Originally Posted by Light Illusion
I'm sorry, but that is incorrect...
Poor black displays just means the blacks are not as low as they should be.There is no crushing - that's a display that is not fit for purpose, and/or has been very badly set-up.
No acceptable display will 'crush blacks' if it is set-up remotely correctly.
All you will see is 'grey' blacks...
And, if blacks are lifted on a 'poor' display, BT1886 will further lift shadows, washing them out, and causing the colourist to grade down, so when viewed on a 'good' display the shadows will then appear crushed.
Does that make sense now?
Please remember I am a colourist (or I guess rather - was - as I have not graded a film for a while as I've been rather busy with other projects...) and have owned a couple of post-production facilities as well as having built many around the world with other members of Light Illusion, and trained their staff, so I only talk from experience.
Sometime I can get it wrong, but when that happens I am happy to admit it.
Oh really? I guess we need to throw VT60s out the window and re-train all pro calibrators because none of them will ever be able to make a VT60 show proper black detail with power law 2.2 or 2.4 gamma.
Only truly crappy displays, like IPS or TN screens with awful black levels will technically have crushed black levels with power-law gamma, but other TVs will simply have blacks that are too dark to notice the details properly. Does my Samsung F5350 have bad blacks? Its 0.013 cd/m^2 - pretty damn good if you ask me. Power law 2.2 does not technically crush any black levels on it, but it does make black details real hard to see! It doesn't matter if its an average LCD with 0.05 cd/m^2 black point or VT60 with its super-low black point - black details are way too dark/black with power law gamma.
I am not even taking in consideration the fact that BT.1886 gamma makes the content look way better - not washed at all. Just watch Dark Knight Rises scene where Batman goes down into the tunnels (and fights Bane) using power law 2.2/2.4 and then using BT.1886 on a non-reference plasma TV with excellent blacks and then dare to say that you could see all the details with power law gamma that you could also see with BT.1886 gamma.
And again, the whole thing you keep drilling that power law is needed to make it standardized in studios also fails simply because all TVs used must be identical with identical black points. If one is different, then the picture with power law gamma will also be different.
I think what you mean is that unless a consumer has a reference-like studio-quality near-perfect TV with blacks better than VT60 or KURO can do, then he/she should just toss that TV out? That is insane. Have you ever actually seen BT.1886 in action? I helped my buddy calibrate his IPS monitor and ST60 with BT.1886 gamma and he, knowing little about calibration science, specifically told me that now his TV picture and monitor picture look identical. Hmm...must be that BT.1886 gamma because black levels for his displays are very different.There is far too much evidence, common sense and logic that completely outweighs the only fact you are holding onto to justify the use of power law gamma - the fact that studios use power law gamma. So what??? To reproduce the picture that studios mastered, one must have a TV with equivalent black levels, something that is not possible
. Not even VT60 being calibrated with the best equipment out there by the best calibrator out there, then verified by the second best calibrator out there with a different but equivalently accurate equipment can reproduce studio reference TV accuracy with power law gamma. Should all people just throw away their TVs then? VT60 is as good as it gets you know!
Come on - tell us what your cut off for a black level is? I can tell you that most LED LCDs do about 0.05 cd/m^2. If you tell me that it is not good enough then TV studios are not doing a good job selecting standards that 90% of TVs cannot conform to. 0.05 cd/m^2 will not be crushed with power law 2.2 but again, it will have awful black detail.Edited by MonarchX - 1/19/14 at 12:47pm