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Lexington, KY - HDTV - Page 173

post #5161 of 5238
I don't see the draw for WHAS ... unless you're looking for a specific sports package that's not available in Lex. Hopefully, the new owners have decided to run the main ABC channel @720p instead of doing the Belo crossconvert to 1080i, and then throwing in 3 more sub-channels for good measure.

I *could* probably pull it in from my location, but I just don't see the point of putting up a VHF antenna for very sub-par PQ.
post #5162 of 5238
Then again, the constant "Please Call Dishnetwork and tell them ..." begging on WTVQ has got to go ...
post #5163 of 5238

Thanks for the replies.  Yes, it is for a specific sports package and those "Call Dish network to keep ABC" ads are becoming tiresome!  Unbelievably, I saw the same campaign printed atop a Dish network van on new circle road yesterday.

 

Looks like:

- Winegard HD8200U VHF/UHF/FM HDTV Antenna

- Winegard AP3700 VHF only pre-amp

 

That's about $200 with RG-6 coax.  I would also need some sort of mast (or become popular in my neighborhood by building a tower).

 

It would be nice to hear ANY success stories before pulling the trigger.

post #5164 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccspaul View Post

Thanks for the replies.  Yes, it is for a specific sports package and those "Call Dish network to keep ABC" ads are becoming tiresome!  Unbelievably, I saw the same campaign printed atop a Dish network van on new circle road yesterday.

Looks like:
- Winegard HD8200U VHF/UHF/FM HDTV Antenna
- Winegard AP3700 VHF only pre-amp

That's about $200 with RG-6 coax.  I would also need some sort of mast (or become popular in my neighborhood by building a tower).

It would be nice to hear ANY success stories before pulling the trigger.
Do you need Low VHF? Otherwise get the Winegard 7698. And order that AP3700 while still available. It is discontinued.
post #5165 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccspaul View Post

It would be nice to hear ANY success stories before pulling the trigger.

Unfortunately, I can't give you that. OTOH, I can say that the TVFool analysis is pretty much right on the money for my location. Also, it looks like you have a wee bit more terrain to deal with than I do.
post #5166 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

Then again, the constant "Please Call Dishnetwork and tell them ..." begging on WTVQ has got to go ...
Why is TVQ running the ads? They're not owned by Media General any more. confused.gif
post #5167 of 5238
No they are not. WTVQ is owned by Morris Multimedia out of Savannah Georgia. Here are the group of TV stations they own.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Multimedia
post #5168 of 5238
Shocker, WKYT 27 PSIP data is an hour off. Their engineering dept. consistently ignores the integrity of the PSIP data. Incompetence? Ignorance? Doesn't matter, same result.
You would think they would have a monitoring system in place or an automation system for this. At least manually check it a couple times a day, how fricking hard could it be?
post #5169 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTownKY View Post

Shocker, WKYT 27 PSIP data is an hour off. Their engineering dept. consistently ignores the integrity of the PSIP data. Incompetence? Ignorance? Doesn't matter, same result.
You would think they would have a monitoring system in place or an automation system for this. At least manually check it a couple times a day, how fricking hard could it be?

Probably just a DST -> LST switchover issue. OTOH, at least the clock data is right (according to my LG LCD.)
post #5170 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

Probably just a DST -> LST switchover issue. OTOH, at least the clock data is right (according to my LG LCD.)
Clock data is not right.
I'll stick with the incompetence issue. Check the time that WKYT is set at... about 4 minutes slow. Is this something really that hard to keep track of?
Why is it that one station and only one station in the same market consistently has issues like is? ....incompetence.
They either don't care, ...or don't have the ability to.
post #5171 of 5238
Actually, some sets pick one station as the time reference for all the guide data.. and they don't show you which one..

The guide data as its sent out is in GMT and the set "corrects" it to local time.

One of my sets at home doesn't recognize the DST flag and I have to set it to "Atlantic Time Zone" to get the data right.
post #5172 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by William Smith View Post

Actually, some sets pick one station as the time reference for all the guide data.. and they don't show you which one..

The guide data as its sent out is in GMT and the set "corrects" it to local time.

One of my sets at home doesn't recognize the DST flag and I have to set it to "Atlantic Time Zone" to get the data right.
It was off, checked each station individually and yes it was the only one off.
post #5173 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by William Smith View Post

Actually, some sets pick one station as the time reference for all the guide data.. and they don't show you which one..

The guide data as its sent out is in GMT and the set "corrects" it to local time.

One of my sets at home doesn't recognize the DST flag and I have to set it to "Atlantic Time Zone" to get the data right.

Mine appears to "reset" the clock every time you change the channel. It happened to be "parked" on WKYT (27-3,) but it doesn't update the clock until I actually switch to the "TV" (antenna) input. In any case, the clock reset to LST as expected, but the PSIP program data on WKYT was still off by an hour. It looked like it got sorted out by primetime ... I don't remember if I did any channel surfing on the TV input in the interim. In my case, it's non-critical since I don't really depend on the PSIP guide data for anything "useful." wink.gif

OTOH, the WKYT guide data (and clock) on D* and TiVo were correct ... so perhaps WKYT physically reset the "master" clock instead of just flipping the DST flag?
post #5174 of 5238
It depends on the station.. some stations send their listing information to the guide services and then "subscribe" to them back for their PSIP systems. Since KET's programming information originates at the office, KET PSIP comes directly from the same traffic system that feeds the listing services. The data is processed and then a secondary file is sent to the Louisville site for integration into WKMJ. It never made sense to pay to retrieve our own data from a listing service when we had it in house.
post #5175 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

Mine appears to "reset" the clock every time you change the channel. It happened to be "parked" on WKYT (27-3,) but it doesn't update the clock until I actually switch to the "TV" (antenna) input. In any case, the clock reset to LST as expected, but the PSIP program data on WKYT was still off by an hour. It looked like it got sorted out by primetime ... I don't remember if I did any channel surfing on the TV input in the interim. In my case, it's non-critical since I don't really depend on the PSIP guide data for anything "useful." wink.gif

OTOH, the WKYT guide data (and clock) on D* and TiVo were correct ... so perhaps WKYT physically reset the "master" clock instead of just flipping the DST flag?
I don't know about Tivo, but I'm pretty sure D* and E* both get their guide data from Tribune, NOT from PSIP.
post #5176 of 5238
TiVo does get their guide data from Tribune.
post #5177 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

I don't know about Tivo, but I'm pretty sure D* and E* both get their guide data from Tribune, NOT from PSIP.

Correct ... but not the point I was trying to make. OTOH, Tribune gets that data from *somewhere*. wink.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

TiVo does get their guide data from Tribune.

Also correct, although TiVo's data isn't updated as often: For instance, on the night of the 7th Game of the WS, D*'s guide was updated to reflect the lack of the game, TiVo's was not. You'd think 24hrs would have been ample time to make the change. wink.gif ... But also not the point.

My point was simply to confirm that WKYT's PSIP was in "error" for some time between 2am EDT and 6ish pm EST on Sunday 11/3/2013, most likely due to some combination of DLT flag and/or clock settings, whereas the data from Tribune was correct during the same period, therefore, clearly, there was a "glitch" @ the local (WKYT) level that was corrected later in the day.

PS: This was *not* a major calamity ... at least for me. As long as the virtual channel mapping is correct I'm happy. smile.gif
post #5178 of 5238
A final follow-up:

Last night, I noticed the PSIP clock on WKYT was running ~4 minutes slow.

As of 11:36am this morning (11/6) it's still ~4 minutes slow.

In both cases, tuning to WLEX reset the clock on my LG LCD to the correct time, while tuning back to WKYT reset the LG's clock 4 minutes slow.

ergo, Q.E.D. , etc, etc, etc.
post #5179 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

A final follow-up:

Last night, I noticed the PSIP clock on WKYT was running ~4 minutes slow.

As of 11:36am this morning (11/6) it's still ~4 minutes slow.

In both cases, tuning to WLEX reset the clock on my LG LCD to the correct time, while tuning back to WKYT reset the LG's clock 4 minutes slow.

ergo, Q.E.D. , etc, etc, etc.
Have you tried calling KYT and speaking to an engineer?
post #5180 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

Have you tried calling KYT and speaking to an engineer?

I'll leave that task for "GTownKY" ... Apparently, I somehow missed the earlier post where the 4 minute discrepancy was discovered. Plus, GTownKY appears to have a bigger stake in the matter.

On the plus side, at least they're not using the PSIP clock for actual station timing ... now that would be fun. biggrin.gif

PS: Chances are pretty good that I would have never noticed the problem if GTown had not posted about it. These days, I rarely engage the TV/Antenna input on the TV unless there's nasty weather in the area.
Edited by HDTVChallenged - 11/6/13 at 10:44am
post #5181 of 5238
Naw, time being off not a problem here, was just using it as 'yet another' example of the consistent lack of detail that the WKYT SE's have towards the OTA side.
One can try to use the argument that it's just a 'numbers game' as to viewers of cable/sat vs. OTA, and therefore they concentrate their resources towards the greater number, ...however, why is it almost always WKYT with the OTA issues(mainly repetitive PSIP guide data failures)? ...and not the other stations in the same market?

The actual reason as to why WKYT have these technical issues in such higher numbers than their counterparts isn't the issue to myself and others affected, it's that the issues they consistently have, ...are clearly preventable/manageable.

One reason I zero in on incompetence, ...is because of the responses(and sometimes the lack thereof) I have received upon calling the SE and/or the SM to notify them of problems.
It has ranged from , "We hope to have a new system in place in the near future that will provide fault notification..."(not verbatim, but that was one of the responses I heard from the SM himself), to the very typical "there is? ...ok we'll look into it".
If they ended up with a 'fault notification' system for their PSIP data stream, they either haven't installed it yet or they don't know how to use it.
And how easy would it be to just have a small monitor dedicated to displaying the guide data 24/7, something that a glance at every once in a while would be plenty of 'fault notification'?

Five? ....six stations in the market, and 'one' consistently has a recurring problem, ....there's your 'numbers game'. rolleyes.gif
post #5182 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

Have you tried calling KYT and speaking to an engineer?
Yes. Have you tried Powerball? ...if so, then I'm guessing we've experienced the same odds of success. cool.gif
post #5183 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTownKY View Post

Yes. Have you tried Powerball? ...if so, then I'm guessing we've experienced the same odds of success. cool.gif
lol
post #5184 of 5238
As for the 4 minute discrepancy itself, on my TV the work around is to 1) put the clock in "auto" mode, 2) tune to a station with an accurate clock setting, and then 3) put the TV clock back in "manual" mode. Of course, then I'm completely at the mercy of the TV clock's accuracy.

.... The above is for entertainment purposes only. The accuracy and/or validity of the above methodology can not be guaranteed. YMMV.


PS: Of course, one could also start in "manual" mode and just set the TV's clock from one's radio/atomic "master" clock ... Then again, it can be dicey sync two clocks when the target (TV) clock doesn't adjust to the nearest second manually.
Edited by HDTVChallenged - 11/7/13 at 11:11am
post #5185 of 5238
If I told you 'a station' in the Lex market just went completely dead OTA @ 11:45PM(and still dark as I type this), which station would you guess it to be?
Ahhh... they're bacccccck! Approximately 6 minutes of dead air.
post #5186 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTownKY View Post

If I told you 'a station' in the Lex market just went completely dead OTA @ 11:45PM(and still dark as I type this), which station would you guess it to be?
Ahhh... they're bacccccck! Approximately 6 minutes of dead air.
Did the transmitter go down? Did the network feed go down? Lots of possible issues.
post #5187 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by sam_gordon View Post

Did the transmitter go down? Did the network feed go down? Lots of possible issues.
No, the network feed did not go down, it was a complete loss of signal.
"Lot's of possible issues"? Why didn't you expand on those 'lots of possible issues'?
Did some clueless engineer press the wrong button? Did a clueless engineer take 5 minutes longer to discover the outage than he/she should have?
Did a clueless engineer decide to do routine maintenance during a CBS Network program(Late Show with David Letterman)?
It's funny how you always seem to be the 'apologist' for WKYT's shortcomings/failures, yet your reasons/excuses never address that human error/lack of concern is actually more than likely the cause of failures in the case of WKYT, ...due to their track record.
Once again, this was WKYT, not any other station in the market.
post #5188 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTownKY View Post

No, the network feed did not go down, it was a complete loss of signal.
"Lot's of possible issues"? Why didn't you expand on those 'lots of possible issues'?
Did some clueless engineer press the wrong button? Did a clueless engineer take 5 minutes longer to discover the outage than he/she should have?
Did a clueless engineer decide to do routine maintenance during a CBS Network program(Late Show with David Letterman)?
It's funny how you always seem to be the 'apologist' for WKYT's shortcomings/failures, yet your reasons/excuses never address that human error/lack of concern is actually more than likely the cause of failures in the case of WKYT, ...due to their track record.
Once again, this was WKYT, not any other station in the market.
Well a station can "go dark" for a number of different reasons that will only affect it and no other station in the market...

1) Loss of originating signal (in this case, the network feed going down)
2) Loss of a router
3) Master Control switcher going down
4) Someone punching up the wrong source
5) Automation programmed wrong and putting up the wrong source

All the above could cause the station to broadcast black & silence. The following could create a "loss of signal"

1) Encoder goes down
2) Exciter goes down
3) Transmitter goes down
4) Loss of power (or a quick 'brown out' that takes time to recover from), although I believe WKYT has a generator so this isn't likely, but a generator wouldn't help a brownout.

Now, I'll admit while a lack of maintenance could cause any of the above problems (operating on old equipment/firmware/software), it's also possible it couldn't have been prevented.

As far as defending them, I try to put myself in others' shoes and have some insight on what could cause issues that are beyond peoples control. Do we even know if WKYT has an engineer on duty 24/7?
post #5189 of 5238
BTW, a couple weeks ago, WLEX had a brownout that lasted maybe 5 seconds. It took almost 30 minutes until a signal was restored.
post #5190 of 5238
Quote:
Originally Posted by George Molnar View Post

Agreed. Does OP have an ax to grind with WKYT?
Yep. I have an 'ax to grind' with the consistent failures and shortcomings of WKYT OTA signal.
Does Sam and others think I post about every failure/problem WKYT has? ...lol, not even close, that would overrun the thread.

And Sam, if I had noticed WLEX had a problem as you pointed out, I wouldn't of thought twice about it, for the same reason if KET had a similar problem, I would use 'their' track record over the past few years and realize that unlike WKYT, their number of 'issues' have been miniscule as compared to WKYT.

P.S. Hey George, any other GTI employees going to be stopping in asking if I have an 'ax to grind' with their fellow employees? I could have asked what interest someone so far up there in Indiana has in this thread about LEX stations, but then I saw your sig. rolleyes.gif
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