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Upgraditis: is it worth spending $600? - Page 2

post #31 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

I also wondered about the third person use there...

The post was a response to Brad S.
post #32 of 91
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by charmerci View Post

The post was a response to Brad S.

I believe as much, but you quoted me, c'mon, it was funny biggrin.gif
post #33 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnewbie21 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by charmerci View Post

The post was a response to Brad S.

I believe as much, but you quoted me, c'mon, it was funny biggrin.gif

Yeah, no rationalization required, knew what you really were after, it was just a bit.....funny!
post #34 of 91
How far apart are your L&R and how far are you sitting from them?
In my own setups I've noticed distance from the speaker plays a critical part of the equation with smaller drivers.
Then again it could be my imagination....
post #35 of 91
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post

How far apart are your L&R and how far are you sitting from them?
In my own setups I've noticed distance from the speaker plays a critical part of the equation with smaller drivers.
Then again it could be my imagination....

Well, actually, I feel like I need to put more distance between L&R ( I think that contradicts what you were implying) . They are located about 25 degrees from my center position. In stereo, I have found the center image ( in my situation) is pretty much my center listening position. I move one sit to the right, and the right speaker takes over. Same if I move to the left, although image always leans left. My living room is my living room, my theater, and I have a corner desk with my computer equipment at the left, so I believe is messing up my imaging. But overall, as a multipurpose room, it serves my needs, but it also limits my HT experience.
post #36 of 91
Is it possible they are a hair too far apart?
post #37 of 91
Thread Starter 
Since the "optimal" is 30 degrees from your listening position, I doubt it.
post #38 of 91
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post

Is it possible they are a hair too far apart?

I would think having them farther part will help increase the sweepspot. I mean, being the sweetspot the center position is as narrow as it can get.
post #39 of 91
You could maybe try something like the Behringer 2031P. It has a 8.75" woofer and would offer a lot better dynamics and mid-bass than the Pioneers. These speakers are known for being very accurate, and you would get all the detail you like, and hopefully a more enjoyable sound for music. Three of them would be right around $600 and you could probably get them at Guitar Center and try them out at home.
post #40 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Transmaniacon View Post

You could maybe try something like the Behringer 2031P. It has a 8.75" woofer and would offer a lot better dynamics and mid-bass than the Pioneers. These speakers are known for being very accurate, and you would get all the detail you like, and hopefully a more enjoyable sound for music. Three of them would be right around $600 and you could probably get them at Guitar Center and try them out at home.

Actually three 2031ps would be quite a bit less than $600, it would be $350 (pair + single). However, those are 4 ohm speakers, and I would guess the OP's receiver doesn't have the most robust amplifier. Three might be a bit much for it for prolonged loud listening. Their soundstage isn't bad, but it isn't abnormally expansive. It's about what you expect from studio monitors. It would be a good setup though and might warrant thinking about for the OP.
post #41 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

Actually three 2031ps would be quite a bit less than $600, it would be $350 (pair + single). However, those are 4 ohm speakers, and I would guess the OP's receiver doesn't have the most robust amplifier. Three might be a bit much for it for prolonged loud listening. Their soundstage isn't bad, but it isn't abnormally expansive. It's about what you expect from studio monitors. It would be a good setup though and might warrant thinking about for the OP.

Ah you are right about the price, I was thinking of the active version. Good point about the impedance, OP what are you powering your speakers with?
post #42 of 91
Thread Starter 
It's a Yamaha RX-V673, so it should power them fine at normal levels. However, I need a horizontal center due to placement limitations.
post #43 of 91
I have a read a lot of good things about the JBL L830s, I think though you just need to demo some speakers and see if you can get the sound you are looking for within your budget.
post #44 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnewbie21 View Post

It's a Yamaha RX-V673, so it should power them fine at normal levels. However, I need a horizontal center due to placement limitations.

Moot point now, but your receiver would run probably run hotter with a 4 ohm load.

It seems like with everything you have said, the HSU's would be the speaker to try. smile.gif
post #45 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Moot point now, but your receiver would run probably run hotter with a 4 ohm load.
4ohm eats twice the amps at a given voltage... and all ohm ratings are "nominal" on a curve anyway. I think you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.
post #46 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryLove View Post

4ohm eats twice the amps at a given voltage... and all ohm ratings are "nominal" on a curve anyway. I think you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.

Great. Glad you understand that. However, a 4 ohm speaker will be more likely to dip even lower in its impedance variance than an 8 ohm rated one. So I'm not sure what your point is other than showing you know how they are rated???
post #47 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryLove 
4ohm eats twice the amps at a given voltage... and all ohm ratings are "nominal" on a curve anyway. I think you are making a mountain out of a mole-hill.
Great. Glad you understand that. However, a 4 ohm speaker will be more likely to dip even lower in its impedance variance than an 8 ohm rated one. So I'm not sure what your point is other than showing you know how they are rated???
That I think you are making a mountain our of a mole-hill.
post #48 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryLove View Post

That I think you are making a mountain our of a mole-hill.

Sorry. I don't understand who you are. The assertion seems to be that, because you think it, we should agree? confused.gif
post #49 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Sorry. I don't understand who you are. The assertion seems to be that, because you think it, we should agree? confused.gif
So you are just flame-baiting at this point?
post #50 of 91
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Moot point now, but your receiver would run probably run hotter with a 4 ohm load.

It seems like with everything you have said, the HSU's would be the speaker to try. smile.gif

I am leaning to this and I think I would like them. With my budget, I cannot afford paying $160 just to try them. One thing that stops me, is the HB-1 MK2 particular placement requirements for best sound. Like I said before, my left side area is kind of compromised, and I wonder if non-optimal placement will negate any benefit over the Pioneers. I think the Pioneers are more forgiving in terms of placement.

To the left side of the left speaker (between the speaker and the wall) I have 2 LCD monitors. I wonder how much these influence early reflections as opposed to clean space to the wall.
Edited by hdnewbie21 - 11/1/13 at 2:10pm
post #51 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnewbie21 View Post

I am leaning to this and I think I would like them. With my budget, I cannot afford paying $160 just to try them. One thing that stops me, is the HB-1 MK2 particular placement requirements for best sound. Like I said before, my left side area is kind of compromised, and I wonder if non-optimal placement will negate any benefit over the Pioneers. I think the Pioneers are more forgiving in terms of placement.

To the left side of the left speaker (between the speaker and the wall) I have 2 LCD monitors. I wonder how much these influence early reflections as opposed to clean space to the wall.

Best bet, then, would be to listen to a bunch of speakers locally, both at your budget level and above. Then come back and report on what you liked and why (or didn't like), and people can recommend best value choices for you smile.gif
post #52 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryLove View Post

So you are just flame-baiting at this point?

Ironic, since that was my first inclination of interpreting your two previous posts given their tone. But I gave you the benefit of the doubt that it wasn't intentional, and I assumed it just must be hubris.
post #53 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnewbie21 View Post

I am leaning to this and I think I would like them. With my budget, I cannot afford paying $160 just to try them. One thing that stops me, is the HB-1 MK2 particular placement requirements for best sound. Like I said before, my left side area is kind of compromised, and I wonder if non-optimal placement will negate any benefit over the Pioneers. I think the Pioneers are more forgiving in terms of placement.

To the left side of the left speaker (between the speaker and the wall) I have 2 LCD monitors. I wonder how much these influence early reflections as opposed to clean space to the wall.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Best bet, then, would be to listen to a bunch of speakers locally, both at your budget level and above. Then come back and report on what you liked and why (or didn't like), and people can recommend best value choices for you smile.gif

Always good to listen to some yourself. But, owning HB-1s I can say they are great bookshelf speakers. I initially had them at about 45deg and they sounded great. After a while I moved them to around 30deg from my spot and they still sounded great so IMO they're pretty flexible in regards to positioning. I upgraded from satellites so it was a pretty significant jump in SQ for me. They have very good bass extension and midrange. The highs are nonfatiguing and they get plenty loud while staying clean. They're even good enough in 2ch for most music. They qualities you mentioned were lacking, I got when I bought the Hsus. The center is also very good with dialogue. My dad has a hsu 5.1 and states he doesn't have to rewind to hear things he missed anymore. I don't think you'd be disappointed with them but ymmv.
post #54 of 91
where exactly is 'loud city'? There are many happy HSU owners here that would be happy to give a demo , myself included. Their constant directivity allows you to toe them in enough that side reflections are very limited, and give a much wider 'sweet spot'. I think they would be a huge upgrade over the Pio's you have now. I've only heard those speakers once, and it was in a very poor environment, and poorly (if at all) optimized.

No disrespect toward Andrew Jones, but I believe he designed these speakers to meet a certain price point, and to be 'OK' for that $. .. not necessarily what he would like to have as his own speakers. Dr Hsu designed his speakers to be what he likes, and uses himself. That speaks volumes to me, and his speakers, IMO, are excellent, both for music listening, and for movies. I have used them without subs, and they are very capable for music by themselves... again IMO.

One other point, take into consideration what you could sell your current Pioneer speakers for, and subtract that from what the Hsu's would cost, for a more appropriate idea of what this upgrade would really cost. It's not really a $600 outlay, because those Pios do have value, but it's really a 'bottom acceptable level' from a very large manufacturer, versus an "as good as it needs to be" speaker from another highly respected ID speaker designer.

Are there better speakers? of course, but for the budget? IMO, the Hsu's offer an incredible value.

Joseph
post #55 of 91
I had the 2nd gen pioneer towers, horizontal center, bookshelf surround 5.0. It sounded small for movie usage and my living room is not that big. Then I remembered being much more pleased with my previous infinity primus set that I sold due to a move.

Went out and bought the infinity primus again, p363 front, p163 center, and p163 surrounds, and it's much better now. I sort of miss the b22's for desktop use though. As desktop speakers I preferred them over the infinity p163. I may rebuy for that purpose.
post #56 of 91
Old setup:



Current setup:



post #57 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by wlhungdude View Post

No disrespect toward Andrew Jones, but I believe he designed these speakers to meet a certain price point, and to be 'OK' for that $. .. not necessarily what he would like to have as his own speakers. Dr Hsu designed his speakers to be what he likes, and uses himself. That speaks volumes to me, and his speakers, IMO, are excellent, both for music listening, and for movies. I have used them without subs, and they are very capable for music by themselves... again IMO.

I like the Hsu speakers, but I'm pretty sure Hsu had a price point or at least a general price range in mind when making these speakers. If Hsu wanted, I think they could release a more expensive, higher performing speaker.
post #58 of 91
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post

Best bet, then, would be to listen to a bunch of speakers locally, both at your budget level and above. Then come back and report on what you liked and why (or didn't like), and people can recommend best value choices for you smile.gif

Cel, I am not looking for a "better speaker" per se. Overall, I am happy with the Pioneers. I'm looking for a certain characteristic and I can't easily identify it just by demoing at the stores. Maybe it is not the speaker but the movie is mixed differently or setup differently for theater, and I'm just chasing butterflies. If it is the case that a better speaker can provide this particular need, I wonder if the ones within budget are a leap from the pioneers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wlhungdude View Post

where exactly is 'loud city'?
Thunderland smile.gif
Quote:
One other point, take into consideration what you could sell your current Pioneer speakers for, and subtract that from what the Hsu's would cost, for a more appropriate idea of what this upgrade would really cost. Are there better speakers? of course, but for the budget? IMO, the Hsu's offer an incredible value.

Joseph

I really like the Pioneers, so I think i'll keep the BS22s. I'm still using Onkyo's satellites as surround, so they are relative weak sounding. I think I'd relegate the BS22 for surround duties. I'd need to sell the C22, hopefully it won't be too hard to do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

I like the Hsu speakers, but I'm pretty sure Hsu had a price point or at least a general price range in mind when making these speakers. If Hsu wanted, I think they could release a more expensive, higher performing speaker.

shadyJ, you don't sound as enthused talking about the HSUs as you used to. Have you moved up in the world (of speakers) ?wink.gif
post #59 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdnewbie21 View Post

shadyJ, you don't sound as enthused talking about the HSUs as you used to. Have you moved up in the world (of speakers) ?wink.gif

I like them, but they aren't a no-expense-spared design which the post I was replying to almost seemed to imply. My next speakers will be DIY projects.
post #60 of 91
Thread Starter 
If you are still using them for your main setup, what don't you like about them? Or what are you seeking to improve with the DIY if I may ask?
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