* Offical Velodyne Support Thread * - Page 2

Hi Kevin,
There are spikes and there are spikes. Some just sit under the sub unattached. If you use the type that screw in just do it carefully and the shorter the screw, the better. If later on you remove them fill the hole with silicon or a like material.
As far as the auto/on funtion using a "Y" splitter into both inputs will help and your idea of more input and backing off on the Velodyne's volume control is right on. Velodyne's funtion best with plenty of input. I normally run the receiver's level control for the subwoofer jack about two thirds of the way up.
Hope this helps,
Curt

Kevin,
You can find the answer to your question at Velodyne Tips and FAQs under the fourth FAQ. It is best to keep the pre-amp subwoofer volume below -5.
-Jai

Curt or Bruce-

When will the SPL Series II specs be posted on the Velodyne website. I'm interested in a SPL 1000 but may be able to swing a SPL 1200 depending on it's physical dimensions.

Thanx,

-skip

Hi Skip,
The new SPL II's will have 1000 watt RMS (2000 watt dynamic) amplifiers.
The dimensions on the SPL 1200 II are 14 3/4 H X 14 1/4 W X 16 3/8 D.
We hope to have them on the website in the next thirty days. They're great performers, available in maple, cherry and black gloss.
Curt

Hey Bruce, thanks for your time with this thread, its interesting!

Can you give me a somewhat uncolored view as to whether a Velodyne F-1500 is competitive at all with newer 12 inch and 15 inch subs?

Is it obsolete? Would replacing the driver on it with a more modern, faster driver bring this old beast up to date?

Or is it best to just move on to something newer?

Thanks again
John Rutkai

What's the Velodyne Deco system 5 like? is this system on the Velodyne web site and if it is, what's the direct url please? And what does it list for?
Deco System 5 sats and 8"sub

Hi Chad,
Let's start with the crossovers. Since we're bass kind of guys, we'll start at the bottom with the subsonic filter. Basically, this is the point at which the sub will begin to roll off the lowest frequencies it plays. So, if you have it set to 15 Hz, the electronics will, starting at 15 Hz and heading downward in frequency, play those frequencies gradually softer (how gradually depends on the slope of the crossover). So, 14 Hz will play a little software then 15Hz, 13 softer than 14, and so on. Depending on your musical/theatrical tastes, you may want to raise this a bit since having the sub not play the deepest frequencies frees up amp headroom to play higher frequencies louder, and sometimes there is noise down at those frequencies that is unwanted. Of course, for the HGS-18 we set it at a default of 20 since we think that's the best setting for most applications, and your HGS-18 has little trouble playing those frequencies accurately.

The low pass crossover pertains to how high the sub plays. This defaults to 80 Hz, and the rolloff goes upwards. So, 81 Hz will play a little softer than 80 Hz, and so on depending on the slope of the crossover. You want the sub pretty much silent by 120 Hz, since that is the frequency at which the bass can become directional and expose the location of your sub. You have it set relatively low at 40 Hz, so the woofer is in fact doing little at, say, 60 Hz and above.

The high pass crossover pertains to your main speakers. This dictates how low the mains will play. A high pass crossover set at 80 causes the main speakers to play a little softer at 79 Hz and so on, again depending on the slope.

All the crossovers are very important since they dictate the relationship between the sub and the main speakers.

Now let's talk about your Polks. Whatever anyone tells you about this is their opinion, and you need to experiment to get your system sounding good to you.

First of all, even though your Polks are pretty "big," I would still set the setting on the Yamaha to "small", and I would change the setting that is currently on"both" to "sub only" or however it's labeled. This is because the HGS-18 will play the mid-bass frequencies louder and cleaner than your Polks, since it has lots of power (1250 watts dedicated to the bass), and a servo to keep things clean and tight. I would then run the low pass crossover on the HGS-18 up to 80 or so and adjust for taste.

You can try variations on this, but I would definitely give the sub more to do in the 40 - 80 Hz range. I believe that your whole system will benefit.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

Hi John,
The F-1500 is the 15" precursor to the HGS series HGS-15. It has a 200W RMS amp, and 5/8" linear travel. By contrast, the HGS has about 1" of linear travel, and 1250 watts. To go one step further, the DD-15 has 1.25" of linear travel and the same 1250 watts, as well as the built in EQ, digital control, etc. All have accelerometer-based servos and so keep distortion very low.

There isn't any upgrade path for the F-1500 - we don't make the driver or the amp anymore, and all our subs have carefully matched amps and drivers.

The F-1500 was and is a great sub. New HGS or DD subs will play with slightly lower distortion, but not much lower. The biggest difference in the new subs is that they will play quite a bit louder and stay just as clean. It is certainly true that the DD-12 and possibly even the HGS-12 would play louder than your F-1500, but just as cleanly.

So, the question is, does the F-1500 have enough output for you? If so, I'd see no reason to upgrade.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

Bruce or Curt,

First, thank you guys for spending time replying to questions posed here at this forum, it is most certainly a nice touch.

Now, on to my question, or concern really, I have purchased and am demoing a CHT-10 Sub, it has a foam surround.... I knew this before I bought it, but I bought it because it sounded very well. But a "foam surround" in the year 2003? Why? I was told it was to keep costs down by someone at Velodyne. Now, I can understand the need to keep costs down, but surely, the cost saving in that amount of foam vs. even a good quality rubber surround could not be that great, geez... I would certainly not think that there would maybe be a few pennies difference... even if it was a few dollars difference, I would gladly pay 5 or 10 dollars more for a sub with a rubber surround thats not going to dry rot in 7 to 10 years down the road... And yes... If I pay good money for something, I plan to keep it.. not junk it for a new one ever two years. Even if some consider the CHT line to be a value line... it should still have a rubber surround. Paradigm sells their PDR line very cheap, and they don't have foam surrounds. In fact, I know of no other ones that do still use foam.. I quess there may be... But, foam was outdated 15 years ago if not longer.

Sorry, if this sounds like a rant... It's not meant that way.. it's just that in this day and age, using foam for a driver surround is like sending a telegraph, when you have a cell phone in your pocket.

Thanks for listening,
Terry

Could someone please give me some opinions on these systems?
Velodyne CHT 14 sat speakers
Cht24 center
SPL523C which includes 5 sat speakers I assume, but no sub.
Deco Satilites
Deco System 5 sats and 8"sub
I wanna know how the sound is for the Deco sattelite speakers. If you have full range sound minus the bass, or if say you had them with a sub you get lot of bass and highs, but missing some midrange/midbass. Like you are with Bose cube speakers.

Hi Bruce or Curt,

I currently have a HGS12 II in my system. I have a couple of questions concerning using this sub. I have a little different setup than most. Although many will debate whether I truely have this setup, I have my main speakers (Nautilus 804s) biamped. The way I have the amps fed is that I have one set of unbalanced cables from my Bryston BP25 running into one side of both amps to drive the mid/tweeter. The other connection is running to the HGS12 and then to the remaining channel that drives the woofers. I have done some tests with an SPL meter both before and after adding the sub. No matter what I do, I can't quite get the response the same after adding the sub in the 100 Hz range. It is about 3-4 db down. Although I'm measuring a drop in output in the lower operating range of the mains with the sub in the system, I'm actually pretty pleased with the overall presentation. Is there some other way I should be looking to hook the sub up? I'm guessing the lowered output of the woofers could be a drop in signal output after being passed through the high pass filter of the sub. In a normal system setup, this isn't an issue.

My second question is this. I'm planning on maybe adding a second sub to my system (DD12.) My plan is to add the DD12 as the sub to reinforce the Nautilus 804s. I plan on moving the HGS12 as my LFE sub during HT use. I've been told I would be better off adding the DD12 as the LFE sub and keeping the HGS12 where it is. My reasoning for adding the DD12 to the 804s is that my major emphasis is on two channel listening. So I wanted the better sub on the 2 channel setup. Also when I do get a DD12 which way would be the best way to hookup the sub? At the time of purchasing the DD12, I'm planning on upgrading my current amps used in the 2 channel biamping to balanced amps. When I do this I have a couple of options. One is to run the system in fully balanced mode where I have everything hooked up like I do currently but now with balanced connections. I think I'll still be suffering the effects I'm describing above in question 1. The other way I'm thinking of hooking up the sub is to have the amps driving the 804s running balanced connections but also running the speakers full range without adding the high pass crossover of the DD12. The DD12 will be hooked up via unbalanced connection from the freed up unbalanced outputs of the Bryston BP25.

Sorry for the long post. I appreciate any help you can give me on my setup issues.

Thanks,

Henry

PS. I'll also be looking for your advise when I decide to introduce an active crossover to the mix so I'll be running the 2 channel setup in active biamp mode.

At the recent price drop of the Deco system (used to run $1600) Velodyne is pretty much giving away this system. The subwoofer alone is worth the $999 cost of the package. They are on sale at CC right now as well.
Get them quick because when word gets out that these things will
be hard to find. I am feeding my Deco system with a Yamaha RX-V3300 and they just sing! I watched Chicago and LOTR 2 last night with some friends and all I got was compliments. Heck , they were talking more about the sound then the 6' wide sweet looking projection set-up I have.

I think the Deco system is a true "diamond in the dirt" so to speak.

Snatch up a set.

James, thanks for the message.
How do the sat speakers sound though? That is what concerns me more then anything. And the sub, I'm not sure why they put that much of a sub with those tiny cheap sat speakers. What do you mean they are on sale at CC? is that circuit city?
Check your PM though James, I have a question to ask ya.

How do the CHT-14 and CHT-24 sat speakers sound in a 5 speaker set.

Hello Bruce or Curt,

I have been looking into the SPL 1200 Series II and DD12 and wondering what the differences are between the two units? I understand the the DD has the build in EQ but in overall performance how much difference is between the two units?

I am currently running my home theatre setup in my living room of approximately 11.5 feet wide by 17 feet long, open concept with a hallway to the front of the house and stairways to the top floor.

Regards and thank you for your assistance,
Matthew

Bruce,
I totally missed your reply....found it....THANKS!
I'm still amazed by the DD18.
If no one has mentioned it:
You should be commended for producing your speakers in the USA!
You are proving it CAN be done....contrary to others' claims.
Do you get a lot of pressure to fabricate them in China? Just curious.

So has anyone heard the CHT-14 and 24 speakers? i need some help and it seems no one will answer me,

Hi Buggs,
I wasn't sure if you were looking for a reply from an end user or the company. Let me give you my viewpoint of the Velodyne satellite speakers. The CHT satellites were the first, after eighteen months of development. It takes a long time to find the best drivers, design the crossover and then voice it correctly. I bring all this up because in one of your comments you called the 'DECO' satellite a cheap little speaker. Cheap in price - yes, but certainly not in sound quality. Both the CHT and DECO satellites use a high quality 4" woofer/midrange and a silk dome tweeter with a very sophisticated crossover. The enclosure on the CHT is a simple but nice design while the DECO is a stylish molded design. Both sound extremely good on music and home theater, especially considering price and size. The SPL satellite is a taller, slimmer design utilizing a built-in stand or mounting unit. It uses a pair of 3" woofer/mid's and the silk dome tweeter. All three of these satellites sound about the same, with a nice presence and sparkling but not agressive highs.
All the satellites have nice frequency response down to about 110hz. They start rolling off but still hold up fairly well to 80hz. So even with older receivers that offer only an 80hz crossover they intergrate well. In newer receivers that offer higher crossover points such as 100, 110 or 120 they will do even better.
The CHT and SPL satellites are available seperately, whereas the DECO system is currently sold as a complete package. And yes the DECO sub is very high-tech. It is comparable to a $1000. sub. So to me the system price of $999. is a steal. As James Johnson pointed out, the system was designed to sell for much more. Pick up one of our satellites and the weight of the unit gives you a good idea of what's inside. I have yet to hear any satellites in our price range that come close. Sure it sounds like a sales pitch but I've been in audio for a long time and it's my honest opinion. I hope you get a chance to audition them. BTW our website is; www.velodyne.com, click on products and take your choice.
Have a good one.
Curt Chisholm
Velodyne Acoustics

[quote]Originally posted by Woodley71
Hello Bruce or Curt,

I have been looking into the SPL 1200 Series II and DD12 and wondering what the differences are between the two units? I understand the the DD has the build in EQ but in overall performance how much difference is between the two units?

I am currently running my home theater setup in my living room of approximately 11.5 feet wide by 17 feet long, open concept with a hallway to the front of the house and stairways to the top floor.

Regards and thank you for your assistance,
Matthew [/QUOTE)

Matthew,
The SPL 1200II is the best small (non servo) subwoofer we build. It does a great job in small to medium home theater applications. The DD-12 is the best small subwoofer we can build, period. It's not just about equalizing, you have an on-board digital computer. All rooms can benefit from equalizing and some need a lot. Our flexible eight band system is years ahead of what's included on any other subwoofer. The DD subs include a calibrated microphone and you do real-time corrections at your listening position. You view the signal sweep and watch your corrections on your television set. But that's just a part of what the computer can do. Want custom crossover flexibility? Got you covered. How about flexible adjustments for phase, polarity, subsonic filter, presets and my favorite the ability to choose between theater (maximum loudness) and music (maximum accuracy) or in between. All this and more - you start to see the power of the DD series. Nothing like it. If we ignore the computer for a moment, how would the two subs compare? The DD-12 would play louder, go deeper and have less distortion since it has the servo. Add the computer and it's one of a kind.

Curt Chisholm
Velodyne Acoustics

Curt, thanks for the response. I wanted opinions from anyone even you guys at Velodyne. Because in my opinion I don't believe you guys would like just do a sales pitch.

I can't listen to them as no one in washington state sells CHT Satellite speakers. My cousin can get them for me and I would be buying the CHT-14 2 pair, and CHT-24 along with the Velodyne CHT-10 sub. Unheard also, since I am sure I'd like them, plus I know velodynes sub reputation. All for an awesome cost. I did get to listen to Infinity Primus 140's for $99 each and I think they sounded ok. These speakers are for my parents. I am pretty sure the Velodyne CHT14 and 24 sould sound even better then the Infinity Primus bookshelf ones, so I was going to have my cosuin get for my parents the Velodyne CHT-14 and 24 and for me the CHT-10 sub for my bedroom considering it's really kind of small. 15 feet long, 12 feet wide and 8 feet tall.

The receiver that will be used for the Satellite speakers is the Denon AVR 1800, it's an 80 watt x 5 really nice model Denon. I'm not sure about the x over, but it wouldn't be used, or at least I forget how I have it set up right now, I think 80 hz and that's all it does I think, but forget. The sub however goes in my bedroom and the Satellite speakers go upstairs in the main room which also already has a sub.

The woofer is recessed right? like the cone isn't a normal pushed out bubble like cone on traditional speakers in the middle of the woofer. What I mean is the cone you have in the CHT-14 and 24 is flat. How come that is and what does it do being flat? I like that in a woofer/cone in that it looks cool.

I've also checked out all the stuff on the Velodyne web site and like how the CHT speakers look.

Bruce or Curt, I just thought of a question about the anti clipping protection in the Velodyne subs on all the mdoels. Could you please explain to me and others what this does, how it works please? Here's what I think.

It detects how far the woofer is moving and if it senses it is getting to the max capability of how far it can move it will shut down or something. is this about right? my hope is that it is correct cus if i drive it hard I'd love for it to be able to sense how far it's pushing outward and when it's close to the max, shut off or something so I don't drive it to clip or pop or move to far. Also is that woofers movement called Excursion? And when the bass hits the woofer it moves. What level of movement is it made for the CHT woofers/CHT-10 specifically? Like 1 inch or what?

Curt,
Doesn't the Deco system already have a built in high pass crossover @ 110Hz?

Buggs,
There's a monitor circuit that makes sure the amplifier isn't overdriven so the driver isn't pushed beyond it's capability. This in turn keeps distortion low and protects the woofer.
Curt

James,
No there is not a crossover built into the satellite at 110hz. The small sealed box acts as a mechanical roll off for the 4" driver. We rate response 110 to 20K because below 110 it's rolling off fairly rapidly.
Curt

Hi Curt,

Did you get a chance to read my post? Was wondering if you all had any answers for my situation.

Thanks.

Curt or Bruce,

I was also wondering if either of you could answer my question (on the 2nd page)

Thanks.

Thanks for the response Curt. Could you or Bill reply to my question about the Middle of the woofer in the CHT Satellites? How they are flat like. I'm really curious about that design.

Thanks and God Bless you man!! Can't wait to check the CHT-14 and 24 and CHT-10 5.1,

Thanks Curt, they sure do handle alot of power without sounding strained for such small speakers, they keep amazing me every time I hear them.
The reason I asked is because I have fed them full bandwidth material for testing and they never strained or distorted...so the mechanical
roll off makes sense.

They really blend well with the Deco subwoofer in my small 12'x8.5' HT room and they dont really seem to be too picky about placement. I have yet to tweak the subwoofer and sat positions for better performance because they sound so good in the inital positions I placed them in when I took them out of the box.
While my room may be more active then others I am getting usable output down to ~20hz in my small room with this little thing. I would never need any more bass then what this subwoofer can provide.

I have to wonder if you guys are not going to start including a lesser subwoofer with this package or something because at the current going
price I feel like I stole them. I have been in the HT hobby for many years
and this is by far the best Sub/Sat system I have ever heard..if fact if these
were not available then I would have had to use large speakers in this room because I was not interested in anything else, I did spend some time listening to the Energy Encore system (which also recently got a price drop from $1500 to $999) and I the subwoofer was such a dog that I could not justify even $999 for the package..the subwoofer seemed to cheapen the whole deal.

I actually called Velodyne before buying these , I was curious about the warranty as well as the product itself because at the price point I was
wondering if these were being discontinued or something.
I am not sure if it was you or not Curt but I received a level of customer service that I would never have expected, the man I spoke with was very knowlegable about his own product , so much so that it seemed like the guy was a designer for Velodyne. We spoke for 10min or so and I learned a little about Velodyne and had alot of questions answered about the Deco system. Rarely have I received this level of personal service from a company. The conversation sealed the deal, I ran back to Good Guys and bought the set.
BTW guys , these have a 5 yr warranty on the sats and 2 years on the sub.


I hope this did not sound too much like a salespitch because I certainly dont have anything at stake in Velodyne but I think credit should be given where credit is due.

BTW this is my first Velodyne subwoofer , the first commercial subwoofer I had was a Paradigm PW2200 and the last commericial subwoofer I had was
a Paradigm Servo-15. After that I began building my own HT/music subwoofers because I found the DIY section of HTF where Tom Vodandle
of SVS used to partipate. I have build at least 10 subwoofers for myself and friends since then ,so
I consider myself a bass connoisseur and the Deco subwoofer provides very satisfying bass for music and movies.

BTW if anyone buys the Deco system , make sure and buy a DVD-A player because they are good at mutichannel music as well as HT duty.

Hi James,
Yes I remember our telephone conversation. Thank you very much for the positive feedback. We do try harder! I wish everyone was aware of the DECO system. It's an incredible system for the price. Thanks again and enjoy the speakers.
Curt

Hi Henry,
In your current setup I would hook it up just the way you have it. The 804's have small woofers and I would want to roll off the bass going to them. I wouldn't worry about the 3 or 4 db drop at 100hz if the sound was good. Of course you could run the 804's full range and just augment with the HGS-12, adjusting the low pass on the Velodyne probably somewhere between 40 and 60hz.
When you get the DD-12 you may very well have to experiment to see how to best utilize it. Your question is, which sub for LFE and which for music. That's a hard call. So you know, the DD sub only has one (mono) balanced input and no balanced output. It does have stereo (L&R) unbalanced inputs and outputs like your HGS. With it's flexible crossovers, slopes and phase adjustments and it's EQ capabilities it's a natural for two channel since it can easily intergrate with any speaker. At the same time there's nothing better for home theater. In addition to the previous mentioned features, the presets and servo control really come into play here.
If I were going to use them as you suggest I would lean toward using the DD-12 for the LFE and the HGS as you are currently using it. The DD-12 also has a little more output, we've increased the excursion a 1/4 inch.
Truth is, you're going to need to experiment and see what works best.
Hope this providedsome help.
Curt Chisholm
Velodyne Acoustics