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Official Sony VPL-VW500ES / VW600ES 4K Projector Thread - Page 41

post #1201 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdfein View Post

The recent discussion has got me curious about the whole bulb life / cost equation. So if this is obvious to y'all that have owned projectors before, then I apologize. So I was doing some looking and it appears that the bulb for the VW600ES is the LMP-H260. Sony Parts and Accessories doesn't yet list this item.

They did carry (albeit not in stock) the spare lamp for the vw1000ES. The LMP-H330. Interestingly the Sony price for the lamp is $699.99. I know that the 100ES was a $25k item, but I guess I was a little surprised at the list price for the bulb. I checked out a few of the lamp supplies listed at Projector Central and none of them carry a listing for this bulb, or for the 600ES for that matter. So I suppose it might be too early for last years PJ's to need a new bulb and I believe I recall hearing that the 1000ES came with a spare bulb.

With my 600ES on order and my guesstimate that it will see on average 2hrs of use per day per year for 700-800hrs per year, I guess I was thinking I might be needing to change the bulb once a year. So if the bulb ends up running $700 per, this becomes a not insignificant annual maintenance cost.

I suppose these are "1st world problems" and must sound like I am the guy complaining about how much it costs to replace the tires on his Ferrari.

I just wanted to share my observation.

The MSRP for the VW500/600 lamp is the same as the VW1000/1100 lamp, $699. 500 hours of lamp life on a system that sees 800 to 1,000 hours a year is not an insignificant cost of ownership and that is why it should be considered in the system design. It should be brought into the discussion so that the customer can decide if the cost is worth it for the screen size.
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post #1202 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsteak View Post

Enter the newbie.

I'm building a new room, and what I find frustrating is trying to discern what is a good match. The manufacturers' websites/tools all give ranges of acceptance, but not suggested optimal solutions (unless I'm not finding the correct information). When I query them directly by email or phone with my room parameters, I always get directed to their literature. The AV shops I've dealt with aren't much better. My question of "which projector would work best in my room" are usually met with "any projector we sell" answers. When I go to ProjectorCentral and use their calculator, it gives me an idea, but when I bring those results to the "A/V specialists" or the manufacturer, they poopoo the results ("you have to take those things with a grain of salt").

Is there a definitive answer to "which projector / screen combination would work best in my media room"? Perhaps I'm just asking the wrong people, or should I take a CEDIA course and learn for myself? As a newbie, I"m trying to learn as fast as I can but there seems to be a plethora of misinformation and contradiction out there. The audio end of things is a piece of cake compared to the video.

If we can help you with recommendations and pricing, give us a call or shoot us an email.
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post #1203 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

The MSRP for the VW500/600 lamp is the same as the VW1000/1100 lamp, $699. 500 hours of lamp life on a system that sees 800 to 1,000 hours a year is not an insignificant cost of ownership and that is why it should be considered in the system design. It should be brought into the discussion so that the customer can decide if the cost is worth it for the screen size.

OK, yes, this is a significant price for the lamp , more than any other I have seen to date no doubt. This debate about lamp price has been going on for some time, even when the PJ was sub $3500 and the lamp $250 or so. The 1000 was selling for $28000, the 600 now is $15000 . A new lamp at
$699 is , well, no big surprise to be honest, it is all relative .

Not sure how many are putting 1000 hours on their PJ a year though, I'll personally be hard pressed to make 500 to be honest. I put more on during the winter months when it's colder and dark. When summer arrives my PJ will take a back seat to nature. Speaking of nature, time to strap on the snow shoes and go pound out a few hours of fitness before the next big over-the-top meal.
post #1204 of 2792
The bulb for the Qualia 004 was $3000, a high powered xenon bulb. The Qualia came with a voucher for a new bulb. The Sony 1000ES does not come with a voucher for a new bulb. In my experience Sony bulbs will be available at a discount but perhaps not a big one. Even if under Sony sure pricing because people will bitch to their dealer that the bulb didn't last long enough and the dealer will try and help the customer out with a new lamp at a discount. The 1000ES to 1100ES upgrade kit includes a new bulb and this will be the first projector I have ever owned where I wanted a new bulb. I have changed quite a few for customers though, but not on 1000ES. If the possibility of spending money on a new bulb is really bothersome to you, it would be best to not get involved with a projector. Projectors are like British sports cars in the 60s but not as bad. Projectors do require what I would call tune ups but will run quite well without one. It becomes a question of the level of performance you get from the beast and whether it will most sit parked in your HT or actually be run significantly there.f
Edited by mark haflich - 1/1/14 at 11:58am
post #1205 of 2792
Its possible that some people paid a lot more than they were expecting and do not have anything left over. Just because they wanted something that they could afford at that time, does not mean they will have an extra $500-700 to spend on an annual maintenance fee. A lot of people buy cars, then can't afford sudden repairs that occur.
post #1206 of 2792

What is Sony's official estimated lamp lifetime for VW500/600 (I've seen the 1000 hours warranty on the bulb but not the expected bulb lifetime) ? Do we have to expect to change the lamp much before the manufacturer's estimate ?

 

Bulb life is easy to find for hw55es on the official website, but not for 500 / 1000 ... 

post #1207 of 2792
For those looking for 3d glasses that work, I've used the Samsung SSG-5100GB 3D Active Glasses and they seem to work fine. Note that I am still waiting on delivery of the Sony 3d glasses, so I have no comparison to provide. ~$18 at Amazon.

Have any of you with the Sony media server been having any issues with connectivity when changing movies? So far I've only been able to watch a little Bridge Over River Kwai (with all the bowl games). I finally got 4K to work switching from HDMI input 1 to input 2. Apparently 4K has to go to input 2.

Happy New Year
Paul
post #1208 of 2792
I agree. But I think one must plan on it. The bad situation is when one's economic situation drastically changes. But the situation is the same. Gasoline, home heating water, insurance sewage to keep you fixed chattel going. No different for a projector. Especially if it breaks outside of warranty. I new bulb should be considered in a projector's operating cost just as its power consumption should be. Suppose a bulb is bright enough for 1000 hours. assume one buys a replacement blessed by Mr. Sony for $600 shipped complete. That's 60 cents per hour of operation. Put that in some sort of piggy bank every hour you watch. What is scary is how much power your projector uses when on and even if on low power standby. I am just guessing but I bet total electric power costs will exceed bulb costs over the 1000 hour estimated operating life.
post #1209 of 2792
There is a bit of a price to pay for 1600+ D65 lumens. What other projector can put out this much light at this price range that is 4K capable?

I only need low lamp on the 600/1000, I bet it will last quite a long time in my setup. It still torches the HP screen in low lamp, I was squinting last night during bright scenes which is just how I like it... biggrin.gifcool.gif
post #1210 of 2792
Appreciate all the comments. Please don't mistake my intent. I knew there was a periodic cost of bulbs, but as the 600 will be my first PJ I was just surprised by the cost. I imagine that a year from now bulbs may be a little cheaper as well.

Ever since I saw the 1000es a year ago and fell in love (more like have to have it) with 4k on a 100+ inch screen I've been waiting for it to become more affordable by my standard to make the jump. My point on bulb cost was just that in all my research since the 500/600 was announced and then these past few months in conversations with dealers, the maint cost was never raised to me (save by AVS Mike). While I do think its a lot to pay on a possible annual basis, knowing allows me to anticipate rather than be surprised. In the scheme of things it's less than 5% of the PJ cost. My old Sammy DLP rear projection was approx 2k and the replacement lamp was about $200. By comparison though I only had to replace the DLP bulb once in 10yrs. Very different technology so maybe not a valid comparison, but sharing my $0.02 all the same.

I just think prospective buyers should have as much information as possible.
post #1211 of 2792
I would not expect any change in bulb prices. Bulbs are OEMed for manufacturers by third parties. The manufacturer supplies the packaging and offers the warranty it has flowing from the OEMer..
post #1212 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

Its possible that some people paid a lot more than they were expecting and do not have anything left over. Just because they wanted something that they could afford at that time, does not mean they will have an extra $500-700 to spend on an annual maintenance fee. A lot of people buy cars, then can't afford sudden repairs that occur.

People do over extend themselves for everything, be that home, car, rv's etc. When the maintenance comes, and it will, they are not prepared .
post #1213 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View PostThe MSRP for the VW500/600 lamp is the same as the VW1000/1100 lamp, $699. 500 hours of lamp life on a system that sees 800 to 1,000 hours a year is not an insignificant cost of ownership and that is why it should be considered in the system design. It should be brought into the discussion so that the customer can decide if the cost is worth it for the screen size.

That is an expensive lamp!!!

post #1214 of 2792
I am guessing the bulb life will be alot longer than 500 hours even at high lamp..

Craig
post #1215 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by gdfein View PostEver since I saw the 1000es a year ago and fell in love (more like have to have it) with 4k on a 100+ inch screen I've been waiting for it to become more affordable by my standard to make the jump.

I just think prospective buyers should have as much information as possible.

Me too, remember when 1080p projector were $26,999 now you can find them starting at $999 :)  Sony Qualia-004 Projector any one : http://www.soundandvision.com/content/sony-qualia-004-sxrd-video-projector-specifications

 

Talk about overpriced! Here we go again 10 year later the VPL1100ES

post #1216 of 2792
I am coming up on 2 years use on my 1000ES. I don't think it was over priced at all and Sony is upgrading it to the new model and supplying one of those break the bank HS Wow expensive lamps (I just discovered my car needed high test gas, salesman never told me). Server and tablet too. Price, basically the difference between a 1100ES without the goodies and a 1000ES. The 1000/1100ES has a much more expensive lens than the 500/600. The 500/600 lenses are adequate just as many cheap camera lens are adequate. But it you want the good stuff and top optical performance, don't kid yourself that you get that with a 500/600. And testers that have both side by side will attest. maybe the 1000/1100 is underpriced. Sure there will be less expensive 4K projectors but I am pretty sure they won't out perform the 1000/1100 optically and in many other ways including calibrated brightness.
post #1217 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View PostI am coming up on 2 years use on my 1000ES. I don't think it was over priced at all and Sony is upgrading it to the new model and supplying one of those break the bank HS Wow expensive lamps (I just discovered my car needed high test gas, salesman never told me). Server and tablet too. Price, basically the difference between a 1100ES without the goodies and a 1000ES. The 1000/1100ES has a much more expensive lens than the 500/600. The 500/600 lenses are adequate just as many cheap camera lens are adequate. But it you want the good stuff and top optical performance, don't kid yourself that you get that with a 500/600. And testers that have both side by side will attest. maybe the 1000/1100 is underpriced. Sure there will be less expensive 4K projectors but I am pretty sure they won't out perform the 1000/1100 optically and in many other ways including calibrated brightness.

Good for you yes Lenses are expensive

 

AF-S NIKKOR
800mm f/5.6E FL ED VR

 
$17,899.95
What's in the box
  • HK-38 Lens Hood
  • LN-2 Lens Strap
  • CT-801 Trunk Case
  • 52mm Screw-on NC Filter
  • LF-4 Rear Lens Cap
Nikon
post #1218 of 2792
That's a very rare lens and is actually intended to be used with a unique tele extender specifically made for that lens and matched by serial number. If you lose it you are screwed and the lens contains all sorts of warnings. No. I don't own it but if I were younger and more physically able to lug long lenses around and were shooting more, I would have purchased it. Obviously you can get the same magnifying power with other lenses and tele extender combinations and 1/2 frame sensors etc, but it does present a unique angle of view. In the field on group photo shoots it will draw attention just like a really expensive car but it won't help you pick up chicks like the car will.
post #1219 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

That's a very rare lens and is actually intended to be used with a unique tele extender specifically made for that lens and matched by serial number. If you lose it you are screwed and the lens contains all sorts of warnings. No. I don't own it but if I were younger and more physically able to lug long lenses around and were shooting more, I would have purchased it. Obviously you can get the same magnifying power with other lenses and tele extender combinations and 1/2 frame sensors etc, but it does present a unique angle of view. In the field on group photo shoots it will draw attention just like a really expensive car but it won't help you pick up chicks like the car will.

Who needs the chicks anyway? What's most important is the fact the guys will all know who has the longest one......correct ? . biggrin.gif
post #1220 of 2792
Quote:
I am coming up on 2 years use on my 1000ES. I don't think it was over priced at all and Sony is upgrading it to the new model and supplying one of those break the bank HS Wow expensive lamps (I just discovered my car needed high test gas, salesman never told me). Server and tablet too. Price, basically the difference between a 1100ES without the goodies and a 1000ES. The 1000/1100ES has a much more expensive lens than the 500/600. The 500/600 lenses are adequate just as many cheap camera lens are adequate. But it you want the good stuff and top optical performance, don't kid yourself that you get that with a 500/600. And testers that have both side by side will attest. maybe the 1000/1100 is underpriced. Sure there will be less expensive 4K projectors but I am pretty sure they won't out perform the 1000/1100 optically and in many other ways including calibrated brightness.

The 1000 / 1100 is a quality projector. I'll bet it serves you well for several more years Mark. There may be less expensive 4K projectors coming, but there will be more expensive ones too. Top quality projectors will always be expensive.
post #1221 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I agree. But I think one must plan on it. The bad situation is when one's economic situation drastically changes. But the situation is the same. Gasoline, home heating water, insurance sewage to keep you fixed chattel going. No different for a projector. Especially if it breaks outside of warranty. I new bulb should be considered in a projector's operating cost just as its power consumption should be. Suppose a bulb is bright enough for 1000 hours. assume one buys a replacement blessed by Mr. Sony for $600 shipped complete. That's 60 cents per hour of operation. Put that in some sort of piggy bank every hour you watch. What is scary is how much power your projector uses when on and even if on low power standby. I am just guessing but I bet total electric power costs will exceed bulb costs over the 1000 hour estimated operating life.

With 10,000 watts RMS in my system, the projector lamp is just a small amount of the power used. smile.gif
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post #1222 of 2792
Mike. You need to get one of these coming soon new Sony wrap around gaming and HT glasses and a multichannel headphone set and processor and you are done. In a few years, the glasses will be 4K instead of 720p (here's hoping they will be 1080p).
Edited by mark haflich - 1/3/14 at 2:41pm
post #1223 of 2792
Just finished watching Star Trek Into Darkness on Blu-ray and had to post immediately. The picture on this projector is absolutely fantastic! I was honestly blown away by what I just saw - and I say this as someone who calibrates almost every day professionally therefore having opportunity to see all manner of displays - the good, the bad and the ugly. Just wow!
post #1224 of 2792
Would someone be so kind as to put in the AVS 709 HD disc 2d and navigate to the misc. patterns and select D (the resolution patterns) and tell me what they see on their screen?

Mine looks like this: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1506530/ultimate-sony-vpl-vw500es-vw600es-information-thread/90#post_24152874

That is with sharpness at 0 and RC off.

thanks!

Brian
post #1225 of 2792
Though I don't have a 500/600, on the 1000ES even upscaled DVDs look fantastic. Its hard to tell they are not Blurys, Uoscaled Bluerays look great. I do prefer the upscaling to be by the Lumagen 2041 at 3840 x 2160 at 24 which allows the RC to do its stuff and to be accurately set without introducing artifacts..
post #1226 of 2792
Brian. I don't have that disc or a 600 or I would do it. I suggest PMing Zombie10K. I am sure he will do it quickly for you.

You might try engaging RC and trying various noise filtering settings. This might make the blotchiness go away. I assume you don't see the abnormallies except on test patterns of the type you are using which the Sony just can't handle well.
Edited by mark haflich - 1/3/14 at 3:30pm
post #1227 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canary_Jules View Post

Just finished watching Star Trek Into Darkness on Blu-ray and had to post immediately. The picture on this projector is absolutely fantastic! I was honestly blown away by what I just saw - and I say this as someone who calibrates almost every day professionally therefore having opportunity to see all manner of displays - the good, the bad and the ugly. Just wow!

Better than the new JVC RS57?
post #1228 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

Brian. I don't have that disc or a 600 or I would do it. I suggest PMing Zombie10K. I am sure he will do it quickly for you.

You might try engaging RC and trying various noise filtering settings. This might make the blotchiness go away. I assume you don't see the abnormallies except on test patterns of the type you are using which the Sony just can't handle well.

I haven't spent enough time yet with actual material. The test pattern problem came about when I was doing the basic adjustments--brightness, contrast, sharpness, etc.

Take a look below. The full white field is excellent (even better than the camera would suggest). Then see the pretty colors on the single pixel pattern. Not the best picture, but you can see the colors in the same place on the small grid pattern. I tried these identical patterns on my Panasonic plasma and they are perfectly fine.

B.

PS. I talked with tech support today and the guy said he had never seen anything like that and would forward to a "higher up" and see what he thought. I'm waiting till Monday to see what he says. In the meantime I will take your advice and try fiddling with the settings and see if there is any difference.

sonyfullfieldwhite100percent.JPG 1508k .JPG file
sonypixel.JPG 1996k .JPG file
sonygrid.JPG 2982k .JPG file

Here are the pics to easily view in the thread:



post #1229 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View PostI haven't spent enough time yet with actual material. The test pattern problem came about when I was doing the basic adjustments--brightness, contrast, sharpness, etc.  Take a look below. The full white field is excellent (even better than the camera would suggest). Then see the pretty colors on the single pixel pattern. Not the best picture, but you can see the colors in the same place on the small grid pattern. I tried these identical patterns on my Panasonic plasma and they are perfectly fine.  B.

PS. I talked with tech support today and the guy said he had never seen anything like that and would forward to a "higher up" and see what he thought. I'm waiting till Monday to see what he says. In the meantime I will take your advice and try fiddling with the settings and see if there is any difference.

sonyfullfieldwhite100percent.JPG 1508k .JPG file
sonypixel.JPG 1996k .JPG file
sonygrid.JPG 2982k .JPG file

Here are the pics to easily view in the thread:



Whoa that's interesting

post #1230 of 2792
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View Post

Would someone be so kind as to put in the AVS 709 HD disc 2d and navigate to the misc. patterns and select D (the resolution patterns) and tell me what they see on their screen?

Mine looks like this: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1506530/ultimate-sony-vpl-vw500es-vw600es-information-thread/90#post_24152874

That is with sharpness at 0 and RC off.

thanks!

Brian

I will check this out tomorrow morning on my 600. The pictures you posted are crazy looking!
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