Albany, NY - HDTV - Page 165

Troy, NY

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d1dda45d27df96a

What antenna(s) would work best for me?

It has to be an indoor antenna (UHF/VHF). It probably will need an amplifier to boost the signals.
Having a outside antenna is NOT an option.

I do get some OTA channels through my HDTV built-in antenna.

At roughly 17 miles from the Community Tower in the Helderbergs, which has most of the channels you probably want, you have a reasonable chance of getting them with an indoor antenna. Don't discount the possibility of using an outdoor antenna indoors. See my earlier post on the subject.

Don't expect a tiny antenna to get WRGB on 6 and it may have trouble with the high VHF channels (7, 12 and 13) as well. I haven't kept track of which of WRGB's repeaters are actually on the air but you could try for it on 39 from a different direction. Also, their sister station WCWN (43) carries WRGB on an SD subchannel. It's not HD but it looks very good. You're only 7 miles from WNYT's repeater on 18 but it's also a different direction.

Radio Shack has a basic rabbit-ears-and-loop antenna (Catalog #: 15-1874) for $15. It might be all you need and if not, you're only out $15.

The best indoor-only antenna I've used is the Silver Sensor sold under the Zenith and Philips brands. It's available with or without an amplifier. It's for UHF only although I've received the high VHF channels with it at 10 miles. Terk has one that looks similar but I've read varying opinions about its quality. However, it's available with rabbit ears.

An antenna amplifier will not make up for an inadequate antenna. It can't improve the signal coming from the antenna; it can only keep it from getting worse on the way to the TV. Over a short distance to one TV that's not really an issue. It can also be a benefit if its noise figure is lower than that of the TV's tuner. The only way to find that out is to try it. Only the best amps report their noise figures and TVs never do.

Attached is my friends tvfool report. He is looking to install an antenna in his attic, however he has limited space. He has seen my hd7015 and knows that it will not work in his attic. Can anyone make an antenna recommendation that will still pick up channel 6?

Thanks,

Dan

Here are the channels I'm interested in receiving. If I can get them OTA with an antenna great. I also don't viewing delayed showings online (which I do now on occasion). If there are sites that offer programs aired on these channels that would work to. Free would be great, but I wouldn't mind a reasonable monthly or annual plan. I don't want a pay per episode deal. *Note* the #.# channels are available on my HDTV as well as my digital cable box. But on the cable box there on different channels.

WNYA 4 (4.1) MyTv4
TBS 5 TBS
WRGB 6 (6.1) CBS
WRGB 6.2 ThisTV
8 WXXA/FOX
9 YNN
WTEN 10 (10.1) ABC
WTEN 10.2 WTEN Storm Tracker
WMHT 11 (17.1) PBS
WMHT 11.2 ThinkBright/Create
WMHT 11.3 WMHT3 World
WNYT 13 (13.1) NBC
WNYT 13.2 MeTV
WCWN 15 (45.1) CW
WYPX 20 (20.1) ION
23 .The Weather Channel
24 .ESPN
25 .ESPN2
26 .MSG+
27 .TNT
28 .USA
29 .AMC
30 .Lifetime
31 .FX
32 .Cartoon Network
33 .Nickelodeon
34 .Disney
35 .ABC Family
36 .Comedy Central
37 .Discovery
38 .A&E
39 .History
40 .TLC
41 .HGTV
42 .Food Network
44 .Versus
46 .CNN
47 .HLN
48 .CNBC
49 .MSNBC
52 .Yes Network
53 .SyFy
54 .MSG
55 .Spike
58 .TCM
59 .Bravo
61 .National Geographic
63 .TV Land
64 .Lifetime Movie Network
65 .WE
66 .SportsNet NY
70 .FOX News
71 .truTV
235 .Animal Planet
301 .Travel Channel
222 .Bio
225 .SCIENCE
330 .Discovery Fit & Health
410 .Nat Geo Wild
415 .Chiller
429 .ReelzChannel
444 .Cloo
448 .IFC
449 .Sundance
450 .BBC America
225 .SCIENCE
330 .Discovery Fit & Health


What solutions should I be looking at?

You should be able to get these over the air with a reasonable antenna:
WNYA 4 (4.1) MyTv4
TBS 5 TBS
WRGB 6 (6.1) CBS
WRGB 6.2 ThisTV
WXXA/FOX
WTEN 10 (10.1) ABC
WTEN 10.2 WTEN Storm Tracker
WMHT 11 (17.1) PBS
WMHT 11.2 ThinkBright/Create
WMHT 11.3 WMHT3 World
WNYT 13 (13.1) NBC
WNYT 13.2 MeTV
WCWN 15 (45.1) CW
WYPX 20 (20.1) ION

This is only available from Time Warner Cable:
9 YNN

The remaining channels would require either cable or satellite service (e.g., DirecTV, Dish):
TBS 5 TBS
23 .The Weather Channel
24 .ESPN
25 .ESPN2
26 .MSG+
27 .TNT
28 .USA
29 .AMC
30 .Lifetime
31 .FX
32 .Cartoon Network
33 .Nickelodeon
34 .Disney
35 .ABC Family
36 .Comedy Central
37 .Discovery
38 .A&E
39 .History
40 .TLC
41 .HGTV
42 .Food Network
44 .Versus
46 .CNN
47 .HLN
48 .CNBC
49 .MSNBC
52 .Yes Network
53 .SyFy
54 .MSG
55 .Spike
58 .TCM
59 .Bravo
61 .National Geographic
63 .TV Land
64 .Lifetime Movie Network
65 .WE
66 .SportsNet NY
70 .FOX News
71 .truTV
235 .Animal Planet
301 .Travel Channel
222 .Bio
225 .SCIENCE
330 .Discovery Fit & Health
410 .Nat Geo Wild
415 .Chiller
429 .ReelzChannel
444 .Cloo
448 .IFC
449 .Sundance
450 .BBC America
225 .SCIENCE
330 .Discovery Fit & Health

There's no getting around the long element needed to pick up channel 6.
However if he went with seperate UHF, VHF antennas he would cut down on the boom length considerably.
He's only 12 miles out with -33.4 his worst signal, has he tried rabbit ears yet?

I kinda figured that I wouldn't be able to get the rest. Most of the main stations do offer delayed online streaming of some of their shows.
I've used that from time to time. But now one of those stations (TNT) has put a cable provider password lock on that feature.

What would you recommend for those programs? Is there a site online (free or paid) that also offers those shows?

Hopefully the other stations don't get as greedy.

Ok here is my situation ATM.

I got this http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3643548&znt_campaign=Category_CMS&znt_source=CAT&znt_medium=RSCOM&znt_content=CT2032189 at RadioShack. It was easy to hook up, and picked up the following channels.

8-1 AmericaOne.com
8-2 *************
8-3 AmericaOne.com (Has No Sound)
10-1 ABC/WTEN
10-2 ABC/WTEN Weather
10-3 Living Well Network
13-1 NBC/WNYT
13-2 ME-TV
13-3 NBC/WNYT Weather
15 Antenna TV (Fuzzy)
17-1 PBS/WMHT
17-2 Create
17-3 WMHT 3
23-1 FOX 23
23-2 Country Music (Formerly Cool TV)
45-1 CW
45-3 CBS 6
51-1 MyTV4/WNYA
51-2 Antenna TV
_______________________________________________________

Is that the best I'm going to get? Or would an amplified antenna like this http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3611256&znt_campaign=Category_CMS&znt_source=CAT&znt_medium=RSCOM&znt_content=CT2032189 be better for my location?

Does it matter what length of coax cable I use to connect the antenna?

Why am I not receiving "ThisTV" ? Before I hooked up the antenna it was showing on Channel 6.2

Is is possible for me to get "ION" or "RetroTV" ?

I'm getting a channel on 8-2, and I haven't been able to figure out what it is. Any chance somebody knows?

If I wanted to, could I add a split to connect both the cable & antenna? Would I need a special split?
Edited by IN2tvClassics - 2/22/13 at 11:31am

Is that first antenna capable of receiving VHF signals? I believe that WRGB-TV (CBS) is on channel 6 for their digital. Also, can you explain the fuzzy signal of Antenna TV on channel 15-2? (Is that an analog low-power station in the Albany area?)

It's the same one I bought. From the first link I provided:

Receives HDTV, FM HD radio, VHF, UHF and FM radio signals*
12-position fine-tuning provides optimal reception
Discrete black dipoles and integrated UHF loop
Gold-plated connectors help reduce signal loss and interference
Includes 6-foot, 75-ohm coaxial cable

When I was plugged into the cable line WRGB-TV (CBS) came in on channels 6 & 6-1 HD, and I got WRGB "This TV" on 6-2. Now being connected through the antenna WRGB-TV (CBS) comes in on 45-3. I don't get WRGB "This TV".

Basically Antenna TV comes in on both channels 15 & 51-2. The only thing is channel 15 is snowy/unclear, while channel 51-2 is perfectly clear.
_______________

So far the overall picture quality is good. I had some pixelation here and there. But that I can deal with. Would an amplified antenna do much better?
It would be great if I could get "WRGB ThisTV", ION, "WTEN RetroTV".

It looks like I'll be keeping "Basic & Standard Cable". There's a few channels we really like, and it's possible that will be the only way to see the shows.

I was in Albany on Monday for an AHL Devils hockey game at the Times Union Center. On our way down from the Red Robin on US Route 9 in Latham (Colonie), I remember seeing the WTEN-TV (ABC) channel 10 studio off to the right near I-90.

As for the market itself, did WNYT-TV (NBC) channel 13 move their digital transmitter to a different area? I know they had to be a bit further away in the analog era, due to WNET-TV (PBS) channel 13 of Newark, NJ.

Here in Hartford/New Haven, channel 20 had their analog transmitter in Prospect, just south of Waterbury (Waterbury was/is their city of license). When channel 20 moved to their current digital service on channel 20 (original digital was on VHF channel 12), their site changed to that of Rattlesnake Mountain in Farmington, CT, atop the WTIC-TV (FOX) channel 61 tower. It's also much closer to the capitol city of Hartford.
Edited by KEVINL71 - 2/23/13 at 3:32pm

That's because you're not receiving WRGB on channel 6. Lots of people can't because it requires a larger antenna than they are willing to install. Which is why WRGB is also available (in SD, not HD) on a subchannel of its sister station WCWN. Your best chance of getting WRGB and ThisTV on channel 6 is to fully extend your rabbit ears and make them as close to horizontal as possible. See How to use Rabbit Ears for more tips.
In addition to its digital transmission, WNYA still broadcasts in analog on channel 15. It's low power so they didn't have to shut it down when the other stations did. They used to repeat their main subchannel but apparently they've switched it to their other one, AntennaTV.
Not likely. See the link above for the reasons (and the circumstances where it might help).
WRGB ThisTV: Only if you can get WRGB on channel 6. At 17 miles that should be doable.
ION: At 32 miles with 2 hills in the way I wouldn't count on it. Especially not with a simple loop antenna, which is what you have for UHF.
WTEN RetroTV: WTEN used to carry this on a subchannel but dropped it in favor of Living Well Network.

WNYT's analog transmitter was on Bald Mountain. Their digital antenna is on the Community Tower in the Helderbergs along with WRGB, WTEN, WXXA, WMHT and WCWN. WNYA is nearby, using WRGB's old tower. WNYT uses channel 12. They have a duplicate broadcast on channel 18 from their old analog facility. Both appear as virtual channel 13, which can confuse some digital receivers if both transmissions can be received. BTW, WNYA took over channel 13 when WNYT stopped using it.

Ok guys thank for all the help so far. I'm sorry for this long reply. This should be my last post about this setup.

When I first attached my antenna and did my initial scan it found the following channels:

8-1 AmericaOne.com
8-2 *******????******
8-3 AmericaOne.com (Has No Sound)
10-1 ABC/WTEN
10-2 ABC/WTEN Weather
10-3 Living Well Network
13-1 NBC/WNYT
13-2 ME-TV
13-3 NBC/WNYT Weather
15 Antenna TV (Fuzzy)
17-1 PBS/WMHT
17-2 Create
17-3 WMHT 3
23-1 FOX 23
23-2 Country Music (Formerly Cool TV)
45-1 CW
45-3 CBS 6
51-1 MyTV4/WNYA
51-2 Antenna TV

But when I thought my signal was a bit off I did another scan. The channels I got was:

6-1 CBS
6-2 ThisTV
8-1 AmericaOne.com
8-2 *************
8-3 AmericaOne.com (Has No Sound)
10-1 ABC/WTEN
10-2 ABC/WTEN Weather
10-3 Living Well Network
13-1 NBC/WNYT
13-2 ME-TV
13-3 NBC/WNYT Weather
15 Antenna TV (Fuzzy)
17-1 PBS/WMHT
17-2 Create
17-3 WMHT 3
23-1 FOX 23
23-2 Country Music (Formerly Cool TV)
45-1 CW
45-3 CBS 6

So I lost two channels and found two others.

I decided that lineup was lacking so I rescanned.
This time I got:

8-1 AmericaOne.com
8-2 *************
8-3 AmericaOne.com (Has No Sound)
10-1 ABC/WTEN
10-2 ABC/WTEN Weather
10-3 Living Well Network
13-1 NBC/WNYT
13-2 ME-TV
13-3 NBC/WNYT Weather
15 Antenna TV (Fuzzy)
17-1 PBS/WMHT
17-2 Create
17-3 WMHT 3
23-1 FOX 23
23-2 Country Music (Formerly Cool TV)
45-1 CW
45-3 CBS 6
55-1 ION
55-2 Quba
55-3 ION Lite
55-4 ShopTv

So that time I lost two channels, and got four others.

I decided my original scan was the best lineup for me. So I rescanned until I got it back:

8-1 AmericaOne.com
8-2 *************
8-3 AmericaOne.com (Has No Sound)
10-1 ABC/WTEN
10-2 ABC/WTEN Weather
10-3 Living Well Network
13-1 NBC/WNYT
13-2 ME-TV
13-3 NBC/WNYT Weather
15 Antenna TV (Fuzzy)
17-1 PBS/WMHT
17-2 Create
17-3 WMHT 3
23-1 FOX 23
23-2 Country Music (Formerly Cool TV)
45-1 CW
45-3 CBS 6
51-1 MyTV4/WNYA
51-2 Antenna TV

So my question is if I really wanted those other channels would I need a amplified or larger antenna?

6-1 CBS
6-2 ThisTV
55-1 ION
55-2 Quba
55-3 ION Lite
55-4 Shop TV

IN2tvClassics,

 

Have you tried going to TVFool.com and entering your address to see which stations you are most likely to be able to receive?

There is also a maps feature that gives some idea of the coverage for each transmitter.

 

Since you're having trouble consistently receiving WRGB and WNYA, I'm guessing that you might be in a fringe area for those two stations.

Sometimes for fringe channels, a channel scan won't pick them up, but you might be able to manually tune them by knowing the RF channel number that they broadcast on.

 

To see the subchannels for the stations, you can try www.rabbitears.info

IN2TV, as EBO said extend the VHF elements all the way out.
Seperate them, spread them, so they form one continuous plane.
From tip to tip over six feet.
Try moving the antenna around the apartment, keeping the VHF elements horizontal.
Try windows/walls facing the tower.
I would not expect to get ION but, there is no reason why you should not receive everything else.
Once you've scanned and received a station, your tuner remembers that station.
So with your last scan all you were missing was channel six.
Go into the menu and add VHF 6, it might come in, just to weak for the scan to lock on.
6 is your strongest station.
So if doesn't come in after adding, with your tuner tuned to channel 6 move the antenna around until you find it, then check your other stations.
Under 100' run of RG6 should not require an amp, so you can put a long lead on you antenna to move it around.
Good luck

WNCE is a low power digital station broadcasting from downtown Glens falls.
They are the local Americaone affiliate.
They broadcast on UHF 31.
Americaone is also on UHF14 out of Windham mountain.

I have already, I posted my results in "my first here". If I understood what all those features meant, I'd
probably have this setup already. I'm just wanting to fine tune it, before the big cut.

I'm in a fringe area for those stations? I think it may also be other interfering signals in the way.

How do I manually add those stations so my antenna will pick them up?

I'm sorry but I don't see what you are trying to show me, or how to find what I need.

 

 

Sorry that I didn't notice that you had already posted a TVFool report.

I'm new to OTA TV, too, so I'm just learning some things myself.

 

That report looks pretty favorable to me. Most of the stations have a decently strong NM(db) reading, which suggests that you should be able to pick them up with an indoor antenna. However, bear in mind that indoor antennas are always less reliable than outdoor ones. Indoor antennas are very prone to multipath interference, where signals take two different paths to the antenna and cause the receiver to not be able to tune the signal.

 

Try to get the antenna close to a window and as high above the ground as you can.

 

17 miles from the transmittters would be no problem for an outdoor antenna or an attic antenna, but for an indoor one, reception can be tricky at that distance, especially when some of the stations on VHF (WRGB on RF 6 and WXXA on RF 7 could be especially tough). Unfortunately the WRGB transmitter that operates on RF 39 is 42 miles away from you, too far even for an amplified indoor antenna. And the RF 39 transmitter is in a different direction from the other stations.

 

RF 2 through 6 are the toughest frequencies to pick up in digital broadcasting.

That's why most stations that had channel numbers 2 through 6 tried to get FCC approval to operate on a different RF channel (usually a UHF channel) when they converted to digital broadcasting.

There are just a few, like WRGB and Philadelphia's WPVI that have stayed on VHF-LO.

 

As for manual tuning --- You said that WNYA (RF 13, virtual channel 51) does not always show up when you do a channel scan. On some sets, there is  a feature where you could tune the set manually to RF 13, see what the signal strength is, and add that channel to your channel list. Then whenever you scroll through the channels, if the signal is strong enough, the set will tune the channel and display it as channel 51.When you scroll, you might want to pause for a bit when you reach that channel. Sometimes with a fringe signal, it can take the tuner a while to lock onto the signal.

 

There's lots of cool info at the rabbitears.info site. If you choose Web Listings from the Listings menu at the top of the page, you can see the channels that are available in all of the markets throughout the U.S.

Albany is market #45 in those listings. Click on the name of the market (Albany) to see a list of all of the stations with their primary network affiliations. To see the subchannels, click on "Expand All."

I'm sorry but I have know idea how to do that. The only thing I was able to do was go into my HDTVs menu and have it "skip" the channels that didn't come in or were poor signal doubles of other channels. How would add those channels? I would prefer mot having to rescan, I have a good line up.

_____

Here is a "easy" question I hope, where can I get a RF Combiner, Diplexer, Signal Combiner, or what ever you call it?

I want to have TWO video sources to join to one TV.

IE: Source one Cable TV, Source two Antenna

You should have an option to manually tune your TV.
That is what I suggested too.
What TV set are you using?

A splitter won't work to combine cable and antenna.
You needed an A/B switch.
Like one of these:


They sell infra red ones too so you don't have to get up to switch inputs.
You can buy them at Walmart, Radio Shack anywhere that sells TV accessories.

Why don't you use the RCA connections from your Cable box into the TV?
That way you don't need an A/B switch just use your TV's remote to change between antenna and what ever input you used for cable.
Cheers!

RCA CABLE:

Edited by The Hound - 2/26/13 at 12:20am

WNYT has made a deal to acquire WNYA from Venture Technologies. It is expected to close within the second quarter.

Sounds like he's going without a cable box. Your suggestion should be right for him if that is the case.

Ok here is the setup I am trying to get working.

I have an Vizio HDTV that already has a DVD player hooked up using RCA cables working fine.

My cable service comes through the wall outlet in the picture I attached.
I am planning on downgrading my service to just Standard Cable, and adding the Antenna for some other channels I can only get OTA.

My HDTV has a setting in its MENU to choose between CABLE or ANTENNA.

I currently have my New antenna plugged into the cable that is normally plugged into the wall. The antenna works fine, but I need to connect both the Antenna & Cable to my tv. This Vizio HDTV only has ONE COAX connection on the back of it.

It's a PITA to disconnect one to plug in the other. I've tried an old "cable splitter" I had. The antenna side worked fine. But the cable wasn't too clear. I need a Combiner to achieve this.

Would one of these work for what I want to do?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103927

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103923

I think your HDTV's menu setting to choose between CABLE and ANTENNA only tells it's internal tuner what frequency scheme to expect from the rear panel coax connector, rather than switching between two different rear panel coax connectors where one is connected to an antenna and the other is connected to the wall outlet. The scheme for ANTENNA would be 8VSB on chs. 2-51 and the scheme for CABLE would be QAM on chs. 2-125.

I once had an analog Sony TV with two ANT jacks and the remote control allowed A/B selecting between them, and the set expected ANT A was over the air and the MENU allowed assigning ANT B as AIR or CABLE. My current HDTV lacks that feature, so I have connected CABLE into the rear panel coax connector, plus a discrete OTA tuner wired into HDMI #1, and the HD CABLE box wired into HDMI #2, all with multiple remote controls.

IN2tvClassics:
Sorry, but what you want to do just won't work. Cable uses all of the frequencies used by broadcast TV and more, and most cable channels have something on them whether you can watch them or not. If you mix them with a simple splitter/combiner, the signals will conflict. Worse, the broadcast signals will leak back into the cable system, harming other cable users, and the cable signals will be broadcast out of the antenna (although weakly). Your first link is a diplexer that combines broadcast and satellite signals into one coax. It works because there is no frequency overlap. Your second link is a UHF/VHF splitter/combiner. It won't work because both broadcast and cable use both UHF and VHF.

You could use an RF switch as Davird_Jr suggested but that could still more trouble than it's worth, depending on how your TV works. You'd have to flip the switch, then change your TV tuner to receive either antenna or cable signals. Some TVs keep separate tables of broadcast and cable channels. If yours doesn't you'll have to do a full rescan every time you change sources.

Another way is to use the RF input for just one source and use a separate tuner for the other, feeding into an HDMI or component input on the TV (I'm assuming you want HD from both sources; if not you could use a composite or S-Video input).

Your best bet is to connect the antenna to the RF input and rent an HD tuner from your cable company which you'd connect to the TV via HDMI. Whatever you're getting directly from cable (without a company-supplied tuner) won't last. All major cable companies are moving toward dropping all analog channels and encrypting all digital ones, so the RF input will soon be useless for cable.

Are there any devices other than the set-top boxes that the cable companies provide that can tune an unencrypted "clear QAM" signal?

Things like Roku boxes? What will happen to those devices when cable companies go all digital and start encrypting everything? Will those devices need cable cards or other

hardware from the cable company in order to keep working?

 

Another question: When people use a Blu-Ray player for "cord cutting", does the Blu-Ray player have any kind of "tuner" or is it just basically passing along to the TV (via an HDMI cable) a signal that it has received via the internet, with no need to "tune" anything?

So this should work?

Right now when I can switch connections from cable to antenna or vice versa with no problems. Once I change connections
I go into my HDTVs menu and change the feed source. It works fine so far. If I have to add that external switch to do
what I need to accomplish I will.


Well the way the cable companies have been doing lately it wouldn't matter. They have a good show on for a few episodes, then cancel it. But they keep on the garbage reality shows.
In the past few days since I have had my antenna I've enjoyed the OTA shows.

ME-TV & Antenna TV plus local stations would be fine for me. If I need more there's Netflix & HuluPlus.

I saw this recommended on the Chicago OTA thread and bought one, but it only outputs standard definition. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003OQGJV6/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00

That switch should work and is probably your least expensive option for now.

There are several, but most work only with a computer. One advantage is that it's really easy to turn a computer into a DVR. Sadly, there are few free-standing HD receivers still in production. Those that aren't made to accept a CableCARD can't be made to work with one. They will be useless for cable when it's fully encrypted but they will still work for OTA.

I know of 3 devices that do accept CableCARDs: the TiVo free-standing DVR, a plug-in card from Ceton and the Ethernet-connected HDHomeRun Prime. The latter two have limited functionality unless used with Windows Media Center for Win7 or later, and even then they can't do everything that a cable-supplied DVR can. And don't assume that any of them will work reliably.

When the cable companies were pressuring the FCC for the right to encrypt local channels, Roku objected and won a concession that locals would be supplied to cable subscribers over the Internet. It remains to be seen how that will work, but receiving it will almost certainly require new hardware. Existing tuners need not apply.