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Sony 34XBR910 Reviews - Page 2  

post #31 of 423
Interesting post about the "film-like" quality of the XBR910 with HD and DVD material. I hope you're right (still trying to find one on display myself). But has anyone seen how this set handles analog NTSC signals? Does the "super fine pitch" help or hurt in this regard? Any improvement in the stretch modes for viewing 4:3 material?
post #32 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by Chezbrgr2
The vertical scan lines at 3 feet are almost non existent!
Now, here's what I want to know...will the absence of scan lines at 3 feet also mean a more detailed picture at longer distances?

I've got a 34-XBR800, which I view at a distance of 8.5 feet. For those of you who have seen the new 910, do you think at such a distance the Super Fine Pitch screen will render more detail?

I'm going to have to check out one of these for myself. Given my viewing distance, the difference between my 800 and the new 910 would have to be fairly significant at 7-8.5 feet for me to sell the current set and spring for the new one. Oh, if only we would have known Sony's plans last fall when I bought the 800!
post #33 of 423
I have the same question, but in my case 6-7 feet viewing distance. For example, there is an ongoing debate on the plasma forum on the pros and cons of the ED vs. HD versions of the Panny plasma, and the ED owners indicate that the HD/ED difference is only noticeable up close, and that from a normal viewing distance it is hard for many of them to tell them apart.
post #34 of 423
It's just possible that this being the first iteration of the Super Fine Pitch CRT, the advantages in resolution may not be fully realized until future models.

Who knows, next year's model may have much greater brightness and better contrast than this 910 model.

But we could also have LCOS models with 1080p under $4k too.

So the real question becomes whether this 910 or any other current HDTV set in the market is so compelling enough that you should buy now.
post #35 of 423
For people sitting far away from the TV, you will noitce a big difference only if the source material can put out at that resolution. If you're getting ED signals the 800 and 510 will most likely look "better". However, if you pump in real HD siganls it will blowaway all other CRT's to date.

As for the next model looking brighter comment, dude, didn't you read my post? If they had this problem almost 10 years ago when I first saw HD tubes like this on sale in Tokyo do you really think they haven't had time to work it out if they could?

Like I said, don't hold your breath. It's going to be awhile before you see anything better in a CRT. Better run to your local CC and get one!
post #36 of 423
JCC, are there phosphor trails???? On darker scenes they COMPLETELY kill the film experience for me on the 34XBR800.
post #37 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by folgersnyourcup
JCC, are there phosphor trails???? On darker scenes they COMPLETELY kill the film experience for me on the 34XBR800.
No.

Would you go get it swapped already? Hurry up!
post #38 of 423
If JCC is right (and I hope he isn't), then in practical terms this set will perhaps have only limited use for many viewers--i.e. DVD, ED, and analog viewing will not be improved and may not even be as good as the other sony 34 widescreens. But I would like to be convinced otherwise!
post #39 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by Pedro2
If JCC is right (and I hope he isn't), then in practical terms this set will perhaps have only limited use for many viewers--i.e. DVD, ED, and analog viewing will not be improved and may not even be as good as the other sony 34 widescreens. But I would like to be convinced otherwise!
Look, When I pluck down my hard earned money I want it to last. This TV will be somewhat future proof, for at least the next 5 to 10 years. The analog is going by way of the do-do bird. Do you really want to spend money so that it looks better displaying analog than digital? Look, it's a trade off. Do you want a set that looks better displaying analog and ED sources or one that looks good displaying digital and HD sources? If the former, pick the 800 and 510 and for the latter pick the 910.

The 910's film quality will take some getting use to, but once you do you'll never look at the crappy regular CRTs the same way.
post #40 of 423
JCC, since your post suggested that ED signals (which is what DVD is) will look better on the other sets, this is not just an issue about crappy NTSC regular analog TV programming signals that will be phased out in the next few years (I agree with you on that one--though the conversion is going slow and I expect it to be slower than planned). For many people on this forum the question of whether DVD's look better on the new 910's is critical, and is certainly a "future oriented" concern.
post #41 of 423
Jcc is 100% right about this set. I just came back from my local CC and I am impressed. The picture is the most film like I've ever seen from a consumer CRT. The 510 is better at one thing and one thing only, brightness. The 910 is utterly unable to deliver a good punch to the images in high ambient light, but I'm betting the picture is second to none in a darkened home theater environment.

Also of note is the geometry was very good for a flat screen CRT. The picture it produces won't be everyone's cup of tea, but if I were in the market for a CRT the 910 would be on the top of my list.

The brightness, or lack thereof, is a direct result of the finer pitch. The physical slits in the aperature grille are too small to let a lot of light through.

BTW, the store was showing it's own HD loop. There was a trailer for Bad Boys 2 that was particularly impressive. Also some Discovery HD was played.
post #42 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by Pedro2
JCC, since your post suggested that ED signals (which is what DVD is) will look better on the other sets, this is not just an issue about crappy NTSC regular analog TV programming signals that will be phased out in the next few years (I agree with you on that one--though the conversion is going slow and I expect it to be slower than planned). For many people on this forum the question of whether DVD's look better on the new 910's is critical, and is certainly a "future oriented" concern.
Let me see if I can put this in a way that you can understand what I'm saying....

In 3 to five years, all TV's will look this way...do you understand what I'm saying?

Once HD becomes the standard in 2006 no one will be selling the crappy TV's like today. The resolution on the 800 is a joke compared to the 910. If you own one your neighbors will laugh at you...

For better or for worse, this is the future of CRTs....

No insults intended...
post #43 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by jcc
If you own one your neighbors will laugh at you...
LOL, I think that's a tad extreme!

I will definitely be checking out the 910 once it is on the floor at CC and scrutinizing it. I recieved a full store credit for my 34XBR800 just today.
post #44 of 423
JCC, a bit condescending but no offense taken. But dare I say that CRT's in general (as a technology) will be laughed at in the not-too-distant future despite all that effort at "future proofing..." But the bottom line is that the XBR910 is PROBABLY (still waiting on the reviews) at or near the top of where this particular technology will ever go.
post #45 of 423
I'm with Pedro, CTR's in general are old hat. It wont be long before big heavy tubes shipping and production costs will out-wiegh (no pun intended) plasmas lcds and oleds. BUT in the mean time, I'm taking a VERY close look at the 910.

JCC, thanks for your review. You sound like quite a fan of the 910. I can't wait to see it in person and see for myself (I was getting worried after the other 'reviews'). As for the future and HD, I'm not so sure that ED won't be the norm. Not everyone has dolby digital not everyone will have HD.
post #46 of 423
To the best of my recollection, NTSC didn't look any worse on the 910 than on the 800, except for being dimmer. Getting the 910 for NTSC would not be catering to it's strengths IMO though. The picture is silky smooth. And I suspect that the more detail you can throw at it, the better the results will likely be. A 1080i DVI DVD player, or DVI Tuner would be ideal mates for it, I suspect.

As other people have said, at distances of 5-6 feet the RGB stripes/dots were imperceptible. If going to an even smaller dot pitch means a still dimmer picture, then it's hard to imagine why you'd want any finer stripes/dots than this for the forseeable future. This one particular part of the technology is a breakthrough IMO. Whether or not that's enough to carry it long term, I dunno.

Americans like things that are big, bright and shiny. This TV is bright and shiny silver on the outside, but the picture... not as much, particularly the way it's apparently being displayed in many CC stores. If you weren't clued into it's amazing new abilities, you could easily walk right by it without a second glance, on your way to the latest LCDs, plasmas, or DLPs.

While I was at CC, I "calibrated" the 34XBR910, 34XBR800 and 34HS510 a little better, and by the time I left, there were several customers standing around ogling the latter two. :) They didn't give the 910 a glance.

jcc & Chezbrgr2

It sounds as though you may have seen it in darker surroundings. If that's the case, maybe you could expand a little on how the picture looked under more ideal lighting conditions. In the store where I saw it, there was so much light that the diffuse glare from the screen completely washed out the contrast. I tried to get a couple other people to huddle around as shields, but that wasn't too effective. :)
post #47 of 423
I'll have the 34XBR910 in my modest living room tomorow night. The TV screen will be 8 ft away, and facing a big south-facing picture window. So, obtaining a very bright lighting condition is no problem for the ambient light test. I'll be sitting between 5 ft (most of the time) and 7 ft (sometimes)away, so I'll really appreciate the fine pitch, and the darker screen. I need the darker screen for my viewing habit.

I'll hook up a roof-top antenna on Saturday, and let you guys know how this TV looks with OTA signals from PBS, ABC, CBS, NBC, Fox, ... I don't own a DVD player to play ED, and I don't trust the heavily compressed DirecTV HD signals.

Initially, I'll post some early impression with *D*'s HDNet and the likes on this set any way. But ultimately, I want to see how it'll display OTA HD and NTSC SD signals from the various TV networks.

If there is any problem such as red push, geometry, etc. I'll tweak the service menu using the info from many posts on the 34XBR800 last year. I won't be able to really calibrate this TV until September, as I am waiting for the Digital VE disc to come out.
post #48 of 423
Ok guys, hurry up with the reviews. I am down to picking between the 910 and the sammy dlp HLN437w. The 720p with the sammy is tempting with MNF and ESPN HD but will the 910 be better than 720p native? Is the 800-1000 dollars more for the sammy worth it .
post #49 of 423
So what are you guys saying? That you now think that the 800 and 510's are better TV's? What about the "red push" , the "scanning vertical line", the "phosphor trails" problems? Or is the brightness of the picture in a Circuit City the prevailing criteria of a really good T.V? What about a detached examination of the TV on it's own merits, strengths, and weaknesses? It doesn't look good compared to T.V.'s that have been complained about extensively for a year? Because it's not as bright? One thing I have learned from visiting these forums....do react to quickly because these guy's can get really high and really low about A/V equipment.
post #50 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by dkomisar
Ok guys, hurry up with the reviews. I am down to picking between the 910 and the sammy dlp HLN437w. The 720p with the sammy is tempting with MNF and ESPN HD but will the 910 be better than 720p native? Is the 800-1000 dollars more for the sammy worth it .
The PQ on the DLP is pretty stunning, but FWIW the 910 seemed to have fewer jaggies at 1080i. To the best of my knowledge, all video has to be scaled to 720p for display on the DLP, so there could be some apparent loss on 1080i in terms of aliasing on it. This is only one of many factors to consider though.
Quote:
Originally posted by Glashub
What about a detached examination of the TV on it's own merits, strengths, and weaknesses?
Are you implying that remarks about its Star Trek styling aren't helpful? :)
post #51 of 423
I'm salivating over the first reviews or comments that have seen this set being driven by a DVI-DVD player.

Can't wait.

David
post #52 of 423
Quote:
Originally posted by friedman232
Good news: A review is coming from The Perfect Vision on the xbr910 (mid october).

Bad news: We have to wait two months for it! That was a serious blow.

Looks like I could be like the dad that takes his son to circuit city each week to see "their tv" for a while.
We don't have to wait *2* months - CC has a 30-day return policy - and from what I hear, are really good about it. Now, I've gotta try and "sell" wifey on it.

David
post #53 of 423
Y'know, it's funny. I've been reading all the early opinions on the 910 on this forum with a certain amount of amusement. And, as can be expected, you have your nervous nellies and your fence sitters and your naysayers.

And then you have my favorite group of people, those who are already heavily invested (financially and emotionally) in their existing Panny/Sammy/Toshy/what have you -- and they're CONVINCED, no matter what you might say, that when they stand on their head seven feet from the TV on a dark night with a bad moon rising, THEN they have the ultimate home theatre experience. It's like the guy who buys a house six blocks south of the city dump, and when that North wind starts blowing he says 'I don't really smell anything'. Human nature, you gotta love it.

But the simple truth of the matter is, the XBR910 rocks.

I saw it today at CC next to the 510 AND next to the 800. I spent an hour or so adjusting them to some semblance of equal footing. And to my eyes, there's simply no comparison. The Super Fine Pitch is just that -- super and fine and altogether mind-blowing. Put your face up to the glass and you can SEE the difference. Hook up an HD signal or an HTPC to the DVI and I'm telling you, this sucker will rock your world.

Yeah, there's a certain cheese factor with the retro styling. And no, I don't think any set could possibly live up to all the hype of this one. And yes, CC is not the best environment for making a truly accurate assessment. But I came away convinced there's not a better direct view tv on the market.
post #54 of 423
This is gonna be short and it is an unscientific observation from someone who would never pretend to know too much about Monitors, me, the average Joe, who happens to own the 800.....I like the 910. I put it on Standard and adjusted the brightness settings exactly the same as on the 510 and I thought, my opinion, that it looked really, really nice. I looked for the washed out effect and I didn't see it. Another thing I didn't see was red tinted white faces like on the 510. That's what I noticed...the skin tones looked good to me. I liked the black. Yeah, the glossy black looks classy but this flat black is meant for watching the tube i.e. your attention is drawn to the picture. The brightness? Looked good to me. And except for the apparent lack of red tint that I had to make note of, I made an effort not to do a flick my eye back and forth comparison thing. Does it live up to the hype generated in these forums? Maybe not. Is it a good looking picture? In the opinion of 2 other guy's looking at it and me...yes, definitely. Peace.
post #55 of 423
I am not a videophile. I need the experts to point out what's wrong with my logics:

For people that are concerned with how the 910 displays non-HD, DVD (with DVI or not), etc. I think you'll like the 800 or the 510 better. The 510/800, with horizontal resolution at 854, should be more than adequate to display the DVD signals. I think the horizontal resolution of the best DVD is around 525. The 910's horizontal resolution is 1440.

Garbage in, garbage out. If you feed the TV with 525-hor-res signal, you get 525-hor-res picture. It doesn't matter if your TV's horizontal resolution is 525 or 10000, you will get the same level of detail watching DVD. Since human nature favors brighter screen, the 910 will lose the DVD test because it's dimmer than the 510/800.

The real test is to feed both the 510/800 and the 910 with true HD signal (1080x1920). I am not sure if your CC feeds the 910 with true HD. The place that I bought the 910 sight unseen, only used DVD to feed their HDTVs.

The OTA HD signals, at 1440 horizontal resolution, is my only option for testing the true capability of the 910 right now. Theoretically, if you feed OTA HD to both 510/800 and 910, you should be able to see the difference in picture quality. Then again, human nature favors brighter screen, many people will still like the 510/800 better.

Without even seeing the 910, I suspect it's meant for people who will use it to watch true HD programs, and don't mind the dimmer screen. If your world is SD, DVD (DVI or not), or casual "HD", then the 510/800 is clearly the winner for being brighter.

I'll post my first review of the 910 in less than 24 hours after I take it home.
post #56 of 423
When was the last time that you looked at a set in store and didn't have to turn down the brightness? Torch mode just looks bad, BUT it sells set b/c 'everyday joe' thinks it looks better.
post #57 of 423
quote:
____________________________________________________________ And then you have my favorite group of people, those who are already heavily invested (financially and emotionally) in their existing Panny/Sammy/Toshy/what have you -- and they're CONVINCED, no matter what you might say, that when they stand on their head seven feet from the TV on a dark night with a bad moon rising, THEN they have the ultimate home theatre experience. It's like the guy who buys a house six blocks south of the city dump, and when that North wind starts blowing he says 'I don't really smell anything'. Human nature, you gotta love it.
____________________________________________________________

Well as a owner of a 34xbr800 I have to say it does looks 100 time better than the 910 when I stand on my head rub my belly and chant sony sony you the one and ony. Just joking I really haven't seen the new model yet :)
I do have to say the quote got a good laugh from me. As a happy owner of a 34xbr800 since last October, I am honestly hoping that the newer model is a improvement over the current one.
With each years new model I would expect inprovements and honestly be disappointed if the PQ wasn't a improvement over last years. It's just the way things are with this type of equipment.
post #58 of 423
OK, we finally got power back about 4 hours ago... after walking up and down the stairs to my highrise apartment, it nice to have elevator service.

Anyway, I digress...I'm hopefully going to say this for the last time. The 910 is the best set Sony ever produced in the U.S. No question about it. There's no need to wait for reviews. The resolution is just way ahead of the 800 or 510 that it's really dumb to think that somehow tweaking the 800 or 510 will somehow get it to produce a better picture than the 910. The only problem is that people might not be used to the fact that the 910 has whites that are not as white as the 800 or 510. However, that's something you can get over pretty quickly after seeing the set. Only if you compare the sets side by side can you notice that but it doesn't take side by side comparisons to see that the resolution on the 910 is way better.
post #59 of 423
The 910 is in my living room. I am watching it right now. One word: Impressive. I took a lot of pictures, front, back, side, ... You name it.

Will post pictures and an initial review soon.
post #60 of 423
34XBR910 out-of-the-box review.

I have been watching the screen very critically in the past 5 hours. Service menu is untouched.

Setup: Hughes E86 feeding 1080i DirecTV-compressed HD signals (HDNet, Discovery HD, ...) to the TV through the component video cable that came with the E86.

Cardboard Container:
A little flimsy. Easy to damage. However, the top and side can be separated from the base, allowing the TV to be removed from the box easily.

TV appearance:
Pictures posted here. More to post later. Pardon my cheap digital camera:
http://f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/nic...src=ph&.view=t

Picture Brightness (white intensity):
Default mode is vivid, which looks very bright in my living room at night. White is bright white. There are 1 60W incandescent lamp, and one 15W fluorescent lamp at the 4 and 8 O'clock positions, 7ft away from the TV screen.
Most people would prefer to keep the display at "Vivid". I changed mine to "Standard" because I typically like darker picture, where white is a shade towards the gray side. "Movie" and "Pro" modes are just too dark for me.

Black level:
Black is pure black out of the box.

Fine Pitch:
It's really fine. At my viewing distance of 5ft, the screen looks like a living photograph. No grid lines whatsoever. The 510 and all other CRTs of similar size, on the other hand, failed this test at the CC store miserably. The "pixels" almost disappear as close as 3ft with 20/20 vision. You really have to look very hard to see them. At 5ft, "pixels" are definitely not visible.

Geometry:
Very well out of the box. I called up the various menu displays of the E86, and used them to check the geometry. After some measurements using a ruler and a square, I detected some very minor vertical, as well as horizontal linearity problem. For example, if you have equally-spaced vertical lines, or equally-spaced horizontal lines, the spacing will not be exactly the same at some part of the screen compares to most others. Letter-box lines look completely straight and horizontal, verified by a ruler. Geometry problem can be easily fix by tweaking the service menu.

Overscan:
There is evidence of slight overscan. Problem can be easily fix by tweaking the service menu.

Discoloration:
None.

White screen saturation:
None

Phosphor trails in dark scenes:
None

Rolling vertical bars in dark scenes:
None

Red push:
None

Anti-reflective coating:
Reflection is still visible, and has a purple tint to it due to the special coating. However, it is less prominent.

Picture blowing during bright scenes:
None observed. This set has a good power supply.

Service wires:
Very faint, but visible in bright, neutral color picture. You have to look extremely hard for them. I repeat: extremely hard. They are at about 25% from the top, and 25% from the bottom. In normal viewing, they are not visible no matter how hard I look.

I am extremely pleased with this TV. It's 4AM and I can't pull myself away from it.

More later. Next step is to review this set during the day, with the bright sun striking it. Then I'll comment on its OTA HD picture quality. In a few weeks, I'll review again after I calibrate it with Digital VE disc.
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