Real Reference - Page 3  

I guess you missed the 4th response in this thread. :D I was wondering why it didn't make it into the list.

Definitely, I think N by NW is probably not going to get any dissent from anyone! Also, My recollection was that Mullholand Drive did look superb but I haven't seen it in a while, so maybe I should double check!!

I don't remember Panic Room as being as good a test for a dark movie as, say, Dark City, but I don't own it so I could be wrong. If no one can jump in to defend it I say can it though.

Also, someone (Art??) pointed out that pretty much all the CGI disks are shoo-ins. I'm more worried about regular film-to-disk transfers, on the pq front anyway... We might as well take the Toy Stories, Lion King's and such as givens...

Oh, Art, just "Fred" is fine :D

I think that one of the best methods of "weeding" the list is for a specific flaw to be pointed out and then have it confirmed or denied by other members of the forum. I think three or four confirmations should be sufficient for deletion from the list. This should eliminate the possibility of poor calibration or user error.

as much as i hate to admit it, because i like the movie and the disc, i would rule out X2.
in most respects its excellent, but i found the ringing on it to be pretty noticeable (especially in the opening with Logan poking around the 'deserted' Alkali base.)

In the spirit of helping "weed" the list:

RedWyvern had this to say,
If those could be confirmed or denied it might at least be a place to start. This and ckolchak's last post's reference to X2 are the only critiques that have gone unheaded so far.

No one has mentioned any of the Indiana Jones films? Temple of Doom probably looks the best and except for some slight edge enhancement in a few shots is about as good as a dvd can look.

How about Pleasantville or Blade? I've talked to the telecine colorist who worked on both transfers and he thinks they're his best transfers. He also probably handled Seabiscuit now that I think of it. Definetely a guy Bjoern would love to talk to. :D

haven't seen a lot of the titles on the list.
AOTC looks like reference to me, but i think Hulk is one of the best looking-and sounding-discs out there.
no matter what you think of the film itself (i appreciate Angs take on the material), the fact that the film is 1.85 AR i think gives it, like Starship Troopers, an edge over those really wide 2.35 films.
the level of detail available to squeeze out is just that much more.

i would have said the SE of Troopers was reference, and not having seen the superbit (i don't feel like i need to with the quality of the SE), i'm sure that HAS to qualify as reference.

after taking so long to make it to disc, i was pretty unimpressed with the Indiana Jones films as far as PQ and SQ went.
ok to fine, but nothing special in 2004, imo.

much more impressive was the remastered/re-transfered Alien.
it has some ringing unfortunately, but despite that, i would consider it reference quality.
especially for a 'restored'/re-transfered catalog title.

I'm with ckolchak on X2. It is one of the movies that looks very "glossy"
or "shiny", not very "natural". Did it appear like that in the theater?
X2 and OUATIM were 2 that did not quite stack up to the rest in the list
(that I've seen).

larry

You are missing a few that should be at the top of the list, certainly before ones like The Pledge, and Fargo (Which I really would not include on a reference list for picture or sound)!

The One Superbit WSR 5 out of 5 Picture 5+ Sound!!!

Pitch Black WSR 5 out of 5 Picture 5 out of 5 Sound!!

Tomb Raider 2 WSR 4.5 out of 5 Picture 5+ Sound !

Art,

I hate to run this in the ground but have you seen The Quadrilogy of Alien on DVD?

My wife even said the picture was incredible. (she is an Alien fan)

I thought of two more that should be on your list if what you are after is reference quality picture and sound.

Blade WSR 5 Picture and 5 Sound

Blade 2 WSR 4.5 Picture 5+ Sound
(There is a little EE in Blade 2, but I don't remember it being bad at all).

I would certainly add these two to your list along with Pitch Black for demonstrating black levels (especially since you will be viewing them on your fantastic CRT set up :cool: )

Is there a reason that Dinosaur is not on this list?

I agree that at least the first movie Alien should be on this list. There is some very minor EE on the DVD, but I hear it is completely gone on the D-Theater tape. I have the Quadrilogy, but not the D-theater tape of Alien yet.

I agree that Blade certainly belongs on this list. And despite it being a pretty bad movie Lost in Space probably belongs there as well if my recollection of it holds up to PQ scrutiny. I have the DVD and may watch it again as soon as I can find the time.

I also think a very good case can be made for the new release of Alien from the Quadrilogy.

--Jerome

I think Rules of Engagement deserves a spot on the list. It still looks absolutely fantastic! Zero EE. The sound is very good too although there are some spots where the dialogue gets a bit crackly. However, when the action kicks in, it sounds mighty fine.

I have to vote against OUATIM, though when it looked good, it looked good, I felt the contrast was screwed up on it - I don't know, something just looked off. I think Desperado Superbit looks much better than OUATIM.

I would keep Shrek on the list, I still use it to show off my system.

Also, one more that I think looks very, very good is Jason X. Hard to believe it looks that damn good on its relatively small budget.

This may be a good time to define the critera for inclusion on the list, or at least some of it anyway. Perhaps reasons for exclusion would be a better approach? Either way, if we hope to make this "The Definitive Reference List for DVD" the DVDs are going to have to be put through a "gauntlet" in order for the list to stand for "true excellence" in DVD.

Is this region 1 discs only or discs from all regions ?

For DVD Video:

DINOSAUR
FINDING NEMO
X-MEN 2 (I have to dissent from those who feel this one has disqualifying flaws---I thought it looked great.)



For DVD Audio:

FINDING NEMO
CONTACT
LOTR: THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING
RULES OF ENGAGEMENT
SAVING PRIVATE RYAN

I think that in order for this list to be "THE" list we should include all regions. OFFICIAL RELEASES ONLY. I know for a fact that several region 2 and 4 DVD releases are better than their region 1 counterpart. If you nominate a DVD that is not region 1 you should specify the region code. In the end, they must all meet the same PQ requirements in order to be on the list.

Unless I'm mistaken we are mainly focusing on PQ at the moment. I would say that no language dubbed tracks (regardless of the language) should be considered for the Audio portion of the list and if only a dubbed track is available on the DVD, that would be reason for removing the DVD from both lists but might still be eligible for an honorable mention in PQ.

Thoughts?

Art,

I haven't watched Blade in quite a while. My setup has undergone several changes since then as well. Back when I had a NEC XG110LC 8" CRT projector I regarded Blade as being among the very best DVDs that I had, and I had many of the top dogs being kicked around here. I remember it being exceedingly clean and rich from the Radeon equipped HTPC that I used as a source for the projector.

Regrettably, I got seriously stung on a 9" CRT projector purchase last March. I drove over 650 miles round trip to go inspect this machine in person and it ran fine during my 3-hour evaluation, but the projector blew up after about 30 hours of use after I got it home and I was unable to get it serviced in a reasonable time-frame. So I took my lumps and swore off used CRT projectors forever. And I do happen to believe that great equipment and setup are important ingredients in judging these things.

After going through several digital projectors I have gone back to CRT. But this time it is a 65" RPTV with a warranty. But I won't use it evaluate PQ on anything since the display is not calibrated and that won't be done until March; this set needs to break-in and settle first.

Art, I don't know about everyone else, but I am quite comfortable with you "supervising" this list. You have a keen eye for PQ and a fabulous setup with your Runco stack, even more-so once you get your recently purchased G90 stack up and running--congrats on your new acquisition.

--Jerome

The Japanese version of Blade with DTS sound is even better than the region 1 version both in picture and sound quality its a complete step up.

Would you mind quantifying those statements? It's not that I doubt you but your claim might be more persuasive if you elaborate on where you thought the R1 version of Blade was lacking, being as specific as you can, and how the R2 version surpasses those deficiencies.

--Jerome

I believe the picture was very good for its time but the Japanese version came out later and because of improvements in coding techniques it enjoys a better picture although its subtle improvements and the region 1 picture is still very good, the real difference comes in the sound department, the DTS soundtrack truly is a major step up and you hear little things you didnt hear before, i originally had the region 1 but upgraded to region 2 NTSC Japanese version late last year, i don't have proof its merely my opinion and perhaps some other members who have both discs can put their opinion forward.