The Official AVS Antenna and Related Hardware Topic! - Page 480

It worked great! I get 44 channels with this one (some of them with lots of pixellation, mind you) and only got 35 channels with the first one I made.

With these being so much fun to make, the next thing to do is look into a dipole to see if I can get the ABC station (WPLG Miami, FL) which unfortunately is broadcasting in the VHF frequencies and doesn't show up with my db4 foamboard rig. (The other ABC station in Tequesta is apparently too far away for my indoor antenna).

You could try a foamboard-mounted 2-bay high-VHF that wouldn't be terribly large.

Take one half of the DB4, multiply all dimensions by about 3.5 to 4 or so, and assemble. It will be in the ballpark for high-VHF. (Scaling factor is off-the-cuff...)

My standard response: http://m4antenna.eastmasonvilleweather.com/index.html documents the best bowtie antenna designs. You can get 3 or 4 dB gain in the high VHF band along with 10+ dB in the UHF band with the right design. I'm not sure that will be enough, though, in your case.

I'm going to be dropping cable soon and want to be able to pick up the signals in my area.

I live in a rented townhome so I cannot install anything on the roof, so I was thinking internal only.

here are my results from tv fool's website

I'm REALLY green on this topic, so any recommendations under $50 will be SERIOUSLY considered

thank you

xosubuckeyex:

Welcome to the forum.



Your signals are very strong. Try this inexpensive indoor antenna first:
www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103077

With an indoor antenna, sometimes it is necessary to try different locations. You can make the antenna coax longer by using an F81 coupler with a coax extension.
www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103459
www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103648

DO NOT use an antenna with a built-in amplifier; it will be overloaded.

Please let us know how it works out.

LOL

I just paid 200 for a book...must have been on that

+1.
Also like to add for optimal performance, try to aim the antenna to the south where the TV towers are.

Another +1 on that specific model RS indoor antenna. It usually works well when signals are strong, like yours are. The loop & dipoles should be perpendicular to the towers to the South. IOW, the dipole rods should be facing East & West.

If you want to install an outdoor or attic antenna, this one would work well. In the attic, you could just attach it to the side of a south-facing vertical beam.

Thank you, Rabbit, Mikepier, arxaw. Your suggestion is very helpful. I was looking at $50 antennas like the C1C. I'll definitely try this inexpensive option.

Eagle Aspen 2-Bay appears to be identical to Antenna Direct DB-2, which was analyzed vs M2 here:
http://imageevent.com/holl_ands/multibay/2bayrefl

BOTH the DB-2 and the larger M2 Super-2-Bay Bowtie antennas have much more Raw Gain to the REAR,
with minimal Gain FORWARD (depends on the channel)....so their utility for Hi-VHF reception is very limited.

Although old CM4221 also has more Gain to the REAR and CM4221HD is close to being Bi-Directional, the
Super-4-Bay M4 with a much larger Angled Reflector finally results in Hi-VHF Gain being directed FORWARD:
http://imageevent.com/holl_ands/multibay/4bayrefl

Another small but very effective UHF/Hi-VHF antenna is the RCA ANT-751 (about 35"x35"+mount),
which has the SAME UHF front section as the W-G HD7000, except the rear elements were shortened
to eliminate Ch2-6. Modeling reveals Hi-VHF performance remained about the same:
http://www.amazon.com/RCA-ANT751R-Ou.../dp/B0024R4B5C
http://www.winegarddirect.com/pdf/HD7000R.pdf

Except price.


The only VHF in the TVFool was WGCT, an independent. If the channel is not on the "must have" list, the much smaller 2bay would be a better choice and much cheaper. Or the suggested RS indoor will likely work.

Hi folks,

I have been doing a lot of research, but it appears that this is a can be a very big and technical topic. So I thought I should just ask for some help. I am looking to set an Antenna up on my roof. I live in fairly urban environment and there are some buildings around me that are taller than mine, but that being said it also appears from my tvfool report that I have some fairly strong signals. My initial thought is to just go big and tall, but that may be overkill and unnecessary. Initially this will be going to one TV, with a run of about 60 foot of RG6, mostly depending where on the roof the antenna goes. Any thoughts on an antenna choice would be greatly appreciated.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...0b8690fde8ba36

RCA ANT751 (made by Winegard) should work well. It comes with its own mounting bracket. If REAL (not virtual) channels 2 5 and 4 are must haves, they will probably come in with the above, but if not, and if they are important, you may need something else for them. Find out what's on them and if they are important to you.

2,4, and 5 appear to be a public service announcement station, spanish broadcasting and a christian network. They don't seem to be anything that I would be interested in.

That being said, there doesn't seem to be that much of a difference in cost between the two antennas.


I notice that it is only recommended for channels above 7, so I looked at channel 6 as well and that seems to be a waste of bandwith.

You are correct that channel 6 needs the different larger antenna. The RCA ANT751 is a much more compact antenna and will be easier to install and will probably last longer with ice buildup and high winds. The antenna that covers the lower stations looks to have a higher gain UHF section. This is good when aimed at a station but will make aiming more difficult and actually make stations from a different direction weaker.
John

Since the EA "DB2" a direct knock-off by a Chinese manufacturer, the price difference isn't surprising...

So you think that with the smaller antenna I will be able to pick up more stations? or at least ones that the antenna is not directly pointed at? When you are referencing the gain of the larger antenna, are you "looking" at it to make this distinction, or are you referencing technical data.

In looking at my report, I see that the vast majority of the stations available to me are in the area of 241 degrees. This looks like it covers all of the major stations that I want, (ABC, CBS, FOX, NBC, PBS). There are quite a few other stations available as well in that direction. There are also a number of stations in the exact opposite direction as well, but if I am understanding the report it appears that many of these are different market "repeats" of what is located at 241.

Correct. Your "241°" (254° magnetic compass direction) stations will get you all the majors and a bunch of other misc. stuff.

The ANT751 is a very solid performer, well made and quite sturdy. Since it is not encumbered with the long elements needed for real channels 2 thru 6, it has a much smaller footprint; making it easier to install and less likely to have elements damaged by birds, ice and snow. If I had your TVFool report, it is the antenna I would install.

I see you live where my old stomping grounds used to be. Went to high school in Astoria.

You should have no problems getting the major networks. You can even try a regular Radio Shack budget indoor antenna like this:
http://www.radioshack.com/product/in...ductId=2103077

Its on sale for $9. If it does not work you could always return it.

Do you have line-of-sight to the Empire State Bldg?

The stations in the opposite direction are mostly Connecticut stations, which you might not need. If you do want them, then you would definately need to mount the antenna outside with a rotor, or mount a second antenna just for that direction. But I think you'll be quite happy with the amount of NYC stations you will receive.
The stations on real VHF 2,4 and 5 are not much programming to begin with so you probably can do without them.

I figured that I shoudln't have to much trouble, and that is why it occured to me that my plan of buying the largest antenna I could get (within reason) and hoisting it as high as I could might be overkill. That being said, I would prefer a roof mount, as an indoor antenna would not pass the wife test.


I am not sure. Would that change my choice of antenna?

I had wanted to get up on my roof last night to take a look. I guess it is about a 50/50 shot. The building next to me is slightly higher than mine, but not by much (its actually hard to judge but it may be only a few feet). That may block my view, but with a reasonable sized mast I may be able to get it above that building. Whats funny is that I had a new roof put on my house and have been up on my roof more in the last year than ever before but wasn't really looking around at the time.


I see your out on Long Island. I grew up in Suffolk and moved to Astoria when I was out of college.

As strong as your signals are, getting above that building probably won't be an issue.

Does anyone have a picture of an M4 w/ a 40"t x 36 or 40"w curved reflector roof- or chimney-mounted to an average sized single family home?

Similar to this one of two 91XGs + BLV6F or this 91xg / YA-1713 image.

Thanks

I hope no one has already posted this somewhere in the past but this thread is so long that's it's almost impossible to determine if it's been mentioned somewhere. So here goes....

For several years I've been using two stacked 91XGs, combining them with the lowest loss 2-way splitter I could find. I wanted to improve upon this situation as any loss in combining the antennas subtracts from the ~2.5 dB gain you get by stacking. It's easy to lose a dB or more.

My 91XGs are the older ones with the ferrite baluns. I have measured the newer ones with the PCB balun but it was no better, about .5 to 1 dB loss depending on frequency.

Recently I was introduced to the idea of the broadband coax balun and I realized it could also apply to the 1/4 wave matching sections. I had ignored these devices before for combining UHF antennas because I didn't think they were broadband enough. I was wrong about that.

I constructed and measured 2 UHF 300 to 75 ohm coax baluns and a 1/4 wave UHF 2 way power combiner and I measured their losses. These are the losses I measured on the bench using an HP-8640B signal generator and a Boonton 9200 power meter.

Coax balun - 0.5 dB @ 470 MHz, 0.3 dB @ 585 MHz, 0.4 dB @ 698 MHz
Power divider - 0.12 dB @ 470 MHz, 0.25 dB @ 585 MHz, 0.4 dB at 698 MHz

I retrofitted the 91XG plastic feed boxes to accept the baluns and replaced the 2 way ferrite combiner with the coax combiner. I measured between 1.5 and 2 dB improvement on channel 28 using my spectrum analyzer. Channel 28 is the only LOS station I have near me that I have monitored for a long time to be sure it is stable under varying conditions. Most of my stations are 2 edges and vary a lot with conditions so I cannot use them for accurate measurements. My overall impression is that the numerous other stations are as strong or stronger than I've ever seen them. It'll take some time to get a good feeing for those stations under varying conditions.

For construction I used Belden 8241 (RG-59 with a copper shield), Belden 9269 (93 ohm copper shield) and RG-223 (50 ohm double shielded cable). I couldn't use RG-6 because you can't solder to the shield. The 93 ohm cable is used to make the 1/2 wave balun. It's as close to the ideal 150 ohms that you can get these days. I used the RG-223 as the 1/4 wave matching section. 50 ohms is very close to the geometric mean of 75 and 37.5 ohms. I found the Belden cables on Ebay and I had RG-223.

I've attached a few images. The first one is of the 2-way power combiner. I modified an old satellite DC power inserter to join the 3 coax cables with very short leads inside. I used coax seal to keep out the water. The RG-223 length is 3.3" and attaches directly to the preamp input.

The second image shows a complete balun minus the ferrite beads. The 1/2 wave section is 8.5". It is attached to the 91XG with the leads as short as possible.

The third image shows the balun in place on the 91XG with two ferrite beads acting as a UHF choke. They are Amidon FB-61-6873 beads.

The preamp I'm using is a Tinlee MA-25U-77, 30 dB gain and 2 dB noise figure. They tell me it's typically 1.5 dB.

I think I've squeezed everything I can out of these antennas.

Chuck

Hey guys,

I have recently built a HTPC with a TV Tuner card Avermedia Duet. I need to add an Antenna and not really sure if buying one is worth it or just building my own. I went to TVFool's website to get my signal strengths in my area and not really sure how to read them and what would be needed to get good signal strength.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...0b8636543a7194

Can I get away with a cheap antenna to put near my TV or should I build one for my attic?

Any help would be appreciated.

A friend of mine just let me borrow an rca hang on the wall amplified antenna, first night tv picked up 11 stations, the next night all i get with a strong signal is fox 61.
I am looking for reccomendations for an antenna to mount in my attic, or possibly something somewhat small to mount to my eave on the roof, i would rather not mount one directly to my roof top. I can possibly mount one to my chimney, but i heat with wood and do not know if the heat and smoke would possibly affect it. My zip code is 06279, can't post a url because i'm a newbie. Any help will be greatly appreciated. My property is bordered by trees, to the west is pretty open, to the south is trees, to the north is pretty clear, to the east is treed, don't know how much effect that has. I would prefer mounting in the attic, but after reading some posts, it seems like a no brainer to mount outside if possible, thanks again.

Welcome!
Go back to TVFool.com and enter your address.
Copy the link to the final results page.
Post the partial URL that the software allows you to post in this thread.
We can figure out the complete URL.

I would try this specific antenna from RS. If it doesn't work reliably, just return it and consider an attic or outdoor antenna.

If your roofing materials are just conventional asphalt shingles and you have no foil insulation anywhere in the attic area, an attic install should work for you. If I had your TVFool report and if WWAZ was not a must-have, I would get an RCA ANT751 (made by Winegard). It is small, easy to install and comes with its own mounting bracket. Just hang it in the attic from a roof rafter and point it roughly 70-75° magnetic compass direction.

If WWAZ is necessary, you may need an "all channel" antenna, like this one. It's about the same price shipped, but much larger than the ANT751, due to the long elements needed for the frequency WWAZ is on.

If you have a long coax run or split to multiple tuners, you may need a signal preamp. Add one only if needed, though.

hope this is the part of the link you were looking for, thanks .

3d0b86573754e253

I was faced with a similar situation early last year. The link below shows the small VHF/UHF antenna I installed in my attic with excellent results. My local stations range from 14 to 37 miles from my house.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...d#post20372667

AJ

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...0b86573754e253
If the stations at the top of your TVFool report shown in yellow are what you want, a small ANT751 should work well. Install the mounting bracket (included) on an eave at the roof peak and aim roughly 260° magnetic compass direction (W/SW). If you heat with wood, you do not want to put it on or near the chimney, where smoke would eventually corrode it.

If you want to try the antenna in the attic first, just run a temporary RG6 coax to the antenna and place it on top of a large cardboard or plastic box in the attic. If it works to your satisfaction there, install it permanently.

If you want more stations than that, you might need a bigger antenna and possibly a preamp and rotor to turn the antenna.