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Memphis, TN - HDTV - Page 184

post #5491 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

I'd first see if you can find a small combo antenna before you have to do all that hard labor in the heat.

Seriously! This heat just sucks the life right out of ya.

From the little bit I've read so far, it seems as though the smaller combos are only good for higher VHF, like 7 and up. I may just have to break down and buy one of those big-honkin-antennas like my Dad and I put up when I was a kid.
When considering the shipping cost for such a bulky package, I guess I'd better look locally for my best deal on a combo antenna. Maybe I could get away with stuffing that sucker in my garage attic and running a coax to the house.


...and yeah, that is weird. It seems like if you get 5.2 & 5.3, you'd get 5.1 too.
post #5492 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsavchat View Post

From the little bit I've read so far, it seems as though the smaller combos are only good for higher VHF, like 7 and up. I may just have to break down and buy one of those big-honkin-antennas like my Dad and I put up when I was a kid.
When considering the shipping cost for such a bulky package, I guess I'd better look locally for my best deal on a combo antenna. Maybe I could get away with stuffing that sucker in my garage attic and running a coax to the house.

I wonder if your point about channels 7 and up explain why people are having a hard time getting 5 now? They might be using a small antenna? I'm sure you can find something that you need at Radio Shack, Best Buy, etc.

Noticed this morning that WHBQ news has gone HD. Finally! Apparently they went HD at the 5 pm news, but I missed those.

It looks REALLY good. Valerie Calhoun was almost glowing. A lot of the field shots look (pretty sure are) HD. The graphics looks sharp. They don't have a whole lot of moving parts in them, just kinda simple. Personally I don't like all the movement in graphic packages, ala SportsCenter. It's kinda weird to see the ticker stop just before the station bug.
post #5493 of 6016
Well, I went into Setup this morning for the Antenna and did a Reset on one of my HR20-700's. I then let it scan for channels and I got 3-1, 3-2, 5-1, 5-2, 5-3, 10-1, 10-2, 13-1, 24-1, 30-1, 30-2. (I got 40 and all of the 50's too but I have them off in my custom channel guide.) On my other HR20-700, I just did a rescan (not a reset first) and I don't get 5-1. I'll do a Reset tonight and rescan.

Oh, BTW I am using the original solid screen CM-4228 8-bay antenna. This is a UHF only antenna so I'm not sure why I can get all of the channel 5's.
post #5494 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

Oh, BTW I am using the original solid screen CM-4228 8-bay antenna. This is a UHF only antenna so I'm not sure why I can get all of the channel 5's.

Just because your antenna isn't a VHF-lo doesn't mean you wont get a signal, especially if you're close to the transmitter. Your 4228 is designed to receive channels 7-69 and is large enough that it is capturing the low band signal @ 77.25Mhz. I'd have to do the math to see if that is an odd wavelength, but if it is working well.......


Kevin
post #5495 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

I wonder if your point about channels 7 and up explain why people are having a hard time getting 5 now? They might be using a small antenna? I'm sure you can find something that you need at Radio Shack, Best Buy, etc.

Noticed this morning that WHBQ news has gone HD. Finally! [IMG]http://www.*****************/trafficreport/img/3721/k08t1221bbuq/gdsmile.gif[/IMG] Apparently they went HD at the 5 pm news, but I missed those.

It looks REALLY good. Valerie Calhoun was almost glowing. A lot of the field shots look (pretty sure are) HD. The graphics looks sharp. They don't have a whole lot of moving parts in them, just kinda simple. Personally I don't like all the movement in graphic packages, ala SportsCenter. It's kinda weird to see the ticker stop just before the station bug.

I too have a hard time getting 5.
And the news this morning surprised me too.
post #5496 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

I get 5-2 and 5-3 but I don't get 5-1 anymore. Don't all 3 channels broadcast on VHF 5?[IMG]http://***************/9/P/i.jpg[/IMG]

This is strange you should either get all of them or none :S i'd like to know why this is
post #5497 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by juda View Post

This is strange you should either get all of them or none :S i'd like to know why this is

I don't know why, but I did a Reset on my second HR20-700 tonight and then rescanned and I have all of the channels on it too. So, if anyone else is having a problem with 5 or 13, perhaps you need to go into Antenna setup, Reset and then perform the Initial setup.
post #5498 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

I don't know why, but I did a Reset on my second HR20-700 tonight and then rescanned and I have all of the channels on it too. So, if anyone else is having a problem with 5 or 13, perhaps you need to go into Antenna setup, Reset and then perform the Initial setup.

This is a frequently noted "bug" in the HR20-700 when a channel changed it's physical broadcast channel.

Have to do a reset first, then rescan.
post #5499 of 6016
Well, I went into my Menu options on my Dish VIP722 DVR and rescanned the local channels.
I still got nothing for 5. But I did get 13.1 at about 90% and it's in HD. Nice!

Good advice. I don't know why I didn't think to just try a rescan before.

Now if I can just find a nice minimal antenna that'll pick up 5. I've got the satellite version, but it's in SD. The other thing is that with my DVR I can record two satellite channels plus one local channel simultaneously.
Of course, if I find a VHF antenna to pick up 5, I guess I might as well make that the antenna for all local channels.
The last time I looked for outdoor/attic antennas Lowe's had one model in stock, Radio Shack had none. I ordered the little 2 bowtie UHF antenna online and shipping wasn't really an issue. I'd be glad to order the ideal antenna online but it seems that bulkiness of the bigger antennas drive the shipping cost way up. I don't know all the tech stuff about antennas. I wonder if a combo antenna not intended for low-VHF would do a fine job picking up 5 anyway? According to AntennaWeb, I'm only 3.6 miles from channel 5's broadcast tower.
post #5500 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

Noticed this morning that WHBQ news has gone HD. Finally! Apparently they went HD at the 5 pm news, but I missed those.

Surprise!

The studio cameras, graphics and weather maps are all HD. The news footage shot in the field, as well as live shots, are shot in 16:9 SD and then upconverted. The field cameras are capable of HD (that's what we used for the HD Christmas concert), but HD takes up too much storage space in the memory cards to use with DV100 compression. Once we upgrade the field cameras to use MPEG-4, we should be able to do HD in the field.

It's still a work-in-progress, so you may see some funky aspect ratio conversions by accident, but we intend to keep everything 16:9 unless it would require distorting the video, then we use side panels.

If we tried to cheat and stretch a native 4:3 image to fit 16:9, and someone watches it in SD using a 16:9 display (that's what I do at home when I'm too lazy to change from SD DirecTV to OTA HD), and the display is set to stretch the 4:3 to fill the 16:9 width, you end up with a double stretch that looks like crap. We won't do that (at least on purpose!).

We should be adding more HD bells and whistles at we go along. Maybe 5.1 audio one of these days!

The big push now is to get the DTV transmitter on the top antenna. That should solve a lot of reception problems (including mine at home). I hope to have it on the air sometime on Friday.

By the way, the antenna elements for Channel 5 need to be at least 3 feet long. For channel 13, they need to be 14 inches.
post #5501 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV Dave View Post

It's still a work-in-progress, so you may see some funky aspect ratio conversions by accident, but we intend to keep everything 16:9 unless it would require distorting the video, then we use side panels.

We should be adding more HD bells and whistles at we go along. Maybe 5.1 audio one of these days!

The big push now is to get the DTV transmitter on the top antenna. That should solve a lot of reception problems (including mine at home). I hope to have it on the air sometime on Friday.

I've noticed for all field shots there is a black bar all the way across the top.

The news tonight is showing 5.1. Is that a true 5.1?

I'm also getting higher reception numbers tonight.
post #5502 of 6016
Thanks Dave,
I'll keep that in mind while shopping for an antenna. Frankly, I'm beginning to wonder if it's even worth all the trouble for one channel. Really, the only thing I can think of off the top of my head is Heroes, that I'd like to watch in HD on NBC. Can't stand the Today show and many other of NBC's big productions.
I think I'm more interested in the pride of just being able to say that I'm set up to receive all channels.
I just haven't noticed much of an 'in-stock' selection of antennas locally for the last few years.
post #5503 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

I've noticed for all field shots there is a black bar all the way across the top.

The news tonight is showing 5.1. Is that a true 5.1?

I'm also getting higher reception numbers tonight.

The black bars are from a timing problem between the upconverters and the switcher that we're working on. It shouldn't be there.

Our audio for all local programming is up-mixed 5.1 from the original stereo. This allows us to keep the loudness close to the real 5.1 that we pass on from Fox. One of these days, our local shows will be real 5.1, and we will pass them through without change as well.

The signal meter numbers shouldn't have been any higher last Friday (we didn't do anything that would have changed them), but they may be higher now. As of 5 PM yesterday we are now operating from our top-mounted antenna with full power, and even though this is supposed to only be a 2% increase from what we were running, I have noticed a 6 dB improvement in the signal-to-noise ratio at my house. It may make the difference between needing an outdoor antenna or getting by with rabbit-ears.
post #5504 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV Dave View Post

The black bars are from a timing problem between the upconverters and the switcher that we're working on. It shouldn't be there.

The signal meter numbers shouldn't have been any higher last Friday (we didn't do anything that would have changed them), but they may be higher now. As of 5 PM yesterday we are now operating from our top-mounted antenna with full power, and even though this is supposed to only be a 2% increase from what we were running, I have noticed a 6 dB improvement in the signal-to-noise ratio at my house. It may make the difference between needing an outdoor antenna or getting by with rabbit-ears.

I noticed both of these this morning.

The HR20 in our bedroom was able to keep a steady 45% signal to get a/v OTA, compared to about 20 - 25%. I just happened to check it out because the brrriiiippp from the D* feed was so, so, so bad. Then Ernie mentioned it.
I'm using the remote control antenna that came with the box for OTA in there.

Sure enough the next day I was watching 13-1 the signal was breaking up. It was going from 90's to 0. Today it is actually hitting 100.
post #5505 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsavchat View Post

Well, I went into my Menu options on my Dish VIP722 DVR and rescanned the local channels.
I still got nothing for 5. But I did get 13.1 at about 90% and it's in HD. Nice!

Good advice. I don't know why I didn't think to just try a rescan before.

Now if I can just find a nice minimal antenna that'll pick up 5. I've got the satellite version, but it's in SD. The other thing is that with my DVR I can record two satellite channels plus one local channel simultaneously.
Of course, if I find a VHF antenna to pick up 5, I guess I might as well make that the antenna for all local channels.
The last time I looked for outdoor/attic antennas Lowe's had one model in stock, Radio Shack had none. I ordered the little 2 bowtie UHF antenna online and shipping wasn't really an issue. I'd be glad to order the ideal antenna online but it seems that bulkiness of the bigger antennas drive the shipping cost way up. I don't know all the tech stuff about antennas. I wonder if a combo antenna not intended for low-VHF would do a fine job picking up 5 anyway? According to AntennaWeb, I'm only 3.6 miles from channel 5's broadcast tower.

I have the Radio Shack U-75R in my attic and get all the stations at 100% including Ch 5 and 13. This is with a TivoHD using OTA. The antenna is 40" long so it is fairly big.

I am watching an antenna on Ebay that includes free shipping. The seller has a 99% positive feedback. He has tons listed and many are selling for around $30 to $40 with free shipping. I plan to keep bidding until I win one for around $32. It includes a rotor and inline amp. He claims channels 2-79. It is 21" by 16" so still not real small.
post #5506 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by lp38119 View Post

I have the Radio Shack U-75R in my attic and get all the stations at 100% including Ch 5 and 13. This is with a TivoHD using OTA. The antenna is 40" long so it is fairly big.

I am watching an antenna on Ebay that includes free shipping. The seller has a 99% positive feedback. He has tons listed and many are selling for around $30 to $40 with free shipping. I plan to keep bidding until I win one for around $32. It includes a rotor and inline amp. He claims channels 2-79. It is 21" by 16" so still not real small.

Well, if you get the little ebay antenna, let us know how it performs. I'll check that out. I'd prefer not to have to mount a huge and expensive antenna on a new mast just for one channel. A moderate sized antenna in the garage attic would be a more reasonable solution.
post #5507 of 6016
Hi All - For a while now (pretty much about whenever the BIG SWITCH) occurred I have been having audio problems when viewing the WHBQ Fox 13 channel over DirecTV. It frequenty buzzes and cuts out. The channel seems to be fine OTA. Has anyone else experienced this issue - and if so, do they know if anyone is working on it.

I have been patiently waiting for it to clear up and wonder if I should be calling someone!

Thanks,
Bill
post #5508 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgoering View Post

Hi All - For a while now (pretty much about whenever the BIG SWITCH) occurred I have been having audio problems when viewing the WHBQ Fox 13 channel over DirecTV. It frequenty buzzes and cuts out. The channel seems to be fine OTA. Has anyone else experienced this issue - and if so, do they know if anyone is working on it.

I have been patiently waiting for it to clear up and wonder if I should be calling someone!

What you are experiencing is known as the "brrrriiippp" syndrome on D*. I have seen it more on this channel than other locals. DTV Dave who posts here is an engineer at WHBQ. You could either send him a pm or he will eventually read it on here.
post #5509 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

What you are experiencing is known as the "brrrriiippp" syndrome on D*. I have seen it more on this channel than other locals. DTV Dave who posts here is an engineer at WHBQ. You could either send him a pm or he will eventually read it on here.

Thanks for the info. I tried to call D* and their system was down, and thus - they wouldn't take a problem report. I then called WHBQ newsroom, there was no one in engineering at the time, but the guy I talked to sounded like they were very familier with the problem, and he thought that D* would have to be the ones to fix it.

Anyway - apparently WHBQ has more power now then they did right after the "BIG SWITCH" and my home reception is good now, not spotty like it was earlier.

Long story short - I am not going to spend hours on the phone with D* to give a report I am sure they already have, and will just watch WHBQ OTA.

Thanks for your feedback

Bill
post #5510 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by mx6bfast View Post

What you are experiencing is known as the "brrrriiippp" syndrome on D*. I have seen it more on this channel than other locals. DTV Dave who posts here is an engineer at WHBQ. You could either send him a pm or he will eventually read it on here.

I've heard this from several DirecTV customers, although I've never heard it myself on WHBQ using their SD feed (I have heard it on other SD network channels, but I don't have HD). I think in my case, the problem is the buffer in the receiver overflowing. That may or may not be the case with the WHBQ HD feed. Since DirecTV picks this feed up over the air, and it doesn't seem to be an issue when receiving directly over the air for anyone but DirecTV customers, it is probably a DirecTV problem.

One thing that we have also heard via Fox is that AT&T UVerse has problems with audio at the splice points if a local station's audio bit rate differs from the Fox rate. WHBQ is now matching that rate (448 kb/s) to avoid that problem, and that may also have an effect on the DirecTV problem. We'll see.
post #5511 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV Dave View Post

I've heard this from several DirecTV customers, although I've never heard it myself on WHBQ using their SD feed (I have heard it on other SD network channels, but I don't have HD). I think in my case, the problem is the buffer in the receiver overflowing. That may or may not be the case with the WHBQ HD feed. Since DirecTV picks this feed up over the air, and it doesn't seem to be an issue when receiving directly over the air for anyone but DirecTV customers, it is probably a DirecTV problem.

I'm pretty sure it's a D* problem. Since I am seeing it on quite a few channels from D*. Here is a thread that mentions it, http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.ph...58#post2156458.

I haven't seen it on any SD feed, only HD. But it is very bad when it happens. I haven't seen it near as bad on national channels compared to the D* WHBQ channel. The audio gets off sync, and then you hear an audio "stuttering" effect. When it happens the channel is unwatchable. I've only seen it during GMM, and when I go to the OTA feed it's perfectly fine. I'll try to capture it on my video camera next time I see it and send you the link though email if you want me to.
post #5512 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV Dave View Post

I've heard this from several DirecTV customers, although I've never heard it myself on WHBQ using their SD feed (I have heard it on other SD network channels, but I don't have HD). I think in my case, the problem is the buffer in the receiver overflowing. That may or may not be the case with the WHBQ HD feed. Since DirecTV picks this feed up over the air, and it doesn't seem to be an issue when receiving directly over the air for anyone but DirecTV customers, it is probably a DirecTV problem.

One thing that we have also heard via Fox is that AT&T UVerse has problems with audio at the splice points if a local station's audio bit rate differs from the Fox rate. WHBQ is now matching that rate (448 kb/s) to avoid that problem, and that may also have an effect on the DirecTV problem. We'll see.

Thanks for the update Dave. I will try watching/recording the D* version of WHBQ again and see if it is fixed with your change to the audio bitrate. Lately I have just been using the 13-1 OTA signal and have not seen any problems. However, I am using the same receiver for both (D* HR20) so should I expect that if the problem is a receiver buffer overflowing, shouldn't I see that on the ATSC OTA tuner in the same receiver? Or is it only overflowing after the MPEG-2 to MPEG-4 upconvert that D* does.

It is all very confusing...

Thanks,
Bill
post #5513 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgoering View Post

Thanks for the update Dave. I will try watching/recording the D* version of WHBQ again and see if it is fixed with your change to the audio bitrate. Lately I have just been using the 13-1 OTA signal and have not seen any problems. However, I am using the same receiver for both (D* HR20) so should I expect that if the problem is a receiver buffer overflowing, shouldn't I see that on the ATSC OTA tuner in the same receiver? Or is it only overflowing after the MPEG-2 to MPEG-4 upconvert that D* does.

It is all very confusing...

The chip inside of the box does not convert the feed. The box can handle both mpeg-2 and -4 signals. The upconversion is done by D* before it is sent down to us. So for OTA is is coming is as -2. For D* it's coming in as -4.
post #5514 of 6016
FYI, I'm unable to receive channels 5 or 13 OTA (attic mount Philips SDV7400K/17 UHF/VHF/FM/HDTV) through a Dishnetwork VIP622 reciever.

Dish's tech support say they are working on these channels but I was curious if anyone else was having this same problem?
post #5515 of 6016
Did you do a rescan for OTA channels?

Where are you in relation to the towers?
post #5516 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

Did you do a rescan for OTA channels?

Where are you in relation to the towers?

Yes I did a rescan. I have deleted all locals and done rescans several times. I have also tried to use the ADD LOCAL function in the VIP622's setup and there is no signal indicated in the meter.

Per antennaweb.org I'm 17 miles from WMC-5 and 14 miles from WHBQ.

NOTE: This does not appear to be a location or antenna issue as I have no problems receiving these channels with the antenna feed bypassing the Dish receiver and connecting directly to the TV. Since the original issue happened, I've installed a splitter with one coax connected to the Dish VIP 622 and one connected to the TV. This works for viewing channel 5.1, 5.2, 5.3 and 13 but does not allow for using the Dish VIP622's EPG or scheduling timers for OTA DVR recordings.
post #5517 of 6016
It may be that the tuner in the Dish receiver is more sensitive than the one in your TV and it is being overloaded. I think 5 and 13 are at full power now. Do you have a set of rabbit ears you can try with the Dish receiver and see if you can get 5 and 13? At 17 miles rabbit ears should give you some signal on your meter.

What does your signal meter give you on the other channels? If you get 5 and 13 with rabbit ears, you may need to attenuate the signal from your attic antenna.
post #5518 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

It may be that the tuner in the Dish receiver is more sensitive than the one in your TV and it is being overloaded. I think 5 and 13 are at full power now. Do you have a set of rabbit ears you can try with the Dish receiver and see if you can get 5 and 13? At 17 miles rabbit ears should give you some signal on your meter.

What does your signal meter give you on the other channels? If you get 5 and 13 with rabbit ears, you may need to attenuate the signal from your attic antenna.

Do you have a VIP622 receiving WMC-5 and WHBQ-13 OTA?

I do not have any rabbit ears.

The signal meter in the VIP622 MENU SETUP LOCAL is as follows: (Note at the time of this posting atmospheric conditions are not optimal as I'm not receiving Jackson channels 7.1, 7.2&7.3 which usually comes in but only at night)
3=100
7=0
10=100
24=91
30=77
40=64
50=99

My Philips plasma TV has a signal bar without any numbers within the channel setup menu so the following are guesses as to how much of the bar is filled. Also the numbers are the transmit numbers:
5=85%
8=0 to 40% with no picture
10=0 to 40% with no picture
13=85%
19=0 to 40% with no picture
20=0 to 40% with no picture
23=85%
25=85%
28=85%
29=85%
31=55 to 60%
39=0 to 40% with no picture
41=0 to 40% with no picture
44=0 to 40% with no picture
51=85%
post #5519 of 6016
Well, I see that channel 10 also goes from 100 (picture) to 40 or below and no picture. So in essence you loose 5, 10 and 13 between the 2 tuners. It is interesting that these 3 towers are all west of the other towers and 5 is the furthest west.

It is possible that the TV tuner is more sensitive thus allowing you to pick up 5 and 13 with 10 being too strong. Too strong will not peg 100, it will waiver the signal because the tuner can not lock onto it. However, just because a signal waivers doesn't mean it is too strong.

Both meters are not true measures of signal strength but the channel strengths are relative to each other for the Dish receiver and relative for the TV but not relative between the Dish and TV. In other words, a 50 on the Dish is not the same as a 50 on the TV.

If you are getting Jackson sometimes, perhaps your antenna isn't aimed correctly. The Jackson tower would be the furthest east of the others obviously.
post #5520 of 6016
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvluvr View Post

Well, I see that channel 10 also goes from 100 (picture) to 40 or below and no picture. So in essence you loose 5, 10 and 13 between the 2 tuners. It is interesting that these 3 towers are all west of the other towers and 5 is the furthest west.

It is possible that the TV tuner is more sensitive thus allowing you to pick up 5 and 13 with 10 being too strong. Too strong will not peg 100, it will waiver the signal because the tuner can not lock onto it. However, just because a signal waivers doesn't mean it is too strong.

Both meters are not true measures of signal strength but the channel strengths are relative to each other for the Dish receiver and relative for the TV but not relative between the Dish and TV. In other words, a 50 on the Dish is not the same as a 50 on the TV.

If you are getting Jackson sometimes, perhaps your antenna isn't aimed correctly. The Jackson tower would be the furthest east of the others obviously.

Do you have a VIP622 receiving WMC-5 and WHBQ-13 OTA?
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