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HT with budget $30000 - Page 2

post #31 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post

Just to start...............
Acoustic Treatments ie. minimum including bass trapping: $5000, but can do much cheaper if you're willing to research
Acoustic fabric and channels: $2,000

I did all my fabric panels PLUS all of the acoustic treatments for the entire room for just under $2000 total. If you go with higher end treatments like Quest or some of the others, you will obviously pay more. Just know you can do it for much cheaper if you do your research, as doublewing11 has mentioned.
post #32 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post


Shopping with AVS can do your pocket book good!!!!! smile.gif

On equipment to room % breakdown........................for myself, I'm looking at 25% room to 75 % equipment. That number is based on MSRP prices for equipment, including a $25,000 projector...................and believe me, I paid no where near MSRP for any piece of equipment. wink.gif

Look at this cost breakdown..............


http://www.avsforum.com/t/1434831/the-coffin-build/60 post ...........post 85

 

You are killing me, Doublewing11, ^-^.  I finally see the light at the end of the tunnel as my wife agreed to spend 30k for everything, and just start to get the sense what I will do next, then came with you $25000 projector........Oh, man, can you be mercy enough to let me have a happy weekend!  Cheers!

post #33 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by water48334 View Post

You are killing me, Doublewing11, ^-^.  I finally see the light at the end of the tunnel as my wife agreed to spend 30k for everything, and just start to get the sense what I will do next, then came with you $25000 projector........Oh, man, can you be mercy enough to let me have a happy weekend!  Cheers!

Remember.......................since you are a new member, you can only talk MSRP here! wink.gif

If I was able to write about true cost of equipment.......................I'd be in trouble.

The actually percentage of room to equipment is more like 35-40% room to 60-65% equipment!!! biggrin.gif
post #34 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman View Post

I did all my fabric panels PLUS all of the acoustic treatments for the entire room for just under $2000 total. If you go with higher end treatments like Quest or some of the others, you will obviously pay more. Just know you can do it for much cheaper if you do your research, as doublewing11 has mentioned.

Good comments................

My treatments are Quest products which you pay a pretty penny for............................in addition, it was much easier for me to use fabric channels and not manufacture self-contained panels. Fir striping is cheap........ but the 5 foot long fabric channel is not.
post #35 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post


Remember.......................since you are a new member, you can only talk MSRP here! wink.gif

If I was able to write about true cost of equipment.......................I'd be in trouble.

The actually percentage of room to equipment is more like 35-40% room to 60-65% equipment!!! biggrin.gif

 

Thanks again, Doublewing11.  I will keep that in mind and hopefully get in touch with Mike tomorrow.

 

I know you cannot tell, but is it possible that you could enlight me which way to go about off MSRP for the equipment....I promise I will buy you fancy dinner if I am in your city;) .   I could only find one dealers locally to have Klipsch, all others are somehow look down at it for reasons I don't understand, one of them specifically gave low mark for Onkyo 3010 or 5010.  At the same time, the sound from the speaks they referred, I am not impressed, probably they did not show me the middle end speaks.  I heard ultra2 once before and think it fits my need, maybe even overkill for the 21x13 room.  Sometime, I thought RF-7 II should be enough for me for now, but I need to extra two speakers to make it 7.1/2.

post #36 of 52
Suggestions:
Buy and read this first before you do anything else http://shop.avscience.com/The-Home-Theater-Course_p_427.html

Do NOT buy your equipment to soon....plan, design, build your room, buy your equipment when 75% complete, newer features/specs always roll into gear.
post #37 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

Suggestions:
Buy and read this first before you do anything else http://shop.avscience.com/The-Home-Theater-Course_p_427.html

Do NOT buy your equipment to soon....plan, design, build your room, buy your equipment when 75% complete, newer features/specs always roll into gear.

Got it, thanks.  After read you guys suggestions, I finally got the sense to the room first,  appreciate it, I am heading that way.

post #38 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by water48334 View Post

Thanks again, Doublewing11.  I will keep that in mind and hopefully get in touch with Mike tomorrow.

I know you cannot tell, but is it possible that you could enlight me which way to go about off MSRP for the equipment....I promise I will buy you fancy dinner if I am in your city;)  .   I could only find one dealers locally to have Klipsch, all others are somehow look down at it for reasons I don't understand, one of them specifically gave low mark for Onkyo 3010 or 5010.  At the same time, the sound from the speaks they referred, I am not impressed, probably they did not show me the middle end speaks.  I heard ultra2 once before and think it fits my need, maybe even overkill for the 21x13 room.  Sometime, I thought RF-7 II should be enough for me for now, but I need to extra two speakers to make it 7.1/2.


I already have! Support AVS Forum and talk to a sales rep! Getting Mike involved is a first step!!!! wink.gif
post #39 of 52
1 more important item to add:

Treat this as a project, make a timeline of things you need to do, and a schedule to do them in.
"Most" people here who DIY seem to be on the 1-2 year minimum turnaround time from HT "start" - planning thru completion, as part time work.
Many skills can be learned, or if you are not comfortable some can be contracted out while you do some.
Hence you establishing a budget is good, but so much more work needs to be done in planning and build phase before spending that $$$

As reference to my HT and it's budget/real costs

Front Proj: Sony VPL-VW60; say $4k for PJ for 2014/2015 PJ (my swag at when you might be done)
+ a-lens UH380 on slide, ; if you are going this route $2k for a b-stock, or more for new
with Darbee Darblet video processor; $300, suggest wait till after your HT initially done
A/V: Denon AVR-4520CI ; approx $2.2k
Emotiva XPA-3 amp; $600 - I have 11.3 set-up so needed this as no AVR currently has 11 amps, mine has 9
Screen: 130" DIY 2.35:1 curved screen; $600-ish, if you buy $1k or so
11.3 speakers: Paradigm Monitor 9's for front, CC-390 center, 4 ADP-390 for rear and back surround, Monitor bookshelf for wides/fronts.; I have about $4k in these, maybe slightly more.
>>Consider DIY speakers via the DIY sound group as alternative

subwoofer: 4 x 15" IB array on Sub1, plus 18" and 15" Stereo Integrity cubes on Sub2; My IB sub $1.3k, the 2 added cube subs $800, total $2.1k
>>Again DIY soundgroup has sub cubes, or better yet now Parts Express is carrying them with drivers bundled to save $$
speaker wire: 500 feet of 14ga/4c, all runs equal length.; $250? (copper prices change too fast)
Seats: 2 rows thru Roman $2.5k
DIY Acoustics: $1.3k

My gear + acoustics + seats total comes to $23k-ish, then add in carpet + pad ($2k top tier), drywall/soundproofing/etc ($2k), AV rack ($500), remotes ($500), $500 12ga/14ga wiring, lighting $500 (fixtures & what not, also add $750 if grafik eye), misc stuff $1k (riser, a-lens slide, etc) .
So yea $30k you should budget for seems ballpark, w/o labor of others.

For reference, that $30k gave me this, and it took 4 years initially, then 3 more for "upgrades" and applying lessons learned:
front view .............. ......................................................Rear view:
HT%252011.3%2520cover%2520off%2520Pano-b.jpg . _MG_5464.jpg

Layout:
HT%2520Plan%25202x4%2520Seats-Riser-acoustics%2520Jan-2013_angles.JPG
Edited by mtbdudex - 9/28/13 at 11:16am
post #40 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

1 more important item to add:

Treat this as a project, make a timeline of things you need to do, and a schedule to do them in.
"Most" people here who DIY seem to be on the 1-2 year minimum turnaround time from HT "start" - planning thru completion, as part time work.
Many skills can be learned, or if you are not comfortable some can be contracted out while you do some.
Hence you establishing a budget is good, but so much more work needs to be done in planning and build phase before spending that $$$

As reference to my HT and it's budget/real costs

Front Proj: Sony VPL-VW60; say $4k for PJ for 2014/2015 PJ (my swag at when you might be done)
+ a-lens UH380 on slide, ; if you are going this route $2k for a b-stock, or more for new
with Darbee Darblet video processor; $300, suggest wait till after your HT initially done
A/V: Denon AVR-4520CI ; approx $2.2k
Emotiva XPA-3 amp; $600 - I have 11.3 set-up so needed this as no AVR currently has 11 amps, mine has 9
Screen: 130" DIY 2.35:1 curved screen; $600-ish, if you buy $1k or so
11.3 speakers: Paradigm Monitor 9's for front, CC-390 center, 4 ADP-390 for rear and back surround, Monitor bookshelf for wides/fronts.; I have about $4k in these, maybe slightly more.
>>Consider DIY speakers via the DIY sound group as alternative

subwoofer: 4 x 15" IB array on Sub1, plus 18" and 15" Stereo Integrity cubes on Sub2; My IB sub $1.3k, the 2 added cube subs $800, total $2.1k
>>Again DIY soundgroup has sub cubes, or better yet now Parts Express is carrying them with drivers bundled to save $$
speaker wire: 500 feet of 14ga/4c, all runs equal length.; $250? (copper prices change too fast)
Seats: 2 rows thru Roman $2.5k
DIY Acoustics: $1.3k

My gear + acoustics + seats total comes to $23k-ish, then add in carpet + pad ($2k top tier), drywall/soundproofing/etc ($2k), AV rack ($500), remotes ($500), $500 12ga/14ga wiring, lighting $500 (fixtures & what not, also add $750 if grafik eye), misc stuff $1k (riser, a-lens slide, etc) .
So yea $30k you should budget for seems ballpark, w/o labor of others.

For reference, that $30k gave me this, and it took 4 years initially, then 3 more for "upgrades" and applying lessons learned:
front view .............. ......................................................Rear view:
HT%252011.3%2520cover%2520off%2520Pano-b.jpg . _MG_5464.jpg

Layout:
HT%2520Plan%25202x4%2520Seats-Riser-acoustics%2520Jan-2013_angles.JPG

Cannot thank you enough, mtbdudex.  This is exactly the post I am looking for with clear step by step instructions from room to equipment. 

 

However, I am not that handy as you guys to do so many things little by little, I know it would be fun to learn and practice, I don't believe I could do these (shame on me!).  So I will find someone do it.  I am thinking about the timeline, but, sorry again, I am not patient to finish it in years.  I probably find someone to complete the construction in 1-2 months, then, while studying and comparing more speakers combinations, and try to get them.

 

I really need sometime to study your post carefully, there are too much information/education to digest for me, thanks again.

post #41 of 52
Understood, then I suggest you outsource making your plans to erksine group at $1.8k, then add $12-15k for labor, act as your own general contractor.
Budget now $50k.
Pull permits for everything, minimum 4-5 months still.
Regards, mike r


Sent from my 32GB iPhone4 using Tapatalk
post #42 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post

Understood, then I suggest you outsource making your plans to erksine group at $1.8k, then add $12-15k for labor, act as your own general contractor.
Budget now $50k.
Pull permits for everything, minimum 4-5 months still.
Regards, mike r


Sent from my 32GB iPhone4 using Tapatalk

 

Thanks again.  Have a wonderful weekend!

post #43 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by water48334 View Post

Thanks again.  Have a wonderful weekend!

If you plan on DIY'ing it but aren't 100% handy, then spending the money with the Dennis E group is a value added investment. Between his plans and what you can get from here on execution...you, might get near that 30k since you will be spending efficiently. Secondarily, it might give the wife a bit of comfort as you go forward. You can say "honey, but these plans are from a nationally known and regarded HT designer". Furthermore, there are some very well known contractors on this forum that can give you a solid step in the right direction (e.g. the base foundation) for a reasonable cost. My guess is you still need 4-5 months before the first 2x4 will even leave the hardware store. However you go about it....PLAN.

My basement isn't even close to what some people are doing here. It is a joke compared to some and I probably spent nearly 50-60 hours in research just to get where I am. I couldn't imagine how many hours they REALLY spent before they even spent that first $.
post #44 of 52
Quote:
for myself, I'm looking at 25% room to 75 % equipment

From what I can tell, you did your room right. I can see spending that much more on equipment on well-designed and excuted room. However, the OP has only single layer of drywall and in-wall wiring wherever the builder decided it should go. In his case, I'd have to say 75% room, 25% equipment.
post #45 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlogan6797 View Post


From what I can tell, you did your room right. I can see spending that much more on equipment on well-designed and excuted room. However, the OP has only single layer of drywall and in-wall wiring wherever the builder decided it should go. In his case, I'd have to say 75% room, 25% equipment.

 

 I very much appreciate your input, but I feel very reluctant to spend 22.5k for the room, only 7.5k for equipment, especially I am looking at Epson 5030, good screen around 2k, relatively good receiver of around 2k, so really not much left for speakers.

 

Another factor is: I am really an entry-entry-entry level of listener, my ears are not same level as most of you.  From the above posts and others I read, now I am completely understand how  important to do the room first and do it right, then upgrade equipment later slowly.  However, I am like  in a fast-food chain now and feel the urge to complete it asap before my wife changes her mind, that's where I came from and  I know it is completely out of high level audiophiles' logic from you guys.

 

That's also part of reason I want to choose ultra2 because they are either standing or mount on wall, not like in-wall speakers, so I might have a chance to remove it if I have save enough later to re-do the room, again, sorry, not a logic way to do.

post #46 of 52
Quote:
Another factor is: I am really an entry-entry-entry level of listener, my ears are not same level as most of you.

If THAT's the case, can you tell the difference bertween the really high-end equipment and mid- or entry-level equipment? It's been said by the REAL experts around here that $20k speakers in a crappy room will still sound crappy.

But if you insist, I could recommend the best speakers you can afford. In the end, that's what you REALLY hear. Then upgrade the rest of equipment as you have $$$. And try to find equipment from dealers that you can actually audtion in YOUR room and return if you don't like it.
post #47 of 52
Where do you live? If you're near Washington DC having someone like BIG over would REALLY help. I too think if you are talking 30k budget for a theater room that putting money toward design is well worth it. Either from BIG, or Erskine, etc. Always plan first.

Also, just a quick takeaway, you made a comment about "Panels from Magnolia". Don't bother. All you really need is a 2" piece of OC703 which is wrapped in GOM. You can hang that, frame it, or mount it to the wall and cover the walls completely. It is very cheap to make.

I also agree with the long list of people here saying that on the budget you are on, your room is your #1 priority. Even with those of us who put in a lot of money to our rooms, there are things we still wish we did better... but it is a nightmare to do. You can always buy a new AVR or SUB but tearing down walls is not something you will want to do in the future.

You can take a look at the first page of my build thread if you want to see what my cost breakdown was. My total budget was in the mid 30s, but I did already have most of my audio equipment. Still, you can see how much I spent on things and where the major costs come in. For me the highest cost ITEMS were the Chairs and the Projector. The highest total cost was the labor, but relatively speaking, my labor costs were at an excellent discount, and if you are handy and can work along with any paid help, you will save money and learn things in the process. Though I love my theater, I still miss working on it. (Not the painting though)
post #48 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by water48334 View Post

I am really an entry-entry-entry level of listener, my ears are not same level as most of you.  From the above posts and others I read, now I am completely understand how  important to do the room first and do it right, then upgrade equipment later slowly.  However, I am like  in a fast-food chain now and feel the urge to complete it asap before my wife changes her mind, that's where I came from and  I know it is completely out of high level audiophiles' logic from you guys.

That's also part of reason I want to choose ultra2 because they are either standing or mount on wall, not like in-wall speakers, so I might have a chance to remove it if I have save enough later to re-do the room, again, sorry, not a logic way to do.

If you don't consider yourself to be an audiophile, you could probably free up some cash for acoustic treatments by spending less on your speakers and receiver. $12k is a lot to spend for a speaker/receiver package if it doesn't leave you enough funds to properly address room acoustics.

I don't consider myself to be an audiophile either. My overall budget was similar to yours and I wound up spending 35% of the budget on equipment (7.1 surround, receiver, projector, screen, remote). The rest was spent as follows: 49% for room improvements, 11% for seating and 5% for tools and misc. supplies. It doesn't sound like you intend to do much as far as room improvements, but what you do intend to do will most likely be hired help, so perhaps your final breakdown will be similar.

For components similar to the ones listed in your $12K speaker/receiver package, I spent about $5700 (or would have if I went with a 2nd sub). I'm not saying my components are an apples/apples comparison to the Klipsch Utra2 system, but I can tell you I'm very happy with what I have (although I would like a 2nd sub smile.gif ). If you do your research, I'm confident you will be able to come up with a decent equipment package that still leaves you enough $ to properly finish the room. Rushing into it without having a plan though is a recipe for disaster.
post #49 of 52
Thread Starter 

Hi, everyone,

 

I am going to put an end to this post.  I am overwhelmed by so many helpful, practical and honest opinions, and I really appreciate everyone's input.  I have learned quite a lot lot from all of you (my learning curve jumped quite some for the past several days).

 

I am now working with an AVS team into the detail, and hopefully I will be back with some pictures in several months.

 

Thank you so much, take care and enjoy all of your settings.

 

Cheers!

post #50 of 52
Yeah...I think you got depth charged in this thread. Bud glad you didn't take it the wrong way. Really looking forward to see what happens in your space!
post #51 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by water48334 View Post

Hi, everyone,

I am going to put an end to this post. 
Over- Over? It ain't over.... biggrin.gif
post #52 of 52
I purchased about $10-$12K worth of equipment used for $4500 through various sources. Been great for the last 5 years. It would be a good way to save yourself some money and stay under budget!
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