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taking RAW Video Using the Black Magic Pocket Camera - Page 4

post #91 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

Then you are ready for RAW video!
I may be ready. That's not an issue. A new camera about every 18 months is my speed. Between my DW and I there are two camera bodies and three lenses under the tree! It might take two years this time!

For now, I'll watch what happens with supporting software. I would like to see Lightroom get the capability to do RAW video clips just like it does RAW photos. But, Adobe's marketing and technical teams may not agree! It already does a surprising (to me) good job on AVCHD video clips. Their goal seems to be to aim at schizophrenics that can't decide if they are photographers or videographers and want to produce a show including both media and then add a soundtrack.

I'm looking forward to your RAW pioneer work as much as I did when I watched you make 1080p60 work! My guess is you have, or soon will have, some editing fun with your travel clips.

Keep up the good work!
post #92 of 109
Thread Starter 
Thanks. Yes, Lightroom for RAW video is what I would like too.

Right now I am stuck with Resolve if I do not want to spend all my time at a computer. Resolve is what the Pros use, which basically means it is not user friendly and requires expensive hardware.

I can use Lightroom on my Windows tablet along with Vegas Pro. It just requires too many steps (and two programs) to get to video, and audio synching is a nightmare. Resolve handles the audio and video together and treats folders of the RAW frames as simply video clips.
post #93 of 109
Thread Starter 
More frame grabs from Hong Kong:



















One camera. One lens (12-35mm f2.8).
post #94 of 109
Again, I like your stills. You probably explained it elsewhere, but how are you getting the frame grabs from the BMPCC? Are you grading with Lightroom?

Can you drop box me an original frame grab to try in Lightroom? Maybe one of the first two?

"One camera. One lens (12-35mm f2.8)" That is exactly why I enjoy the Sony RX100 so much (even though it won't do RAW video). It provides 28-100 equivalent zoom. If I understand it right your lens on a BMPCC would be 36-105 equivalent. Mine fits in a (zippered) "travel shirt" pocket!

Frame grabs are a unique art form, or technique, I had never thought of until you posted one long ago from another camera. Since then two of my favorite photos of my granddaughters are from p60 footage. One is a perfect moment of windblown hair on river boat ride. The other is a nano second before striking a baseball. Both are enlarged and framed. No, they are not as tack sharp as a "real" photo, but they please everyone that looks at them.

The potential for frame grabs is one of the reasons I never take my cameras out of the 1080p60 mode.
post #95 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

Again, I like your stills. You probably explained it elsewhere, but how are you getting the frame grabs from the BMPCC? Are you grading with Lightroom?

Can you drop box me an original frame grab to try in Lightroom? Maybe one of the first two?

"One camera. One lens (12-35mm f2.8)" That is exactly why I enjoy the Sony RX100 so much (even though it won't do RAW video). It provides 28-100 equivalent zoom. If I understand it right your lens on a BMPCC would be 36-105 equivalent. Mine fits in a (zippered) "travel shirt" pocket!

Frame grabs are a unique art form, or technique, I had never thought of until you posted one long ago from another camera. Since then two of my favorite photos of my granddaughters are from p60 footage. One is a perfect moment of windblown hair on river boat ride. The other is a nano second before striking a baseball. Both are enlarged and framed. No, they are not as tack sharp as a "real" photo, but they please everyone that looks at them.

The potential for frame grabs is one of the reasons I never take my cameras out of the 1080p60 mode.

Frame grabs are actually a misnomer for RAW video: each frame is a complete 1920x2080 uncompressed RAW still. There is no "grabbing" at all.

The conflict between taking stills and taking video is completely gone. You have 30 (24 for the pretentious) complete RAW stills per second of video. You are taking stills while taking video.

So, you import any RAW "frame" (still) into Lightroom and use its controls to make it look like what you want. Then export as a jpeg or tiff. Just like you work with any RAW still. And they are as tack sharp as any still from a stills camera, just at 1920x1080 (and you have the much higher dynamic range).

I'll find a way to upload a few of the RAW stills.

You are correct, the lens is equivalent 36-105mm f2.8 (all the way). Its bigger than the RX100, but it looks just as innocent.
post #96 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

Frame grabs are actually a misnomer for RAW video: each frame is a complete 1920x2080 uncompressed RAW still. There is no "grabbing" at all.

The conflict between taking stills and taking video is completely gone. You have 30 (24 for the pretentious) complete RAW stills per second of video. You are taking stills while taking video.

So, you import any RAW "frame" (still) into Lightroom and use its controls to make it look like what you want. Then export as a jpeg or tiff. Just like you work with any RAW still. And they are as tack sharp as any still from a stills camera, just at 1920x1080 (and you have the much higher dynamic range).

I'll find a way to upload a few of the RAW stills.

You are correct, the lens is equivalent 36-105mm f2.8 (all the way). Its bigger than the RX100, but it looks just as innocent.

The frame grab from AVCHD p60 is 1920x1080, but compressed. The 60 frames per second produce good .jpgs for email and computer viewing. Not so good, but OK as prints. I'm looking forward to playing with one of your 1920x2080 RAW stills.

A RAW still from my lowly RX100 point and shoot is 5472 x 3072 and 20MB. There is a lot of data in there for Lightroom to play with. I've not done the homework on the soon to be opened GX7 holiday present, but I suspect the larger sensor may produce even more RAW data. Technical reviewers seem to be arguing about that.

I get confused on this, but my future RAW pictures from the Lumix 100-300 should do well up to about 16x20 inch enlargements. I won't go past 13x19" as that is the limit of my new amazing "awsum" Canon printer. Famous wildlife photographers like Mangelsen and Wolf want much bigger prints to sell and have to use full frame DSLRs. BMPCC frame grabs, and GX7 shots may not print as well at 30x40 inches!

Again, keep up the good RAW work! I really do think you may be on a sort of pro-sumer cutting edge.

Bill
post #97 of 109
Thread Starter 
1920x1080 of course. 2080 is typo. Same pixel count as from RX100 video, but 12-bit 4:2:2 color and much higher dynamic range and resolution. Not good for big prints or for much cropping given the pixel count. But most viewing is on screens nowadays.

Here's a link to the first four RAW frames:

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=F951DD14A00DF741!2255&authkey=!ANioFi-CL6dLr68&ithint=file%2c.dng
Edited by markr041 - 12/19/13 at 6:23pm
post #98 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

1920x1080 of course. 2080 is typo. Same pixel count as from RX100 video, but 12-bit 4:2:2 color and much higher dynamic range and resolution. Not good for big prints or for much cropping given the pixel count. But most viewing is on screens nowadays.

Here's a link to the first four RAW frames:

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=F951DD14A00DF741!2255&authkey=!ANioFi-CL6dLr68&ithint=file%2c.dng
Thanks. I downloaded it and will try to play with it this afternoon.

As I understand internet etiquette, it is terribly wrong to post any artwork on another's thread. If I get anywhere in Lightroom, do you want to see the results?

Bill
post #99 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

Thanks. I downloaded it and will try to play with it this afternoon.

As I understand internet etiquette, it is terribly wrong to post any artwork on another's thread. If I get anywhere in Lightroom, do you want to see the results?

Bill

Sure, of course.
post #100 of 109
Thread Starter 
Three more HK screen grabs:







post #101 of 109
Thread Starter 
The BMPCC does in-camera time-lapse videos from RAW

You can choose intervals as small as every other frame to as long as ten minutes. The time-lapse video is put together in camera at the frame rate you set (30p, 24p). But the individual frames are still (heh) RAW.

Here is an example, using the 10-frame interval, graded in Lightroom and edited in Vegas Pro on my tablet:

https://vimeo.com/82485985
post #102 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by markr041 View Post

The BMPCC does in-camera time-lapse videos from RAW

You can choose intervals as small as every other frame to as long as ten minutes. The time-lapse video is put together in camera at the frame rate you set (30p, 24p). But the individual frames are still (heh) RAW.

Here is an example, using the 10-frame interval, graded in Lightroom and edited in Vegas Pro on my tablet:

https://vimeo.com/82485985
You're getting good detail in the bright foreground and dark shadows in the back. Nice! Your color grading is spot on for my eyes. What tablet runs Lightroom and Vegas Pro?
post #103 of 109
Thread Starter 
Thanks. This camera really delivers.

The tablet is the Microsoft Surface Pro - my current travel tablet/computer (with keyboard cover). Does everything my big machines do, but no CUDA so no Resolve. It really delivers power in portable and flexible form. And the screen color is excellent so I can use it to make color judgments.

Lightroom is really easy to get the color looking right, but importing (dng) and exporting (tiff) for every clip just takes too long, on any computer. Just not a viable workflow for extended videos.

My trip is just about over - I have shot 280GBs of RAW video. That's about 1.5 hours.
post #104 of 109
Kelby Training and B&H have a new 20 minute BMPCC review on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKgu0oHB-KE

On edit: After watching twice, I have to say that I'm not ready for RAW video yet. Footage may be more beautiful than anything else, but it is too much work with a BMPCC.
Edited by bsprague - 12/23/13 at 10:47am
post #105 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsprague View Post

Kelby Training and B&H have a new 20 minute BMPCC review on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKgu0oHB-KE

On edit: After watching twice, I have to say that I'm not ready for RAW video yet. Footage may be more beautiful than anything else, but it is too much work with a BMPCC.

RAW video isn't as difficult as it's made out to be once you get a grasp on it, but it's addictive. I often find myself enjoying grading as much, if not more so, than filming. You get a sense of accomplishment when you edit RAW video and get a great look that you achieved in post. Hard to explain, but it's like when people who buy cars to fix up or CRT projectors to calibrate. it's extra work, but it's fun and addictive and you get the best quality in the end. It's definitely not for everyone though.
post #106 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTyson View Post

RAW video isn't as difficult as it's made out to be once you get a grasp on it, but it's addictive. I often find myself enjoying grading as much, if not more so, than filming. You get a sense of accomplishment when you edit RAW video and get a great look that you achieved in post. Hard to explain, but it's like when people who buy cars to fix up or CRT projectors to calibrate. it's extra work, but it's fun and addictive and you get the best quality in the end. It's definitely not for everyone though.
I know very well how addictive RAW photo processing is. In fact, digital imaging is adictive. I had an amazing self made wet darkroom for film and ignored digital until a couple years ago. Now I'm a junkie.

Lightroom makes RAW photos a lot of fun, but it took about 4 or 5 versions to get there. RAW video will probably get there to. If it were as easy to get RAW video out of my Sony RX100 as it is easy to get AVCHD and RAW photos, I'd be there. If Lightroom would do RAW video, I'd be there. If the BMPCC didn't need a handful of 64GB SDXC cards, I'd be there.

I'd never leave my office/studio/den if I had one of those $35k, three screen Black Magic Resolve set ups!
post #107 of 109
Thread Starter 
BMPCC #2 video camera of the year by the Camera Store TV team. The Sony F5 was #1 and the Sony RX10 #3 (Thanks Jogiba).
post #108 of 109
Here's the video (caution, Chris and Jordan partake in a little holiday cheer while they hand out the awards, so it's a little less "crisp" towards the end smile.gif)





I only watched the "best lens", "best video camera" and "best still camera" awards and I have to say, I agree with them.

I have an RX10 reserved at borrowlenses for this weekend, and will test it side-by-side with BMPCC ProRes and RAW, but I think they pretty much nailed it. The Sony F5 was the best video camera of 2013 - but it costs $16,490. If you don't have that kind of coin and you want to bring home the power of Hollywood-style RAW, the $1000 BMPCC is the best value for the money.

If you want ease of use and great images straight out of the camera, the RX10 is clearly the best choice.

Looking forward to exciting new cameras in 2014 - it will be interesting to see what the global shutter in the $3995 Blackmagic Production Camera can do when compared to the global shutter in the $28,990 Sony F55 - the only other Super 35mm 4K global shutter camera on the market today.

Hope everyone is enjoying the blessings of family and friends this holy-day!

Bill
Hybrid Camera Revolution
Edited by brunerww - 12/24/13 at 10:11am
post #109 of 109
Thread Starter 
RAW Video: Landing in Phoenix during sunset (and some train travel).

The purposes of this video:

1. To capture the changing light at sunset.

2. To test the new FAA rules about use of electronic devices at landing and takeoff.

3. To test for rolling shutter effects: do vertical lines bend?


Be sure to choose 1080p.

RAW video edited using Resolve Lite.
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