generally give you an idea of how you experience ULF compared to others. I'm okay with using 8 SI drivers for the cap at 16hz, because it puts you in the ballpark of F'in loud systems, compared to others.

 

The problem is that folks will interpret this score as something that it is not, and thus the debate begins. So, perhaps it is best to not guess given the nature AVS...sad, but a reality I guess.

 

As to your other question about 10hz...I guess the 'assumed' bar was 10hz because that's the lowest freq that Ricci measures and in a perfect world, everyone could play 121db from DC to your chosen crossover. But in my mind, there is no bar. It is how you want to represent your HT ULF system. If you personally do not care for less than 15hz, determine what your score is at 16hz. The ULF Calculator will let you choose the frequency you want. 

 

Great point about horn subs...taking the lowest frequency measured by Josh is doing that design an injustice. Don't use the 12.5hz conversion then. Use the 16 or 20hz. For the horns, you could have popalock type scores at 16 and 20hz. Awesome! If that's the hz that is important to you, give me that score and forget the rest! Doing that will tell everyone your perspective...yes my subs may go lower, but what's important to me is 16hz and above, and that's why my score is 100@16hz, or whatever the figure you choose.

 

I will go back and update the 1st post so that you can easily convert your subs to SIs at the frequency of your choice. Until then, the HT ULF calculator can give you that info! Or, just get out the pencil and paper, and solve for log(x)! smile.gif

post #42 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by dominguez1 View Post

Let's try a few examples:

Room size = 3000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Epik Empire,
Conversion to SI = 1.1 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 3000 / 1.1 = 2727@12.5hz

Room size = 6000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Dual Rythmik FV15HPs
Conversion to SI = 1.9 x 2 = 3.8 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 6000 / 3.8 = 1579@12.5hz

Dom,

I’m having trouble replicating your above referenced original examples. When entering the examples above, this is that the calculator is telling me.

Room size = 3000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Epik Empire (93.5db@12.5hz)
Conversion to SI = 1.10 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 3000 / 1.1 = 2736@12.5hz

Room size = 6000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Dual Rythmik FV15HPs (98.5db@12.5hz)
Conversion to SI = 1.95 x 2 = 3.9 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 6000 / 3.8 = 1539@12.5hz

Am I doing something wrong? I know it’s not a huge deal, but the results should be repeatable, correct?
post #43 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Dom,

I’m having trouble replicating your above referenced original examples. When entering the examples above, this is that the calculator is telling me.

Room size = 3000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Epik Empire (93.5db@12.5hz)
Conversion to SI = 1.10 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 3000 / 1.1 = 2736@12.5hz

Room size = 6000 cubic feet
Subwoofer = Dual Rythmik FV15HPs (98.5db@12.5hz)
Conversion to SI = 1.95 x 2 = 3.9 at 12.5hz
HT ULF Score = 6000 / 3.8 = 1539@12.5hz

Am I doing something wrong? I know it’s not a huge deal, but the results should be repeatable, correct?
Its because the calculator holds all the decimal places and is the most accurate. if you use the table like I did, you only have 1 decimal. I can change the calculator to round and it will give the same result.
post #44 of 1882
Ok guys…

I took a video of my basement space this morning for some perspective. Sorry for the horrible PQ. Cheap phone video. If you guys get a chance, can you verify that the links in the video work. They won't work for me here at my day job.

I didn’t bust out the tape measure, but I’m confident that my hall connecting to my theater is roughly 7ft wide. That said, I’ve layed out a few options for space calculations as follows:

Option 1
If I count the red portion in this sketch (in addition to my dedicated space) it will add on another 1,092ft^3 bringing the calculated space from 1,512ft^3 up to 2,604ft^3:
BasementLayoutv2_zps5615c22a.jpg

Option 2
If I extended it out to the end of the hall, as depicted in this photo, it will add an additional 560ft^3. Bringing the total calculated space from 2,604ft^3 to 3,164ft^3:
BasementLayoutv3_zps73dc4fe5.jpg

Option 3
Again, if I include the total basement, it brings me in the neighborhood of 6,900 – 7,000ft^3. The 6,904ft^3 I referenced in an earlier post was my best attempt at taking the measurements I identified in my basement layout sketch up, throwing them in an excel spreadsheet and guesimating with all of the unmeasured nooks and crannys. I’ll just stick with the 6,904ft^3 figure for now and if anyone would like for me to take the time to get more detailed, I will do so…

To recap based on the info provided above. Here is my potential scores depending on who wants to draw their own conculsion on what area should/should not be counted:

(HT Space) 1,512ft^3 = 95@10hz
(Option 1) 2,604ft^3 = 163@10hz
(Option 2) 3,164ft^3 = 198@10hz
(Option 3) 6,904ft^3 = 432@10hz


What say you all? Feel free to use whatever calculation/score you prefer Dom.

This makes me want to seal off my room and get more subs…
tongue.gif
post #45 of 1882
Video works. I agree with sealing off your room and adding more subs, gosh smile.gif
post #46 of 1882
Man, I spent way to much time this morning throwing the above post together...lol

So, I was thinking about the calculator last night... Partly because I love spreadsheets and partly because I'm a fan of standardization.

Since the concept of this thread is "ULF" score... What if an individual was to fill in the spreadsheet in it's entirety and post their results, yet you use a set standard (say 16Hz) as the bench mark to be included in the above consolidated list?

I'll give you a few examples of what I am thinking...

Example 1:
SVS PB-13 Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
N/A@10hz
2219@12.5hz
501@16hz
314@20hz
260@25hz
225@31.5hz

Example 2:
LMS-Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
796@10hz
403@12.5hz
260@16hz
204@20hz
179@25hz
157@31.5hz

Here is where I think it get’s interesting from a “ULF” score stand point. Let’s say we arbitrairly remove the 10Hz score from the LMS-U. Looks what it does to the numbers:

LMS-Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
N/A@10hz
815@12.5hz
386@16hz
274@20hz
230@25hz
196@31.5hz

Note, that by removing the 10Hz response it increases the numbers across the board. May not seem fair to individuals lacking response down super low, but do you think it's applicalbe to the "ULF" topic at hand? Just thinking out loud I guess...something else to consider.
post #47 of 1882
Yes pop, you have a point, if we HP our systems so the 10hz and below is filtered out it would give us much more headroom above.
I knew you had walls in there, I would option 3 and not the whole basement as that long hallway will divide the rooms, although option 2 might not be that different.
post #48 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Man, I spent way to much time this morning throwing the above post together...lol

So, I was thinking about the calculator last night... Partly because I love spreadsheets and partly because I'm a fan of standardization.

Since the concept of this thread is "ULF" score... What if an individual was to fill in the spreadsheet in it's entirety and post their results, yet you use a set standard (say 16Hz) as the bench mark to be included in the above consolidated list?

I'll give you a few examples of what I am thinking...

Example 1:
SVS PB-13 Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
N/A@10hz
2219@12.5hz
501@16hz
314@20hz
260@25hz
225@31.5hz

Example 2:
LMS-Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
796@10hz
403@12.5hz
260@16hz
204@20hz
179@25hz
157@31.5hz

Here is where I think it get’s interesting from a “ULF” score stand point. Let’s say we arbitrairly remove the 10Hz score from the LMS-U. Looks what it does to the numbers:

LMS-Ultra x 2, 3000ft^3 Space

Scores:
N/A@10hz
815@12.5hz
386@16hz
274@20hz
230@25hz
196@31.5hz

Note, that by removing the 10Hz response it increases the numbers across the board. May not seem fair to individuals lacking response down super low, but do you think it's applicalbe to the "ULF" topic at hand? Just thinking out loud I guess...something else to consider.
at work and can't digest this post fully yet, but sounds interesting. one thing I would say though is that the way that the calculator works is that it changes scores because it assumes different Subs. Like I said, I'll take a look later and dig in more! Glad to see folks think like me! smile.gif
post #49 of 1882
OK, here's my modest system just for comparison. I'm using the PB13-Ultra's number than - 3db which is what most people said the PB12-Plus's output is, about 3db down across the band from the PB13-Ultra.

2500^3
Dual SVS PB12-Plus
2612 @ 12.5hz
590 @ 16hz
370 @ 20hz
306 @ 25hz
post #50 of 1882
Using sims in winisd only gets an idea because when I put in the SI it does not match the data-bass.
post #51 of 1882

Room size = ~4600 cubic feet (just remember general size from when we bought the house but don't have exact measurement right now)
Subwoofer = Outlaw LFM-1 EX (97.5db @16hz)
Conversion to SI = .97 at 16hz
HT ULF Score = 4600 / .97 = 4761@16hz

 

This is a great very cool thread and a good read.  Cannot wait to see what others post and until I have time to be able to add more to what I have.


Edited by SupaKats - 8/29/13 at 11:33am
post #52 of 1882
So how do we adjust the winisd numbers to correspond with the SI's databass numbers because the SI data does not match up to the winisd numbers for it. Even subratcing 6 dBs don't match up to go from 1M(winisd) to 2 M data-bass.
post #53 of 1882
Thread Starter 
Guys, remember the calculator was meant for adding different subs together. If you use the same sub for each row, it is assuming you have that many more subs as it sums the scores for every line. Thats why the scores get alot better with every frequency. I'll need to change the calculator to work differently if this is the way we go.
post #54 of 1882
Makes sense now, I will just use 10hz, thank you! Still, the output numbers from data-bass are different than winisd even subtracting 6 dBs for distance. Even when I input the power to get 89.2 dBs at 10hz for the SI the 20hz number is much lower on winisd than Data-bass. So even if I wanted to try to compare it is very hard. All I can do is compare in winisd and see what the difference is in dBs although it may not measure that way thru DB.
post #55 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by landshark1 View Post

OK, here's my modest system just for comparison. I'm using the PB13-Ultra's number than - 3db which is what most people said the PB12-Plus's output is, about 3db down across the band from the PB13-Ultra.

2500^3
Dual SVS PB12-Plus
2612 @ 12.5hz
590 @ 16hz
370 @ 20hz
306 @ 25hz

I do not think thats figured correctly. you are suppose to use the si conversion number from dominguez chart, not the output at the given frequency from my understanding.

Using the PB13, the si number is 1.0 @ 16hz and .7 @ 12.5hz

Dual PB13's would have a si of 2.0 in 20hz mode @ 16hz and a si of 1.4 in max ext. mode @ 12.5hz
2500÷1.4=1786 @ 12.5hz
2500÷2 = 1250 @ 16hz

The PB12 plus would have a si of .7 @ 16hz, so duals would give you a si of 1.4.

2500÷1.4 = 1786 @ 16hz
post #56 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post


This is a very strange comment for someone with a score of 379@10hz. I absolutely love the 10-15hz stuff when it happens. It's such a cool feeling, IMO.


I should have said what I meant by that. Recently I have been experimenting with my minidsp's low pass filter to see what kind of impact/feel low bass has in my room.

I used the song Bass I Love You and the Irene scene from Blackhawk Down. I set the LPF at 14hz so that nothing above 14hz (or at least very, very little) is played by the subs. What I found is that the bass didn't do much for me with the LPF set at 14hz. The doors sounded like they wanted to blow open, the room groaned and creaked, but I felt no couch shake and no body feel.

Next, I turned up the LPF to 15hz, and then 16hz, 17hz and so on one step at a time. Each 1 hz increase made a huge difference in couch shake/body feel. It's amazing what a difference 1hz can make in that area of bass.

Now, there is of course a chance I did something wrong and I do understand that Bass I Love You has a huge and repeating hit at roughly 17hz, but I cranked the volume up quite a bit louder when I had the LPF set to 14 hz and there is plenty of content below 14hz on that song and still nothing. Like I said, my room feels it a lot - but I (and the couch) do not.

I am NOT saying that I regret going with 8 SI's. I know I could have had much less enclosure area taking up room space if I had built a couple of large ported to 15hz subs but in my room I have plenty of room for subs so the size of the sub(s) doesn't really matter.
post #57 of 1882
Yes guys, you can not just plug the same sub in at all frequencies.
post #58 of 1882
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Yes guys, you can not just plug the same sub in at all frequencies.

agreed
post #59 of 1882
Carp, how do you know it was playing the low stuff loud enough - were your drivers moving much?
post #60 of 1882
DD, they were moving a TON and very slowly. I kept turning up the volume, I could have gone until the breaker blew maybe I'll try that next time but the low stuff with the drivers moving so slow and moving a lot freaks me out a little bit.
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