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Best way to use DSP Pro Amps

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 
I am interested in learning more about how to set up pro amps with DSP capabilities to optimize my system.

I have been reading a lot about them online but I am curious, can you bypass a processor entirely and just have something like a source selector?

But if you do this how can you also integrate something like a turntable?

I know you could always use something like an AVR with Preouts for this but is there a better way to do it if going the pro audio route?
post #2 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimeran View Post

I am interested in learning more about how to set up pro amps with DSP capabilities to optimize my system.

I have been reading a lot about them online but I am curious, can you bypass a processor entirely and just have something like a source selector?

Yes, the pro amps with DSPs that I've worked with could completely bypass the DSP.
Quote:
But if you do this how can you also integrate something like a turntable?

I would recommend going with a regular preamp because pro amps almost always have separate volume controls for each channel and adjusting volume while maintaining channel balance is a pain. Some common sources lack enough signal to drive the power amp directly. Preamps typically have about 20 dB of gain to overcome this common situation.
Quote:
I know you could always use something like an AVR with Preouts for this but is there a better way to do it if going the pro audio route?

Pro amps have gain structures that are not that dissimilar from consumer amps, so sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
post #3 of 14
Thread Starter 
but if I wanted to use the DSP in the amps but not the processor, is that something that is good to do or does that generally not have much benefit?
post #4 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimeran View Post

but if I wanted to use the DSP in the amps but not the processor, is that something that is good to do or does that generally not have much benefit?

The DSPs in power amps are generally extremely powerful, sometimes more powerful than the ones in other components.
post #5 of 14
Thread Starter 
That's what I thought but I wasn't too sure.

The Lake Processing in the Lab Gruppen stuff looks particularly interesting but those are some very expensive components.

One thing that is interesting to me though is the idea of doing active speakers vs. passive. I know that active has benefits and that you can set that up with these amps with DSP but woudl there be any worry about blowing tweeters too much with something like the LG IPD 1200 that sends 600w per channel when most CDs dont like more than 100w? I know it is just overhead but I dont want to risk any damage.
post #6 of 14
Thread Starter 
Another thing is can you kinda daisy chain DSP amps at all?

So for instance, Could I get a LG that is 2 in and 4 out that will drive the midrange and the top end with active crossover and DSP correction. THen have another amp that is 2 in 2 out to handle a large woofer that is mounted in the same box but have it so that when looking at it online will I be able to set it up so that I can see the sub channel with the mid and top channel to better assist with optimizing the integration of the sub to the res of the system.
post #7 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimeran View Post

Another thing is can you kinda daisy chain DSP amps at all?

So for instance, Could I get a LG that is 2 in and 4 out that will drive the midrange and the top end with active crossover and DSP correction. THen have another amp that is 2 in 2 out to handle a large woofer that is mounted in the same box but have it so that when looking at it online will I be able to set it up so that I can see the sub channel with the mid and top channel to better assist with optimizing the integration of the sub to the res of the system.

It is common to take a bunch of DSP amps and connect them to the same source. Configure the first amp with bandpass filters for the tweeter, the next with bandpass filters for the midrange, and so on.

Many pro amps have multiple input connectors to facilitate daisy-chaining. Every input has both male and female XLR connectors so you can daisy chain them with short XLR M-F jumper cables.
post #8 of 14
Kimeran- I am not sure if I interpreted your first question correctly, but I think you were asking whether it would be possible to use a DSP pro-amp and no pre-amp or receiver, with the pro-amp connected directly to a source?

If that was your question, I am unsure how to answer, but I do know that it is possible with just about any amp, depending on the source. Something like the Oppo BDP-105 or BDP-95 can be used straight into an amp.

. I am not sure if having DSP in a typical pro-amp, such as a Behringer iNuke 1000dsp, would be capable of running without a pre-amp or AVR. I will let some of the more knowledgable folks take a stab at that one.
post #9 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Kimeran- I am not sure if I interpreted your first question correctly, but I think you were asking whether it would be possible to use a DSP pro-amp and no pre-amp or receiver, with the pro-amp connected directly to a source?

If that was your question, I am unsure how to answer, but I do know that it is possible with just about any amp, depending on the source. Something like the Oppo BDP-105 or BDP-95 can be used straight into an amp.

. I am not sure if having DSP in a typical pro-amp, such as a Behringer iNuke 1000dsp, would be capable of running without a pre-amp or AVR. I will let some of the more knowledgable folks take a stab at that one.

I've used pro amps in that kind of application using a passive volume control. Most digital players put out 2 volts or more, while most pro amps take less than 2 volts for full output. You may end up putting more crank on the volume control than you are used to, but you can usually fully exploit the pro amp.

It is possible to find stand-alone phono preamps with a enough gain for this sort of thing,

At some point I say stop thinking so hard and buy a preamp. I picked up an old Conrad Johnson and a number of Dynakit PAT-5 preamps for like $50 each or less.
post #10 of 14
I was just going to tell him to re-read post #2...

Dynakit? Dating yourself, Arny (OK, and so am I -- as a matter of fact, whilst cleaning the basement, I found a stack of little booklets on modifying various Dynacos, filed them where I could find them again, and thus lost them again). smile.gif
post #11 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post

I was just going to tell him to re-read post #2...

Dynakit? Dating yourself, Arny (OK, and so am I -- as a matter of fact, whilst cleaning the basement, I found a stack of little booklets on modifying various Dynacos, filed them where I could find them again, and thus lost them again). smile.gif

In the store room I have a couple of Dynakits I think at least 1, a couple of Apt/Holmans and the Conrad Johnson. So you may have the doc, but I have that and the hardware in the flesh! ;-) They are all pretty nice new/stock - some have been on the test bench.

Preamps age about as poorly as anything. One of the Apt Holmans has nothing but crappy switches and a noisy volume control, and I'm not all that encouraged to check out the other one.

OTOH the CJ has aged well. BTW the CJ preamp I have isn't that far from being a Dyna PAS 3 with really high quality parts especially pots and switches, SS regulated power supplies, and no tone controls. It is sort of a PAS3 with a well-done maxi-mod.
post #12 of 14
Thread Starter 
Well in looking around something that I think looks like a really great option would be something like the Parasound P7 because, from what I understand, you can send the bass to the subout for two channel sources. Unlike many of these other preamps that are two channel only....but then again you could always just use a Y splitter. and set a low pass in the DSP of the amp.

I was actually thinking about the Oppo offerings as well. However I think the best option to do what I am looking at is still going to require some sort of Home Theater Pre/Pro simply due to the fact that without it then it would get more complicated with HDMI switching and all.

The only other way would be to use the Oppo with the HDMI in that are on those units and then have another external HDMI switching box for more inputs.
post #13 of 14
If you plan to do multichannel and HDMI you would be way ahead just picking up a decent AVR as a pre-pro. There are lots of options, and of course a plethora of threads about them, in the receivers subforum of AVS.

@Arny: I got rid of most of my old gear, alas; got to be too much work to haul around the country and an unfortunate incident caused most of it to be lost. I sold my old ARC D-79 a few years ago, still have an SP3a1 in the closet (heavily modified) and an old Eico power amp (EL34's). No Dynaco stuff left, closest I have is a Hafler amp. I also got rid of all my old test gear (HP analyzers, Heathkit scope and generator or two, bunch of little stuff). Really wish I had held on to it now, natch. I keep thinking when I retire I'll have time to play more, but the way things are going I'll be about 183 years old by then. frown.gif

Apt Holman, small world... I spoke with him ages ago, and then with his son a decade or two later (his son was working for a biomed firm I was thinking of interviewing; took a different job, but Tom's son was very nice and very sharp).
post #14 of 14
Thread Starter 
Yea I have an AVR, and I know it will work, I just didnt know if you can make it work better by goign a different route. However, those way just seem more complicated than what it is worth.
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