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Monster's University 3D (Blu-ray) Official AVSForum Review - Page 2

post #31 of 97
Watched this last night in 2d and really enjoyed it. I thought it was close to on par with the first which I was not expecting.

Really fun audio track with lots of movement around the room and good low end support. PQ was insanely good! eek.gif I love 3d and hope I can check it out at some point for this title, but there is still nothing that beats reference quality 2d animation for me when the mood strikes.
post #32 of 97
Thank you all for the posts on this thread. I have an Oppo BDP-93 and was experiencing significant audio dropout on TrueHD. We actually switched over and watched the DVD. I'm going to test it again with PCM right now.
post #33 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post

Yes, the Dolby TrueHD audio dropout issue is a strange bug that seems to affect a handful of titles and players. My Oppo exhibited it but my Panasonic played flawlessly.,

Hello Ralph,
Could you please mention any dropouts in future reviews when you notice the problem?
I wasn't surprised when it affected my older Oppo 83, but it also sputtered on my newer Sony 770 which just gained a firmware update. Switching to PCM was of course the workaround, as usual with these problematic titles.
Regards,
Stefan
PS - I think you nailed the review otherwise!
post #34 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

Hello Ralph,
Could you please mention any dropouts in future reviews when you notice the problem?
I wasn't surprised when it affected my older Oppo 83, but it also sputtered on my newer Sony 770 which just gained a firmware update. Switching to PCM was of course the workaround, as usual with these problematic titles.
Regards,
Stefan
PS - I think you nailed the review otherwise!

Greetings,

Thanks for your post Stefan. I generally do mention problems like this in my reviews. In this case I probably should have however the problem wasn't excessive and didn't occur when I switched to another player. My feeling at the time was that it may have been player related and until I could verify through with the manufacturer I opted not to mention it.

Going forward I will err on the side of caution and make note of it in the article.


Regards,
post #35 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Watched this last night in 2d and really enjoyed it. I thought it was close to on par with the first which I was not expecting.

Really fun audio track with lots of movement around the room and good low end support. PQ was insanely good! eek.gif I love 3d and hope I can check it out at some point for this title, but there is still nothing that beats reference quality 2d animation for me when the mood strikes.

Greetings,

Glad to hear it Todd, and be sure give the 3D a shot when time permits. You won't be disappointed... wink.gif



Regards,
post #36 of 97
Thanks Ralph and sounds good. I am looking forward to seeing the 3d version as this film looked like it had a ton of 3d potential. I will run it down. cool.gif
post #37 of 97
I also had 3 instances of dropouts in the 2D version and 2 in the 3D version. I'm using a Marantz 7004 for the 2D and a Panasonic 310 for the 3D. I'm not sure it's so much a player issue as a Dolby True HD issue. I also had droputs on the new "Cars" release, both 3D and 2D. But I also watched the 2D and 3D of "R.I.P.D." and had no issues with dropouts - but that is DTS-HDMaster.
post #38 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post

Greetings,

This is related to the same issue associated with the audio dropouts using the Dolby TrueHD soundtrack bitstreamed from the player to your decoding device. It doesn't affect every brand of player so it's hard to know where to root the cause but solving it is simple enough. Set your Oppo to internally decode the signal (meaning set it the LPCM) while watching this film.


Regards,

Good to know Ralph I'll play this movie on my Denon 2500btci.
post #39 of 97
Had audio dropouts with the Panasonic 230, also. Started about 40 minutes and stopped at about 1:20.

S~
post #40 of 97
I had audio dropouts on my sony BDP-BX37. The True HD track was unusable because of all the issues. Switched to stereo. I will be curious to see if the 3d version has the same issues.
post #41 of 97
^ next time just change your HDMI Audio setting in the player setup to PCM (instead of AUTO). It will decode and play the 7.1 track just fine.
post #42 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by teachsac View Post

Had audio dropouts with the Panasonic 230, also.

Wow a lot of complaints coming in, even on brand new models. Minus a star for Monsters U, Disney!
post #43 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

^ next time just change your HDMI Audio setting in the player setup to PCM (instead of AUTO). It will decode and play the 7.1 track just fine.
Yes this worked. Is there any downside to this?
post #44 of 97
No. Converting True HD (or DTS-HDM) to PCM is not a difficult process and your processor gets the PCM and converts to analog, same as if you sent it the original bitstream.
Edited by moovtune - 11/8/13 at 8:49am
post #45 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by moovtune View Post

No. Coverting True HD (or DTS-HDM) to PCM is not a difficult process and your processor gets the PCM and converts to analog, same as if you sent it the original bitstream.

You know, I was wondering the same thing...I'm in the process of getting MU-3D and, since I recently got myself a "superslim" PS3, I'm also aware I won't be able to even output Dolby TrueHD while playing the 3D disc (a PS3 caveat). The fact of the matter is I set the PS3 to linear PCM and, get this, at least on other 3D Blu-ray titles like Brave, Star Trek 2, and G.I. Joe 2, the 7.1 (D-TrueHD) channels are output as 5.1 (PCM). Something tells me something is lost in the process, but I'm no expert and, when closely listening to it, it could all be just me subjectively "hearing a difference." I mean, why not LPCM 7.1?

To go even further OT ranting about my PS3's underwhelming performance issues, last night I played my old Extended Edition DVD (not Blu-ray) of Part 1 of The Fellowship Of The Ring just to try out the DTS-ES 6.1 track on the PS3 and ran into a new set of difficulties: PS3 bitstream won't even output that! I realize DTS-ES 6.1 is a fancy codec available only in a very short list of very select titles, but this is a DVD for crying out loud! You'd think it gives you maybe DTS 5.1, right? Think again! It outputs PCM 2.0! After struggling (and cursing mad.gif!) a bit, I found the solution was to set the PS3 to output linear PCM and, for some unbeknownst (to everyone confused.gif???) reason, the PS3 now reads on screen it's outputting DTS-ES 6.1!!! But, NOW the problem is that my ONKYO receiver reads PCM 7.1 input, and so I'm able to get the same output. This is a 2011 model that used to have a Sony DVD player hooked up to it via digital-coaxial (not an HDMI upconverting model) and which acknowledged being fed DTS-ES 6.1 and output it as DTS-ES 7.1. Furthermore, the very same LOTR DVDs include DD EX 5.1 (a DVD codec a bit more common--Star Wars saga, most PIXAR films, a few Harry Potter ones, Charlie And The Chocolate Factory, etc) and with that setup I got DD EX 6.1 input, DD EX 7.1 output. All the while the receiver lighted everything nicely and accordingly on its display and sounded great to me. So, I also tried the DD EX 5.1 option last night on the PS3, and what I got was, via bitstream, DD 5.1 (no "EX" to be found, less even "6.1") output from the PS3, and which the receiver read as DD 5.1 input and output as DD EX 7.1; via linear PCM, I got PCM MultiCh output from the PS3, and which the receiver read as being input PCM 5.1 and output it as PCM 7.1.

Mind-boggling why a more sophisticated Sony device which is hailed as one of the best multi-format players ("It only does everything"--NOT!) can't get these things right, huh? Anyway, I found that linear PCM output from the PS3 (on-screen showing DTS-ES 6.1) and PCM 7.1 input/output on the receiver was by far the best option--there's even a considerably higher kbps reading this way, around 755 kbps vs 400-and-something! The receiver won't display anything fancy, but I truly believe, after listening to about an hour of Fellowship, it sounded AWESOME and "as if you sent it the original bitstream." Took a while, but I think I got it right this time, and I'm ready to revisit the whole Lord Of The Rings Extended Ed DVD series--it even put a smile back on my face and made me happy for owning a treasured set and not yet falling for the Blu-ray upgrade (I don't think I ever will, as that DVD Box Set is the most handsome item in my movie collection--unless they were ever to bring out a 3D-conversion, that is wink.gif!). Moreso on the plus side, it looks a lot better HDMI-upconverted by the PS3!

I guess there'll always be a "workaround" to every problem, but the fact remains it's exactly that: a problem. Time to get a PS4 and see if that'll take care of "doing everything"? Count me out!

Thanks for letting me vent! smile.gif
post #46 of 97
Panasonic 210 here, no problems. Jim
post #47 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post

Greetings,

Thanks audiofan1. smile.gif

Yes, the Dolby TrueHD audio dropout issue is a strange bug that seems to affect a handful of titles and players. My Oppo exhibited it but my Panasonic played flawlessly.

Regards,

Glad I read this I will play this movie on my Denon 2500BTCI.
post #48 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taranteacher View Post

The fact of the matter is I set the PS3 to linear PCM and, get this, at least on other 3D Blu-ray titles like Brave, Star Trek 2, and G.I. Joe 2, the 7.1 (D-TrueHD) channels are output as 5.1 (PCM). Something tells me something is lost in the process, but I'm no expert and, when closely listening to it, it could all be just me subjectively "hearing a difference." I mean, why not LPCM 7.1?

That is a well known PS3 issue. With BD functionality basically thrown in for free with a gaming console you can't expect perfection.

For those with real BD players, if it can decode the bitstream into 7.1 PCM you are not losing anything in terms of fidelity. There may be slight volume level differences due to firmware issues with DTS-HDMA decoding in some receivers.
Edited by AVfile - 11/12/13 at 6:24am
post #49 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

That is a well known PS3 issue. With BD functionality basically thrown in for free with a gaming console you can't expect perfection.

For those with real BD players, if it can decode the bitstream into 7.1 PCM you are not losing anything in terms of fidelity. There may be slight volume level differences due to firmware issues with DTS-HDMA decoding in some receivers.

LOL! Nothing's "for free," friend. It's more a matter of "false advertising." My eldest was asking for a PS3. I wanted an OPPO. An opportuniy to good to pass landed me the former and I didn't hesitate since it "offered the best of both worlds" according to the research I'd done. Moreover, where I live, I can't get OPPOs or even a Panny BDT500, unless I'm willing to shell out 300% what they cost you in the States, and that's without including a universal region-free upgrade (I would need that for many of my DVDs are Region 4). I would even have a harder time were my imported technology to fail and were to need servicing, etc, etc. All in all, "real" BD players are hard for me to come by and I have to admit that PS3 does a superb job once you get passed the headaches. For me, the gaming console is being thrown in for free, if anything!

Still, many thanks for your reassurance on PCM fidelity, Stefan. Peace.
post #50 of 97
Watched it last night Ralph, we all loved it Video and Audio spot on
post #51 of 97
I paid over $1,000.00 for my denon 3313UDCI blueray player as its their latest model and its played every new release flawlessly until i played this movie. Im no expert either so i was puzzled, the audio dropped the whole movie. The visuals though were quite impressive, some of the best ive ever seen on any blueray.
post #52 of 97
My old Denon 2500BT Transport played it without no issues
post #53 of 97
Okay, so I have watched this 3 times now (all in 2D) and I also went back and watched the first Monsters, Inc. movie.

I would give this one a 3.5/5 and Monsters, Inc a 4.5/5.
The visual presentation is great, and there is no denying that. Bright colors, great textures, great lighting effects, etc. Lots of dazzling visuals and that "pop" that people are looking for in reference material. It's a family-friendly movie also. My 2-year old son LOVES this movie. He screams with joy when the "children" are screaming. He thinks the monsters are funny. The sound is great, as is pretty much expected from any tier-1 Pixar release. My son particularly liked the closing credits score. In fact, the score overall is very good and appropriate.

The one thing is that I think this movie is missing the "heart" that the first had, mostly through the story of the little girl and the friendship she developed with Sully. Breaking the monster/human boundaries was a really interesting theme and a metaphor for life in general. So this movie was technically executed to perfection but falls a little short of the bar set by the first movie.

None the less, I am happy to own this one and I'm sure it will continue to get repeat viewings down the road. I think Ralph's review is spot on for this movie as well.
Edited by djkest - 11/20/13 at 8:29am
post #54 of 97
In regards to the Monster's U blu-ray audio drops, the following is from Oppo:

"For many Disney CG animated films you will need to set the player to LPCM instead of Bit Stream. This will resolve your audio dropouts with these titles. We are working with Dolby to see if there is a way that we can make our firmware fix their mastering mistakes, but we do not know when this may occur.

The issue is either the player is outputting an incorrect Bit Stream signal that the receiver partially rejects, or the receiver is misinterpreting the Bit Stream data which is resulting in the dropouts as it decodes it improperly.

This only occurs with Dolby Digital TrueHD soundtracks that use seamless branching. So far, these titles have been primarily CG Disney films.



And this is from Disney:

Thank you for the e-mail. We are concerned about your inquiry and would like an opportunity to address this issue with greater detail. We are currently researching the issues that you are describing.



At this time there is not a disc replacement for the Blu-ray discs. Hopefully this issue will be able to be resolved with a firmware update for the affected Blu-ray players.



If you have any other questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this email. You may also contact us at 1-800-723-4763 (US)/1-888-877-2843 (Canada) Monday 9:30-7:30 and Tuesday through Friday 9:30-6:30 CST.
post #55 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado Red View Post

In regards to the Monster's U blu-ray audio drops, the following is from Oppo:

"For many Disney CG animated films you will need to set the player to LPCM instead of Bit Stream. This will resolve your audio dropouts with these titles. We are working with Dolby to see if there is a way that we can make our firmware fix their mastering mistakes, but we do not know when this may occur.

The issue is either the player is outputting an incorrect Bit Stream signal that the receiver partially rejects, or the receiver is misinterpreting the Bit Stream data which is resulting in the dropouts as it decodes it improperly.

This only occurs with Dolby Digital TrueHD soundtracks that use seamless branching. So far, these titles have been primarily CG Disney films.



And this is from Disney:

Thank you for the e-mail. We are concerned about your inquiry and would like an opportunity to address this issue with greater detail. We are currently researching the issues that you are describing.



At this time there is not a disc replacement for the Blu-ray discs. Hopefully this issue will be able to be resolved with a firmware update for the affected Blu-ray players.



If you have any other questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this email. You may also contact us at 1-800-723-4763 (US)/1-888-877-2843 (Canada) Monday 9:30-7:30 and Tuesday through Friday 9:30-6:30 CST.


Good post, I did set my blueray to Pcm now and it fixed any audio issues I had. I guess i dont mind keeping it at pcm, supposedly there wouldnt be any quality difference then if I let my receiver do the decoding. Im assuming either device would do the same job
post #56 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVfile View Post

^ next time just change your HDMI Audio setting in the player setup to PCM (instead of AUTO). It will decode and play the 7.1 track just fine.

That is great except for guys like me like got a crappy player like the Sony 5100 that will not decode to multichannel PCM, only stereo!

And Franin..who still uses the 2500 Denon transport...I give you credit. You are still willing to wait 10 to 15 minutes to get a movie going. I just bought the Sony 5100 and it is amazing how fast that boots. Too bad it does not internally decode TrueHD in pcm multichannel
post #57 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tornado Red View Post


And this is from Disney:

Thank you for the e-mail. We are concerned about your inquiry and would like an opportunity to address this issue with greater detail. We are currently researching the issues that you are describing.



At this time there is not a disc replacement for the Blu-ray discs. Hopefully this issue will be able to be resolved with a firmware update for the affected Blu-ray players.



If you have any other questions or concerns, please feel free to reply to this email. You may also contact us at 1-800-723-4763 (US)/1-888-877-2843 (Canada) Monday 9:30-7:30 and Tuesday through Friday 9:30-6:30 CST.

I had an issue with the LPCM option on my Oppo. I called yesterday and was offered an exchange for another title or a refund. They did not offer a replacement disc as the Tech rep said that it would not help. I'm hoping for a re-pressing or something to fix the error. On a separate note, Disney's employee training must be something else. They are always pleasant and maintain a positive tone regardless of the situation.
post #58 of 97
I didn't think the film was on par with the first one but still pretty good. The grass in the scene where Mike first arrives at MU looks so life like!!
post #59 of 97
I played Monsters U on a Panny 220 and Denon 1713 and had two noticeable audio blips in the TrueHD track. Hollywood... go back to DTS MA!!!!!! I've never experienced a problem with that codec. There's something going wrong with the mastering of new TrueHD tracks, because previous versions didn't seem to have these issues.
post #60 of 97
Is the Dolby TrueHD problem with the players, or with the receivers/pre-pros? Seems odd to blame the players... They just send the encoded signal. And when they decode it to LPCM, there are no problems. The receivers are having the decoding issues, right?

I've fallen victim to this also (Total Recall, Brave, etc) using an Oppo BDP-83 and Rotel RSX-1560. I've read posts where users with the same players have different results. Aside from the HDMI cables, the only other link in the chain is the receive, and since the LCPM works, I'd think that leaves the cables out. Blu-ray players get updates frequently, but receivers seem to get them less so.

I'm just guessing on this. Is there anyone who has tested this or who is knowledgeable that can comment?
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