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post #9661 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlou99 View Post

Maybe. This is off of a nxt2004 connected to a SAA7133 and I don't have the datasheet handy. I suppose I could switch to my HDHomerun if it is important.

Have you tried better tuners (actually demods)? I've found that LGDT 3303 and newer and Samsung S5H1409 and newer tuners outperform my HDHR when I have multipath issues. The HDHR is so nice in so many ways, I just wish it used a Samsung or LG demod, rather than the Micronas demods that seem mostly designed for low-power consumption in mainly cable uses. I keep hoping the HDHR4 will have better reception. Right now, my best tuner is a cheap Pinnacle 801eSE USB stick based on the Samsung 1411.

Drew
post #9662 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post

The exception to this is KKPX on Mt. San Bruno which can rise from no signal at all to SNR 31 dB at times.
Chuck
Wow! That's a really huge signal swing. I don't receive any stations here that vary that much. 10 dB is about the biggest swing that I get and that's on the two VHF stations, 6 and 10, from Walnut Grove.

Interesting comments on inversions and how they affect signals. Thanks.

Larry
post #9663 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post

One more thing about inversions.

The San Francisco Bay has a moist marine layer above it most of the time.

From time to time this wet fog is replaced by drier air from inland which sometimes matches my periods of poor receiption for some stations.

SHF

I think that's what's causing KGO to have reception problems for their translator at Mt. Allison. They're fighting the very high RF level there at the site plus the marine layer inversion across the Bay. While it's only 35 miles from transmitter to receiver, the signal varies enough to drop out occasionally.

Larry
SF
post #9664 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewwho View Post

Have you tried better tuners (actually demods)? I've found that LGDT 3303 and newer and Samsung S5H1409 and newer tuners outperform my HDHR when I have multipath issues. The HDHR is so nice in so many ways, I just wish it used a Samsung or LG demod, rather than the Micronas demods that seem mostly designed for low-power consumption in mainly cable uses. I keep hoping the HDHR4 will have better reception. Right now, my best tuner is a cheap Pinnacle 801eSE USB stick based on the Samsung 1411.

Thanks for jogging my memory! I completely forgot that I have a couple of free-after-rebate KWorld USB sticks from several years ago that have been sitting unused in the back of my spare parts drawer. I seem to recall that these use Korean frontends. I'll give those a shot.

I also have half a mind to build my own HDHR: plug these two tuner sticks into a small/cheap embedded Linux board, hack up some software to respond to hdhomerun_config commands and repackage ATSC packets into UDP packets. Hm...
Edited by dlou99 - 10/11/13 at 10:45am
post #9665 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post


I think that's what's causing KGO to have reception problems for their translator at Mt. Allison. They're fighting the very high RF level there at the site plus the marine layer inversion across the Bay. While it's only 35 miles from transmitter to receiver, the signal varies enough to drop out occasionally.

Larry
SF

Hi,

 

It's only the FOG in the way.

 

While my graphics are primitive compared with what the Weather Consultants provide to the stations, this is a sample what a $100 program can do. (I have Topo 9 for my PN-60 GPS, was ~ $ 60)

 

http://shop.delorme.com/OA_HTML/DELibeCCtdItemDetail.jsp?item=32746&section=10742

 

I can take the satellite pictures and overlay them on top of the topo data, rotate, zoom in, change altitude to get the view I want and do so much more.

 

SHF

 

Red line is from Sutro to Mt Allison

 

 

Click on picture for a larger view.

post #9666 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlou99 View Post

Thanks for jogging my memory! I completely forgot that I have a couple of free-after-rebate KWorld USB sticks from several years ago that have been sitting unused in the back of my spare parts drawer. I seem to recall that these use Korean frontends. I'll give those a shot.

I also have half a mind to build my own HDHR: plug these two tuner sticks into a small/cheap embedded Linux board, hack up some software to respond to hdhomerun_config commands and repackage ATSC packets into UDP packets. Hm...

I've had the same idea myself!

Anyway, I had a UB-435Q, and it was the best tuner I had. It finally failed in a weird way -- it only worked if I heated it up before plugging it into the USB port (eg, hold it over a stove burner for 30 seconds or so, until it is almost too hot to touch). Probably a crack in something.. Be warned there are 2 versions of this, and the linux DVB code will only talk to the V1 version.

Drew
post #9667 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post

iitywygms... With good signal strength and good symbol quality, but poor signal quality, as shown in your post, that indicates to me that you have multipath problems. You say it worked one day, then it didn't the next. Did they build something new in your neighborhood, by any chance? You could be getting a canceling reflected signal and moving the antenna might get rid of it. An EMI problem could be the culprit, but I suspect multipath.

Larry
SF

Well moving the antenna did not help. I moved the antenna a total of 50 feet from its original position, stopping every 5 feet to check signal. Only thing I got was a slight increase in signal strength about 30 feet from the original position. But the signal quality still remained very very low.
Still nothing from pge regarding the emi.
I wish there was some easy way of checking for multipath without a oscilloscope.
Cable offers basic channels for 25 a month. I may have to finally bite the bullet and pay the man. Ugh.
post #9668 of 10433
Sorry to hear that moving your antenna didn't solve the KGO problem, iitywygms. Hopefully PG&E will find something and fix you up. Fingers crossed!

Larry
post #9669 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by iitywygms View Post


Well moving the antenna did not help. I moved the antenna a total of 50 feet from its original position, stopping every 5 feet to check signal. Only thing I got was a slight increase in signal strength about 30 feet from the original position. But the signal quality still remained very very low.
Still nothing from pge regarding the emi.
I wish there was some easy way of checking for multipath without a oscilloscope.
Cable offers basic channels for 25 a month. I may have to finally bite the bullet and pay the man. Ugh.

Hi,

 

I tried just as hard to connect to the "Street Light Pole" ISP. Bought more and more equipment, moved the antennas around everywhere, even got a loan of the special 802.11b box from the company that was specially designed. Time invested was HUGE.

 

Turns out that I was in the center of four Street Light Poles with White Cans and the 802.11b boxes could not figure out which one to use.  I paid $$ to eliminate ads. Service was terminated and White Cans removed from the Street Light Poles except in Santa Clara, CA where the city electric utility took them over.

 

Google may still have theirs up in Mountain View, which was the home of MetroLink (???) who never got to their home city.

----------------------------------------------

I wanted to avoid AT&T and Comcast but after getting DSL it has worked well. Except, I started out at ~ 300, got a person out to raise it to ~ 600 and when AT&T installed a Remote terminal nearby went to 1300. Comcast has Fiber to the wrong side of my unit from where I need HDTV and AT&T is incompatible with all my HDTV equipment. Comcast just turned off all clear QAM channels the first of the month. I would need to buy / rent tons of $$$ equipment from Comcast. Cheaper to buy paperbacks.

 

Now it is down to 910 and I have started complaining. (AT&T wants less money for more speed, but I have had the same E-Mail address since 09/30/97.)

-------------------------------------------------------------------

I am sorry to say that I predicted your result a long time ago when I saw how many mountain ranges you were behind and mountains in every direction.

 

SHF

post #9670 of 10433
Scanning road trip line-up ...... (In towns near you)
Todays trip ..... Salinas Costco Parking Lot 10-12-13
What's up eek.gif with all these "Analog" channels ???


8-1 KSBW NBC
8-2 KSBW ABC
-15- Analog Telemundo
19-1 Mundo Fox
19-2 ESTV
19-3 Daystar
19-4 "4 Lease" Directs you to tune 27-1 for Me tv ..... (I am not seeing 27-1 from here)
22-1 KLFB 3ABN English
22-2 KLFB 3ABN Spanish
22-3 KLFB Dare Break Network
22-4 KLFB 3ABN
-23- Analog Telemundo
25-1 KQET ( KQED-9 )
25-2 KQET
25-3 KQET Veme
-29- Analog (KICU-36) repeater
-33- Analog Unimas ........... with some serious audio level problems.
35-1 KCBA Fox35
38-1 ESNE
38-2 MCAET
38-3 Color Bars
38-4 VZTV
39-1 KMMD
-43- Analog Azteca (Complete with ghosts) wink.gif how nostalgic
43-1 Digital Azteca
43-2 Azteca 2
43-3 Jewelry
43-4 Azteca 4
46-1 KION- CBS 46
46-2 KION- The CW
67-1 Univision HD
67-2 Unimas
67-3 LATV

Battery tv connected to High VHF Dipole and stubby UHF dipole with parabolic reflector. .... ( Sample taken inside truck cab.)
Sorry, no Low VHF dipole used this time. (Results could vary)
post #9671 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888CALLFCC View Post

Scanning road trip line-up ...... (In towns near you)
Todays trip ..... Salinas Costco Parking Lot 10-12-13
What's up eek.gif with all these "Analog" channels ???

...

Hi,

 

A very large low income Hispanic set of viewers that some broadcasters think still do not have digital ATSC sets.

 

 

SHF

post #9672 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888CALLFCC View Post

Scanning road trip line-up ...... (In towns near you)
Todays trip ..... Salinas Costco Parking Lot 10-12-13
What's up eek.gif with all these "Analog" channels ???

Thanks for the rundown of stations found! I compared your list to my list of digital stations (the one linked below) and found only two places where mine was wrong. I don't get any input from down there very often, so it's good to see that it's still mostly accurate.

The two that differed are 38-3 and 67-4. I have K38JP 38-3 shown as "Spanish Programs" and you have "Color Bars". I have KSMS 67-4 as "Zuus Latino" and you didn't list that sub-channel. I will make the corrections.

Larry
post #9673 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post

Thanks for the rundown of stations found! I compared your list to my list of digital stations (the one linked below) and found only two places where mine was wrong. I don't get any input from down there very often, so it's good to see that it's still mostly accurate.

The two that differed are 38-3 and 67-4. I have K38JP 38-3 shown as "Spanish Programs" and you have "Color Bars". I have KSMS 67-4 as "Zuus Latino" and you didn't list that sub-channel. I will make the corrections.

Larry

Correct, nothing but "color bars" on 38-3. I did not see 67-4. After 67-3 then comes 8-1 I did not test the low vhf. I did not have a large dipole for that.

Also did a scan at a private residence in Aromas.
Mostly only full power channels there. + locked on 36 KICU san Jose and parts of sutro but no lock on that.
Very fussy location for mt. toro.
post #9674 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888CALLFCC View Post

Scanning road trip line-up ...... (In towns near you)
Todays trip ..... Salinas Costco Parking Lot 10-12-13
What's up eek.gif with all these "Analog" channels ???

Analog 33 just recently came back on. It had been off for so long that I thought it was gone for good. It is very weak here and has no audio at all.

In a little less than 2 years the analogs will all be gone. All of LPTV is on hold until the auction takes place next year then maybe we'll start seeing changes.

KSMS is on low power again so I can't check 67-4. They seem to have a hard time keeping their full power transmitter running.

Chuck
post #9675 of 10433
I just checked 67-4 again. From a prime Hayward reception location a few blocks away from here. No 67-4
Scanning found 97 channels ! .... without moving the antenna. So there's probably lots more channels available here.
Highlights include duplicates of channels 2 and 7, and QVC "On air" channel on 1-3

Location ?
Lucky Supermarkets Roof top parking structure..... 22555 Mission Blvd, Hayward, CA 94541
Elevation around 100 feet above ground.
post #9676 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888CALLFCC View Post

... QVC "On air" channel on 1-3
...

Hi,

 

I can confirm QVC on 1-3.

 

Larry would need three full time paid workers to keep up with KAXT.

 

Here is what I got Sunday night, may be different Monday.

 

Click on picture for larger view.

 

SHF

 


Edited by SFischer1 - 10/14/13 at 6:29am
post #9677 of 10433

Hi,

 

KKPX (ION) has dropped the encrypted channels.

 

Quote:

 

1013024C-05_18_2013.txt

 

SCANNING: 635000000 (us-bcast:41)

LOCK: 8vsb (ss=96 snq=93 seq=100)

TSID: 0x0195

PROGRAM 3: 65.1 ION

PROGRAM 4: 65.2 qubo

PROGRAM 5: 65.3 IONLife

PROGRAM 6: 65.4 ShopTV

PROGRAM 82: 65.82 GranCin (encrypted)

PROGRAM 85: 65.85 NFL (encrypted)

PROGRAM 87: 65.87 GolTV (encrypted)

PROGRAM 88: 65.88 RedZone (no data)

PROGRAM 90: 65.90 Starz (encrypted)

1013024C-10_15_2013.txt

 

SCANNING: 635000000 (us-bcast:41)

LOCK: 8vsb (ss=97 snq=85 seq=100)

TSID: 0x0195

PROGRAM 3: 65.1 ION

PROGRAM 4: 65.2 qubo

PROGRAM 5: 65.3 IONLife

PROGRAM 6: 65.4 Shop

 

I need to get back and finish my AWK reformation of the HDHR almost unreadable format.

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/731457/hdhomerun-dual-atsc-or-qam-to-ethernet-box/1950#post_23356506

 

SHF

post #9678 of 10433
I visited a friend in Saratoga today and brought along my potable DTV - the MyGoTV. The only antenna I had was the miserable built-in 10" whip. Previous experience with the whip is that it works marginally on UHF but is very poor on VHF. It's just too short. My location was in a condo complex very near Hwy 85 and Saratoga avenue and 41 miles from Mt. Sutro. I checked to see which stations I could receive standing in the parking area completely surrounded by two story buildings and large trees.

To my surprise I could receive all the UHF stations I checked from Sutro, San Bruno and Fremont. There were a couple I didn't check because they were not programmed. I could not receive 7 or 11 as they were both below the cliff on the Signal Quality meter. This was not a surprise based on past experience. I had a tough time with both 6 and 10 when I tried this from Stockton once.

Of course this is only one test but I'm surprised that so many people are having reception problems in the south bay. I'm sure a decent outside antenna would receive all the stations.

Chuck
post #9679 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post

Hi,

I can confirm QVC on 1-3.

Larry would need three full time paid workers to keep up with KAXT.

Here is what I got Sunday night, may be different Monday.

Thanks for the update. I'll have to update my list again.

Larry
post #9680 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post


Thanks for the update. I'll have to update my list again.

Larry

Hi,

 

A update on KPIX, just after I said in a PM that KPIX was OK except for rain (On tree leaves), the next NFL game had many gaps using MyHD. The HDHR tuner may be doing a better job that the gaps do not show up on a time-delayed playback. I suspect airplanes increasing the multi-path. The early KPIX game today I am spotting some gaps. MyHD is reporting 32% - 40% so it is a weak signal strength.

 

EDIT: I just realized that we are in the time period when the Sat dishes (For the stations) can be looking direct into the Sun. That may explain the gaps last week and the ~ two this week.

 

Toasts RF 29 chart shows strength > 80% for his HDHR.

 

Chuck, move the mouse over the strength trace and others, he may have added more info like you wanted. First click on the color boxes to the upper right.

 

 

 

Remember my report of both KPIX and KTVU being totally junk when we had strong winds moving the trees in my path to Sutro at noon. (See profile for picture).

 

Part of my AWK project to change the HDHR scans into better order is a CSV output that multiple scans can be loaded into a spreadsheet and then sorted.

 

SHF


Edited by SFischer1 - 10/20/13 at 1:30pm
post #9681 of 10433
Reception here looked good from all directions earlier today. I got KVIE 6 and KXTV 10 from Sacramento this afternoon - they've been mostly below the cliff edge lately - and I even got KCRA 3 for a while. KEMO 50 from up north and KOVR, KMAX and KQCA from Walnut Grove were all stronger than normal. The biggest surprise was KAXT 1. It's usually just above the cliff edge here at 16 to 17 dB. This afternoon it was at 23 dB!

Larry
SF
post #9682 of 10433
It has been a very uneventful Fall so far here. Despite the strong high pressure sitting over us for the last couple of weeks with low temperatures in the 60's at my location there has been very little going on with reception. Not much enhanced or degraded reception. So far there have been no drop-outs on the evening shows I have recorded. That's good!

Chuck
post #9683 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post

Hi,

I can confirm QVC on 1-3.

Larry would need three full time paid workers to keep up with KAXT.

Here is what I got Sunday night, may be different Monday.

Click on picture for larger view.

SHF


I'm in Hayward (94545 ZIP code) and a friend's HDTV tuned in channels just like ones on your photo above. For some reason, channel 5 (5-1 DT) didn't get tuned in and channels 2 and 4 weren't even identified as stations. Channel 7 comes in great in HD.

Does anyone know the scoop on channels 2,4, and 5 being broadcast in digital or HD?

Thanks!

Peace...
post #9684 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomdkat View Post

I'm in Hayward (94545 ZIP code) and a friend's HDTV tuned in channels just like ones on your photo above. For some reason, channel 5 (5-1 DT) didn't get tuned in and channels 2 and 4 weren't even identified as stations. Channel 7 comes in great in HD.

Does anyone know the scoop on channels 2,4, and 5 being broadcast in digital or HD?

Thanks!

Peace...
Take a look at the DTV Channel List linked below. It shows which channels are broadcast in HD and the channel they transmit on. Chennel 2 is on 44, 4 is on 38, 5 is on 29, etc. and all of the -1 channels are in beautiful HD.

If your friend doesn't receive 2, 4 and 5, something is wrong with his antenna system and it needs to be checked or adjusted.

Larry
post #9685 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomdkat View Post


I'm in Hayward (94545 ZIP code) and a friend's HDTV tuned in channels just like ones on your photo above. For some reason, channel 5 (5-1 DT) didn't get tuned in and channels 2 and 4 weren't even identified as stations. Channel 7 comes in great in HD.

Does anyone know the scoop on channels 2,4, and 5 being broadcast in digital or HD?

Thanks!

Peace...

Hi,

 

Check Larry's list, see his post one back at the bottom.

 

KPIX  Virtual Channel 5, RF 29, the perhaps only remaining station with no second stream,

KTVU Virtual Channel 2, RF 44 and RF 48,

KRON Virtual Channel 4, RF 38,

 

are all UHF RF channels.

 

KGO Virtual Channel 7, RF 7 is VHF and  RF 35 is UHF.

 

There are no Analog stations nearby except for RF 6 which is a FM radio station.

 

Enter your zip code into this page:

 

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=90

 

and click "Show lines pointing to each transmitter" and then zoom out.

 

Sutro / Bruno and Mt. Allison / Monument Pk are about 180 degrees so you might get all with an antenna that has a low front to back ratio.

 

EDIT:

 

Picking up on Larry's comment about the antenna, I suggest also:

 

  1. Disconnect the antenna (And any other cables to the HDTV).
  2. Do a full channel scan, this should result in NO channels.
  3. Reconnect the antenna and again do a full channel scan.

 

The last full scan might have some old data that is messing the channel tables.

 

For a HDHomeRUN, a BAT file will collect all the stations quickly.

 

Scan-HDHR.BAT

Quote:
"C:\\Program Files\\Silicondust\\HDHomeRun\\hdhomerun_config.exe" 1013024C scan /tuner1 G:\\1013024C.txt

The tuner ID, number and the file name will have to be changed, PM for more info.

 

 

SHF


Edited by SFischer1 - 10/21/13 at 7:09pm
post #9686 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post

Hi,
There are no Analog stations nearby except for RF 6 which is FM radio station.


SHF

We have analog 23 here, and that one is quite strong. Along with 6,

If you have a monster antenna (The kind most people don't have) 2 is possible.
But a fluttery mess at that.
post #9687 of 10433
Quote:
Originally Posted by 888CALLFCC View Post


We have analog 23 here, and that one is quite strong. Along with 6,

If you have a monster antenna (The kind most people don't have) 2 is possible.
But a fluttery mess at that.

Hi,

 

Ah yes, the location that gets all the signals in the northern hemisphere. :D

 

Funny, Larry does not list those analog channels, but then the title is

 

Digital Television
DTV - HDTV Channel List

 

23 would be impossible for me as KRCB comes in so strong and my metal roof blocks all to the East and South anyway.

 

SHF


Edited by SFischer1 - 10/21/13 at 7:33pm
post #9688 of 10433

Hi,

 

You finally made me do it.

 

I mapped the profile from 22555 Mission Blvd, Hayward, CA 94541 to KMUV which is on Fremont Peak which I have visited many times as well as riding a motorcycle over all roads between there and here. One must be closed by now as so many roads have been in state parks.

 

It you draw a line between 100' and the top of Fremont peak on the profile by my eyes it looks like it is almost line of sight ignoring the curvature of the Earth.

 

It is almost as good as from my location to KEMO at ~ 97 miles which is over water which is good.

 

22555 Mission Blvd, Hayward, CA 94541 is a great location for the Salinas Valley reception.

 

SHF

 

Hint, save the file after clicking on the map to use a viewer to zoon in. Or PM me for a  better map, when I downloaded it, it looked really bad. :rolleyes:

 


Edited by SFischer1 - 10/21/13 at 9:46pm
post #9689 of 10433
I live 1 mile away. (15 minute walk) A huge signal cut-off when you cross Mission Blvd ..... and go to the hills.

Most of the Salinas area from here has co-channel problems with Sutro.
So you only get about half the stations.


On the other hand, people in Gilroy (For example) may have problems with Sutro due to co-channel issues.
29 analog + KPIX = problems
post #9690 of 10433
Conditions sure have been changing these past few days from one extreme to the other. Stations from Walnut Grove and Sonoma County have varied as much as 14 dB in the last three days. KMAX 31 from Walnut Grove has reached a high of 28 dB and as low as 14 dB... great signal to no signal. KEMO from Mt. St. Helena way up north has varied between 26 dB and 16 dB. I wonder what's causing these huge swings in signal strength? Has anyone else who watches distant stations seen similar changes?

Larry
SF
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