Los Angeles, CA - OTA - Page 194

At present, there is no trace of a digital or analog signal on ch 33 here. Ch. 58 does come in quite reliably here, howver. In any case, I suspect that I will detect an analog signal on 33 later in the day.

33 comes in ok here at the office (Tustin), at 20-21dB. It is certainly much stronger than KNLA-LD/50, which I can't receive here, though I can see traces of it on the signal meter.

This is with the 4221 1' off the ground, with some obstructions.

KNLA on 50/20 and KFLA on 8/8 are running with an ERP of less than half a kW.

KSMV 33/31 is on a six month 'special temporary authority' (STA) with 15 kW.

KNLA has an application for a power increase to 12.5 kW.

KFLA has an application to move to 22 with an increase to 15 kW.

They lost audience when KFMB fired up with digital in February and it will only get worse for them if KFMB gets their power increase.

The analog station on ch 33 apparently is XHAS which has a digital outlet on virtual ch 33.1, and serves San Diego as a Telemundo affiliate. Since it transmits on ch 34, the digital signal is blocked out locally here by KMEX. I was not receiving the analog signal on 33 this morning, because there was no inversion "skip", and none of the other San Diego stations were coming in either. The skip conditions improved this afternoon, and analog 33 started coming in again.

KFLA definitely needs to do something. I have never been able to receive it here, not even when KFMB was not coming in.

I'd prefer having KFMB. KFLA is a blot on the dial as far as I'm concerned (though certainly not the only one). The main channel shows garbage, while the lousy audio and video engineering on White Springs TV makes it unwatchable.

Can they possibly be making any money with that station - enough to justify purchasing a UHF transmitter? I'd think their viewership would be negligible no matter where they were on the dial.

I just bought the Philips SDV2740/27 amplified antenna and every channel comes in great except for Fox 11. I don't get it at all. I have scanned twice and both times it does not pick it up and when I go to 11 nothing is there. I will not have cable for at least a month since I need to move but in the meantime I wanted to watch TV but Fox is one of my favorites and I can't get it. Is it the antenna? Is it just not possible in my area? I get like 69 total channels but not Fox 11. What gives? BTW, my zip code is 92626

I assume that you are getting ch 13. If so, this seems very strange, as both transmitter antennas are close together, and both are of comparable strength. I am getting ch 11 at about 50% strength and ch 13 at about 65%, and both are very stable. Right after the transition, the ranking was the opposite with ch 13 at about 50% strength and 11 around 65%. Later they made changes which strengthened ch 13 but weakened ch 11, at least here.

I think your problem is probably with the antenna and its orientation. You might try re-positioning it and try again. Do you know if you can enter channels manually without rescanning? If so, that will make it a lot easier to go through the trial and error process.

Yes, I get channel 13 and I can enter manually I think. I have a Panasonic TC-p42X1 TV and I see the manual option. So do I go to the scan channels again but instead of automatically searching, I put in each channel? That will take a long time so do I write down all the channels I have and manually input them? Do I have to move the antenna? It's on the wall and getting great reception but if I have to move it I will.

Anyone in Torrance (south of court house) having any luck getting Fox 11?

If you are only trying to add one station, it would be much easier to manually add that station than to rescan, if you are able to do so on your set. This is especially desirable here, since you may have to do it several times, while trying a different antenna position each time. Also keep in mind that when you rescan, you can lose other weak stations from your stored list, which may not be coming in at the moment.

No problem at all at Maple and Eldorado. But I do have a full sized VHF-UHF antenna (not one of these UHF sized antennas that they make VHF claims for) on top of a 2 story house.

I'm just around the block on Sonoma & Madrona, single story. Several years ago I tried a 4 bay bowtie UHF antenna mounted on the roof. Got terrible results. Bringing it inside the house and on top of my entertainment center worked great until switch. I'm hoping the CM3016 will do the job...

Well if the 4 bay bowtie worked inside the house and not outside (and I'm assuming we're talking UHF only for that), then there's something suspect about your outside installation. It might just be something about your specific location but it's not typical behavior.

One thought that comes to mind is that that the courthouse building is close to being on a direct line between you and Mt. Wilson. If it's severely attenuating the signal then I'm not sure what will work for you. The CM3016 will probably be better for VHF but I'm not so sure about UHF.

Well I entered it manually and nothing came up. I've tried all different positions with the antenna and I can't seem to get a signal. Am I maybe doing something wrong?

Thanks. I went with the HD7694P. It should be here on Wednesday. Very curious to see how it will perform at my location. Thanks for the suggestion!

I tried a Yagi and 4 bay bowtie, both clamped to a vent pipe on a 5 foot antenna mount pole. As I recall, this setup would catch some channels, just not all... Like the 4 bay indoors would.

I was told by the guy at Torrance Electronics that the current antenna location is probably in "a hot spot", and that is reason it worked indoors and not out.

Seems OTA reception is part science and part magic...

Do you know for sure that you can add digital stations manually on your set? The user's manual may or may not say whether you can. Unfortunately if the set does not allow it, it will respond in exactly the same way as it would on a set that does allow it but where the signal is too weak.

FYI: on sets where manual inputting is possible, you have to add the real channel number, and not the virtual number; so, for example, somene adding ch 2 (KCBS) would input '43' and not '2'. This, of course, does not apply here because they are both the same.

Anyway, at this point you might try tuning to ch 13 which is nearby on Mt. Wilson, and select "Signal Strength" on the set, then watching the display, adjust for maximum signal strength, then enter ch 11 manually or else rescan. If that fails, you just may have to go to a better antenna, ideally a roof antenna.

The two primary causes of not being able to receive a single channel are 1) multipaths from numerous directions that the digital TV cannot compensate for and 2) a fluctuating TV signal caused when there are moving trees in the line-of-sight, the ghost canceling circuitry cannot handle it. I'm afraid all you can do is try to reorient your antenna for each channel which is hugely inconvenient or invest in an outdoor antenna that is mounted on a rotator. You will have the find the optimum direction which again is inconvenient.

Decades back, when OTA was the norm, and not every market had a consolidated antenna farm, rotators came with little stick-on (RF) channel numbers to put on it for the best headings found for the various stations. With NTSC that meant aiming for the least snow/ghosting - which often could be a compromise for vertical sync to be maintained. With DTV sets/tuners one has to rely on whatever "quality meter" it has to obtain the "best" heading due to the all-or-none "cliff effect". In worst-case scenarios decode will only occur over a narrow range of azimuths per station (limiting any channel surfing). More than a few will be driven to CATV/sat services (if available) by these added frustrations.

Thanks for the info guys. I still can't get Fox 11 so I decided to hook up the antenna to the downstairs tv since it is right by a window. The Tv is a Sony XBR 700 40 inch CRT HDTV but I can't get any channels to come in. The set can output 480p and 1080i but not 720p. Do I need a converter box for this TV? I thought since it was an HDTV, all I would need is the antenna but no channels are coming on and it has a program channel option so unless I am doing something wrong, the antenna is not working on the Sony. HELP!

The XBR 700 didn't come with a built-in digital tuner. You'll need a converter box at the very least, and a genuine outboard HD tuner if you want to watch in high definition.

I am in Venice, and like many in this thread (even on this page I see), I suddenly cannot pick up Fox 11 either as of a few weeks ago (around the time of the digital switch). I cant get channel 13 either.

Whats strange is I used to pick them up just fine, and then one day they just turned off. Every other channel is still crystal clear. Ive tried scanning, repositioning the antenna every which way and nothing, I am really tearing my hair out.

Searching this thread and others it looks like many had the same problem, at the same time, but it seemed all of the solutions discussed on here were about a vista/media center issue and I am using a Samsung digital reciever model DTB-H260F

Anyways, any help is greatly appreciated, and if I find a solution I will be sure to post it as well.

Ummm ... you certainly didn't get that from this thread.

LA's digital channels 7, 9, 11 and 13 moved to VHF on transition day.

If your antenna is UHF only (which a lot of the so-called "digital" antennas are), then it isn't optimized to pick up VHF - in which case it's time to buy a new antenna.

Are you using an indoor antenna? That might not cut it for VHF stations.

Well that really sucks. I guess that's what happens to early adopters of HDTV like me. I will just have to live without FOX for now. Maybe I will just bring my Plasma downstairs and see if I can get FOX. I am not gonna buy a new antenna cuz it's most likely just my area.

That's up to you, but in Venice you should have no trouble getting 11 and 13 unless you have something blocking you.

I was referring to this thread, particularly posts such as these:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post13462391

Which, I did not realize at the time were from an earlier year.



Thanks for the information! This is something I had not considered, I will investigate it.

I am in Wisconsin and lost channel 11 after the transition.
It was 11(51), now 11 VHF at 17kwatts. I am 65 mi away and have another channel 11 65mi away in a different direction....both FOX.
I get 7 and 9 no problem, nothing from 11.
Engineer at Green Bay FOX says "Madison FOX is canceling their signal"
Madison FOX engineer says "no we are not" Madison FOX will move to 49 someday in the future, but not this year.
No FOX for me, either.

If you are getting two (or more) DTV sigs on the same channel and one does not dominate in strength by at least 15 dB the system will abort all - and what's more misleading is that the "quality meter" may indicate that very little is there. When tropo ducting conditions are up here some of our lower-powered locals will not decode over as wide an antenna azimuth range as usual and that meter becomes very "dynamic".

KTTV-11 has been troublesome for me in the LBC (90804) as of late. It's been hovering around 40% for weeks and while sister station KCOP-13 has been holding steady at 70%. I wish it was the other way around but dems the brakes I guess. Hopefully, the power increase KTTV was granted actually gets performed.

As far as the other two VHFs. KABC-7 is fine even though the signal is 50%. It's steady though. KCAL-9 is rock solid with the meter pegged all the way.

Get a 10-element high-VHF Yagi and point it at whichever Fox affiliate is able to get your best signal. An antenna like that should be able to knock the other one down by 10-25 dB, depending on the relative azimuths and the selected antenna.