Toshiba 57HLX82 LCoS Owners Thread - Page 25  

Verified. I've at least got geometry problems ... pretty minor, but present. Over the weekend, I was able to connect my home PC to my 57HLX82 via DVI (thank you Powerstrip) up to 1920x540p (i couldn't get 1080i out of my geforce4 Ti4600 for some reason).

Where some of you have described a 1/2" - 3/4" tilt, my tilt can't be more than 1/4" total ... but is accompanied with a visible bow whereby the middle of the image is "lower" than it's extremeties. It's almost like the mirror is bent slightly due to stress resulting from an imperfect fit in it's mounting ... e.g.: poor engineering. Not something I've come to expect from Toshiba.

Guess I'll just have to wait and see about the other problems. I'm sure that football season will put it to the test. :)

Tegg

I suspect that the sets themselves were probably ok when they left the factory.
The sets just were too bulky and cumbersome to transport well.
They weren't built hardy enough to withstand the over-the-road trip.
And it was this road stress that was the initial source of a lot of sets' problems.
That's my suspicion anyway.

Of course heat+time are causing a whole new set of problems for us.

Thomas,

I noticed that S&V didn't mention a VGA input on the 83's too. Has anyone else confirmed this?

Tegg,

See my response in the HTPC forum.

Sean

I suspect the "Bow" is due to the slight sagging of the extremely thin lenticular lense behind the glass screen. It is only attached at the edges and I think it is the cause of the large "Eye" near the center of the screen. I reported on that many months ago.

I've had my set since March and it also gets very heavy usage. The picture continues to be second to none for HD and DVD.

The only problem I experience are stationary images (e.g. baseball base indicator while watching an Orioles game), temporarily "burn in". Changing to another channel will show a ghost of the stationary image. This also occurs over a large area if I watch a 4x3 TV show for a while. When I change to a 16x9 movie, I'll see a discoloration where the 4x3 image was.

This is all temporary. If I turn off the set for some period of time (1 hr?) the effect disappears.

I can live with this, because the overall picture is breathtaking. HD travel pictures are unbelievable.

Well it was fun while it lasted...
Tonight my 57HLX82 ultimately decided to spiral into its final meltdown.
I was watching tonight and I saw a faint blueish glow sneaking into the
image from the lower right corner. When it was just a tiny circle in the
absolute corner (imagine one quadrant of a dime overlapping the corner
of the image), I ran up to the glass and changed sources and inputs
to make sure it was a fault with the display and not the signal.
I was in denial that it was THE dreaded blue flares. After all, this
was in the bottom right, and all screen shots I had seen in the past were
in the bottom left. But literally in a matter of minutes the spot grew and grew.
In under thirty minutes it was no longer a dime, but now a blue blotch
as big as my fist (and even as I write this, it's now as big as a softball).
It seems to be perfectly centered on the bottom right corner, and it growing
up at a 45 degree angle into the picture.
Upon closer inspection it appears there is a "browning" effect along the edge
of this phenomenon. It's an advancing brown front leaving a blueish illumination
in its wake.
This demise was not at all as I imagined. It wasn't a slow wearing.
The meltdown was sudden and almost violent. It's moving so incredibly fast.
I guess my hand has been forced... I'll be taking that refund sooner than anticipated.
:(

Get out of that room while you still have a chance to survive.

Go to Page 3 of this set and you'll see my name listed as owner of the 4th set delivered to a participant of this thread on March 5.

I 've read this entire thread, all 37 long winded pages of it. Except for a seemingly short life bulb expiring Sept. 1, this set has been nothing but sheer bliss. No geometry problems, no halos, no blue flares.

I manhandled this box off the truck with the driver took the box off all by my lonesome and wheeled it into place.

Not a single problem. NADA. Not one. Just amazing picture time after time.

But, I must confess. All of you, every single one of you is scaring the absolute _________ out of me! I figure that sooner or later, some day, I'll fire my set up and it will flare up and die before my very eyes.

Question: Is there anybody reading this thread who like me hasn't experienced a single problem with his/her Toshiba LCoS 57HLX82????

Chris Cargen

Hey Cargen.... have no fear! I have had the unit for at least 6 months and love it! The Fed Ex guy manhandled it into the living room with me, I built a dolly which buts up against my new wall unit built specifically for this unit. I can push up the dolly, roll off the unit on to it, and move the dolly to access all the wires behind it... (and clean the filter which I've only done once!)... The unit did flicker when I got it, i understand that a bunch of units had this problem from the bulb being damaged in shipment. I popped in the replacement bulb, and Tosh sent me a new one to replace my damaged one. It has been rock solid and I love it! I am a high end computer guy, but not a "videophile"... Still it's my second HDTV and I think it rocks... No offence to the group, but its sort of like having a sister as a doctor.... You ask her questions and pretty soon you start getting all sorts of symptoms! (she is and I thought I was having an pulmonary embelism last month... Turned out to be a little asthma!) I only check forums when I am concerned about something with any specific equipment I have... Thats why I haven't been here in some time!!! (Now on to roadfly.com to check out info on my Bimmer... It really sucks!

You two guys are too happy. :)

Who will repair your sets in the future if Toshiba never develops a service manual for them? :confused:

Don't get me wrong... I agree with you! I just don't get too involved in this, my computer problems / bmw problems / tivo problems keep me busy enough! I am a huge Microsoft gadfly, it's what I know.... I leave it to you A/V guys to make our TV's better!

(I also took a 5 year contract on the unit...) It's let them figure it out insurance on such an expensive unit!

Anyone would be nuts to not purchase the longest extended warranty service possible on such a "bleeding edge" set. I certainly did.

Of those of you who gave up and returned your final LCoS to Toshiba:

How many took the refund?

How many instead are waiting for Toshiba to somehow figure out how to ship version 2 of the LCoS?

A Google search yields this listing for the NEW version 2 Toshiba LCoS 57HL83:
<http://www.buy.com/retail/electronic...27962&loc=6693>
Such a deal! Only $4,244.32 and "usually ships 1 to 2 weeks" Yeah, right! Obviously a vaporware listing, but the picture and dimensions are still there for anyone interested.

Over at<http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...postid=3050535>, a poster on 11-18 said:

"ONE CALL who states they are the biggest toshiba distributor in the US says they were told recently by Toshiba that LCOS TV's will NEVER COME OUT! PERIOD!"

I purchased my Toshiba LCOS 57HLX82 from One Call. And I saw that One Call used to have a page for the Toshiba LCOS 57HL83 a couple of months ago, but it is no longer there.

Doesn't look good.

Anyone know anything definitive? Gary Merson? Anybody?

Chris Cargen

If it comes to pass that they can't be repaired (Toshiba seems to have a problem doing repairs) then I assume your contracts would entitle you to an equivalent replacement. I wonder what "equivalent" would mean if this case?

Wow, all that and a bag of chips!

Sorry, could'nt resist. :D

I would think that a definite answer on whether the new Toshiba LCOS will be real or not is <1 month away. I know people are interested, but if you wait, you'll know then.

The closest match would be the 82" Mits, right?
or the $21k sony SXRD front projector...
those are the only 6M pixel options I can think of.

Good thinking. Go for the front projector. You may not be able to handle 500lbs.

Would Tosh actually get you a competitor's equipment? I'd think they'd rather give you the money. (Or is this like 'Miracle on 34th Street' where anything goes to make the customer happy? :D )

I think we're talking about a warranty from the retailer or a third-party,
not the manufacturer.

Zac, if it makes you feel any better, I've had exactly what you descibe for about 2 or 3 months. Sometimes it creeps further into the picture than other times...sometimes I don't get it at all. Pulling the set farther from the wall helped a little as it seems to be heat related. What is really weird is that it used to be in the lower left corner, but now it's in the right...and it only affects the blue chip.

I'm still holding out for the 65HLX83. I will only take the refund if it's vaporware.

Sean

My set was perfect for about 6 months. Then over time the blue flash
started in the lower left corner and got worse and worse and worse.
Then it disappeared completely for a couple of days, and now its
back again. It is not a temperature thing, it does it from stone cold.

Toshiba is now going to replace the entire set because they ran
out of engines. Does not look good. If the next set does this in another
6 months then i want my money back and the h* with it.

I would even consider the mitsubishi if it wasn't so huge. From what
i hear though, the panels are the same.

I don't think it is an lcos panel problem. On mine the blue flash goes
below the available pixel array. I think it is a delamination of the
blue filter, or some problem in the polarizers.

Sean,
I'll wait until CES (Jan 8-11).
If there's not a concrete availability date for a next generation LCoS announced,
then I think I'm taking the cash.
And I suspect the cash will sit as a lump until some other 1920x1080p option
becomes available.

Imagine my surprise to see the old "LCoS Owners Thread" reappear!

I am maybe the only one I know of who has executed on the "refund" offer to date. Before that I was eagerly awaiting the 65HLX83.... They came and took the set away a week or so ago and I expect to see a check soon. I will let you know.

One thing to consider in all of this is that everything is better and cheaper than it was 9 months ago, so that "LCoS money" should go a bit farther than before. Of course, there is no current 1920X1080p option in the range.

Zac: Sorry to hear you have finally sucumbed to the dreaded "blue flares". If I remember right all you had before that was some minor geometry problems and a mild case of the "racetrack". My flares started from the left and progressively got worse (grew toward the right) until the final version was more of a "blue glow" that came out of the lower right corner of the screen and was perhaps softball size. It was progressive and minor at first, but later started to appear more quickly and more severely. Definitely a degradation of something going on.

In other news: Two weeks with the 60XBR950 and no signs of problems. The picture is not quite what the LCoS could do ( for the first 4 months) but is very good. The picture is brighter, BTW, with the 120W light source.

Since my "meltdown" on Friday night
my racetrack symptom has changed.
It used to be a red ring visible on dark
backgrounds only. Now its always visible,
and it's reddish on dark backgrounds
and blueish on light backgrounds. Bizarre.
And the image retention phenomenon is
different too. Flipping to 16:9 content
after watching 4:3 material used to make
the sides of the 16:9 image slightly brighter,
so you could see a distinct line showing where
the side pillars of the 4:3 image were.
Now that side pillar area has an additional
very blueish cast to it. As if that area of the
image has its color temp set to "cool".

Oh well, I'm going to stop dwelling on it,
the set is going back in a few weeks,
and I don't want to agonize over that decision
any more than I have to.

Over the past month, my set has developed the blue blob problem on left side of the screen. On mine, it seems to be heat related. If the set has been off for an hour or two then turn it on, I don't really see the blue blob. But, as the set warms up it seems to reappear, often with a different shape or in a different location on the left side of the screen.

What is really interesting, if I'm watching 4:3 programs for a long time (1hr?) with black bars on either side (my Moto 5100 cable box does this), I usually see the blue blob but it is sharply defined by the edge of the 4:3 picture. You see this very well if you switch to HDTV (16:9) format with a light colored background. The blue blob abruptly stops (on its left) where the edge of the 4:3 picture was. Bizzare

The thought of returning this set without a comparable 1080p replacement is just horrifying. Without the blue blob, which isn't always there, the picture is second to none. The set is the perfect size for my room. My Martin Logan center channel speaker fits perfectly in the bottom cavity. I continue to marvel at the beautiful picture.

....but the blob is getting slowly worse. Right now the set is still under Toshiba's 1yr warranty. I have a Tweeter 5yr extended warranty on it, but I'm concerned that if a few months down the road Tweeter needs to replace the set, they won't have anything comparable. I don't want to just settle for second best. Even plasma displays don't look as good to me.

kwolfman,
There are plenty of us in EXACTLY the same boat as you.

Maybe the blue blob isn't a bug... it's a feature.
The Toshiba 57HLX82 LCoS/lava lamp. :cool:

This will seem a little odd, and a little off topic, but I have an RCA 52152ST 52" rear projection CRT TV that I am still using from 1992 as my primary set. It gets blue flares as you describe. The set was perfect till a year ago, when the high voltage transformer went out. After being repaired, I get blue flares in the lower left corner of the picture. Everything looks to be roughly in convergence, and the flares change depending on what is on the screen. I've cleaned the tubes, mirror surface, etc. They aren't heat related.

Could these be sympathy blue flares? Or maybe my tv is blue with envy from the LCOS?

Zac, Are you sure Toshiba didn't sneak into your house and replace your set with the one I just returned? :D What you are seeing sounds EXACTLY like what I have been seeing for the past couple of months, and perhaps now you can understand why I went for the refund much more eagerly.

I understand the angst in having to trade your 1080p Tosh for a lesser beast -- 720p or 788p most likely -- but I am reasonably pleased with my results so far and very happy to have $1,500 extra in the bank waiting for the HD-TiVo. I figure it will be time to pop up again in 3-5 years and see what the latest 1080p flat screens look like! :)

Axel,

No doubt this is a completely different problem than what is happening here. I'm actually not sure what would cause that kind of effect on a RP-CRT set other than internal refections of some sort?

Having the high voltage transformer go out, in my experience, is a very bad thing. I almost consider it as a harbinger of future problems with the set. This was definitely the case with my Pioneer Elite.

BTDT
I'm thinking of getting a 16:9 directview CRT set to hold me over.
Possibly the monivision special offered here in the directview section
of the forum.
Then I will be dying to pounce on the first viable 1920x1080p set available,
be it LCoS, LCD, or DLP.
If multiple solutions reveal themselves around the same time, obviously 3-chip
options will win out over single-chip options.
(I wish the JVC HX1 front projector was more in the high $5k/ low $6k range,
rather than the $8k range.... if I could get one for $6k even, I'd seriously
consider making the necessary changes to run a front projection system
instead of a rear projection tv.)

BTDT,

I agree, my set is on borrowed time. I wanted to get the 57hlx82, but missed the boat, and am hoping the 65hlx83 or something similar comes out before fall. If not, I guess I'll have to settle for 720P...

Hopefully my posting made you brave LCOS guys feel better. I'm stuck watching a 480i 4x3 TV with blue flares!