Seattle, WA - OTA - Page 325

Try writing the engineering dept. and the programming dept. for each station and ask them to increase the PSIP data out to a minimum of 72 hours. Right now I have ABC at 5 days out, NBC at 48 hours, CBS at 24 hours, PBS (9) at 3 days, Fox at three days, CW at 24 Hours, Joe and Ant at 3 days. It seems that three days is very doable for all and it is enough information so you will be able to keep up easily. The stations down at 24 hours and below get a little hard to schedule and see unless you have unlimited time to keep watching every day.
I also have had a little trouble with the program discriptions but am going to wait for a few more weeks to make sure it is not something to do with the changeover from TVGOS. Check out the Pal DVR thread to see what others from around the country have already experienced. Keep in mind that even though the information is posted out to a time in the future it slowly decreases by three to six hours until the next update. I believe if enough of us write we can get all the major networks at least to go out to three days (72 hours). ABC seems to have no trouble going clear out to five days.

Taylor
HD UHF, which is what 4 & 5 are, is very line of sight. Does not like to bend over hills like the old VHF analog 4 &5 did. Even when you could get the old analog signal there, it was ghosty and lousy. In the late 70's, I lived across the street from Aki Kurose school and behind the shopping center at 39th & Graham. Reception for 4,5 & 7 was lousy, even after I put up a new antenna. And that had a much better shot at downtown and QA Hill than you have.
The signal is way above you, at least 150ft, plus trees. You couldn't go high enough with a mast, obviously. And even if you did, those tall buildings downton are right in the path. Yes, there's a small chance some signal might be there, but all those trees right NW of you, and the buildings are going to chop up what little might be left. An amplifier is just going to go into overload from ch9, 11 & 22. No help.
If you want to play, go to RatShack, there's one at Rainier and Genessee, and get the biggest Antennacraft they have, at least an HBU33, and a ten ft mast. Assemble it carefully and keep the packing so you can return it. Also pick up a 50ft coax with ends on it already. Have somebody hold it in place, pointing towards downtown. A little more west than parallel to MLK, give or take. Then do another scan and see what happens.
Then buy the Lotto and pay for cable with the winnings, at least Basic for $13/mo.
Or just buy a new house at better location!
Dan

I'm adding the direct line of sight to Queen Anne to my list of criteria for the next house. I guess for now I'll swallow my pride and call Comcast for basic cable. Thanks for taking the time to help Dan. Really appreciate it!

Taylor
Welcome.
Send me some basic areas your interested in for reception when the house hunt starts.
You don't need perfect line of sight, just not the major hills like you have now.
Dan

Okay, Dan I know what you said about my chances of getting the Queen Anne channels. I was up in bed thinking about what you said last night but I told myself I have to at least try it before giving up. I know, it's problem of mine, I obsess over things like this until I know for sure that it can't be solved. Anyway, as I was driving to work this morning, I saw several houses in the neighbor, at lower elevation than mine had antennas of various sizes pointing at QA so they must be getting something. So I think I'm going to give it a shot. Can you recommend some antennas to try? Here are some I'm considering...

Channel Master CM3671 (This is the biggest CM they have)
Channel Master CM 3679
Winegard HD8200U
RCA ANT751R ( I thought I put this one my list since it got great reviews on Amazon.)

I would think the best thing to do is to knock on your closest neighbors doors with antennas and ask how their reception is and what exactly they have in equipment. That would be a lot easier start than trying several different antennas yourself. At least that is what I would try first.

Taylor
I agree with tmn1. Checking with neighbors would get some quick results. If they are more towards MLK, they might have a better chance at seeing around the hill. If they are getting 4&5, find out what they are using, or if they don't know, snap a picture and post it, along with their approximate nearest cross streets. (No address)

As for testing, those two Channelmaster antennas are not what you want to try, as they have huge low band VHF elements, won't help. The Winegard has a lousy balun on it, and no VHF hi band. The RCA is way too small. Antenna reviews on Amazon, or anywhere else actually, from customers, don't mean a whole lot, because you have no idea what their particular location was like. For other things it's usually okay.
Try the HBU33 from RatShack. It's big enough to make a difference if there's anything there to receive. If it doesn't work they'll take it back. Also get a mast and 50ft cable with ends on it as well from them, and save the packaging on all of it.

But first, try the excellent suggestion to check with the neighbors.

Dan

The announced merger of Fisher into the Sinclkair group of stations is not one that I am happy with. In my market of Las Vegas, Sinclair operates two stations, a CW and a MyNetworkTV affiliate. Neither station has any newscasts currently. I grew up with KOMO and know the quality of the station, their newscasts, and their parent company. Seattle and the entire Northwest deserve much better than tight budgeted Sinclair. Let the FCC know your displeasure of this pending merger. I'm also a Fisher shareholder.

In my honest & deepest opinion, Fisher has sold its kingdom to the devil. Nuff said.

So yesterday KOMO went out, I had nothing. Today, KING is giving me problems and KING was the strongest station I had! KIRO seems to be chuggin away and hasn't given me grief. Any reason for these changes? KOMO has also been on the fringe, but KING was my strongest. Is it the weather? My antenna hasn't moved. I'm located in Snohomish.

Thanks

Everything looking good in Funky FedWay on my meter.
What usually happens is the elements on the antenna, where they're riveted together, start to corrode over time. With the weather, temp changes and small amounts of wind, even the birds sitting on them occasionally, all add up to small changes. You won't see it because the tuner still has enough signal to lock on to.
When you fall beneath that threshold or actual signal level, it will start to break up, audio will stutter or it will just be gone. You could've been on the ragged edge for a long time and not known it. Your "strength" indicator will still show happy times.
The other possibility is the balun. If not sealed well, it can get moisture in it and short out. When it dries out, it may start to work again. In time it will rust out. The wiring in it is tiny thread like wires, so it doesn't take much to do it in. If nothing else, try a balun swap. Cheap-N-EZ. Just be very careful of the antenna's elements. When they get weathered, they become brittle and can snap off.
Let us know what you find.
Dan

Thanks for the response. The antenna is new, about 2 months old and is mounted in my garage. I'm going to tinker with it today, maybe place it in my attic. Later this summer I'll look at mounting it outside. I'm also using cheap coax, will that effect the signal?

Having it mounted inside just makes the problem worse. It could be something in your path, a tree or trees that have limbs sagging or moving around enough to bother the signal. It just means you probably have a pretty ugly signal, scope and meter wise, that your tuner is just able to handle. You wouldn't know it, because once it's locked on, the picture is perfect. A very small change in the signal reception could just push you past the threshold. Not like old analog where yo would still see a ghosting snowy picture. It's all or nothing.
The cheaper quality cable will lower the overall level of the signal, but it won't normally cause a sudden change. Environment is the more likely culprit.
Don't wait for summer, going to be nice this weekend!
Dan

I remounted it and I'm getting great signal from KOMO and KIRO. Both are at 70% and are solid. I can't seem to lock on to KING. When I first flip to KING their signal is at 40% and then it just drops...and bounces back from the teens to twenties. Any idea why it's off so much? Aren't the towers right next to each other on Queen Anne? I'm in Snohomish.

drlovety
Ch5 is much higher in frequency than 4 or 7. Also, surrounding obstacles, like trees, buildings, etc, can act like filters and block some signals more than others. When you see the signals bounce around it's either right on the ragged edge of a weak signal and what your tuner can handle, or there are trees in the path and the limbs moving around in the breeze can interrupt the signal. There's also the possibility that the antenna just doesn''t do that well on the higher frequencies. Since it was working before, it's probably good enough, you just need to find that sweet spot for all three channels.
Moving the antenna in any direction, not just turning it, but relocating it as little as 8 inches can make or break reception when you're working with poor or weak signals. Patience wins out. Keep a record of how well the cahnnels are doing, and where the antenna was and it's direction. Move it a LITTLE bit and WAIT. It takes 10 to 15 seconds for some decoders to lock on to weak signals. It's not like the old analog days where you could whip it around and watch the ghosting get better or worse in real time.
Dan

Hello All - I used to post in the audio section a few years back but have been away. Yesterday I cut the Comcast cord and i am looking into OTA TV again - never went ahead with it in the past. I am a bit confounded by the uncertainty and the alternatives. This looks like a great helpful forum - maybe someone here could please point me in the right direction.

We live in the 1800 block on 40th Ave East - a little north of Madison. TV fool indicates that we have a good chance of getting about 14 stations with an indoor set top antenna, 4 with an attic mounted antenna, and 2 more with a roof mounted antenna. I would be delighted just to get the 3 major networks and PBS and TV Fool's info makes this look realistic. However I am concerned about the rise toward Broadmoor and Capitol Hill. I have also heard that reflections and multi-path issues may occur in the city, although we are just in a residential area with 1 and 2 story homes so maybe not as much of a concern. There is a two story house south of our 1 story.

I was thinking of mounting an antenna on the old mast where electrical power came into the house before I dug a trench and had it undergrounded during a backyard project I did. This is a low point on the roof but I could secure a support that would put the antenna about the height of our ridgeline.

Sorry for the long intro but I wanted to describe the situation before asking two questions:

What antenna would you recommend?

Any other advice?

Thanks so much for your help!

Volcan
TV Fool doesn't take in to account hills, trees or buildings.
You are correct, the hill to the west by Broadmoor is in your way, and then Capital hill rises quickly on the other side which really blocks 4,5,7 & 16. Channels 9,11, 22 and channel 13's repeater would most likely come in from the South, if there aren't too many trees in the way. There's also some stations from the direction of Issaquah and ch7's repeater, which should be easy to get. A Channelmaster 4221, which normally isn't made for ch's 9 & 11, would probably be okay because you're so close. It also has a wide reception capability, which might work if aimed somewhere between South and East. If you have a lot of trees near you, it could be a lot tougher.
If you want to use your old power service entrance mast, it could be okay if it's well anchored, and weather sealed. Be sure to remove the part of the pipe that attaches to your power panel. I know, its only metal, no wires, but it gets into code violations, which then gives your insurance company a good excuse to not honor your home policy.
Dan

Here is my reception report for Lacey, zip code 98503:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d1ddaf78697886d

I'm using the Y10-7-13 for VHF and the 91XG for UHF. This is feeding through a CM7777 preamp. My cable run is 50 feet and I have only one TV (Sony 34XBR960 with a QAM tuner). I have quite a few large conifer and broadleaf trees to the North and West.

I found reception to be extremely sensitive to the location of the antennas on my roof. I believe this is due to the trees and some large houses to the North. Originally I tried both antennas stacked on one mast. I could not find an optimum location which got me all the channels I wanted with this method. The only VHF station I get is 13 KCPQ-DT. There is only one location on my roof where this comes in. The signal is very strong in this location however. Unfortunately at this location I can't get 28.1 KBTC which I definitely want. So I put up another mast for the 91XG. With this antenna I'm getting 28.1, 20.X, 33.X, 42.X, 51 (7.1 KIRO), 46, 50 (51.X Spanish language). Sometimes 38 (4.1 KOMO) comes in with a lot of breakup.

Why the preamp? It gets me KIRO on 51. I don't get the local KIRO translator on 34 to the West at all, even pointing the antenna in that direction, probably because of trees and numerous 2-storey houses.

I do wish I could get KOMO and KING. I believe I could if not for the trees in that direction. I'm not going to put an antenna on top of a 100 ft tree. Still, I'm reasonably happy.

Dan - Thanks so much for your good advice. I have taken a closer look at the old power strike and it only extends above the roof about 6". I was going to just lash a mast to the old vertical, but it is so short I am going to plan B, which is to mount the mast on the chimney. I will be busy for next couple of weeks but then I will install the CM 4221 and will check back in to let you know how it goes. I think I have pretty good LOS toward Issaquah for the Ch 7 repeater. But it sounds like the QA towers and even the CH Madison towers are not likely. Thanks again!