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Official JVC DILA-X500R / RS49U / RS4910U Owners Thread - Page 23

post #661 of 1226
JOE-C,

Great description. Thanks
post #662 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOE-C View Post


I'm one of the minority guys here that loves 3D and since I own 80 plus 3D Blurays I was interested in seeing if there where significant enough improvements in that area to warrant me purchasing to upgrade from the 45. Now I have to say on the 45 I still use low lamp to view 3d but I do use OOTB settings. On the 45 my biggest complaint is ghosting and it's gotten worse as my bulb has aged. So after viewing the 4910 with the new JVC glasses and the new EStar 6100 Cauldron RF glasses using Despicable Me and Priest 3D with scenes that bring out all the worst ghosting on my 45 I have to say it was an improvement but not as much as I would have liked. The ghosting was still there in tough scenes BUT the biggest thing that bothered me was the increased flicker. I have to say I don't notice flicker on my 45 and that is probably because the 4910 is brighter even though we used low lamp to check it. Also we used a cross talk setting of 6 which Zombie recommended. I played around with different settings to no avail.

JOE

joe, did you manually adjust the RF transmitter? I'm using the Optoma RF transmitter + Optoma RF glasses on the 4910, I did have to adjust them for best performance.
post #663 of 1226
So Craig, can you do a short comparison of your Lumis to the JVCs?
post #664 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

joe, did you manually adjust the RF transmitter? I'm using the Optoma RF transmitter + Optoma RF glasses on the 4910, I did have to adjust them for best performance.

If you mean adjust the EStar transmitter with the Cauldron glasses to try and get rid of ghosting -no I didn't . I know the MV glasses can be adjusted and the EStar are the same only in RF but inCraig's setup the projector was in the back of the room in a separate little room directly behind the couches so it would have been difficult to do on the fly besides I was the only person really interested in 3D so I didn't want to take up too much time on it as we only had a few hours with each projector.
If the JVC transmitter adjusts - I wasn't aware that it does or if the new JVC glasses adjust.
post #665 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by xb1032 View Post

Joe,

Did have CMD enabled when you viewied 3D?

It was enabled on 2D and we just switched over to 3D so I think it was . I know that will smooth out the motion but does that make any difference for ghosting or flicker ?
post #666 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOE-C View Post

If you mean adjust the EStar transmitter with the Cauldron glasses to try and get rid of ghosting -no I didn't . I know the MV glasses can be adjusted and the EStar are the same only in RF but inCraig's setup the projector was in the back of the room in a separate little room directly behind the couches so it would have been difficult to do on the fly besides I was the only person really interested in 3D so I didn't want to take up too much time on it as we only had a few hours with each projector.
If the JVC transmitter adjusts - I wasn't aware that it does or if the new JVC glasses adjust.

by chance I have the HD91 here which has the latest Optoma RF transmitter + glasses so I wanted to see how it looked on the 4910. After some fiddling with the settings, I think it looks pretty good even with the tough content. Not perfect, but way better than my RS55. There is no adjustment on the factory JVC RF transmitter.

Did you have the CMD on in 3D? I think it helps take the edge off the flicker a bit.
post #667 of 1226
By the way Craig my room has a black ceiling and dark gray walls but your room has inspired me to go black on the walls too as I definitely can see how it will help out the contrast.
post #668 of 1226
GOod Morning,

@joe, are you using the anamorh modus a on the 4910 at 3d ?
if yes , try out and turn it off !wink.gif

Greetings poem
post #669 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

by chance I have the HD91 here which has the latest Optoma RF transmitter + glasses so I wanted to see how it looked on the 4910. After some fiddling with the settings, I think it looks pretty good even with the tough content. Not perfect, but way better than my RS55. There is no adjustment on the factory JVC RF transmitter.
Are those the Optoma ZF2100 RT glasses? Could be good then what with better availability, cheaper, and with the more settings.
post #670 of 1226

So... after a lot of nonsense and BS from the dealer, the X500 was finally delivered.  Very pleased with this first projector, love the image quality but nothing to add to what others have more eloquently stated.

 

I did have an odd question though.  My wife says she prefers the "film look" and that the picture was too much like looking through a window which I always thought was a good thing??  This tends to be in more mundane-looking scenes (e.g. in Life of Pi, when Piscine Molitor is talking to the writer around a table).  

 

Has anyone heard a comment like this before?  Does she just need to get used to the better image quality or is there something in the calibration that I should look at?  I've been pleased with the out of the box picture but I have bought a Spyder4 to calibrate (I know a lot of people aren't fans of this but I pulled the trigger on it, prematurely I guess, in early December).

post #671 of 1226
Calibration of your wife should help quite a bit. Go slowly and be patient.
post #672 of 1226
Make sure CMD is turned off, as CMD will take away the film look to some degree.
Also, turn off Clear Black and perhaps turn down the MPC controls. All those, when turned to high, may give what some find to be a "too clear" look.

Also, try the "cinema" or THX picture modes and see if those look more film like to your wife.
post #673 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaViD Boulet View Post

I'm also curious about lag-time for gaming, as well as 3D performance. In comparison to the Sony 50/55ES, how does this JVC's 3D compare? Thanks!

I don't know about the Sonies (or about the 3D on this unit), but I have played GTAV on this PJ (X500R). If I disable e-Shift, Clear Black and C.M.D. then it is quite playable, to me. Maybe a smidgen slower than my previous PJ (Panasonic PT-AE2000), but that is hard to say. Likely too slow for HC FPS type of games.. rolleyes.gif With all of the image processing features on, the image looked tremendously good and sharp, but the input lag made driving around in GTA feel clearly too weird (i.e. too much / noticeable lag).
post #674 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdidari View Post

So... after a lot of nonsense and BS from the dealer, the X500 was finally delivered.  Very pleased with this first projector, love the image quality but nothing to add to what others have more eloquently stated.

I did have an odd question though.  My wife says she prefers the "film look" and that the picture was too much like looking through a window which I always thought was a good thing??  This tends to be in more mundane-looking scenes (e.g. in Life of Pi, when Piscine Molitor is talking to the writer around a table).  

Has anyone heard a comment like this before?  Does she just need to get used to the better image quality or is there something in the calibration that I should look at?  I've been pleased with the out of the box picture but I have bought a Spyder4 to calibrate (I know a lot of people aren't fans of this but I pulled the trigger on it, prematurely I guess, in early December).

Turn off CMD and enable e-shift (MPC). I think Cinema color profile is the most "film" like.
post #675 of 1226

Thanks all, I will try these tonight (and work on the longer term wife calibration project) - the future purchase of a 4K projector is at stake after all!

post #676 of 1226
post #677 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

That's really cool Craig. It's so hard to demo projectors these days, so your Equipment Demo Day I'm sure was quite welcome by your guests.
I hope some of them will post here about their impressions too.

Re bright corners: Happily my RS57 looks very uniform on an all black screen. (Wish my convergence were better, but we can't all get the golden sample).

How many of us are using the Clear Black feature? Seems I'm in the minority. Though that's not surprising since I know many people eschew any added processing to an image. JVC's processing, though, seems to have hit a sweet spot for me.
I liked the MPC processing better than my Darbee (though I also employ the Darbee) and I think I like the added bit of clarity/intensity of Clear Black (on low) as well, choosing it over the Darbee most times. I've actually been impressed that the Clear Black doesn't seem to exacerbate image noise (at least, not too much) as the image remains really smooth with it on.

One thing I'd ask new JVC owners: How are you finding the Intelligent Lens Aperture, now that you've lived with it for a while?

I'm mostly positive about it, because it really has helped the black levels in low APL scenes, making for a surprisingly substantial contribution to watching movies (for me). At the same time, it's not perfect by a long shot. I do see some brightness pumping, especially on credits some times, and also during movies. But it's not so bad, excepting one other issue: flickering. Has anyone noticed much flickering of the image with the ILA engaged? I seem to keep noting images with the light
pulsing/flickering somewhat, much like film-projection flicker. Or pulsing brightness of certain objects. E.g. I've mentioned the scene in 2001 where the astronauts first enter the frame in the long shot of the Monolith dig on the moon. The far away
earth in the shot is fairly bright, and it was pulsing/flickering somewhat. As well, some portion of the excavation lights were pulsing. I turned off the ILA and then the image looked calm. I have not investigated this closely yet, for instance I don't know if it would be the mechanical iris "freaking out" a bit on a scene and opening/closing rapidly. But my hunch is that it's actually the gamma adjustment "freaking out" a bit, causing these brightness fluctuations.

Thoughts?

I also think the ILA works nicely most of the time but certainly has faults that are occasionally noticeable. I also notice the occasional "flickering", and like you I've suspected that it may be the intelligent gamma adjustment getting wiggy.

And then there is the dimness and pumping of things like credits, movie titles, and other things where you have a full black screen with just a few white (or bright) words. I don't like what it does with that. As someone who actually liked to watch the credits and listen to the score, I find this quite annoying. But fortunately the vast majority of the run time the movies look great using the ILA.

I found that clear black makes the image look too processed and unnatural for me, even on low. However, I like using Darbee around HD 30. It might not be as tough if I wasn't using Darbee.
post #678 of 1226
Anybody using low lamp mode? I have a dark colored light controlled room with a 105" wide scope screen. (114" diagonal with right at 1.0 gain) The projector's throw is pretty close to the short end, and we watch mainly movies in this dedicated room. Seems OK, however the lamp is brand new at this point.
post #679 of 1226
Quote:
So Craig, can you do a short comparison of your Lumis to the JVCs?

I knew someone would throw this one at me. rolleyes.gif I love my Lumis, but it is the original almost 5 year old version ( new Super Lumis projectors are improved since mine came out ). If my Lumis blew up tomorrow I could easily live with a JVC RS4910 or 57 while waiting for future 4K choices. The zoom memory feature ( which new Lumis's have but mine does not ) worked great on my 2 screen / 2 aspect ratio set up. The picture looks super sharp with eshift on. Colors with Zombies " super secret special settings " looked great. Motion - I couldn't really see anything to complain about. I might have to change lamps more frequently to have the picture as bright as on the Lumis, but that's not a problem.

I guess my wife summed it up best - " our projector looks better but it doesn't look 5X the cost better ". Hard to complain with a wife's logic sometimes. smile.gif
post #680 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thebes View Post

Hi,

a review from England (AVForums) :

http://www.avforums.com/review/jvc-x500-dla-x500-3d-d-ila-projector-review.9922
Rich is doing a good job of addressing this over there. The reviewer claims that the dynamic iris crushes shadow detail (we know auto1 seems to have this issue, but I have not seen this with auto2) and that the dynamic iris was only added for marketing reasons. People have the right to enjoy what they enjoy, but when I read comments like in this review about the DI it makes me imagine a car review where the reviewer states that the car had a turbo, but the manufacturer allows it to be turned off and the reviewer did that since the the car has enough power without it and the turbo is just there to make the specs look better. Enthusiasts would know better.

I also wonder if the reviewer has lights in his room that raise the black floor of the screen even with the projector off or did his testing of the DI using scenes where it wouldn't make a lot of difference. Some people just won't care about certain things, but it seems pretty clear that this reviewer does not care much about some of the same stuff I (and some others here) do.

--Darin
post #681 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp2 View Post

I also wonder if the reviewer has lights in his room that raise the black floor of the screen even with the projector off or did his testing of the DI using scenes where it wouldn't make a lot of difference. Some people just won't care about certain things, but it seems pretty clear that this reviewer does not care much about some of the same stuff I (and some others here) do.

He also likes how e-shift improves motion handling, which is not what e-shift does at all.
post #682 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post

He also likes how e-shift improves motion handling, which is not what e-shift does at all.

I noticed that as well.

Generally I think the AVForum guys do an excellent job. This particular review, though, dropped the ball somewhat on a feature that they should have known would have been of particular significance and interest.
post #683 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thebes View Post

Hi,

a review from England (AVForums) :

http://www.avforums.com/review/jvc-x500-dla-x500-3d-d-ila-projector-review.9922

 

They should have done their homework first, there are few inaccurate details like the one darinp2 pointed out and also I noted that the reviewer thought that eshift would downscale 4K inputs to 1080p which is not what JVC documentation says (takes 2 1080p frames out of a UHD input, which is very different).

post #684 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdidari View Post

My wife says she prefers the "film look" and that the picture was too much like looking through a window which I always thought was a good thing??

I'm of two minds on this.

The looking-through-a-window effect is obviously attractive, but it can also dispel the illusion of a fantasy world.

OTOH the director has the means to create the latter effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

Colors with Zombies " super secret special settings " looked great.

Better wrap your wrists for the coming slaps for using settings from someone else's pj.

Are these the secret settings that have been posted elsewhere (which IIRC are mode settings and not color adjustments)?
post #685 of 1226
" Given the dominance of their projectors in terms of blacks we found JVC’s decision to include a dynamic iris this year a strange one. This type of technology was developed to improve the perceived blacks on projectors where this is a weakness but clearly in the case of the JVC projectors, they just don’t need it. For the purposes of completeness we tested the feature but quickly realised that it added no real value and returned to the X500’s already superb native blacks."

That is a strange review - by using the dynamic iris I got quite a bit more lumens than they did in that review - which could be helpful for folks with a larger screen.
post #686 of 1226
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Peer View Post

Colors with Zombies " super secret special settings " looked great.

Better wrap your wrists for the coming slaps for using settings from someone else's pj.

Are these the secret settings that have been posted elsewhere (which IIRC are mode settings and not color adjustments)?

Lets face it - the majority of people probably never bother to have their projectors calibrated. This was to demo the pj's in an " optimized out of the box " condition. According to Zombie the end results aren't far off from a fully calibrated machine. And since they aren't my projectors I couldn't burn the lamp hours to calibrate them anyway.

Yes, they are mode settings. Not being familiar with JVC projectors as a personal owner / user of one myself, it was very helpful to have someplace to start.
post #687 of 1226
As I mentioned on the AVforum, the AVforum review completely ignores the discussion of advantages for the ILA: one being that you no longer have to compromise between an iris setting that looks best for bright scenes, vs the setting that looks
best for dark scenes. You can't get both with a manual iris (usually). The ILA allows you to have both - choosing the brightness peak you like best, and the ILA makes sure the darkest scenes look their best.
post #688 of 1226

Hello All,

 

Newbee here, i am awaiting delivery of a JVC DLA-X500R. I never had 3D and I am anxious to see it. I really need to save some cash on the 3D glasses, any other glasses that will work for less money? Thanks so much and glad to be a part of the group, 

post #689 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by poem View Post

GOod Morning,

@joe, are you using the anamorh modus a on the 4910 at 3d ?
if yes , try out and turn it off !wink.gif

Greetings poem

 

V-streching distortion in 3D

 

I love the 2D picture of my RS 4910 and the 3D picture in 1.85:1 is ok. I can tolerate the flickering and if there is not too much movement in the picture which leads to a bit of blurring. 

 

However, switching from a regular 3D 1.85 picture with black bars on top and bottom to v-stretching in 3D of the same picture on my 2.35:1 Stewart 1.5 gain screen leads to instant artifacts. It appears with or without using my Schneider M anamorphic lens, so it's not the lens. It's hard to describe what i'm seeing but any movement becomes artificial. For instance Bobby the dog in Tintin 3D when running seems to float over the surface, cars glide unnaturally as if disconnected from the road, and any movement by people show motion jumps/smears, water flowing or camera pans look off. I have to sit an additional row back and still have a hard time getting my eyes to focus on the fast moving objects or people. I also noticed considerable more eye strain while watching in this mode as if my eyes are trying to make sense of something unnatural on the screen. I'm left with a slight headache something I never have with 1.85 3D on my projector or in theaters. 

 

All this is NOT noticeable in 1.85 3D without the v-stretching. By the way I have CMD, and Clear Black off, so it's not the "soap opera" etc. artifacts that arise from using these adjustments. Using CMD does not help in the v-stretch mode while it does in 1.85 aspect ratio although I hate the effect and leave it off. V-streching in 2D with lens is completely normal. 

 

Is it possible the algorithms used for 3D v-streching for each eye are inaccurate, creating a distortion in the adjusted 3D stretched picture. Currently I have to use zoom to fill my 2:35:1 screen rather than using the v-strech with lens to get a "normal" looking 3D picture without black bars.

 

Does anyone have the same issue or knows what is going on here? Is there a way to resolve this? Does this issue exist on the previous round of projectors too? Thanks for you help.

post #690 of 1226
Quote:
Originally Posted by PJ2014 View Post

V-streching distortion in 3D

I love the 2D picture of my RS 4910 and the 3D picture in 1.85:1 is ok. I can tolerate the flickering and if there is not too much movement in the picture which leads to a bit of blurring. 

However, switching from a regular 3D 1.85 picture with black bars on top and bottom to v-stretching in 3D of the same picture on my 2.35:1 Stewart 1.5 gain screen leads to instant artifacts. It appears with or without using my Schneider M anamorphic lens, so it's not the lens. It's hard to describe what i'm seeing but any movement becomes artificial. For instance Bobby the dog in Tintin 3D when running seems to float over the surface, cars glide unnaturally as if disconnected from the road, and any movement by people show motion jumps/smears, water flowing or camera pans look off. I have to sit an additional row back and still have a hard time getting my eyes to focus on the fast moving objects or people. I also noticed considerable more eye strain while watching in this mode as if my eyes are trying to make sense of something unnatural on the screen. I'm left with a slight headache something I never have with 1.85 3D on my projector or in theaters. 

All this is NOT noticeable in 1.85 3D without the v-stretching. By the way I have CMD, and Clear Black off, so it's not the "soap opera" etc. artifacts that arise from using these adjustments. Using CMD does not help in the v-stretch mode while it does in 1.85 aspect ratio although I hate the effect and leave it off. V-streching in 2D with lens is completely normal. 

Is it possible the algorithms used for 3D v-streching for each eye are inaccurate, creating a distortion in the adjusted 3D stretched picture. Currently I have to use zoom to fill my 2:35:1 screen rather than using the v-strech with lens to get a "normal" looking 3D picture without black bars.

Does anyone have the same issue or knows what is going on here? Is there a way to resolve this? Does this issue exist on the previous round of projectors too? Thanks for you help.

I have used the v-stretching on the RS 45 with a Prismasonic 5000 lens for 2 years and have never seen a problem like you are describing . What 3D glasses do you use?
By the way Zombie has stated that the CMD should help flicker.
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