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Seattle, WA - OTA - Page 9

post #241 of 10032
also Lowes and other hardware type places carry some antenna mounting stuff and the prices are usually reasonable. try to mount the mast off the end of the house so you don't have to poke holes in the roof.
post #242 of 10032
Thanks guys -- I will check Lowes and RS for the mast/mounts. FYI -- I got my Dish 6000 installed yesterday and got my first view of HDTV on my Tv. Wow -- I am so stoked.

Now I'm going to work for the OTA stuff (CM 4228 will arrive Oct. 13th). One question I still have is how to properly ground the antenna. The side of the house/roof where the 4228 is going is on the opposite side of the house from my "official" underground ground. I guess I could run a wire around the house...

But I was wondering if I could tie the CM 4228 ground into my existing Dish Network stuff. Surely that equipment is grounded, and I think the tech may have already run a line around to my houses ground. Is there a way to ground the CM 4228 to the ground (if it is grounded?) on my satellite dish?

Thanks a bunch. I'll keep you posted on how things go. BTW -- Until yesterday I didn't know about all the "subchannels." I was at antennaweb and saw channels like 4, 5, 7, 38, 39, etc., but no 4-1, 4-2, etc.

If I ask my OTA tuner to scan will it pull in all the subchannels or will I have to punch them in manually? And if I want to input subchannel "4-1" how would I type that in?

Sorry for my ignorance about the OTA and grounding stuff -- I'm trying to learn!
post #243 of 10032
I can't tell you much about the grounding, I've always used indoor or attic antennas. However, a search here should help you out.

As for sub-channels, a scan should find all of them. All of DTV channels are identified by sub-channel. For example, KOMO has only one digital channel and it is on 4-1. The only Seattle stations that I know of that use multiple sub-channels are KCTS (9-1,9-2,9-3,9-4,9-5), KCPQ (13-1, 22-2) and KTWB (22-1,13-2).
post #244 of 10032
Just found this thread and realized how much I have been missing out!

I have built an HD HTPC system using MyHDII with DVI and had some success pulling in some OTA channels with an RS VU-75XR 18 element yagi mouted in the attic with an RS Cable TV high gain amplifier. Of the channels I care about receiving, only channel 48 (NBC/King) is unreliable with significant dropouts even when pointed for optimum signal.

I have exprimented with the Zenith SS with no success and was also thinking of the trying the Xium. After reading this entire thread, I am inclined to try the CM4228. Before I do....

Larry: would you be so kind as to check the LOS for intersection of SE 24th Way and 194th Ave SE in Sammamish (some maps have this as Issaquah)? Given that, can you tell me if the CM4228 or Xium would improve my situation over the RS setup?

Thank you very much - and how do I drop in my $0.25?

Kenny
post #245 of 10032
Kenny,

Your LOS is somewhat marginal dues to the hill across the lake from you. But it looks like you just clear the hill when I plot it out. The problem with KING dropping out may be to something in the path or a reflection that causes the receiver to lose track. I don't know if the 4228 will help but it is worth a try. I have seen it work for many people on this forum where other antennas failed. I would definitely put whatever you try up on the roof since being in the attic is not helping your situation. You need as much height as you can get.

Oh, and leave the quarter under your pillow - the HD fairy will come by while you're asleep...

Good luck.

Larry
post #246 of 10032
Hello All -- I'm getting close to installing the CM 4228 and three questions came up.

1) Have any of you installed an antenna rotor for seattle stations?

It seems that abc,cbs,nbc are all on the same bearing, pbs is close by, and that the only other I might want is fox.

If you have installed one, why? Did it have to do w/ the install process and "finding" the signals on your own w/out a buddy on the roof?

2) Also -- do I have to use any particular type of wire for the groundwire? I saw 40' of aluminum "ground wire" for $5 at R.Shack and I can by a copper ground pole (I'll have to dig and bury it myself) for $10. I'm looking to keep the cost minimal on grounding...

3) How many of you used or purchased an actual compass for your OTA install? Any suggestions?

Thanks!
post #247 of 10032
Larry,

I'm wondering if you can check my location on the topo -- I'm near the interesection of Seattle Hill Rd. and 137th SE, just east of Mill Creek (Snohomish address). It's fairly far out, so I am wondering how big of a Channel Master to get. Thanks a lot!

-Lance
post #248 of 10032
Lance,

You should have no problem. You're at the same altitude as QA hill and there is nothing in the way. I would use the CM 4228 since it seems to work for almost everyone and has more than enough range. I use one and I'm only 6 miles from QA - so no problem with overloads. Bearing is 207 degrees at 18.5 miles to QA. Aim 3 degrees east of that to cover CH towers as well. Good luck.
post #249 of 10032
Ron,

I would use a rotor if I wanted the PAX and other eastside stuff but I didn't feel it was worth it. I have my 4228 pointed halfway between QA and CH - that gives me digitals for 4,5,6,7,9,11,13,22. I think since you are in Everett you probably won't need a rotor - everything is within a 15-degree window which is easily handled by the 4228. I looked up the thread where I gave you the topo info. Just aim about 20 deg. west of due south - it ain't that critical. +/-5 won't be noticed.

As far as grounding goes, it depends on whether you want to meet code. I'm not sure what it says about aluminum for antennas. It will work, since the ground is there to drain off charge, not to take on a lightning bolt. And it should go to the building ground point, not a separate one, to avoid potential buildup. I would scan these forums on grounding if you don't get any useful replies (like mine).

Larry
post #250 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by quarque
Lance,

You should have no problem. You're at the same altitude as QA hill and there is nothing in the way. I would use the CM 4228 since it seems to work for almost everyone and has more than enough range. I use one and I'm only 6 miles from QA - so no problem with overloads. Bearing is 207 degrees at 18.5 miles to QA. Aim 3 degrees east of that to cover CH towers as well. Good luck.

Excellent news, thank you so much for looking that up for me. I'm going to put the antenna in the attic, so I need to see if the CM4228 will fit in there. I was originally hoping that the CM4221 would work since it is less expensive and smaller, because I don't think the CM4228 will fit.

I'm also wondering if I could realistically pick up some the the Bellingham stations... Antennaweb.org seems to think it is a possibility, but I'd probably need the 4228 for them.

-Lance
post #251 of 10032
Larry,

Thanks again for the helpful info. You own this thread!
post #252 of 10032
Does anyone on this thread have an "in" to UPN engineering?? This is the only Seattle OTA that I can't receive. I was wondering what their current power output is, what their final power output is expected to be, and when is the power bump going to happen. I heard on another thread that UPN is supposed to start delivering HD material soon.

Darryl
post #253 of 10032
I wonder if Larry (and the other gods of this thread) could help me figure out why I'm unable to receive OTA HD channels at my location? I've tried a CM 4221, and added a CM 7775 signal preamp, but still no luck.

I'm at the intersection of NE 46th St and NE 162nd Ave in Redmond (close to Marymoor park). I'm happy to buy a beer (or two for anyone on the thread who can help me get the OTA HD broadcasts working!
post #254 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by darmad2002
Does anyone on this thread have an "in" to UPN engineering?? This is the only Seattle OTA that I can't receive. I was wondering what their current power output is, what their final power output is expected to be, and when is the power bump going to happen. I heard on another thread that UPN is supposed to start delivering HD material soon.

Darryl

Darryl,
KSTW DT 36 is currently transmitting 68KW ERP from about 450 feet on our tower.
We just last week received an FCC construction permit to replace our top mount antenna with a combo CH11/CH36. We were held up for 9 months by the Canadian CRTC.
The antenna and tower modifications should be ordered soon. We are anticipating installation late next summer.
Our licensed full power for DT36 will be 850KW ERP. We should have one of the best NTSC and DTV signals in town when finished!

Dave Frank
KSTW TV Assistant Chief Engineer
post #255 of 10032
Thanks for the info Dave. Do you think there will ever be an "incremental" increase in power before you actually go to the full 850KW ERP. Meaning, maybe in a couple of months push it up to 125KW and then 850 next summer ?? Just being hopeful.

Of course I can always have hope for UPN to have a digital HD channel on Comcast sometime before next summer. I currently get 0 signal OTA.

Thanks Darryl
post #256 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by sdossick
I wonder if Larry (and the other gods of this thread) could help me figure out why I'm unable to receive OTA HD channels at my location? I've tried a CM 4221, and added a CM 7775 signal preamp, but still no luck.

I'm at the intersection of NE 46th St and NE 162nd Ave in Redmond (close to Marymoor park). I'm happy to buy a beer (or two for anyone on the thread who can help me get the OTA HD broadcasts working!

I have come down from the topo mountain my son and the tablets indicate much darkness in your realm. Your elevation is about 200 feet and you have a 550 foot hill west of you that blocks the QA and CH towers. Sorry.

On a lighter note, I'm working on a script for a movie. The working title is "Dude, where's my signal".

Larry
post #257 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by darmad2002
Does anyone on this thread have an "in" to UPN engineering?? This is the only Seattle OTA that I can't receive. I was wondering what their current power output is, what their final power output is expected to be, and when is the power bump going to happen. I heard on another thread that UPN is supposed to start delivering HD material soon.

Darryl

Your problem may not be signal strength. You may be getting reflections or have something blocking that tower. Try moving your antenna as far as possible in each direction from its current location. What is your nearest intersection?
post #258 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by DaveFrank
Darryl,
KSTW DT 36 is currently transmitting 68KW ERP from about 450 feet on our tower.
We just last week received an FCC construction permit to replace our top mount antenna with a combo CH11/CH36. We were held up for 9 months by the Canadian CRTC.
The antenna and tower modifications should be ordered soon. We are anticipating installation late next summer.
Our licensed full power for DT36 will be 850KW ERP. We should have one of the best NTSC and DTV signals in town when finished!

Dave Frank
KSTW TV Assistant Chief Engineer

Dave:

Does your transmitted DTV signal still favor the south as was originally required to meet your Tacoma coverage requirement?
post #259 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by quarque
I have come down from the topo mountain my son and the tablets indicate much darkness in your realm. Your elevation is about 200 feet and you have a 550 foot hill west of you that blocks the QA and CH towers. Sorry.

On a lighter note, I'm working on a script for a movie. The working title is "Dude, where's my signal".

Larry

I was going to say, that part of Redmond is in a big hole there...

sdossick, if you want to get rid of your 4221 and preamp, that's the combo I'm looking at getting. Let me know!

-Lance
post #260 of 10032
Quarque,

I am in a zone which could be considered a "black hole". You once gave me a prediction which was pretty miserable for receiving OTA signals. I now receive ALL OTA Seattle signals except UPN 11-1. Its wierd. Why should I receive all except 11-1. Now I am north east of the towers. I am at Woodinville-Duvall Rd and 236th PL. I use a CM 4248 with a CM 7775 and do a pretty good job with most channels (depending upon conditions).

Darryl
post #261 of 10032
Oh great one... er... Larry,

How about the intersection of NE 97th St and 168th Ave NE on top of Education Hill in Redmond? Please.

The magic 8 ball says...

Thanks,
Mike
post #262 of 10032
KSTW UPN 11 DT 36 (11-1) is broadcasting it's HD signal at low power, 68Kw directionally aimed at the S, SW toward Tacoma, our city of license. That's probably why you're getting everyone but us...everyone is at full power and we're not...plus the directionality of the signal.
KSTW just received approval (10/3/03) from the FCC to construct new full power (850 Kw) DTV facilities and a new ch. 11 antenna as well. We hope to complete this project by mid 2004...then you should be able to receive 11 and 11-1.
Ron Diotte
CE, KSTW
post #263 of 10032
Lance -- I've PM'ed you about selling the 4221 and preamp.

Cheers
post #264 of 10032
Ron:

Thanks for the KSTW clariification.
post #265 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by mle_ii
Oh great one... er... Larry,

How about the intersection of NE 97th St and 168th Ave NE on top of Education Hill in Redmond? Please.

The magic 8 ball says...

Thanks,
Mike

Looks pretty good. You have a hill to the west but if you put your antenna on a rooftop it should be OK. Height may affect your success significantly.
post #266 of 10032
Quote:


Originally posted by darmad2002
Quarque,

I am in a zone which could be considered a "black hole". You once gave me a prediction which was pretty miserable for receiving OTA signals. I now receive ALL OTA Seattle signals except UPN 11-1. Its wierd. Why should I receive all except 11-1. Now I am north east of the towers. I am at Woodinville-Duvall Rd and 236th PL. I use a CM 4248 with a CM 7775 and do a pretty good job with most channels (depending upon conditions).

Darryl

Well, it ain't an exact science. A few blocks in either direction can make a big difference when hills are involved. Glad to hear you succeeded though. Obviously the directional nature of 11-1's broadcast is working against you. May not improve until they change their equipment.

Larry
post #267 of 10032
Hello Larry,

I could DEFINITELY use your help. I currently have a rooftop antenna and cannot get a good HD signal. I usually get 1-2 minutes tops before it drops out and comes back in again. I am primarily interested in being able to get ABC (Monday Night Football). I live near the corner of NE 97th St and 27th Ave NE.

Am I just in a hopeless location?
post #268 of 10032
darmad2002, UPN is not a Seattle signal, it's coming from Tacoma.

Enter your address at the URL in my signature to learn where to point. I think your antennea can pull it in if aimed right. Your on top the hill, right?

sorry, no sig! www . antennaweb . org / aw / welcome . asp

IGNORE THE SPACES!
post #269 of 10032
quarque!!

where do you get your topography info??? it's fascinating

Can you tell us a distance from hill / height of hill = ratio
for signal reception ?
post #270 of 10032
Quote:
Originally posted by weebling1
darmad2002, UPN is not a Seattle signal, it's coming from Tacoma.

KSTW UPN 11 (NTSC) and 11-1 (36-1, ATSC) both broadcast from the same tower on Capitol Hill in Seattle, adjacent to the tower for KCTS PBS channel 9 (NTSC) and 9-n (41-n, ATSC).

KSTW is licensed for Tacoma, but their transmitter is in Seattle. Their digital transmitter/antenna is currently directional and favors Tacoma while it is at low power. They recently received FCC approval to up their digital power. Their target is to have new NTSC and ATSC antennas deployed with higher power sometime next summer.

KSTW station engineers Ron Diotte and Dave Frank both monitor and post in this forum and provided the information that I repeated here (accurately I hope--working from memory). They have been extremely helpful with their ongoing communications with several Seattle area HD enthusiasts and the AVSForum.
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