Poopli FAQ for AVS - Page 2

I know if you click on the "Account" tab, then you can update your profile to stop sharing your list online. However, does Poopli stop logging into your MyReplayTV.com account at that point or does it simply not show the list of your shows in the database, I can't say?

Either way, that's what I did due to a few factors (most of which were people who kept bugging me for shows and movies on premium networks and my crappy upload speed).

It stops logging into your account once you unclick the "share online" checkbox. The "hide" certain shows function is coming this week.

-a

Technical Writers make big bucks. Want a Job?

The poopli test works and sees my RPTV, but I have 2 messages that the person can not send me a show.

Can the problem be a PPV will not send?

Also, there seems to be no way to contact the person sending the show. I get an email from poopli to my email address, but no way I can see to contact the person doing the sending.

Am I missing something? The PPV is about a 15 minute show.

OH, no...BUSTED!
RE: MAIL...the point was that I never got a user name. Just an email from poopli saying someone tried to send it to me...twice.

Hi,

I have a Replay TV 4080. The IP address of my unit and the IP address of my computer are different. Poopli keeps using my computer IP address instead of my Replay TV. Consequently, I keep getting error messages whenever request shows or test my IVS connection. Is there a way to manually change my IP address settings within Poopli? If not, anyone have any ideas?

Thanks

Scorp66
00055-09166-63655

Poopli doesn't control this. You need to check your network settings on your ReplayTV unit and do a force net connect to update the RDDNS servers.

-a

Actually, that is the way it is supposed to be. Your router assigns IP addresses that start with 192.168.x.x to all of YOUR computers and ReplayTVs. These are for the use of your home network only; my home network may (and probably does) duplicate the numbers you use without a problem, since they're only an internal reference, like an apartment number. But your router actually has an "external" IP address (think street address of your "apartment building") that is in a range owned by your ISP, and that's what the IVS Test returns. If that's what you mean by different, then that is OK. You need to assign a port to your ReplayTV (I would use 40801, but just make sure it's over 1234 and less than 65535), then you have to tell your router to forward that port to the 192.168.x.x that shows up in your ReplayTV's settings. So externally, your ReplayTV would be addressed as "external IP: port#", the message is sent to your router because of the "external IP" part, and your router says "OK, this port number gets forwarded to this internal IP".

If your router's manual isn't clear about how to set up port forwarding, I'm sure someone here has a similar or identical router and could talk you through it. Sometimes it's called a NAT Table, for Network Address Translation, which is how the port # gets translated into your internal IP.

I have a question about a show I received via Poopli.

I received an episode of Smallville from someone via Poopli and I now want to send that show to my dad. He and I both have 5040s. However, the show is listed on my RECEIVED tab and when I bring up the menu, the SEND SHOW option isn't there.

Is there anyway to move the show to the All Shows tab?

Can I not send shows that I've received from other people? Am I going to be forced to put this show on VHS for him?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Unfortunately, despite the boneheaded management decisions at DNNA, the techs there are quite astute. To allow you to send a received show would make it very easy to circumvent the 15 sends-per-show limit by sending it to someone and having them send it back to you, or sending it to 15 people who could each send it to 15 people, and so on. The easiest way around this is to have your dad join Poopli and have someone send it to him! Otherwise for other threads discussing ways to manually make a second recording of a show from your RTV back onto the same unit. Try searching under "Pay Per View" or "PPV", as these items are also un-send-able.

That's what I was afraid of... Thanks... I'll either sign my dad up on Poopli or just VHS it. He won't care either way...

Infact, right now he's waiting for his 5040 to come back from DDNA warranty repair.

I have to say I think the whole IVS thing is pretty stupid. I don't understand why people don't just extract the video with DVarchive and then use bit torrent to share. It would be much faster, it would use less bandwidth from each person, everyone would be able to use it regardless of their RTV version, and it wouldn't have stupid restrictions like the 15 shares limit. Why not set up a site like poopli for bit torrent shares of replay files? I've downloaded other files and stuff with Azureus and it is unbelievably fast.

The way I see it Poopli is a great website/database made to work with a ridiculously backwards file sharing system when there are much better file sharing methods that could be used.

I have a question regarding IVS though. What happens if you have a recording setup where it records a show every night and only keeps a few episodes at a time but someone requests your oldest show? How does your RTV handle that, does it wait until it is finished sending the show to delete it, does it delete the second oldest show instead, does it change the settings to "keep until I delete?"

IMO - I would rather watch received shows on my TV rather than at my desk on my computer. D/L via bit torrent and the burning to DVD seems like more of a hassle than using IVS. I suppose media center PC/TV people can do that.

-a

The Replay doesn't care if your currently uploading. If it is scheduled to delete the show, it will delete it. Usually if I'm uploading, I increase the number of shows to save by one until I know the upload is complete.

Probably because they don't want to get sued for publicly sharing copyrighted material would be my guess..

It's easy to track the real IP address of someone using bit torrent, there is no privacy or protection..

While IVS is not secret either or secure, at least its limited.. its different than say a bit torrent file offering.

One word: SECURITY.

The last thing I want installed on my home file server is some piece of who-knows-what-ware (you heard it coined here first!) written by who-knows-who that's going to allow people all over the world to download my files.

Now.... I realize can set things up to make them more secure, but frankly, I don't trust Bit Torrent or Arureus one bit. Let's face, they're written and developed by people who are not exactly at the forefront of legitmate commerce.

What makes these other sharing methods better? IVS is simple and it works. Granted, it's not fast, but that's a limitation of my connection, not the hardware/software.

While your connection is the main limiting factor, I believe what cool8man was saying is that IVS isn't the most efficient use of the bandwidth. Even a slight speed upgrade, say even a 5KB/s speed increase will make the transfer quite a bit quicker. Although I can't imagine most advanced J6P users like myself doing all this just for a little speed upgrade.

I only request shows on the most dire circumstances (wife threatening divorce kinda things) and I know the transfer is slow, but it's better than waiting on a VHS tape from a friend and it's a lot more cleaner.

Basically, it's very easy to transfer shows to/from a ReplayTV, especially with Poopli. Setting up a server for a little bit more efficient transfer isn't worth it in my opinion.

Files extracted from a ReplayTV can still be viewed on the ReplayTV. You don't need to burn DVDs. I'm saying instead of using one of the worst file sharing programs ever created (IVS) why not extract the video files using a program like DVarchive or whatever other RTV extraction tool you have and then share the video with a much better (faster, more compatible, less bandwidth intensive) file sharing system like Bit Torrent. The files you download can be viewed on the computer or on the ReplayTV. It isn't more of a hassle than IVS because with Torrent all you would have to do is double click the torrent file and you start downloading immediately. How is typing in long RTV ID numbers, sending emails, blindly waiting for responses, etc. less of a hassle than just double clicking on a file? IVS is the clunkiest slowest file sharing system I've ever seen.

Millions of people already share shows with Bit Torrent (a lot more than are using this crappy IVS system). Obviously the files that people are sharing aren't in a RTV compatible format right now, so what I'm saying is why not create a Poopli type of database and community to share the RTV extracted files through another sharing method like Bit Torrent. Doing that would open up file sharing to the entire ReplayTV community and not just limit it to 5000/4000 machines. Bit Torrent, Fasttrack, Edonkey file sharing all allow you to download a file from multiple people at once, thereby off putting the burden of sharing to more people, increasing file availability, and drastically increasing your download speed potential.


Limited how? In that it sucks and very few people use it in comparison to all other file sharing methods? How does it being "limited" make it better or more useful in any way? If it's legal now to share copyrighted material over poopli and IVS then why wouldn't it be legal to share this same material over poopli and torrent? What makes IVS anymore legitimate than Torrent or any different for that matter, they're both file sharing software.


It is a limitation of the outdated software.

Other file sharing methods are better because:

1. Sharing wouldn't be restricted to a couple of out of production RTV units
2. Receiving a file would be instantaneous (click on database file and it starts to download)
3. Uploading a file would be shared between several users at once and not reliant upon a single user to share
4. File downloads would be limited by your download speed and not by the sender's upload speed

Most DSL/Cable download speeds are between 768k-1.5M, most DSL/Cable upload speeds are limited to about 128k. What speed would you rather receive a show at, your download speed or someone else's upload speed? We're talking about the difference of downloading an 850MB-1.7GB file at 15KB/s (IVS) or 100KB/s (Torrent). That's the difference of downloading a file in a day versus downloading in a couple of hours. My download speeds are capable of going over 300KB/s and with a file sharing system like fasttrack, torrent, or edonkey combining the upload speeds of others it is possible to reach that.

With torrent there's no server to take the brunt. And we're not talking about a little more effeciency, we're talking about saving entire days of downloading. What would take days on IVS could take hours on torrent. We're talking about not being reliant on a single person to get a program and expanding program sharing into the entire RTV community.

Couple of things:
1) Files for 4000 and 5000 series replays are not compatible out of the box. So files will need to be downloaded from the same replay series to be viewable on your replay.
2) To use Torrent would mean that everyone would have to extract all their files from their RTV to a computer. Many of us don't have that kind of computer storage. My 2 4504's contain the largest hard drives in my house. Then, if someone did partake in your plan, they would also have to watch all their shows from their DVArchive server. The inconvenience factor of your plan is way too high.
3) The universe of Replay users sharing shows is not very large, and most people don't want to keep a P2P system running on their computers all the time. I know I don't. I prefer to be in control of the request. Torrent works because there are millions of people sharing. If you only have a couple of hundred people, it's not as viable.

To add to what joesc1 said, I think you are overestimating the benefits of using something like bit torrent for ReplayTV files, both in terms of efficiency and speed. Bit torrent works because a lot of its users have binary identical file(s), so that downloads can be spread among several sources. The same is not true for ReplayTV files. Even though a lot of ReplayTV users may have recorded the same show, every single one of the MPEGs will be binary different. Thus, often you will still be downloading from a single source, just as you would with IVS. Of course, this would change for popular shows as more and more people download a particular user's copy of the show. However, for it to truly work well, one would have to open up the system to non-ReplayTV users. Personally, I don't want to do this. IVS's requirement that you have a ReplayTV does 2 things: 1) it brings a certain level of maturity to things and 2) it generally (though not always) limits the collector-types from trying to download every show you have. When people send a show via IVS, they know that usually the receiver a) missed the show for some reason or b) the show wasn't available in his/her area. At least in my mind, that is the purpose of IVS and is what makes it better than the "share everything with everyone" P2P services.

This is taking quite a bit for granted.

Poopli's database works because it reads RTV units show listings. Since it's already in a "sendable" format, what is listed on the database is available for sending.

What you are proposing would require all participating users (those who wanted to send shows) to transfer all shows from their Replays via DVA to a computer to be able to be sent via P2P. Those users would then have to label their shows with a 4xxx or 5xxx tag so that receivers know what NOT to download. So to have a dynamic database of shows like poopli has now, basically all 500 users would have to continuously rip from their units and put everything on their computer HDs.

Now the other scenario. A listed database via poopli as is today but only sending what you are being asked for via P2P. I see you have Friends, I request it from you. You now have to DVA it to your computer which even at max DVA speeds takes at least 15 minutes. How long does it take to enter the RTVID?

I get what you are saying in that one for one, P2P smokes IVS in terms speed and timing of transfer. But as a whole structured system, using IVS to send replay shows is much easier than using any other xfer method.

And neither way is 100% legal. It's just not being persued by the courts on an individual basis.

-a

Poopli already keeps track of this. It's not very difficult to keep track of the RTV version of the user uploading and indicate it on the site. This info can be stored easily by the registered username of the person uploading the 20K torrent file or filled out in a simple submission form. Here is an example of how torrent sites work: http://213.158.115.194/site/upload_torrent
No not everyone has to extract their files. Only the initial person sharing the torrent has to extract it. Most people using the torrent database would probably never have extracted a program even once. Once they begin downloading they are already sharing and that would be the source of 90% of the downloads that take place (from people that did not extract the file). As far as you not having HD space, there are a lot more people who have purchased home computers with large hard drives than people who have cracked open and upgraded their Replay drives. I bet almost everyone has several GBs free on their computer which would be more than enough space to download several shows. Not saying DVA is the tool to be used, but watching a show served from DVA is not inconvenient in any way. That is how I watch most of my programs and there isn't any discernable difference between watching a show served through DVA or straight from the RTV. The inconvenience factor is extremely low.
The Poopli community is relatively new and it's already pretty large considering the archaic file transferring it uses. If you build it, they will come. Any site offering to RTV owners a download of [insert popular tv show] in a few hours is bound to be popular enough. Everyone doesn't need to keep the torrent program running on their computers when they're not downloading, with torrent you are sharing while you are downloading. It is true that the more popular a file is the faster the download will be, but even the least popular file will download as fast as IVS and if even 2 people are sharing, it will download faster than IVS. 2 people sharing would be twice as fast as IVS. Is it that uncommon for more than 1 person to want a show listed on Poopli?
When you register your RTV at the site it asks you what RTV version you are using. Any 20KB torrent file that would be uploaded to the site from that person would already register and make that information clear, the same way your database does now. Only 1 person has to actually extract and upload the torrent, after that everyone is automatically sharing the file just by downloading it. Torrent would be easier than IVS on the part of the person requesting the show and on just about everyone sending the show, the only person it would be slightly more difficult on is the person who has to initially seed the program. The 15 minute extraction (acceptable loss considering the time it takes to transfer over IVS). I'm in the middle of an IVS transfer that is downloading at 1-2K/s. This is an appallingly slow process.

There are already a lot of people who have enormous archives of RTV recorded shows on their computer hard drives. These people could add a lot more to the current database of shows on Poopli whether it be through voluntary submission or at the request of another user which is exactly how the site works now. Less than half of the people using Poopli share their shows in the database yet they still make use of the service.
And there's no reason why a database couldn't list torrents available for sending. A simple 20KB upload or email attachment is what gets stored and listed in the database. I'm not saying everyone has to upload their files to the computer with a DVA type extraction tool. A torrent share could augment a Poopli database of IVS shares. If 1 or especially more than 1 person was requesting a show from me I would greatly prefer to send the program via torrent rather than IVS. The speed increase would be dramatic even with a few users.
Maybe for the intial sender, but not for all the people downloading or the subsequent senders which is the vast majority of people that would be involved in the xfer process. Assuming their program isn't already archived you're talking about 1 person extracting in 15-30 minutes, uploading the torrent to database in 2 seconds, and then a much larger number of people receiving the file in a couple of hours just by double clicking on the file.
Or in the more likely scenario that extremely popular episode of Friends has already been torrented more than once so you simply have to click on the torrent, initiate download immediately, and receive the show in a couple of hours. 15 minutes to extract doesn't sound like much of a hardship considering the hours and days you could save by not using IVS.

Here's how the system could work.

Show Request:
A person requests a show like they do on Poopli indicating their RTV version. Additional people indicate that they are interested in the show as well (maybe by clicking on a button next to the show request). Someone who has the show on their RTV sees the request and the number of requests. To share the show they then extract the file in 15-25 minutes and create a torrent file to be uploaded using the tracker provided from the website (extremely easy to do). They then go to the website and upload the 20K file, maybe fill out a short form and the show is now listed on the site. From that point on the website could keep track of how many people have downloaded the 20K torrent file and send out an email to share/seed the file the same way Poopli does now. The only difference is that now you're talking about more people sharing a file and resulting in much faster downloads. Sending out emails helps assure that there will be people to seed the file.

Database Request w/ torrent not yet uploaded:
In your account options you can choose whether you prefer to share using Torrent or IVS. The website would then indicate next to your database listings maybe with a little symbol that you can upload and seed a torrent for that show. So the person requesting from the database clicks on the Torrent link next to the show and it sends an email request to the person who has the show, same as it does now. When the person has extracted/uploaded the site indicates in the database that a torrent file is available for the show now. An email is sent to the person who requested it went the torrent file is uploaded.

Database Request w/ Torrent Available:
A user goes looking for a show in the database. They find the show and there is a link that indicates that a torrent is available for the show and how many people have downloaded the torrent file, there is also a comments link to read feedback on the torrent. They click on the link to download the 20K torrent file and in addition to downloading, it sends out a request email either to the initial seeder or to all people who have downloaded the file.

Access to site and database requires RTV ID registration similar to the way Poopli does now. Access to torrent files could also be limited by a registered IVS share.


For more info on setting up **********: http://btfaq.com/serve/cache/51.html

While all this talk about using bit torrent is interesting.. I think its just ultimately wishful thinking since poopli works fine and its already here..

Trying to get people to use bit torrent would be an uphill battle.. In theory there is nothing stopping individuals who are technically savvy enough to offer their files via bit torrent, (go for it) I imagine some may already be doing that. .. but I just can't see the "masses" (i.e. every day folks) doing it, for many people even using the Replay's show send is almost at the limit of their technical skills (the type of people I am talking about people are not the type who read this forum but every day Joe and Jane Sixpacks out there -- i.e. average people)..

The other problem with using torrents is that it effectively opens the files up to anyone with a bit torrent client installed, where as shows send is a limited "finite" group, (i.e. far smaller than the entire global internet user community) (since we can count how many 5XXX series machines are out there its scope is limited), in the grand scheme of things, torrents represent a bigger threat to those who are preoccupied with copyright enforcements because the potential audience is massive and this is where the problem lies.

I think though if you start posting your files via bit torrent the MPAA will be on you like ants on a Sunday picnic.. While I am personally not inclined to use bit torrent for that sort of thing (and I certainly know how to), I'd be curious to see how long it would take for the first "letter" to come in from either your ISP or the MPAA directly if one started posting torrents of shows. cool8man, if you set up a web page or post links with torrents, let us know how it goes.. I'd be interested to follow your progress.

I cannot get poopli to work through my Netgear Router.

Anybody know how to set it up properly?


Any help would be appreciated.

Did you set up port forwarding? If not, you're going to need to do that for the port you set up on your RTV. Also, assign a static IP address to your RTV unit(s), as opposed 2 one assigned through DHCP.

I don't have a Netgear Router to help you with the specifics, but this is what you'll need 2 do 2 get it 2 function properly.

I have a few questions I could probably find the answers for elsewhere, but I figure you guys are the experts and will respond faster than I can dig up the info.

1. How many shows can a single unit send simultaneously?

2. How many shows can a single unit receive simultaneously? (I think this is only one, but thought I'd double-check)

3. What happens to the transfer if a show is renamed or its category is changed in the middle of a transfer?