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Orange County, CA - Cox - Page 23

post #661 of 7252
9/21/04 at 5:06pm
Response from Cox:

"Hello Don,
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Thank you for your e-mail. Cox is committed to providing the best customer service possible.
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Please accept my apologies for the "bugs" that have been encountered with this brand new "Cable Industry" technology. It will take time to work them all out and rest assured that the bugs are being addressed.
Thank you again for the feedback, we appreciate it. I will pass it along to our Product Support group. We have received several complaints about the same issue. Motorola is being made aware of these issues so that they can come up with a resolution for us as soon as possible. We can't say yet when the resolution will be available, all we can do is wait on Motorola, sorry. Please continue to send us your feedback, it is important.
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If we can be of any additional service to you, please do not hesitate to contact us again.
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Sincerely, Phil
Tech Support - Video & Telephony
Cox Communications Online Support Team"
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post #662 of 7252
9/21/04 at 6:24pm
Got exactly the same reply from "Phil".
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post #663 of 7252
9/21/04 at 10:33pm
Quote:


Originally posted by fenwayfan
Got exactly the same reply from "Phil".

Well I'm glad someone got an email response - I imagine I was among the first to complain about this via email and never even got a reply. I would encourage anyone in OC who has not already called to complain about this to do so to let them know this is a very widespread problem, and not limited to Orange County.
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post #664 of 7252
9/22/04 at 12:34am
I was wondering what you all where talking about with the pixillation issues and the HD PVR but I ran into both of them with the Amazing Race and Father of the Pride tonight... both where pretty much unwatchable. Thank god for the backup tivo.
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post #665 of 7252
9/22/04 at 8:49am
Quote:


Originally posted by Gendal
I was wondering what you all where talking about with the pixillation issues and the HD PVR but I ran into both of them with the Amazing Race and Father of the Pride tonight... both where pretty much unwatchable. Thank god for the backup tivo.

Please call them and report the issue. In my email I did refer them to these forums for more samples of users with issues.
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post #666 of 7252
9/22/04 at 9:05am
What someone should do is post the exact email address of where to complan. That way no one had to seach around for the correct one.
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post #667 of 7252
9/22/04 at 9:50am
This is where I went. I also got the "Phil" response.

https://www.cox.com/support/oc/emailchat/emailus.asp
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post #668 of 7252
9/22/04 at 10:20am
When you contact OC tech support about this problem also suggest that they setup a technical forum monitored by them where we can go to discuss this and any other bugs/enhancement requests etc. IMO this is the best way to get your problems/needs addressed and to provide useful and efficient 2 way communication. Or easier yet just have them monitor and post to this thread.
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post #669 of 7252
9/22/04 at 10:22am
Here some more from "Phil"
-----------------------------------------
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Thank you for your e-mail. Cox is committed to providing the best
customer service possible.
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We have discovered that the dual tuner software upgrade we loaded into
the DVR's may be causing a problem. Please accept my apologies for the
"bugs" that have been encountered with this brand new "Cable Industry"
technology. It will take time to work them all out and rest assured that
the bugs are being addressed.
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As far as we can tell this problem is happening to all of the DVR boxes,
it appears to be related to the dual tuner software upgrade that was
loaded into the Digital boxes last week. So far we have determined that
the tiling and audio skipping occurs after using the pause, rewind, and
fast forward functions.
-----------------------------------------
... the rest of the email is the same as what was posted by "sucha deal!"
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post #670 of 7252
9/22/04 at 2:27pm
Quote:


Originally posted by Rich4av
By the way, I also have the "hole" in my online guide on Friday - "No Data" for a number of hours and then the guide continues normally.

I've had this problem resurface since Cox fixed it last time. I'm starting to think this another new bug...
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post #671 of 7252
9/22/04 at 3:00pm
I received a reply from "Phil" at 2:15 PM PDT that is a slight expansion (copied belwo) on what Dong-Kinh posted earlier. It's pretty much just a thorough acknowledgment of the problem ...

"As far as we can tell this problem is happening to all of the DVR boxes,
it appears to be related to the dual tuner software upgrade that was
recently loaded into the DVR Digital boxes. So far we have determined
that the tiling and audio skipping usually occurs after using the pause,
rewind, and fast forward, and LIVE functions, especially if both tuners
are tuned to HD channels, and when an HD channel is being recorded.
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For example, if you go to an HD channel and not use pause, rewind or
fast forward, the picture is fine. If you then use one of those 4
functions, the picture starts the tiling and audio skipping. If you
change to a different channel and then come back to this channel the
picture is fine until you use one of those 4 functions again. Then you
have to change the channel and then come back again to stop the problem."
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post #672 of 7252
9/22/04 at 7:06pm
Quote:


Originally posted by Steve Wilcox
I've had this problem resurface since Cox fixed it last time. I'm starting to think this another new bug...

I got the "guide hole" problem now too. Today has a hole in the data as well as several other days ahead. A hard reboot of the unit (unplugging the unit and replugging it) solves the problem but of course is not a desireable workaround to it.
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post #673 of 7252
9/22/04 at 7:57pm
I had the same problem with a day of no data but guide data after that. i just called the Cox phone number and was able to trigger a reset from the phone menu. It was quick and corrected the problem with no side effects.
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post #674 of 7252
9/22/04 at 10:07pm
I have a hole in the guide again on Sunday. I can fix it through a reload but it's a bug for sure.
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post #675 of 7252
9/23/04 at 8:11am
This is the latest status on the 6412 new bugs. It is very encouraging to see that Cox OC is now very aware of the bugs and how to reproduce them and have fed all the information to Motorola. Under the circumstances it seems like Cox OC is doing the best they can to expedite a fix for the problems. This was the latest email I got:
Quote:


We were given an email this morning from our product support team,
explaining the known issues that have been recognized by Motorola
regarding the HD-DVR. As the "front line" employees who speak directly
to the customer, ir can be as frustrating for us as it is for you, to
want to understand why certain problems keep repeating and what can be
done about them. It takes a lot of gathered information sometimes, and
solid data to give our leaders before the situation is acknowledged.

What we were told:
1) Starting a HD recording and then watching a HD channel will cause the
bug to appear.
2) Turning off the power on the box while on a HD channel--If the box is
set to power on to last channel viewed, the box will power on to a HD
channel, which will cause the bug to appear.
3) While recording a HD channel in real time, the use of trick modes
will cause the bug to appear.
4) While watching a HD channel, pressing the instant replay button and
then pressing the live button will cause the bug to appear.

There also seems to be an issue with the fast forward button as well,
that we are just learning about. The program will fast forward, but when
you Play again, it goes back to where you started.

Regarding the guide having "holes" we are just beginning to hear trends
about this, so we are again gathering information and seeking
resolutions. Rebooting the box seems to help for now, but of course it
should not be happening at all.

We have been told that these issues are in every Motorola HD-DVR across
the U.S., not just with Cox or in the Cox system. Although that is no
consolation to you, of course, the bugs are being identified and
explored as we speak, so that we can get these issues corrected.

I have forwarded your email to product support, in hopes that they will
consider posting some sort of formal announcement about the problems and
the resolutions on this forum. Our lack of information has made us look
much worse than the fact that there were bugs in the software. We are
sincerely trying to learn all we can and convey it to you as thoroughly
as possible. Thank you for "hanging in there" with us!

Sincerely,
Brenda
Cox Communications - Video/Telephony Tech Support
Online Support Team
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post #676 of 7252
9/23/04 at 2:06pm
The test of a company's service is not how they act when everything is going according to plan, but how they react when it all goes wrong. I think Cox and their support group is doing a pretty good job on this one.

On the other hand, as the manager of an engineering test department for a computer company, I would have to say that Motorola's test department appears to be nonexistent. These were problems most of us found the first few hours of using the box. Hmmm, lets see, record two HD channels at the same time on your new dual tuner firmware. Nawww, that's way too obscure to bother trying before you release it on all your boxes.
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post #677 of 7252
9/23/04 at 4:03pm
I just get a bad feeling on this. I don't think it will be a quick fix. As I have mentioned in previous posts, this is a bandwidth issue that probably just can't be solved with a simple program patch.

I sure hope I'm wrong, but I don't think these boxes have the necessary horsepower. Firmware, and software patches usually can take care of bugs - I think this fix needs a faster processor and/or memory or redesign. Or downgrade the feature-set (only single HD recording).

It's good to see their contrition, but I also don't think Cox should send any more of these units out until the problem is fixed, whether it's a download, field-service-upgrade or replacement. In the meantime, they should at least waive the $4.95/mo charge.
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post #678 of 7252
9/23/04 at 4:12pm
Quote:


Originally posted by sucha deal!

I sure hope I'm wrong, but I don't think these boxes have the necessary horsepower. Firmware, and software patches usually can take care of bugs - I think this fix needs a faster processor and/or memory or redesign. Or downgrade the feature-set (only single HD recording).

I hope you're wrong too - but even if the hardware needs an upgrade we are all renting the hardware, so if it takes another box to do the job then so be it - just hope there is already one well past the design phase at Motorola.
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post #679 of 7252
9/23/04 at 4:21pm
Cox did waive the $4.95 charge when I told them that the PVR can't deliver its promises.
I recommend everyone to call and ask them to waive the charge until there's a fix.


Quote:


Originally posted by sucha deal!
In the meantime, they should at least waive the $4.95/mo charge.
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post #680 of 7252
9/23/04 at 5:14pm
This morning I notice that it wouldn't let me schedule two HD recording at the same time. I haven't had a chance to throughly check this out, might have been anomaly, but I'm hoping this isn't there resolution to fixing the dual HD bug.

I've also found it annoying that the "skip back" after fast forward seems to just skip back to the last even minute mark. ie. if you hit play at
1h:23m:10s into a program it skips back to 0h:32m:00s; if you hit play at
1h:23m:59s into a program it skips back to 0h:32m:00s; this sucks...
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post #681 of 7252
9/23/04 at 8:02pm
jb510, after FF hit Pause first, then Play. It will skip ahead a bit and resume at the right place.
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post #682 of 7252
9/24/04 at 12:34am
Quote:


Originally posted by moyekj
...This was the latest email I got:
"...We have been told that these issues are in every Motorola HD-DVR across
the U.S., not just with Cox or in the Cox system. ..."

Not quite so. I'd like to point out that Motorola's other two-tuner HD-DVR, the BMC9012 with Moxi has been in commercial deployment since May and both tuners have been working since day one. It's not on the Cox system yet, but subscribers on Adelphia and Charter are able to record two HD shows simultaneously while playing back a third. Motorola's other two-tuner HD-DVR, the BMC9012 with Moxi has been in commercial deployment (but not on the Cox network) since May both tuners have been working since day one. It's not on the Cox system yet, but subscribers on Adelphia and Charter are able to record two HD shows simultaneously while playing back a third.
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post #683 of 7252
9/24/04 at 6:13am
Quote:


Originally posted by Rich4av
jb510, after FF hit Pause first, then Play. It will skip ahead a bit and resume at the right place.

That's even worse! That jumps FORWARD 5 seconds or so. The point is that it should JUMP BACK an even ammount of time to compenstate for user reaction time. TiVo does this perfectly and after a few days with TiVo you find it second nature because it's consistent.
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post #684 of 7252
9/24/04 at 7:36am
Quote:


Originally posted by MoxiGuy
Not quite so. I'd like to point out that Motorola's other two-tuner HD-DVR, the BMC9012 with Moxi has been in commercial deployment since May and both tuners have been working since day one. It's not on the Cox system yet, but subscribers on Adelphia and Charter are able to record two HD shows simultaneously while playing back a third. Motorola's other two-tuner HD-DVR, the BMC9012 with Moxi has been in commercial deployment (but not on the Cox network) since May both tuners have been working since day one. It's not on the Cox system yet, but subscribers on Adelphia and Charter are able to record two HD shows simultaneously while playing back a third.

Thanks for the post. I read about the Moxi system and must say it sounds pretty impressive. It has all the features of the Passport Echo system and more. One feature I really like is that when you remove channels you don't care about/subscribe to from channel list they won't show up in the guide. Don't know yet if the USB 2.0 ports have been enabled to allow additional external storage but at least that option is there. The 6412 only has USB 1.x ports AFAIK.

MoxiGuy, when you say it's not in the Cox system yet, does that mean there are plans for it sometime down the road? Do you know why Cox chose the 6412 as their platform over the BMC9012? Maybe we can start a campaign to have Cox OC transition to the BMC9012 as a means to solve the problems we are seeing.
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post #685 of 7252
9/24/04 at 8:13am
Quote:


Originally posted by moyekj
MoxiGuy, when you say it's not in the Cox system yet, does that mean there are plans for it sometime down the road? Do you know why Cox chose the 6412 as their platform over the BMC9012? Maybe we can start a campaign to have Cox OC transition to the BMC9012 as a means to solve the problems we are seeing.

I can't speak for Cox. I can tell you we're talking with them about the merits of Motorola BMC9012 and the two-room system, BMC9022 with Moxi Mate. "Yet," expresses my hope that we will be persuasive. As for a customer campaign, that's up to Cox customers. If you want to learn more about the Motorola BMC9012 with Moxi, here's our website.
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post #686 of 7252
9/24/04 at 8:24am
Read a little more about Moxi. Other features to like over the Passport system:
- 30 second skip button!
- multi-room system (looks like 2 room system and not yet released). This allows streaming shows between 2 boxes among other things.
- hiding channels in the channel guide (as I mentioned before already)
- didn't see how many days are available in the channel guide, but I have to assume it's more than 6.

There's probably more I overlooked in my quick perusal.
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post #687 of 7252
9/24/04 at 8:40am
Quote:


Originally posted by moyekj
...didn't see how many days are available in the channel guide, but I have to assume it's more than 6....

It's 14 days of program data.

BTW, simultaneously playing and recording high definition video is not that easy. Our developers may have cheated: They elected to use a 733MHz processor that's several times faster than the processor in the 6412. The 9012 has more memory and it uses a real operating system with a highly tuned file system. The architecture was designed from the outset for two HD tuners. It was never thought of as "adding a second tuner."
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post #688 of 7252
9/24/04 at 9:38am
I'm sold on the Moxi system. For all those with Cox and especially those with Cox OC if you like what the Moxi system has to offer please go to the following site to express your interest. Moxi will pass the information along to Cox with enough requests.
https://secure.digeo.com/contacts/moxiform.jsp
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post #689 of 7252
9/24/04 at 10:06am
I just got off the phone with Cox cable customer service. I was informed that Cox has known from the very beginning that the 6412 was not able to work properly in the dual tuner mode. The $4.95 fee for this service is in fact a discounted fee from $9.95, so all of you who thought that cox was providing this service for $14.90 (including box) a month, like me, have been duped. When Cox works out the bugs it is going to be $19.00

On the bright side the customer rep was very happy to escalate my request for the Moxi system. She also has a 6412 and is frustrated.
Now my question is how did some of you get an additional discount?
The rep told me that the only way to remove the $4.95 was to completely remove the service and get my old 6200 back.

Niesman
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post #690 of 7252
9/24/04 at 1:35pm
Quote:


Originally posted by MoxiGuy

BTW, simultaneously playing and recording high definition video is not that easy. Our developers ... elected to use a 733MHz processor that's several times faster than the processor in the 6412. The 9012 has more memory and it uses a real operating system with a highly tuned file system. The architecture was designed from the outset for two HD tuners. It was never thought of as "adding a second tuner."

This is what I thought: it's going to be difficult to get the 6412 to perform the way we want it, and an uphill battle for Cox to make it work. And so far, I'm not overly impressed with the Passport Echo system. As I talked about in a previous post, the channel skip/hide feature alone is worth the change. It also automatically records what's in the buffer when you hit the record button, another very desirable feature that is lacking with Passport. Moxi and the BMC9012 really seem to be the ticket. There are other threads on AVS about Moxi that you can also look at, and it's refreshing that no one has the problems that the 6412 has. The additional processing speed and memory and design that MoxiGuy talks about is what's necessary.

I think we should rally behind a effort to influence this change to the BMC9012. I don't think an email to "Phil" is going to do the job though. I called Cox specifically to get an address where our efforts could make a difference. I was told that a letter sent to the following address would do the most good and is given the most attention. He said writing a letter is much better than an email or phone call:

Cox Communications
29947 Avenida de las Banderas
Rancho Santa Margarita, CA 92688
Attn: Complaints

In my letter, I will explain my disappointment with the 6412 and mention that there is a solution from Motorola/Moxi that looks like it will solve the problems.

What do others think about this letter-writing campaign? I figure those that are on this Forum can really make a difference (and have the ability to communicate). Send a post if you write a letter to Cox!

Don
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